OT: Bombers Thread: Bombers down Sask. Next West Final @CGY Nov 18

[Board Bard]

People said the same stuff about Glenn. Then we got rid of him and turned into the worst franchise in the league for close to a decade. Takes some a while to learn this lesson I guess.

What difference does it make if you're losing with Nichols or Joe Benchwarmer? You're still losing. Does it make you feel better losing with Nichols? I hope so, because that's all you're going to get out of him.

 

[bustamente]

Bombers have quite a few free agents like other teams, at least the re signs are starting already.

 

[None]

Bryant already confirmed, so I assume Hardrick gets signed pretty quickly now.
Goossen and Chungh are both FAs, Goossen the slightly more important of the two by playing centre.



I wonder if the officials would ever consider walking out because of a dispute over discipline. Everything questionable will be called against him if he does play.

 

[Mbraunm]

People said the same stuff about Glenn. Then we got rid of him and turned into the worst franchise in the league for close to a decade. Takes some a while to learn this lesson I guess.

Sorry, but Nichols does not have the ability to CARRY a team. The best that he can consistently is pass for 150-200 yards to “manage a game”. That level of ability will NEVER win a Grey Cup.

We will NEVER win a Cup with Nichols as QB. He is not a good QB period-below average-cannot consistently pass over 10 yards!

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Bryant already confirmed, so I assume Hardrick gets signed pretty quickly now.
Goossen and Chungh are both FAs, Goossen the slightly more important of the two by playing centre.

I'll be pretty surprised if our O-Line next year doesn't open as Bryant - Gray - Goossen - Chung - Hardwick with Couture and Spooner as extra guys. O-Line is not a spot I am concerned about.

In fact the offense will likely look very similar, IMO. With hopefully one more big play WR in the mix.

The concerns are on the defense. Roh, Sayles, Fenner, Gaitor, Bryant are signed for sure. Jeffcoat and Santos-Knox are in line for huge raises coming off their rookie deals, will be hard to retain. Not sure the status of Loffler, Randle, Alexander, Okpaulago but I think all are free agents and I'm pretty sure Fogg and Nevis are free agents. But that's alot of moving pieces. Bighill is the big one of course and he is also in line for a big raise from the discount they got on him this year. Hard to say how this will come together. Leggatt will retire, IMO, unfortunately.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

There are a lot of qb's around the league that could look fantastic behind that O-Line.

If I were an official, I would refuse to referee the Grey Cup unless Rose is suspended. They get 0 respect as it is.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

There are a lot of qb's around the league that could look fantastic behind that O-Line.

If I were an official, I would refuse to referee the Grey Cup unless Rose is suspended. They get 0 respect as it is.

Really who?

Here's the cold hard reality of those that want an outside solution to Nichols. Who do you get? Harris and Masoli aren't going anywhere. Reilly won't sign east of Edmonton (BC, CGY, EDM, only) he has stated this many times. Bo Levi is going NFL. So who is an improvement on Nichols that the Bombers can realistically get? Lulay won't leave BC. So basically your looking at Jennings, Collaros, Bridge, Adams as free agent QB's with any experience. None of those are an improvement on Nichols.

What's going to happen is that Nichols will return to the Bombers with short leash on the starting job. Streveler with a year in the league now will be pushing hard for the starting role. This year it was just never going to happen, but next year is a different story. O'Shea has not shied away from changing his starting QB as we've seen in the past, it's just he didn't have an option this year with a raw rookie behind Nichols.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

Really who?

Here's the cold hard reality of those that want an outside solution to Nichols. Who do you get? Harris and Masoli aren't going anywhere. Reilly won't sign east of Edmonton (BC, CGY, EDM, only) he has stated this many times. Bo Levi is going NFL. So who is an improvement on Nichols that the Bombers can realistically get? Lulay won't leave BC. So basically your looking at Jennings, Collaros, Bridge, Adams as free agent QB's with any experience. None of those are an improvement on Nichols.

What's going to happen is that Nichols will return to the Bombers with short leash on the starting job. Streveler with a year in the league now will be pushing hard for the starting role. This year it was just never going to happen, but next year is a different story. O'Shea has not shied away from changing his starting QB as we've seen in the past, it's just he didn't have an option this year with a raw rookie behind Nichols.

I'd advocate for a QB room of Streveller, Bethel-Thompson, and another developmental QB.

I realize this would really lower the floor of the bombers, but I think it would raise the ceiling as well. I'm more of a general CFL fan, so I just hope the bombers win the Grey Cup. Making the playoffs and losing with a 9-12 win team means nothing to me.

I'm sure if you're a die-hard bomber fan, you'll have a different opinion, but I see no path to a Grey Cup with Nichols as QB.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

I'd advocate for a QB room of Streveller, Bethel-Thompson, and another developmental QB.

I realize this would really lower the floor of the bombers, but I think it would raise the ceiling as well. I'm more of a general CFL fan, so I just hope the bombers win the Grey Cup. Making the playoffs and losing with a 9-12 win team means nothing to me.

I'm sure if you're a die-hard bomber fan, you'll have a different opinion, but I see no path to a Grey Cup with Nichols as QB.

This is what Mike Kelly did when he arrived. You don't get rid of the veteran guy and go with unproven players. That is a recipe for a decade of struggle. You need to have your replacement plan in place before you release the veteran guy you know can be ok. Just basic sense.

Bethel-Thompson does absolutely nothing for me, he is best a cut rate Nichols. He's also OLDER than Nichols, so no upside.

 

[snowkiddin]

I'll be pretty surprised if our O-Line next year doesn't open as Bryant - Gray - Goossen - Chung - Hardwick with Couture and Spooner as extra guys. O-Line is not a spot I am concerned about.

In fact the offense will likely look very similar, IMO. With hopefully one more big play WR in the mix.

The concerns are on the defense. Roh, Sayles, Fenner, Gaitor, Bryant are signed for sure. Jeffcoat and Santos-Knox are in line for huge raises coming off their rookie deals, will be hard to retain. Not sure the status of Loffler, Randle, Alexander, Okpaulago but I think all are free agents and I'm pretty sure Fogg and Nevis are free agents. But that's alot of moving pieces. Bighill is the big one of course and he is also in line for a big raise from the discount they got on him this year. Hard to say how this will come together. Leggatt will retire, IMO, unfortunately.

Bauming was on Twitter with the free agency status of all the Bombers. Nevis and Fogg are both free agents. Nevis is pretty decent, but it’s not the end of the world if he’s gone. I don’t want Fogg starting and he wasn’t great returning this year, so he can go too. Alexander is a free agent too, hopefully they can get someone better than him. Unfortunately, Randle will be back next year, hopefully they find someone else who can actually cover. Loffler is a free agent, I feel they’ll re-sign him though. Leggett needs to retire for his health’s safety, and even if he comes back, I’m not sure he’ll be great anymore. Wild will probably retire too.

Offensively, I agree the team will probably be about the same. LaFrance and Flanders will be gone, so I’d say after Harris, Augustine is the new backup. Dressler wants to come back. Receivers should be Adams, Dressler, Wolitarsky, Demski, Petermann and Simonise. Hopefully they find someone better to replace Thompkins - a big guy like you say. The O Line will likely be exactly as you say. QB will probably be Nichols. I’m lay with bringing him back as the starter, but he needs to have a short leash. Streveler should be next in line, he should get a shot. Bennett can come back for his work on the teams, if not, just a warm body is okay.

Medlock might retire, and if he does, we should definitely go with a Canadian in his place. What happened to Menard-Briere? We’ll likely need a separate punter and kicker if Medlock leaves.

I’d bring Nelson back and give him a shot at returner. Our return game was trash this year, but he gave a little bit of hope in the playoffs.

 

[snowkiddin]

I’m torn because I don’t think you can win a Grey Cup with Nichols, but they did win a Grey Cup with Sean Salisbury, who wasn’t anything incredible.

And I don’t want to go back to the carousel of Hall of Shame QBs (LeFors, Hall, Brohm, Goltz, Marve, Davis, etc.) that we’ve had since kicking Glenn to the curb.

 

[Flair Hay]

Sorry, but Nichols does not have the ability to CARRY a team. The best that he can consistently is pass for 150-200 yards to “manage a game”. That level of ability will NEVER win a Grey Cup.

We will NEVER win a Cup with Nichols as QB. He is not a good QB period-below average-cannot consistently pass over 10 yards!

I dont even disagree hes not great. But I disagree they cant win with him

 

[Flair Hay]

What difference does it make if you're losing with Nichols or Joe Benchwarmer? You're still losing. Does it make you feel better losing with Nichols? I hope so, because that's all you're going to get out of him.

Yeah. I feel better about us making west finals than I did while we were developing alex brink... come on

 

[ps241]

Not sure if anyone saw “I shouldn’t be here: the Andrew Harris Story” on TSN last night. I thought it was put together well and very interesting. He has become my favorite CFL running back in a long long time.

 

[snowkiddin]

Not sure if anyone saw “I shouldn’t be here: the Andrew Harris Story” on TSN last night. I thought it was put together well and very interesting. He has become my favorite CFL running back in a long long time.

My favourite since Charlie Roberts. Roberts was a childhood favourite of mine, my all time fav, but Harris is definitely up there, especially being Canadian and a Winnipegger to boot. Will always appreciate how he came home during free agency. I might even like Harris a bit more than Blink

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Bauming was on Twitter with the free agency status of all the Bombers. Nevis and Fogg are both free agents. Nevis is pretty decent, but it’s not the end of the world if he’s gone. I don’t want Fogg starting and he wasn’t great returning this year, so he can go too. Alexander is a free agent too, hopefully they can get someone better than him. Unfortunately, Randle will be back next year, hopefully they find someone else who can actually cover. Loffler is a free agent, I feel they’ll re-sign him though. Leggett needs to retire for his health’s safety, and even if he comes back, I’m not sure he’ll be great anymore. Wild will probably retire too.

Offensively, I agree the team will probably be about the same. LaFrance and Flanders will be gone, so I’d say after Harris, Augustine is the new backup. Dressler wants to come back. Receivers should be Adams, Dressler, Wolitarsky, Demski, Petermann and Simonise. Hopefully they find someone better to replace Thompkins - a big guy like you say. The O Line will likely be exactly as you say. QB will probably be Nichols. I’m lay with bringing him back as the starter, but he needs to have a short leash. Streveler should be next in line, he should get a shot. Bennett can come back for his work on the teams, if not, just a warm body is okay.

Medlock might retire, and if he does, we should definitely go with a Canadian in his place. What happened to Menard-Briere? We’ll likely need a separate punter and kicker if Medlock leaves.

I’d bring Nelson back and give him a shot at returner. Our return game was trash this year, but he gave a little bit of hope in the playoffs.

Before I get into it, on Menard-Briere he was offered a practice roster spot out of camp. He rejected it. A week later he then signed in Ottawa on their practice roster. I believe he was released off the practice roster in Ottawa sometime during the summer. He was a punter only though and I think he has moved on from football at this point.

I really like Augustine, I think he will replace Harris in 2-3 years when he retires. Harris was a backup his first few years as well, iirc Cornish bounced around a bit too it sometimes takes a while for Canadian backs to establish themselves. I was really hoping the Bombers would draft him two years ago.

As for receivers I think we again go with just two nationals. So Petermann and Simonise will be backups again. I do think both are potential starters though, IMO. We have never had better canadian receivers in the past 25 years, IMO. I'm not sure if Dressler will be back for another year. His role diminished as the year went on, IMO. We'll see if he wants to come back for another year and if the Bombers want him back. We need some playmakers in the receiving corps, at least one more big deep threat to take some pressure off Adams, who is more of a #2, IMO. As long as it's not that jackass Carter.

The O-Line will drive this team again, but I think Gray will be there for Neufeld. I know they love Neufeld but Gray should be starting next year and Neufeld is the easiest to replace.

I don't get the hate for Fogg. I think he's been a very solid DB and his return ability is just a bonus. He's not a superstar but he's been consistent. Ditto Alexander. Randle plays the "hot" corner so he is always going to be a lightning rod. Much like Jovon Johnson, anybody who plays that spot is either a hero or a zero, depending on the play. I think Randle has been real solid there, he is very well regarded around the league for a reason. There's just very very few better corners in the CFL. We had one of the best pass D's in the league this year. Calgary allowed 11 passing TD's, we allowed 15 and next lowest was at 23. We were 5th in pass yards against. Altogether pretty solid. Loffler likely back.

The DL is likely set with Okpalaugo, Nevis, Bryant, Roh next year, IMO. We likely can't afford to keep Jeffcoat after his breakout year so Rivers or a rookie steps in as the other rotational DE. Jake Thomas is likely back as a backup DT.

The LB corps is where is gets interesting. Leggett likely done. Gaitor and Fenner are both signed for next year so both are back as the cover LB/extra HB. Where it gets interesting is that Bighill and Santos-Knox need BIG raises. Both there is no internal options right now since Wild is likely retired or back as a STer and backup (he is apparently one of if not the best leader on the defense) and Kyrie Wilson has never really shown much, IMO. They need both of those guys back. But can they afford them?

Special teams there is no question that things need to change. Our return game was atrocious this year. Fogg had spurts in the punt return and field goal return, but it decreased noticably as the year went on. In kick return we were terrible. One of the issues with holding onto an international kicker/punter means that there is no room on roster for an international KR/PR guy. So we need a starter with KR ability next year, and no Lankford is not an option because despite his versatility he is terrible as a WR. Medlock is back next year he has already said, despite in year's past him talking about retirement this year he said he is coming back.

At QB there's just no better options than bringing back Nichols on a short leash with Streveler pushing. I know there's some concerns about Streveler's arm but I think he will be a player. Next year, unlike this one, I think he has a legitimate shot to unseat Nichols.

Overall I think we agree on most things, except the secondary. I think once we went away from the passive sit back approach we saw the true potential of the defense and secondary. No one is going to cover if you give the opponant QB all day.

Going into the off-season this is my list.
Needs
1. Retain Bighill and Santos-Knox
2. Add a big speedy WR to complement Adams
3. Improve the return game

Wants (but unlikely to get)
1. Elite shutdown corner to move Randle to wide side
2. Either retain Jeffcoat or add elite pass rushing DE
3. Elite QB

Here's the thing. The Bombers are a veteran team with quality young nationals. This is a team set up to win for quite a while. With starting canadians in their prime at S, C, RG, SB, WR and quality young canadians at LG, backup SB, backup WR, backup OL x2/3 this means this is a team that should be able to contend for quite a while despite the older internationals which are easier to replace. The key will be tweaking it and finding the answer at QB. I think the Bombers will take a run at Reilly, Harris, Bo Levi but I'd be SHOCKED if they manage to get any of them.

 

[GNP]

Before I get into it, on Menard-Briere he was offered a practice roster spot out of camp. He rejected it. A week later he then signed in Ottawa on their practice roster. I believe he was released off the practice roster in Ottawa sometime during the summer. He was a punter only though and I think he has moved on from football at this point.

I really like Augustine, I think he will replace Harris in 2-3 years when he retires. Harris was a backup his first few years as well, iirc Cornish bounced around a bit too it sometimes takes a while for Canadian backs to establish themselves. I was really hoping the Bombers would draft him two years ago.

As for receivers I think we again go with just two nationals. So Petermann and Simonise will be backups again. I do think both are potential starters though, IMO. We have never had better canadian receivers in the past 25 years, IMO. I'm not sure if Dressler will be back for another year. His role diminished as the year went on, IMO. We'll see if he wants to come back for another year and if the Bombers want him back. We need some playmakers in the receiving corps, at least one more big deep threat to take some pressure off Adams, who is more of a #2, IMO. As long as it's not that jackass Carter.

The O-Line will drive this team again, but I think Gray will be there for Neufeld. I know they love Neufeld but Gray should be starting next year and Neufeld is the easiest to replace.

I don't get the hate for Fogg. I think he's been a very solid DB and his return ability is just a bonus. He's not a superstar but he's been consistent. Ditto Alexander. Randle plays the "hot" corner so he is always going to be a lightning rod. Much like Jovon Johnson, anybody who plays that spot is either a hero or a zero, depending on the play. I think Randle has been real solid there, he is very well regarded around the league for a reason. There's just very very few better corners in the CFL. We had one of the best pass D's in the league this year. Calgary allowed 11 passing TD's, we allowed 15 and next lowest was at 23. We were 5th in pass yards against. Altogether pretty solid. Loffler likely back.

The DL is likely set with Okpalaugo, Nevis, Bryant, Roh next year, IMO. We likely can't afford to keep Jeffcoat after his breakout year so Rivers or a rookie steps in as the other rotational DE. Jake Thomas is likely back as a backup DT.

The LB corps is where is gets interesting. Leggett likely done. Gaitor and Fenner are both signed for next year so both are back as the cover LB/extra HB. Where it gets interesting is that Bighill and Santos-Knox need BIG raises. Both there is no internal options right now since Wild is likely retired or back as a STer and backup (he is apparently one of if not the best leader on the defense) and Kyrie Wilson has never really shown much, IMO. They need both of those guys back. But can they afford them?

Special teams there is no question that things need to change. Our return game was atrocious this year. Fogg had spurts in the punt return and field goal return, but it decreased noticably as the year went on. In kick return we were terrible. One of the issues with holding onto an international kicker/punter means that there is no room on roster for an international KR/PR guy. So we need a starter with KR ability next year, and no Lankford is not an option because despite his versatility he is terrible as a WR. Medlock is back next year he has already said, despite in year's past him talking about retirement this year he said he is coming back.

At QB there's just no better options than bringing back Nichols on a short leash with Streveler pushing. I know there's some concerns about Streveler's arm but I think he will be a player. Next year, unlike this one, I think he has a legitimate shot to unseat Nichols.

Overall I think we agree on most things, except the secondary. I think once we went away from the passive sit back approach we saw the true potential of the defense and secondary. No one is going to cover if you give the opponant QB all day.

Going into the off-season this is my list.
Needs
1. Retain Bighill and Santos-Knox
2. Add a big speedy WR to complement Adams
3. Improve the return game

Wants (but unlikely to get)
1. Elite shutdown corner to move Randle to wide side
2. Either retain Jeffcoat or add elite pass rushing DE
3. Elite QB

Here's the thing. The Bombers are a veteran team with quality young nationals. This is a team set up to win for quite a while. With starting canadians in their prime at S, C, RG, SB, WR and quality young canadians at LG, backup SB, backup WR, backup OL x2/3 this means this is a team that should be able to contend for quite a while despite the older internationals which are easier to replace. The key will be tweaking it and finding the answer at QB. I think the Bombers will take a run at Reilly, Harris, Bo Levi but I'd be SHOCKED if they manage to get any of them.

_____________________________________________________

Good long post Holden --I just don't see Strevler being accurate enough with his throwing. Personally I think Nichols is better, and good enough to win with. Actually he's pretty good, when it comes to accuracy, and low interceptions. He's not a superstar, but he's pretty consistent, "except for the big games."

I don't know if you can teach touch and accuracy to a quarterback ?- either you have it or you don't. You can improve the QB on his timing, and understanding the routes his receivers are running, but that's about it. I'm not sure Strevler has it, but he's a great short yardage guy, and good runner. I haven't seen enough of him yet tho.

I'm starting to think the problem with Nichols is "confidence"-- he just doesn't seem to have it for the big games, but during the regular season he's good. Look at a guy like Mitchell --he's arrogant, and does not lack confidence, and it shows on the field.

If I was the Bombers, I'd try to get Nichols to work with a sport's psychologist, and see if that helps? I'd go with Nichols next year, and see how it goes. If he starts to head downwards, I'd start looking down south for a young quarterback.

I think the defense is just fine --I guess you could tweak it a bit, but that's certainly not why we lost to the Stamps--the defense played really well.

 

[snowkiddin]

Before I get into it, on Menard-Briere he was offered a practice roster spot out of camp. He rejected it. A week later he then signed in Ottawa on their practice roster. I believe he was released off the practice roster in Ottawa sometime during the summer. He was a punter only though and I think he has moved on from football at this point.

I really like Augustine, I think he will replace Harris in 2-3 years when he retires. Harris was a backup his first few years as well, iirc Cornish bounced around a bit too it sometimes takes a while for Canadian backs to establish themselves. I was really hoping the Bombers would draft him two years ago.

As for receivers I think we again go with just two nationals. So Petermann and Simonise will be backups again. I do think both are potential starters though, IMO. We have never had better canadian receivers in the past 25 years, IMO. I'm not sure if Dressler will be back for another year. His role diminished as the year went on, IMO. We'll see if he wants to come back for another year and if the Bombers want him back. We need some playmakers in the receiving corps, at least one more big deep threat to take some pressure off Adams, who is more of a #2, IMO. As long as it's not that jackass Carter.

The O-Line will drive this team again, but I think Gray will be there for Neufeld. I know they love Neufeld but Gray should be starting next year and Neufeld is the easiest to replace.

I don't get the hate for Fogg. I think he's been a very solid DB and his return ability is just a bonus. He's not a superstar but he's been consistent. Ditto Alexander. Randle plays the "hot" corner so he is always going to be a lightning rod. Much like Jovon Johnson, anybody who plays that spot is either a hero or a zero, depending on the play. I think Randle has been real solid there, he is very well regarded around the league for a reason. There's just very very few better corners in the CFL. We had one of the best pass D's in the league this year. Calgary allowed 11 passing TD's, we allowed 15 and next lowest was at 23. We were 5th in pass yards against. Altogether pretty solid. Loffler likely back.

The DL is likely set with Okpalaugo, Nevis, Bryant, Roh next year, IMO. We likely can't afford to keep Jeffcoat after his breakout year so Rivers or a rookie steps in as the other rotational DE. Jake Thomas is likely back as a backup DT.

The LB corps is where is gets interesting. Leggett likely done. Gaitor and Fenner are both signed for next year so both are back as the cover LB/extra HB. Where it gets interesting is that Bighill and Santos-Knox need BIG raises. Both there is no internal options right now since Wild is likely retired or back as a STer and backup (he is apparently one of if not the best leader on the defense) and Kyrie Wilson has never really shown much, IMO. They need both of those guys back. But can they afford them?

Special teams there is no question that things need to change. Our return game was atrocious this year. Fogg had spurts in the punt return and field goal return, but it decreased noticably as the year went on. In kick return we were terrible. One of the issues with holding onto an international kicker/punter means that there is no room on roster for an international KR/PR guy. So we need a starter with KR ability next year, and no Lankford is not an option because despite his versatility he is terrible as a WR. Medlock is back next year he has already said, despite in year's past him talking about retirement this year he said he is coming back.

At QB there's just no better options than bringing back Nichols on a short leash with Streveler pushing. I know there's some concerns about Streveler's arm but I think he will be a player. Next year, unlike this one, I think he has a legitimate shot to unseat Nichols.

Overall I think we agree on most things, except the secondary. I think once we went away from the passive sit back approach we saw the true potential of the defense and secondary. No one is going to cover if you give the opponant QB all day.

Going into the off-season this is my list.
Needs
1. Retain Bighill and Santos-Knox
2. Add a big speedy WR to complement Adams
3. Improve the return game

Wants (but unlikely to get)
1. Elite shutdown corner to move Randle to wide side
2. Either retain Jeffcoat or add elite pass rushing DE
3. Elite QB

Here's the thing. The Bombers are a veteran team with quality young nationals. This is a team set up to win for quite a while. With starting canadians in their prime at S, C, RG, SB, WR and quality young canadians at LG, backup SB, backup WR, backup OL x2/3 this means this is a team that should be able to contend for quite a while despite the older internationals which are easier to replace. The key will be tweaking it and finding the answer at QB. I think the Bombers will take a run at Reilly, Harris, Bo Levi but I'd be SHOCKED if they manage to get any of them.

Wow. Good post. Appreciate the thoughtful and lengthy response.

Anyway, top of my list right now is to get Chungh and Goossen signed (Hardrick and Bryant are done deals apparently) and then to sign Bighill and Santos-Knox.

Secondary is not spectacular, but if our pass rush is good, it doesn’t need to be. I give Randle a hard time because I don’t think he’s elite, he constantly gets beat, but that’s part of the job. He is way better than guys we’ve had in the past like Bruce Johnson, Brandon Stewart and Matt Bucknor just to name a few. Loffler was great his rookie year, struggled last year and a menance this year. Being Canadian, he is very important to the team and I’m sure he’s back. Fogg gets picked on all the time. He does create turnovers but he gets beat so often. I’d be fine with holding on to him, but I want another (new) DB in there to push him. I thought Alexander was crappy last year (barely a step above Carmichael really) when he first came in but he improved as the year went on and was quite solid this year. He’s only 25 so he could end up being pretty decent. Sayles looked pretty good too and he’s only 24 so he has a bright future. Even Humes looked decent in limited action. I just believe that they need a few more bodies in the secondary to push these guys.

I would love to bring Jeffcoat back, but as you say he might be too pricey. It’s okay because Okpalaugo and Roh are pretty decent and the Bombers have always been good at finding good American pass rushers (Odell Willis, Phillip Hunt, Alex Hall, Jeffcoat, etc.) so they might even be able to bring in a cheap, good American to help the pass rush. Nevis and Bryant were pretty decent against the run. Thomas is an alright Canadian back up as well.

Offensively, I agree with you across the board. I’d say Neufeld likely starts the year but Gray could overtake him. For some reason, we can never find our own American receivers, so I think we should take the scraps of Edmonton or Calgary. They won’t be able to keep all their guys. If we can get someone like a Chris Matthews to push Adams down to #2, that would be ideal. I have a hunch Dressler will be back, and he’s still useful, he’s just not a game breaker anymore. He’s replaceable though if he leaves. Our Canadians remain the same IMO.

Agree 100% on QBs. There’s just no realistic upgrade. I think Reilly goes to B.C. or stays in Edmonton, Harris will probably stay in Ottawa, Masoli is signed another year with Hamilton I believe and Mitchell has NFL aspirations. The remaining QBs after that suck even harder than Nichols. I think our best bet is to start Nichols and hope we really have something in Streveler. He’s super raw, but he has the tools.

Just to touch on special teams - it’s great Medlock is back. I think almost the entire special teams are free agents, but they’re mostly replaceable guys IMO. We desperately need a good returner though. Maybe Nelson is that guy. Bring some speedy Americans into camp and try them and stick with the best. We had some decent ones a few years ago like Stoudemaire, so I’m sure we could find another.

We have 9 picks in the CFL Draft, including the 4th and 5th overall selections. I would really like us to go defense with these picks, but unfortunately after the top two, it’s mostly all receivers and offensive linemen. I’d draft a guy like Kongbo or Betts if they fell to us and weren’t gonna make the NFL, but if not maybe we go for a receiver and a lineman again, which isn’t necessarily bad.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Wow. Good post. Appreciate the thoughtful and lengthy response.

Anyway, top of my list right now is to get Chungh and Goossen signed (Hardrick and Bryant are done deals apparently) and then to sign Bighill and Santos-Knox.

Secondary is not spectacular, but if our pass rush is good, it doesn’t need to be. I give Randle a hard time because I don’t think he’s elite, he constantly gets beat, but that’s part of the job. He is way better than guys we’ve had in the past like Bruce Johnson, Brandon Stewart and Matt Bucknor just to name a few. Loffler was great his rookie year, struggled last year and a menance this year. Being Canadian, he is very important to the team and I’m sure he’s back. Fogg gets picked on all the time. He does create turnovers but he gets beat so often. I’d be fine with holding on to him, but I want another (new) DB in there to push him. I thought Alexander was crappy last year (barely a step above Carmichael really) when he first came in but he improved as the year went on and was quite solid this year. He’s only 25 so he could end up being pretty decent. Sayles looked pretty good too and he’s only 24 so he has a bright future. Even Humes looked decent in limited action. I just believe that they need a few more bodies in the secondary to push these guys.

I would love to bring Jeffcoat back, but as you say he might be too pricey. It’s okay because Okpalaugo and Roh are pretty decent and the Bombers have always been good at finding good American pass rushers (Odell Willis, Phillip Hunt, Alex Hall, Jeffcoat, etc.) so they might even be able to bring in a cheap, good American to help the pass rush. Nevis and Bryant were pretty decent against the run. Thomas is an alright Canadian back up as well.

Offensively, I agree with you across the board. I’d say Neufeld likely starts the year but Gray could overtake him. For some reason, we can never find our own American receivers, so I think we should take the scraps of Edmonton or Calgary. They won’t be able to keep all their guys. If we can get someone like a Chris Matthews to push Adams down to #2, that would be ideal. I have a hunch Dressler will be back, and he’s still useful, he’s just not a game breaker anymore. He’s replaceable though if he leaves. Our Canadians remain the same IMO.

Agree 100% on QBs. There’s just no realistic upgrade. I think Reilly goes to B.C. or stays in Edmonton, Harris will probably stay in Ottawa, Masoli is signed another year with Hamilton I believe and Mitchell has NFL aspirations. The remaining QBs after that suck even harder than Nichols. I think our best bet is to start Nichols and hope we really have something in Streveler. He’s super raw, but he has the tools.

Just to touch on special teams - it’s great Medlock is back. I think almost the entire special teams are free agents, but they’re mostly replaceable guys IMO. We desperately need a good returner though. Maybe Nelson is that guy. Bring some speedy Americans into camp and try them and stick with the best. We had some decent ones a few years ago like Stoudemaire, so I’m sure we could find another.

We have 9 picks in the CFL Draft, including the 4th and 5th overall selections. I would really like us to go defense with these picks, but unfortunately after the top two, it’s mostly all receivers and offensive linemen. I’d draft a guy like Kongbo or Betts if they fell to us and weren’t gonna make the NFL, but if not maybe we go for a receiver and a lineman again, which isn’t necessarily bad.

Man I love this informed opinions and long posts. I will have another long response to this.

I agree with you that Chung and Goossen need to be signed. I think they will get paid and I think the Bombers retain them. One thing I think the Bombers have nailed lately is the team atmosphere and I think both Goossen and Chung recognize that will come back.

With regards to secondary I think most Bomber fans overestimate what a CFL secondary can do. Teams are going to put up 250-400 yards against you regularly it's just part of the game. You compare Randle to Bruce Johnson and Brandon Stewart who were HB not corners or Matt Bucknor who was a throw away national playing the wide side, so there's no real comparaison to Randle who plays the short side corner. Short side corner is the hardest position to play in the CFL, IMO, and no one in the league is happy with their player there, IMO. Jovon Johnson was the best in the league for 4+ years and we chased him out of town. Short side corner will ALWAYS be a spot that gets beat often, just a nature of the position. Fogg for me is a guy that gets lots of heat since he is just average in coverage but is a huge ball hawk. Makes alot of great plays. Ideally he is a wide side HB or CB which is where he slotted after Sayles broke out. Love him on the wide side which is where he will be if he comes back. Sayles himself has developed as an awesome short side HB with run support in his wheelhouse, love him. Loffler was an unknown rookie who became a threat, struggled to find his identity as a sophmore and found his middle ground last year. Last year I was all we you that Alexander was crap, but he stepped up this year once he was moved out to wide side. You gave me terrible chills mentioning Carmichael what a terrible player he was. Anyways, so if we return a secondary of Randle - Sayles - Loffler - unknown/Alexander - unknown/Fogg next year I am very confident in that.

One of the underrated aspects of a secondary is if you can get pressure. A DL that can generate pressure is far more impact on a secondary than if they are actually talented, IMO. In the second half we were actually bringing pressure to the QB which is why our secondary looked much better, IMO. We were bringing more pressure which is why our secondary looked better. Our DE's seemed to finally settle in. For me I'd release Okpalaugo to keep Jeffcoat and Roh, but likely we go with Okpaulaugo and Roh. Rivers in limited time looked fairly solid as well. As you say if there's one position we are good at recruiting for it's DE. A true elite pass rushing DE would be nice, we haven't had that since Willis, IMO. Bryant as the pass rusher on a rookie deal with Nevis as the run stopper seems have been effective in the middle. Jake Thomas as a change of pace works. It's really too bad that Ekaktie wasn't able to develop as a run stopper to replace Nevis but it is what it is.

Again the LB corps is the key. We'll see what happens in free agency, but I think the #1 priority of the Bombers is to bring back Bighill and Santos-Knox.

For me I'm just not sure what Neufeld might be looking for. I think as an 18 game starter last year he might be too pricey to bring back when he's likely replaced by Gray. I think they don't retain him and open the job up to a training camp battle between Gray, Couture, and Spooner which Gray wins. I think Neufeld signs elsewhere as an assured starter since when healthy he is for a CFL starter in the middle (despite being a horrible tackle).

The thing is for years and years the ONLY position we could recruit from the US was receiver. There was a point where arguably 4 of the top 5 receivers in the CFL were all Bomber recruits (Stegall, Johnson 3rd, Simon, Gordon) I agree lately we haven't found much. We have had some good finds with Matthews, Edwards (he stared in MTL but broke out in WPG), Bowman (started in WPG, didn't develop until released into EDM), Denmark,etc. International WR is probably the easiest position in all of the CFL to find. But we do need to find a big play tall deep threat WR to complement Adams. Demski, Dressler, Wolitarsky are all possession mostly underneath threats, we need another deep threat. Thompkins filled that void a bit, but not enough.

ST is ST, it's mostly just guys that run hard. Mostly replaceable. I think Bennett is back as a 3rd QB that works hard on ST is basically unheard of. Gotta love that guy for that, even if he sucks at QB. I honestly wonder if the CFL's ratio might be blown out of porportion by him since teams might realize that they can hide a STer as a 3rd string QB. Anyways yeah our return game needs to improve. Medlock is 99% to be back, IMO, and likely at cheapest since he has been a Bomber.

Yeah at QB there's just no other options. I honestly can see Bo Levi starting in the NFL if not next year the year after. I don't expect him to be a superstar, but I think he is at least as good as say Josh McCown. I don't know that he ever returns to the CFL. As you say Reilly is not coming this far east, and Harris and Masoli aren't leaving. So there's no other options but to stick with a short leash Nichols vs Streveler.

As for the draft, I didn't realize the Bombers had two first round picks. The CFL draft though mostly doesn't effect the roster for next year though. But continuing to build on what maybe the best national depth in the league is always great.

This should be a very interesting off-season. With Calgary likely collapsing after Bo Levi leaving, Sask continuing to be mediocre in all respects, BC maybe getting a big advantage with Reilly but still just BC, and EDM likely collapsing with Reilly leaving I think next year is poised to have the Bombers win the division. I'll be able to say better by next May, but right now I see Bombers as favourites to win West next year.

 

[Flair Hay]

Really who?

Here's the cold hard reality of those that want an outside solution to Nichols. Who do you get? Harris and Masoli aren't going anywhere. Reilly won't sign east of Edmonton (BC, CGY, EDM, only) he has stated this many times. Bo Levi is going NFL. So who is an improvement on Nichols that the Bombers can realistically get? Lulay won't leave BC. So basically your looking at Jennings, Collaros, Bridge, Adams as free agent QB's with any experience. None of those are an improvement on Nichols.

What's going to happen is that Nichols will return to the Bombers with short leash on the starting job. Streveler with a year in the league now will be pushing hard for the starting role. This year it was just never going to happen, but next year is a different story. O'Shea has not shied away from changing his starting QB as we've seen in the past, it's just he didn't have an option this year with a raw rookie behind Nichols.

Maybe people are just mad? This is how I see it as well. They can win with Nichols or Streveler if they build the team around them. But cutting Nichols and handing everything over to Strevelar too soon could be a disaster.

We have gotten better each and every year under OShea. Maybe people should give him a chance...

 

[Ducky10]

Maybe people are just mad? This is how I see it as well. They can win with Nichols or Streveler if they build the team around them. But cutting Nichols and handing everything over to Strevelar too soon could be a disaster.

We have gotten better each and every year under OShea. Maybe people should give him a chance...

For the record I don't think they should dump Nichols. I just don't think he's the guy to take them all the way, Strevelar isn't at this point either though.

 

[Ducky10]

If they don't stay really strong on the O and D line, the rest is irrelevant.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

For the record I don't think they should dump Nichols. I just don't think he's the guy to take them all the way, Strevelar isn't at this point either though.

So what's your answer then? Reilly who won't go east beyond the Alberta border? Bo Levi who is going south? Harris or Masoli neither of which will reach FA and won't be available for trade? Because that is the entire list of QB's better in the CFL than Nichols.

The thought of me defending Nichols is sickening to me. But people need to look at reality. Nichols right now is a proven mediocre commodity. Far better than almost anything that will come in. There's no doubt Nichols will be on a short leash to Streveler next year. Streveler is certainly the future and offers much more upside as a QB, but it's not assured yet he will take over yet.

If people want to boil the entire league down to QB's, the Bombers are the favourite for the West division title next year. Calgary is screwed with Bo Levi gone, Edmonton is screwed with Reilly gone, Saskatchewan still sucks and Reilly isn't enough to move the needle in BC.

 

[Ducky10]

So what's your answer then? Reilly who won't go east beyond the Alberta border? Bo Levi who is going south? Harris or Masoli neither of which will reach FA and won't be available for trade? Because that is the entire list of QB's better in the CFL than Nichols.

Didn't I just say they shouldn't dump Nichols? I don't think there is an immediate answer, other than bringing in someone they feel could develop in a couple of years, or perhaps that might be Strevelar (although I'm doubtful).

Nichols is still their best option to be competitive and win some games, but I don't believe he'll be the one to put them over the top. It is what it is right now.

Btw, don't I recall you ragging on Nichols pretty strongly a couple years back?

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Didn't I just say they shouldn't dump Nichols? I don't think there is an immediate answer, other than bringing in someone they feel could develop in a couple of years, or perhaps that might be Strevelar (although I'm doubtful).

Nichols is still their best option to be competitive and win some games, but I don't believe he'll be the one to put them over the top. It is what it is right now.

Btw, don't I recall you ragging on Nichols pretty strongly a couple years back?

Yes, yes I did. It's why it pains me to defend him now, I've never had faith in the guy. I hated the trade for him and Bomber gave up a 7th rounder two years later for him. By NHL standards it's like if the Jets traded less than a 7th rounder in two years, it's like if they traded say Jacob Cederholm for a player. And I deemed that too much for the player coming back.

He has proven me really wrong though. He has established himself as a solid middle of the road starter. There's just no other better options right now.

I'm not sure at all what Streveler has done to get the flack he does from you and others I've seen, The big I look for in QB's the ability to keep the eyes downfield. There's dozens of rushing QB's brought in every year, but the big difference between them and Streveler is that when Streveler gets pressured he keeps his eyes downfield whereas most tuck and go. That ability alone makes him a potential starter in my book. He has great arm strength, obviously amazing legs, good vision. He sometimes can struggle with quickness of his release, IMO, but that's something that can be worked out with technique. He is going to be a very good CFL QB, IMO. A much better version of Masoli is his upside, IMO. But remember it took Masoli 6+ years to reach starter status.

This idea of "putting them over the top" is overrated, IMO. The offense sucked no doubt the in West Final. But there's more to that loss than Nichols, and you don't need the best QB in the league to win the Grey Cup. You can win the Grey Cup with a mediocre QB. Hell Kerry Joseph, Marcus Crandell, etc have Grey Cup rings as starters.