Player Discussion: Brayden Point

[LTIR Trickery]

I keep laughing about people freaking out that this isn't done on social media. They're still, you know, actual real people. They like to go on vacations and visit family after basically being on the road for over half the year.

I wouldn't be shocked if all the players and hockey ops staff took a solid month or two off after the playoffs to heal and rest.

 

[CupsOverCash]

I keep laughing about people freaking out that this isn't done on social media. They're still, you know, actual real people. They like to go on vacations and visit family after basically being on the road for over half the year.

I wouldn't be shocked if all the players and hockey ops staff took a solid month or two off after the playoffs to heal and rest.

I think its easy for people to think they are right back at it after the draft and FA because most people get to have 1 or 2 months off.

 

[God King Fudge]

That would be ideal, but stamkos and Kuch are gonna have to finally learn to not over-pass when they see the other on the ice. As great as they can be together, they've always had a shelf life.

I may just be daydreaming, but I feel like Kucherov did a lot better with that last year. It may be because he wasn't with Stamkos, but Point was the trigger man and Kuch was the setup guy for the most part.

I'd definitely try and start the season with them together and move on from there.

God I just want to fast forward to the playoffs next year. This season is gonna be such a drag

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Like, even though the season is over, you generally still have another week or so with exit interviews and whatnot, and if you're hockey ops you're doing more draft prep and don't really get time off just yet.

Then, the draft, and kids camp, and then you get a little free time...

 

[LightningStrikes]

Yeah, with both sides assured they can and will work something out I can totally see them be like “aight I will talk to you in 2-3 weeks to figure out the details, have a nice vacation”.

 

[These Are The Days]

I may just be daydreaming, but I feel like Kucherov did a lot better with that last year. It may be because he wasn't with Stamkos, but Point was the trigger man and Kuch was the setup guy for the most part.

I'd definitely try and start the season with them together and move on from there.

God I just want to fast forward to the playoffs next year. This season is gonna be such a drag

Dear God you have no idea how much I share that feeling. This waiting another year shit is getting old

 

[BoltzManConstant]

The only one I can see getting 5M is Cirelli if he keeps up his play and moves Johnson down the lineup. Cernak might make a case but doubtful since its only 1.5 seasons of play. I realized yesterday looking at our cap that next year alone, we should still be able to fit everyone in by moving Killorn. His 16 team trade list and price is good for a contender or a team on the cusp of the playoffs with his production. Moving up Volkov to the roster should replace his regular season production but not sure about playoff.

My point is, it isn't so bad next season.

I don't know, I think we could end up in a position next year where we can't keep everyone (in addition to losing Killorn).

We're looking at giving raises to Joseph and Cirelli, Serg and Cernak, and Vasy.

Let's assume Point signs this year for $8.5m and next year the cap goes up by $2m. And assume we go with minimum contracts everywhere else: Killer's replacement at $700k, Verhaeghe still at $700k, Martel or a replacement at $700k, Rutta's replacement at $700k, whoever we replace Miller with this year still making $700k.

That leaves us just $17m in total salary to distribute among the 5 guys I mentioned above. For sake of argument, let's say it takes $8m to sign Vasy, leaving $9m for Joseph, Cirelli, Serg and Cernak. I don't think that's enough.

I bet Serg will demand term and a number -- say $4.5m x 6yrs. We can probably talk Cernak into a bridge, maybe $2.5m. Joseph, let's say $2m, and that would be all the money; nothing left for Cirelli. And I think Cirelli could definitely go for $4.5m and term, maybe $2.5m to $3m if he'll take a bridge.

Now if we could get all 4 of those guys to bridge, then we can probably keep all of them -- but we'll likely have some real cap problems in 2 years when they all need to get paid, vs getting them somewhat cheaper with term next year. If we can't bridge all 4, it is still possible -- we would probably still have to bridge 3 of them but need to scrape up $2m to $3m from various places (maybe Point and Vasy sign for a little less than I estimated, maybe the cap goes up a bit more than $2m, maybe we trade Coburn and replace him with a rooke to save $1m).

But at this point, I'm trying to make peace with the idea of losing one of them. I think we don't have the depth to lose one of the d-men, so it would be either Cirelli or Joseph. We might need to approach it that we keep whichever of the two will sign for less, so that would probably mean trading Cirelli.

 

[DistantThunderRep]

I don't know, I think we could end up in a position next year where we can't keep everyone (in addition to losing Killorn).

We're looking at giving raises to Joseph and Cirelli, Serg and Cernak, and Vasy.

Let's assume Point signs this year for $8.5m and next year the cap goes up by $2m. And assume we go with minimum contracts everywhere else: Killer's replacement at $700k, Verhaeghe still at $700k, Martel or a replacement at $700k, Rutta's replacement at $700k, whoever we replace Miller with this year still making $700k.

That leaves us just $17m in total salary to distribute among the 5 guys I mentioned above. For sake of argument, let's say it takes $8m to sign Vasy, leaving $9m for Joseph, Cirelli, Serg and Cernak. I don't think that's enough.

I bet Serg will demand term and a number -- say $4.5m x 6yrs. We can probably talk Cernak into a bridge, maybe $2.5m. Joseph, let's say $2m, and that would be all the money; nothing left for Cirelli. And I think Cirelli could definitely go for $4.5m and term, maybe $2.5m to $3m if he'll take a bridge.

Now if we could get all 4 of those guys to bridge, then we can probably keep all of them -- but we'll likely have some real cap problems in 2 years when they all need to get paid, vs getting them somewhat cheaper with term next year. If we can't bridge all 4, it is still possible -- we would probably still have to bridge 3 of them but need to scrape up $2m to $3m from various places (maybe Point and Vasy sign for a little less than I estimated, maybe the cap goes up a bit more than $2m, maybe we trade Coburn and replace him with a rooke to save $1m).

But at this point, I'm trying to make peace with the idea of losing one of them. I think we can't afford to lose the d-men, so it would be either Cirelli or Joseph. We might need to approach it that we keep whichever of the two will sign for less, so that would probably mean trading Cirelli.

When I did the math, I, like an idiot, didn't add the math up properly. Yeah, we will need to make another move past Killorn, but the expansion draft might solve that problem for us.

 

[DistantThunderRep]

Quick question, can Point still show up to Development Camp without a contract? Is the choice his or the teams or is he not allowed to go because of some CBA stuff?

The reason I ask is if he can show up without a contract, what would stop him from coming to camp while negotiations are going practicing with team and then the day we can move Callahan to LTIR, he signs his contract?

 

[Master P]

 

[DFC]

I may just be daydreaming, but I feel like Kucherov did a lot better with that last year. It may be because he wasn't with Stamkos, but Point was the trigger man and Kuch was the setup guy for the most part.

I'd definitely try and start the season with them together and move on from there.

God I just want to fast forward to the playoffs next year. This season is gonna be such a drag

That was on the pp. At ES, they were brutal to start the year. Then they both exploded about 12-15 games in.

Every time they get together for more than a shift or so, they start trying to be globetrotters. It's about the most frustrating part of the team, because when they're a little more selfish, they dominate.

But yeah, I'd like to try them with cirelli too. If it doesn't work,it doesn't work. The reg season is meaningless anyway.

 

[HoseEmDown]

You guys do realize that Point, Sergachev, Cirelli, Joseph and Cernak all will have 4 RFA years left when they sign. So if any of them are looking for term they will have to take a discount because half the years are RFA. So this Point at 9 or 10M I can't see happening.

If you go by the 100k per point standard for forwards Point currently has a career average of 71 points per 82. Say you are generous and pay him based off last year, 92 points so 9.2M if a UFA. To me a RFA contract is 75% of what they would get as a UFA. So the first four years should be at 6.9 and the last four 9.2 for a total of 64.4M for 8 years which gives you an AAV of 8.05. That's a good deal for us, Point would be best served to take a bridge and then go for the 10. Cirelli right now should be getting 3.075 on a RFA deal, if he has a big year than it will go up but I can't see more than 3.5 on a bridge. Sergachev will be tougher to guage as defenseman don't go by the same standard.

 

[BoltzManConstant]

When I did the math, I, like an idiot, didn't add the math up properly. Yeah, we will need to make another move past Killorn, but the expansion draft might solve that problem for us.

Actually, the expansion draft isn't until the year after -- summer 2021. So no help there.

We could open up a little daylight by getting rid of all our third-tier guys making around $1m-$2m and replacing them with guys at the minimum. Paquette, Coburn and Erne will probably be making about $4.4m between them, and we could replace them with guys making $2.1m; the net $2.3m that would open up might be just enough space.
But if we dip into Syracuse to fill those 3 spots _and_ to replace Killer and Rutta, well that's a heck of a youth movement.

 

[Crunchrulz]

Actually, the expansion draft isn't until the year after -- summer 2021. So no help there.

We could open up a little daylight by getting rid of all our third-tier guys making around $1m-$2m and replacing them with guys at the minimum. Paquette, Coburn and Erne will probably be making about $4.4m between them, and we could replace them with guys making $2.1m; the net $2.3m that would open up might be just enough space.
But if we dip into Syracuse to fill those 3 spots _and_ to replace Killer and Rutta, well that's a heck of a youth movement.

From the Syracuse stand point, this is possible. Will result in the Crunch getting younger and less experienced, but that is what the farm team is for. If it means keeping the "core" together for a run or two at the Cup, pull whatever strings are necessary and git-r-done!

 

[Todd1a]

I keep laughing about people freaking out that this isn't done on social media. They're still, you know, actual real people. They like to go on vacations and visit family after basically being on the road for over half the year.

I wouldn't be shocked if all the players and hockey ops staff took a solid month or two off after the playoffs to heal and rest.

Ya but we were only in the playoffs 6 days so they had 3 months off already

 

[Todd1a]

Quick question, can Point still show up to Development Camp without a contract? Is the choice his or the teams or is he not allowed to go because of some CBA stuff?

The reason I ask is if he can show up without a contract, what would stop him from coming to camp while negotiations are going practicing with team and then the day we can move Callahan to LTIR, he signs his contract?

No point would not show up to camp with out a contract done

 

[DistantThunderRep]

No point would not show up to camp with out a contract done

Why wouldn't he? If they have all the contract written up and they know they Re going to sign it, why wouldnt he show up and sign it after Cally had been moved to LTIR?

I didn't want an opinion either, I wanted to know if there was any rules against that?

 

[Rschmitz]

Why wouldn't he? If they have all the contract written up and they know they Re going to sign it, why wouldnt he show up and sign it after Cally had been moved to LTIR?

I didn't want an opinion either, I wanted to know if there was any rules against that?

I don’t believe they need contracts for training camp, that’s why you can invite non-roster players. Having said that, those players have everything to gain, someone with a fat contract to sign has a lot to lose if they suffer an injury. Wouldn’t be the first time players have been hurt without a contract and suffered for it.

 

[DistantThunderRep]

I don’t believe they need contracts for training camp, that’s why you can invite non-roster players. Having said that, those players have everything to gain, someone with a fat contract to sign has a lot to lose if they suffer an injury. Wouldn’t be the first time players have been hurt without a contract and suffered for it.

What if the the contract is signed just not submitted? The commitment is there but just not ratified by the CBA and NHL.

 

[Rschmitz]

What if the the contract is signed just not submitted? The commitment is there but just not ratified by the CBA and NHL.

The NHL ratifies contracts very quickly, that is a non-factor. As a thought experiment let’s assume we live in a world where messages and papers were delivered by pigeons and it takes time for the NHL to approve, well then it’s still up to the player if they want to take on the risk, they are still allowed to play. If the player and Bolts sign and submit, the only thing stopping the transaction is if the NHL revokes the contract, if they don’t but before they approve Point loses an arm in a freak accident, the Bolts can’t abort. Same thing with Point

 

[These Are The Days]

Coming up on 1,000 boys. New thread needs a catchy name..... "Part 2.1?"

 

[DistantThunderRep]

Coming up on 1,000 boys. New thread needs a catchy name..... "Part 2.1?"

Brayden Point Part 2: What's the Point?

 

[DistantThunderRep]

The NHL ratifies contracts very quickly, that is a non-factor. As a thought experiment let’s assume we live in a world where messages and papers were delivered by pigeons and it takes time for the NHL to approve, well then it’s still up to the player if they want to take on the risk, they are still allowed to play. If the player and Bolts sign and submit, the only thing stopping the transaction is if the NHL revokes the contract, if they don’t but before they approve Point loses an arm in a freak accident, the Bolts can’t abort. Same thing with Point

But if the contract is written up and signed but not submitted, it's still a document of intent which would still be upheld.

 

[DFC]

Brayden Point Part II: Boiling Point

 

[Rschmitz]

But if the contract is written up and signed but not submitted, it's still a document of intent which would still be upheld.

Correct, as long as it doesn't violate the CBA.