HAPPY BIRTHDAY! BORJE SALMING'S 70th on April 17 - How good was he?

[notDatsyuk]

For me, having watched them both in their primes, it's tough to pick between Horton and Salming. Both great skaters, but different eras: while Horton was told not to carry the puck, Salming had a green light.

Comparables? Better than Coffey, almost as good as Lidstrom, tougher than either.

 

[5mokey]

I would like to add a qoute by the late great George "Chief" Armstrong who played for the Leafs from 1950 -71.
"He was the most talented player to ever wear the Toronto Maple Leafs uniform".

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[Mugzy97]

Happy birthday legend

 

[socko]

 

[Thornbury]

Not a Hab fan "AT ALL", but in the 1976 Cup final, I wanted Montreal to stomp the Flyers. Got my wish. Think what the game may have evolved into if that Hab team did not stop that run. Many owners, Ballard at the lead had accepted that method. Meathead hockey.

Well, you had to get some muscle in your lineup so your skill guys wouldn't get killed by the Flyers. I really thought the refs let them get away with way too much crap. The old "we can't call everything" excuse.

 

[Chimpradamus]

There's very little footage of him, but there's this:


And a long documentary. Sadly it's in Swedish, but quite a bit of it is interviews with people who speak English:


English section: 17:57 and onwards, interview with Dave Schultz about Salming, Sittler, the Toronto coach, Gretzky and others. Salming says again he didn't know who he was fighting and that he knew he had to to hand out some punishment, otherwise the other players would never respect him.

Notable things: His dad died in a mining accident and Börje lived a very rudimentary and tough life as a kid. People around really noticed he was special at 8-9 year of age. Salming loves nature, to fish and to hunt. His teammates LOVED to hear stories about his rough upbringing. He also had a very good relation with Ballard, probably one of very few who had that. That's probably why he stayed and Ballard loved him, so he never traded him.

Back in Sweden it's pretty much guaranteed it's him and Lidström who are the greatest Swedish D-men.

 

[justloveleafs]

Signed him up over a month ago, our ceo still hasn't announced it, he has umpteen other pr's also. So I wait, but not that patiently at this point. Can't give out the name of the company either. Cause its public.

 

[Mess]

Borje "The King" Salming has always been among my favourite Leafs of all time back when it all began in 1974.

 

[justloveleafs]

Finally, I think I get to announce Borje next week, he is slated to be interviewed by a dear friend, a great guy, Joe Tilley, next Thursday.

Hockey players, are when you get to know most of them, some of the most fun guys. They know, every game could be their last.

They know, how amazing, they had to be, to get into one game, in the NHL.

That is why, its so cool, to know a few of them, or maybe a lot of them, or maybe just one.

They know how darn lucky they are, and they know their parents, coaches, etc. got them scaled up to even be in the show.

Anyways, been ten weeks till I get to share, a friend, a guy that was incredibly popular, with his teammates, with the city of Toronto, and certainly, with the whole country of Sweden.

I would love to have a ongoing thread with Borje, with us, just being able to ask, very non, invasive questions.

Just cool hockey stuff.

Who was tough, who was the funniest in the locker room, stuff like that.

The world has too much of the flaming stuff, lets have some fun, and let a pretty GUD, pro, who still has an NHL, body, talk about hockey.

I personally, want to hear about Lanny Mcdonald, Darryl Sittler.

Positive stuff. I want to hear about how good Rick Vaives shot was. How the heck did he score from the blueline, time in and time again.

 

[justloveleafs]

Here is a really cool show too. Wendel, Vaive, Russ Courtnall, great stuff. And LEEMS.

Gary Leeman was a really good player for us, we had to give him up to get Dougie.

Long stuff, but heck, i just love the leafs.

Listen to these guys,l they all love the game. They know, they were blessed to play in the show.

Get these guys to say a bad word about anyone, even Mike Babcock, very, very, very rare.

They know the price they had to pay to get where they got to, and they know Babcock worked his pair off as well.

NHLers are like fire fighters, marines, they just don't talk bad shop. At first that annoyed me, now, it impresses me, a lot.

If you ever get the pleasure of hanging some time with any of these guys, I think you will be impressed. Really good peeps.

 

[therealkoho]

Here is a really cool show too. Wendel, Vaive, Russ Courtnall, great stuff. And LEEMS.

Gary Leeman was a really good player for us, we had to give him up to get Dougie.

Long stuff, but heck, i just love the leafs.

Listen to these guys,l they all love the game. They know, they were blessed to play in the show.

Get these guys to say a bad word about anyone, even Mike Babcock, very, very, very rare.

They know the price they had to pay to get where they got to, and they know Babcock worked his pair off as well.

NHLers are like fire fighters, marines, they just don't talk bad shop. At first that annoyed me, now, it impresses me, a lot.

If you ever get the pleasure of hanging some time with any of these guys, I think you will be impressed. Really good peeps.

Not exactly, Leeman had 4 excellent seasons as a Leaf, but his play had noticeably slipped after the 50 goal season, that and figuring in the rumours about a major rift in the dressing room that Leeman was squarely in the middle of, the Leafs actually wanted him gone, and so they really didn't "give him up." The Flames had soured on Gilmour after a prolonged contract dispute and arbitration which paid him a lot more then the Flames had wanted to go. Calgary saw Leeman as a player making a lot less money and one who they could rehabilitate, they also got a lot younger on the blueline and in net at the same time.

No matter how it's added up however the Flames got burned hard.

 

[justloveleafs]

For me, having watched them both in their primes, it's tough to pick between Horton and Salming. Both great skaters, but different eras: while Horton was told not to carry the puck, Salming had a green light.

Comparables? Better than Coffey, almost as good as Lidstrom, tougher than either.

You, are describing, quite a defenceman.

 

[justloveleafs]

Typical of Borje, typical of almost any guy, who played in the show. Who, somehow, stuck around, excelled.

They know, they still tingle, that they were there. That they made it, and so many buddies, who were as good as them, or in some cirucmstances, were better. Didn't make the show.

Anyways, he will never say anything negative about any guy, who tried to get to the show, or who got there, and didn't stay long.

That ain't borje. quite frankly, it ain't connor brown. Or Auston Matthews.

Anyways, here is one of his pride and joys, his daughter, Bianca, a great athlete in her own right.

With Borje. Allt du vill veta om Bianca Salming

 

[Bluelines]

Full disclosure, I was born in 1990 so he retired around the same time I was born... So I've never got the chance to see him play.

I watched a short video about Salming last night and it got me looking into stats and numbers and it's quite obvious he was our best defenseman of all-time without a doubt.

Here is Borje's Maple Leaf regular season stat line:
GP 1,099 (ranks #2 in Leafs history among Defensemen behind Tim Horton - 1,184)
G 148 (ranks #1 in Leafs history among Defensemen by a large margin, #2 Red Kelly at 119)
A 620 (ranks #1 in Leafs history among Defensemen by a large margin, #2 is Tomas Kaberle at 437)
P 768 (ranks #1 in Leafs history among Defensemen by a large margin, #2 is Tomas Kaberle at 520)
Plus/Minus +150 (ranks #2 in Leafs history among ALL SKATERS behind Tim Horton, +151)
P/GP - 0.70

Other stats ranked among all-time regular season Leafs defensemen:
Powerplay goals - ranks 2nd
Powerplay points - ranks 1st
Shorthanded goals - ranks 1st
Game winning goals - ranks 6th
Shots on goal - ranks 1st

Here is his Maple Leaf playoff stats:
GP - 81 (ranks #4 among defensemen)
G -12 (rank #3 among defensemen)
A - (ranks #2 among defensemen)
P - (ranks #2 among defensemen)


These numbers are unbelievable! On top of these numbers, he was said to be an amazing defensive defenseman as well. Wendell Clarke said he blocked more shots than some goalies but never missed too many games due to injury. Tough as nails considering the gear he must have worn comparable to today.

Just for fun I compared his numbers to Morgan Rielly's current pace since he has about half the games played than Salming did.
GP - 556
G - 58
A - 239
P - 297
P/GP - 0.53

If Rielly finished his career at his current career pace and played the same amount of games as Salming, he would finish with approx 116 goals, 478 assists, 594 points. NOWHERE NEAR Salming's numbers in any category. This isn't meant to bash Rielly, just using him as a comparison to Salming to give myself an idea of just how good Salming must have been! Although it is possible, these numbers may never be reached in my lifetime.

Your missing the part about how he was mugged every night and still played elite hockey. He was one of the first Euros to come over to North America and there were different rules back then, one for Canadian and American players and another for Euros. Not exaggerating there was stuff that went on out there that today would be an assault charge. The thought that he endured through that abuse and still was one of the greats of all time. It's just a testament to the man, his elite skill and his character.

 

[Notsince67]

Not sure where the stereotype of soft Swede came from because Salming was the first and he was tough as nails.

 

[Mess]

Borje was one of the best Dmen to ever play for the Blue & White.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Here is a really cool show too. Wendel, Vaive, Russ Courtnall, great stuff. And LEEMS.

Gary Leeman was a really good player for us, we had to give him up to get Dougie.

Long stuff, but heck, i just love the leafs.

Listen to these guys,l they all love the game. They know, they were blessed to play in the show.

Get these guys to say a bad word about anyone, even Mike Babcock, very, very, very rare.

They know the price they had to pay to get where they got to, and they know Babcock worked his pair off as well.

NHLers are like fire fighters, marines, they just don't talk bad shop. At first that annoyed me, now, it impresses me, a lot.

If you ever get the pleasure of hanging some time with any of these guys, I think you will be impressed. Really good peeps.

I know what you mean. In the early 80s I was lucky enough to be a practice goalie for about 20 weeks for Brian Conacher's group of Maple Leaf oldtimers.

Playing was a lot of fun, and I managed to avoid being embarrassed only by reminding myself that the guy who just deked me out of my jock has his name on the Stanley Cup four times.

But even better was the time spent in the dressing room afterwards. Often as long as two hours, just listening to them swap stories.

One of my proudest moments was when Brian Conacher told me my style reminded him of Johnny Bower, who, with Tim Horton, were my idols growing up.

One of my sons is a goalie, and a few years ago he played in a Pro-Am tournament, and was picked to play in the final, where half the players on each team were former NHLers.

I got to play with Red Kelly, Carl Brewer, and Eddie Shack: he got to play with Rick Vaive and Darryl Sittler.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Full disclosure, I was born in 1990 so he retired around the same time I was born... So I've never got the chance to see him play.

I watched a short video about Salming last night and it got me looking into stats and numbers and it's quite obvious he was our best defenseman of all-time without a doubt.

Here is Borje's Maple Leaf regular season stat line:
GP 1,099 (ranks #2 in Leafs history among Defensemen behind Tim Horton - 1,184)
G 148 (ranks #1 in Leafs history among Defensemen by a large margin, #2 Red Kelly at 119)
A 620 (ranks #1 in Leafs history among Defensemen by a large margin, #2 is Tomas Kaberle at 437)
P 768 (ranks #1 in Leafs history among Defensemen by a large margin, #2 is Tomas Kaberle at 520)
Plus/Minus +150 (ranks #2 in Leafs history among ALL SKATERS behind Tim Horton, +151)
P/GP - 0.70

Other stats ranked among all-time regular season Leafs defensemen:
Powerplay goals - ranks 2nd
Powerplay points - ranks 1st
Shorthanded goals - ranks 1st
Game winning goals - ranks 6th
Shots on goal - ranks 1st

Here is his Maple Leaf playoff stats:
GP - 81 (ranks #4 among defensemen)
G -12 (rank #3 among defensemen)
A - (ranks #2 among defensemen)
P - (ranks #2 among defensemen)


These numbers are unbelievable! On top of these numbers, he was said to be an amazing defensive defenseman as well. Wendell Clarke said he blocked more shots than some goalies but never missed too many games due to injury. Tough as nails considering the gear he must have worn comparable to today.

Just for fun I compared his numbers to Morgan Rielly's current pace since he has about half the games played than Salming did.
GP - 556
G - 58
A - 239
P - 297
P/GP - 0.53

If Rielly finished his career at his current career pace and played the same amount of games as Salming, he would finish with approx 116 goals, 478 assists, 594 points. NOWHERE NEAR Salming's numbers in any category. This isn't meant to bash Rielly, just using him as a comparison to Salming to give myself an idea of just how good Salming must have been! Although it is possible, these numbers may never be reached in my lifetime.

You have to be careful comparing eras and quoting stats.

Horton played in an era with generally less scoring, and when a defenceman rushing the puck or jumping into the attack was frowned upon, if not outright forbidden by the coach. Salming was one if the first, and best, at doing it.

As for stats, I'd point out two things:

1) Tim Horton played nine of his twenty-four seasons before they started keeping track of +/-.

2) Red Kelly was a defenceman when he played for Detroit, but played center for the Leafs. #2 in goals as a Leaf defenceman is Ian Turnbull, who spent most of his time paired with Salming, with 112, and then Tim Horton with 109.

None of which detracts from the fact that Borje was one of the best defencemen ever to play in the NHL, and possibly the best to play for the Leafs.