Player Discussion Brock Boeser | "Back" in Action PT. 2: Brock Boessing Towards the Mean A.K.A. "Argh, My Groin"

Discussion in 'Vancouver Canucks' started by Ronning On Empty, Oct 10, 2018.

  1. PG Canuck

    PG Canuck Moderator

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    That’s like, the easiest contract to get done. Really solid defensive player but once the puck is outside the Canucks blueline he’s useless.
     
  2. mathonwy

    mathonwy #LindenMustGo

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    Tanev contract was 100% Gilman and zero% Jimbo.
     
    pomorick, dim jim, timw33 and 2 others like this.
  3. sting101

    sting101 Registered User

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    Yesss I bet he didn't even tell anyone.
     
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  4. topched88

    topched88 Registered User

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    Oh give it a rest ffs. It’s fully plausible that a bad Gm can make some good moves. It’s the same as benning made all the bad draft picks (virtanen) but not any of the good ones (boeser).

    Benning did well on the Horvat and tanev contracts. His overall body of work is still dreadful. You don’t have to fight every single battle to bring him down.
     
  5. LordBacon

    LordBacon Registered User

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    6.66 mil/ 6 years, Because hail Satan.
     
  6. WTG

    WTG Verstappen!

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    Handsome goal scoring man still scoring at a .52 G/PG

    More impressively, he's managed to shoot at a 16.3% rate for 99 games.
     
  7. F A N

    F A N Registered User

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    Horvat's contract is turning out to be a steal yet if I remember correctly many here thought Benning severely overpaid. When Gillis re-signed Kesler most here thought it was a severe overpayment as well.

    Most posters here have unrealistic expectations. Don't get me wrong, I want the team to sign guys to ridiculously cheap contracts as well.
     
  8. Melvin

    Melvin HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

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    I don’t remember anyone credible let alone “many”saying he “severely overpaid” but it wouldn’t be a fan post if it didn’t contain some stupid straw man. Maybe since there were “many” you can find five or six of them. /rolls eyes.

    It was a completely fair deal that was completely inline with standards. The only things that matter with such contracts is how many years of UFA you buy out and how much of a premium you pay to do so. Horvat made out very well with the contract as he only lost two years of UFA. I doubt he’s kicking himself over the deal which he should be if he was “stolen.”

    It was a completely standard post elc contract and frankly the easiest job in the world for a gm to do when the player is an obvious core piece, has zero leverage and no imminent cap crunch to deal with. Even Bennington could not have possibly found a way to screw it up and I said that even before the deal was announced.

    Same for whatever he gives Pettersson in a couple years. I guarantee that whatever it is, it is unanimously hailed as great because it’s the easiest thing in the world to do. This is like praising an outfielder for catching a pop fly. I’ll say it right now: great job Jim Benning for signing Elias Pettersson to a ___ year deal at ___ AAV. This is a steal for the franchise. Feel free to fill in the blanks in a year or so. If you can even dream up a possible way that a half sentient human could screw that up I’d like to hear it.

    Not every damn signing needs to be a steal or an albatross. Sometimes a deal is just completely reasonable and fair for both sides. Should be the majority of the time actually.
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2018
    Lonny Bohonos likes this.
  9. Ronning On Empty

    Ronning On Empty Formerly BleachClean

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    I get what you're saying, I do. Normally, no one would be promoting Benning's contract work as a positive. His work has been dreadful there overall, agreed. That said, when we assess deals, let's not forget that there is a relative judgement and an absolute judgement at play. Relatively speaking, the Horvat and Tanev contracts look great compared to his other contract work. Absolutely speaking, these deals are standard fare across the league. So we get caught judging these deals through the lens of Benning's body of work, and that skews things.

    Simply, when people refuse to give Benning kudos on those deals it's because of absolute judgement. It's not simply due to the refusal to give Benning any accolade whatsoever.

    For example, before Horvat signed his 6 year deal in Sept. of 2017, I thought he would get the Wennberg contract: 6 years at 5m per. He ended up getting 500k more per year than Wennberg even though Wennberg produced at a better PPG clip over 3 seasons of play. Did Benning overpay by a little bit? Yup. Did it matter? No, because long-term it was going to be a win regardless.

    Next, when Benning was hired he had the chance to re-up Tanev to a multi-year deal right out of the gate. He should have, IMO. Instead he gave him a 1 year extension to see what Tanev could do. In the end, I think that move cost him millions. Did it mean a whole lot? No because Tanev was going to perform as a #2 regardless.

    So you see, it's not that every fight has to be fought against Benning. It's that the majority of posters here refuse to forget what it's like outside the Benning worldscape. Even on seemingly innocuous takes. That refusal, IMO, is vital in keeping the standard of this board intact. It's one of the reasons I think this board is the best Canucks board on the web, bar none.



    Ah Melvin, you fell for the bait post. Don't fall for the bait, it's not worth it.


    -------------------------------------------


    As an aside, I'm very concerned about the upcoming Boeser contract. I know he's had injury issues and I know that he keeps scoring despite looking behind the play. I'm just not confident that he can sustain his production. If it were the opposite, and he was doing good things on the ice and was not being rewarded, I would be more confident. I would suspect a regression in terms of on-ice shooting percentage. The way it is now, I don't know what he is when his scoring dries up... and that's not good.

    Benning, or the next GM, needs to be very careful with Boeser's upcoming deal. Unlike Horvat and Tanev, this one is not automatic to me.
     
  10. petrishriekandgo

    petrishriekandgo Why not us?

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    His agent floats this stat and the Canucks will be paying through the nose...
     
  11. NoShowWilly

    NoShowWilly Registered User

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    Both horvat and tanevs contracts had comparable player contracts signed in and around the same time.

    Tanev was in no place to argue for more than TJ Brodie. The miss was the show me one year deal.

    After that there was a range with Scandella at 4m and Brodie at 4.65. It was an argument over a few hundred thousand. It adds up when done a dozen times over. That said this team took on no contracts over tanev's deal so no matter.

    Horvat once again you had trocheck, wennberg, drouin all recent signings as well as monohan, Mackinnon in the low 6. Then that outlier draisaitl contract. Trocheck had the no local tax which lowers his number. Once again, Horvat was in the 5-5.5 range.
     
  12. Billy Kvcmu

    Billy Kvcmu Registered User

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    I will give him 7m x 8 yr at max
    Nylander is his comparable, even he is a bit overpaid right now
     
  13. NoShowWilly

    NoShowWilly Registered User

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    Yup no problem with that. Anything less is money. Pastrnak deal would be too sweet.
     
  14. Blue and Green

    Blue and Green Registered User

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    Management asked Tanev to sign a lowball one-year contract on the promise that they would make it up on a longer deal the following year when they would have more cap space. Tanev had shown clearly in the previous season that he was a good NHL defenceman and he also had arbitration rights by that point; no way would he have signed for $2M that year without some form of commitment that the favour would be returned.
     
  15. 50 Sheas of Grey

    50 Sheas of Grey Pettersson for Selke

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    That was a Gilman contract.
    While Tanev had arbitration rights, the arbitrator would not have known the real value Tanev brings to the team (unless he watched most Canucks games) and likely would not be familiar with advanced stats. This helped the Canucks negotiate a better contract.
     
  16. Blue and Green

    Blue and Green Registered User

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    Nothing changed in Tanev's stats, advanced or otherwise, nor his status in the subsequent season that warranted anything close to the massive difference between what he signed for in summer 2014 and what he got the following summer. He scratched the organization's back and they returned the favour.
     
  17. kanucks25

    kanucks25 Registered User

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    On the bright side, he probably won't have a worse game than this one for a long, long time.

    Turnovers, hesitating on every shot, soft on the puck, terrible shootout attempt. Brutal lol.
     
  18. polarbearcub

    polarbearcub Registered User

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    Brock can’t hit the net at all right now
     
  19. GoodBetterBoest

    GoodBetterBoest The Golden Alien

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    Another bad game. It’s becoming troubling.

    He has zero release right now. It’s like he’s forgotten how to snipe it.
     
  20. Neddam ot Sehguh

    Neddam ot Sehguh Nelhad ot Oow

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    he aint playing good, hope he just needs a season of training in the offseason where he can train properly and hopefully can be back to who he was LAST season where he could skate better, puck handle better, shoot more accurate and QUICKER too. This year seems off, please get well BB we need ya :(
     
  21. Ainec

    Ainec Tom Wilson'd by the league (HF)

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    Boeser is not a play driver and that's completely fine. We have that in Pettersson

    he has 29 points and 15 goals in 34 games as a sophomore. That's fine, still a core player



    the way some of you guys are talking it's like he's not 0.5 ppg
     
    WTG likes this.
  22. Billy Kvcmu

    Billy Kvcmu Registered User

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    Shooting at 13.9 % now which is average for a shooter.
    He needs to fire even more, missing a tons of nets right now, just keep firing the goals will come.
     
  23. Billy Kvcmu

    Billy Kvcmu Registered User

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    Bad game? I wouldn’t call it bad
    His issue is that he doesn’t have flying speed which makes every turn over he makes a bit more casusing, he needs to be opportunistic to be successful. Problem is he’s missing the net now with incredible power.
     
  24. mathonwy

    mathonwy #LindenMustGo

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    Brock doesn't want the puck on his stick because his puck handling is average and not very good when he's going fast.

    Brock needs a set up man and Horvat isn't him.
     
  25. LordBacon

    LordBacon Registered User

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    Kid is still scoring lots of points in this “slump”, can’t wait till he gets his swagger back.
     

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