Player Discussion Bobby Ryan Part VII

[jbeck5]

Maybe we can finally win some shootouts.

Also, to those who say Bobby is lazy... I think Bobby is a complimentary player rather than a leader. He excels when surrounded by talent, but by himself is not a difference maker.

Anyway, I am happy. When he was at his best he was my favorite player. I loved watching his skilled play.

Can't he be lazy and a complimentary player? I don't see how the two are related.

His laziness is a different subject than whether he's a complimentary player or a leader.

 

[jbeck5]

you're downplaying or ignoring the potential that these issues in his game are a result of his demons. Like if he was super depressed for example, you don't think that's going to have an impact on the ice?

Could you imagine this was what prevented Bobby from being that 30 goal, 70 point winger? All of a sudden he's skating through teams dangling all over the place embarassing goalies and undressing defenseman?

I doubt it though.

 

[jbeck5]

I have a hard time going to the gym for an hour after a couple beers the night before. Imagine playing professional hockey if addicted to any substance.

Work out at home. Don't need to go to the gym. Having a couple beers the night before will not effect my ability to do leg presses. Smoke weed if you get such bad hangovers. To each their own.

 

[jbeck5]

Try going to gym for 5 seconds when you are depressed. Try going when you have childhood demons to ward off? And so on.

Given the choice between issues such as alcohol or drug abuse and the mental strain of overcoming trauma...take the former.

I am only guessing, but if Bobby Ryan's two choices were a broken leg with a sludge hammer, but no poor family history and a mom still by his side, or reliving his life as it unfolded... Guess which he would take?

I've been dealing with depression...but it makes me want to work out. A lot of bad stuff has happened to me in the last month and calendar year. I'm in a fog. I can't stop thinking of all the negative. But pumping weights gives me a freedom from it all. Kind of like hockey has in my life. It's an escape.

People can deal with depression differently. It's too bad when people can't direct things in a positive way.

I hope you didn't say drug abuse is easier to cope with than mental strain?? You do realize they're both mental health problems. They should be treated with equal seriousness. I lost a good friend and ex gf of mine a week ago to opioid overdose. The two go hand in hand.

 

[Larionov]

Obviously this is about Bobby Ryan the person first and foremost. You hope for the best for the guy after all he has been through in his life, and I hope he is in a better place now having gone through the program.

As for Bobby Ryan the player, maybe this is the reset he needed. That time away gave him time to think about what is important to him. In watching that game last night it's painfully obvious that we need skill and scoring up front, and a healthy, productive Bobby Ryan would make this a better team. If nothing else, he strengthens our absolutely cringeworthy power play...

 

[Dingle]

I've been dealing with depression...but it makes me want to work out. A lot of bad stuff has happened to me in the last month and calendar year. I'm in a fog. I can't stop thinking of all the negative. But pumping weights gives me a freedom from it all. Kind of like hockey has in my life. It's an escape.

People can deal with depression differently. It's too bad when people can't direct things in a positive way.

I hope you didn't say drug abuse is easier to cope with than mental strain?? You do realize they're both mental health problems. They should be treated with equal seriousness. I lost a good friend and ex gf of mine a week ago to opioid overdose. The two go hand in hand.

My Apologies Jbeck5 no, both issues are extreme and my condolences on your loses. It is difficult to articulate a proper point with limited words. My intent was to emphasize the mental difficulties he may be facing.

 

[jbeck5]

My Apologies Jbeck5 no, both issues are extreme and my condolences on your loses. It is difficult to articulate a proper point with limited words. My intent was to emphasize the mental difficulties he may be facing.

All good haha sorry if I seemed aggressive. I agree it's hard to articulate thoughts. I just think both are severe.

As severe as they are, I have doubts that Ryan will be able all of a sudden go back to the player we once hoped he would be if sober/mentally healthy. We could see a more consistent effort for sure though. Time will tell.

It is a neat thought though. Think of all those hot 20 game stretches or that playoff run. If he became a 50-55 point consistent player, he could be huge in helping our young players on a lower line. I'm not optimistic though.

 

[Upgrayedd]

Nothing better than a comeback story, get it Bobby!

 

[Ice-Tray]

I've been dealing with depression...but it makes me want to work out. A lot of bad stuff has happened to me in the last month and calendar year. I'm in a fog. I can't stop thinking of all the negative. But pumping weights gives me a freedom from it all. Kind of like hockey has in my life. It's an escape.

People can deal with depression differently. It's too bad when people can't direct things in a positive way.

I hope you didn't say drug abuse is easier to cope with than mental strain?? You do realize they're both mental health problems. They should be treated with equal seriousness. I lost a good friend and ex gf of mine a week ago to opioid overdose. The two go hand in hand.

Sorry to hear that man, that’s terrible news.

 

[otown]

I've been dealing with depression...but it makes me want to work out. A lot of bad stuff has happened to me in the last month and calendar year. I'm in a fog. I can't stop thinking of all the negative. But pumping weights gives me a freedom from it all. Kind of like hockey has in my life. It's an escape.

People can deal with depression differently. It's too bad when people can't direct things in a positive way.

I hope you didn't say drug abuse is easier to cope with than mental strain?? You do realize they're both mental health problems. They should be treated with equal seriousness. I lost a good friend and ex gf of mine a week ago to opioid overdose. The two go hand in hand.

Hang in there jbeck5, your future needs you!

 

[Xspyrit]

I know the narrative for many on this board about Ryan has been "he's useless, lazy, etc" but looking purely at stats, (and advanced stats), he always took too much crap for nothing. Sure he doesn't look as dynamic as Ennis (for example) out there because he's not a fast skater (and tiny little legs that move fast) and is more a pure skill/finesse type of player that some people doesn't seem to like.

First 3 years in Ottawa (2013-14 to 2015-16) : ~0.7 PPG, started to deal with injuries but that was still 1st line production

2016-17 : injury plagued season (hands) and the first with Boucher (harder to produce for several players), only 0.40 PPG but totally redeemed himself in the playoffs (2nd MVP after Karlsson). We don't even pass the Bruins without him.

2017-18 + 2018-19 : 0.54 PPG (16:01 TOI/GP)

Sure, 0.54 PPG is not worth 7.25 but all the guys that produced better those 2 years are now gone (Stone, Duchene, Hoffman and Dzingel)

Looking at this season only :

Duclair : 0.64 PPG (16:23 TOI/GP)
Pageau : 0.64 PPG (19:19 TOI/GP)
Brown : 0.64 PPG (20:18 TOI/GP)
Tkachuk : 0.56 PPG (18:41 TOI/GP)
Ennis : 0.56 PPG (14:55 TOI/GP)
Tierney : 0.52 PPG (16:56 TOI/GP)

So looking at Pts/TOI, Ryan 2017-19 would pretty much be at the top with Duclair and Ennis. He was "buried" on the 3rd line many times and had to leave several games early because of injuries.

Don't forget that this is a guy that had to adapt his game because his shot was not dangerous anymore and had to focus on being mostly just a playmaker 2-way forward (advanced stats)

 

[Stylizer1]

I know the narrative for many on this board about Ryan has been "he's useless, lazy, etc" but looking purely at stats, (and advanced stats), he always took too much crap for nothing. Sure he doesn't look as dynamic as Ennis (for example) out there because he's not a fast skater (and tiny little legs that move fast) and is more a pure skill/finesse type of player that some people doesn't seem to like.

First 3 years in Ottawa (2013-14 to 2015-16) : ~0.7 PPG, started to deal with injuries but that was still 1st line production

2016-17 : injury plagued season (hands) and the first with Boucher (harder to produce for several players), only 0.40 PPG but totally redeemed himself in the playoffs (2nd MVP after Karlsson). We don't even pass the Bruins without him.

2017-18 + 2018-19 : 0.54 PPG (16:01 TOI/GP)

Sure, 0.54 PPG is not worth 7.25 but all the guys that produced better those 2 years are now gone (Stone, Duchene, Hoffman and Dzingel)

Looking at this season only :

Duclair : 0.64 PPG (16:23 TOI/GP)
Pageau : 0.64 PPG (19:19 TOI/GP)
Brown : 0.64 PPG (20:18 TOI/GP)
Tkachuk : 0.56 PPG (18:41 TOI/GP)
Ennis : 0.56 PPG (14:55 TOI/GP)
Tierney : 0.52 PPG (16:56 TOI/GP)

So looking at Pts/TOI, Ryan 2017-19 would pretty much be at the top with Duclair and Ennis. He was "buried" on the 3rd line many times and had to leave several games early because of injuries.

Don't forget that this is a guy that had to adapt his game because his shot was not dangerous anymore and had to focus on being mostly just a playmaker 2-way forward (advanced stats)

You haven't proven anything.

 

[Filatov2Kovalev2Bonk]

So if Bobby goes on a tear, can we flip him for some picks?
Not sure what kind of NMC he has but that promise of 20+ goal potential has to be appealing to someone...

 

[LudwigVonKarlsson]

I know the narrative for many on this board about Ryan has been "he's useless, lazy, etc" but looking purely at stats, (and advanced stats), he always took too much crap for nothing. Sure he doesn't look as dynamic as Ennis (for example) out there because he's not a fast skater (and tiny little legs that move fast) and is more a pure skill/finesse type of player that some people doesn't seem to like.

First 3 years in Ottawa (2013-14 to 2015-16) : ~0.7 PPG, started to deal with injuries but that was still 1st line production

2016-17 : injury plagued season (hands) and the first with Boucher (harder to produce for several players), only 0.40 PPG but totally redeemed himself in the playoffs (2nd MVP after Karlsson). We don't even pass the Bruins without him.

2017-18 + 2018-19 : 0.54 PPG (16:01 TOI/GP)

Sure, 0.54 PPG is not worth 7.25 but all the guys that produced better those 2 years are now gone (Stone, Duchene, Hoffman and Dzingel)

Looking at this season only :

Duclair : 0.64 PPG (16:23 TOI/GP)
Pageau : 0.64 PPG (19:19 TOI/GP)
Brown : 0.64 PPG (20:18 TOI/GP)
Tkachuk : 0.56 PPG (18:41 TOI/GP)
Ennis : 0.56 PPG (14:55 TOI/GP)
Tierney : 0.52 PPG (16:56 TOI/GP)

So looking at Pts/TOI, Ryan 2017-19 would pretty much be at the top with Duclair and Ennis. He was "buried" on the 3rd line many times and had to leave several games early because of injuries.

Don't forget that this is a guy that had to adapt his game because his shot was not dangerous anymore and had to focus on being mostly just a playmaker 2-way forward (advanced stats)

We know Bobby Ryan sucks, and nobody in the league would take him for free.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

So if Bobby goes on a tear, can we flip him for some picks?
Not sure what kind of NMC he has but that promise of 20+ goal potential has to be appealing to someone...

I'd say pretty much impossible.. Not going to argue hypotheticals though

 

[God Says No]

I'm hoping the time off healed Bobby physically (his hands) and mentally. I'm not sure if we've seen a "healthy" Bobby here in Ottawa. I'm kind of curious if there is a discernible difference.

 

[Xspyrit]

I talked about advanced stats, just had to dig some work I did before for 2016-17 & 2017-18

Player Discussion - Bobby Ryan Part VII

But all that work is so lame/simple because I just can't see that "Bobby Ryan sucks"

These people will then use stats (and even advanced stats if they understand them) to say other player suck. You have to be consequential, it matters or it doesn't?

We know Bobby Ryan sucks, and nobody in the league would take him for free.

Exactly what I was talking about. Good job on demonstrating exhibit A

Blind hate. Uninformed biased opinions. Even if basic numbers and advanced stats shows you that those ignorant statements are simply false. There's absolutely no way you can post between 0.54 and 0.70 PPG in the NHL if you suck lmao

If Bobby sucks as much as you say, then a lot of players in the NHL "suck", which sounds not too credible for anyone who knows what it takes to play in that league. And also that pretty much everybody on the Sens this year suck. Those opinions are to be taken very seriously!

Bobby Ryan is just another veteran that got a heavy contract and could not live up to it as he aged and decline through injuries.

I'm hoping the time off healed Bobby physically (his hands) and mentally. I'm not sure if we've seen a "healthy" Bobby here in Ottawa. I'm kind of curious if there is a discernible difference.

He was healthy when he first came in and was almost PPG though the mid season but then got hernia. There's some stats I posted before in this thread. See how he was starting those seasons until injuries happened. He was 0.82+ PPG for large parts of the first 3 seasons.

2013-14 :

To start the season : 42 GP, 18 Goals, 18 Assists, 36 Points, +10 (0.86 PPG = 70 pts per 82 games)

Rest of the way : 28 GP, 5 Goals, 7 Assists, 12 Points, -3 (then shutdown for the rest of the season, after hernia)

2014-15 :

To start the season : 60 GP, 17 Goals, 32 Assists, 49 Points, +9 (0.82 PPG = 67 pts per 82 games)

Rest of the way (2 injuries that season) : 18 GP, 1 Goals, 4 Assists, 5 Points, -4

2015-16 :

To start the season : 52 GP, 19 Goals, 26 Assists, 45 Points, -1 (0.87 PPG = 71 pts per 82 games)

Rest of the way (2 injuries that season) : 29 GP, 3 Goals, 8 Assists, 11 Points, -8

2016-17 :

To start the season : 8 GP, 3 Goals, 2 Assists, 5 Points, +1

Rest of the way (5 injuries that season) : 54 GP, 10 Goals, 10 Assists, 20 Points, -4

 

[JungleBeat]

I think we’ll get an even lazy and out of shape Bobby when he’s back.

 

[Stylizer1]

I talked about advanced stats, just had to dig some work I did before for 2016-17 & 2017-18

Player Discussion - Bobby Ryan Part VII

But all that work is so lame/simple because I just can't see that "Bobby Ryan sucks"

These people will then use stats (and even advanced stats if they understand them) to say other player suck. You have to be consequential, it matters or it doesn't?




Exactly what I was talking about. Good job on demonstrating exhibit A

Blind hate. Uninformed biased opinions. Even if basic numbers and advanced stats shows you that those ignorant statements are simply false. There's absolutely no way you can post between 0.54 and 0.70 PPG in the NHL if you suck lmao

If Bobby sucks as much as you say, then a lot of players in the NHL "suck", which sounds not too credible for anyone who knows what it takes to play in that league. And also that pretty much everybody on the Sens this year suck. Those opinions are to be taken very seriously!

Bobby Ryan is just another veteran that got a heavy contract and could not live up to it as he aged and decline through injuries.



He was healthy when he first came in and was almost PPG though the mid season but then got hernia. There's some stats I posted before in this thread. See how he was starting those seasons until injuries happened. He was 0.82+ PPG for large parts of the first 3 seasons.

2013-14 :

To start the season : 42 GP, 18 Goals, 18 Assists, 36 Points, +10 (0.86 PPG = 70 pts per 82 games)

Rest of the way : 28 GP, 5 Goals, 7 Assists, 12 Points, -3 (then shutdown for the rest of the season, after hernia)

2014-15 :

To start the season : 60 GP, 17 Goals, 32 Assists, 49 Points, +9 (0.82 PPG = 67 pts per 82 games)

Rest of the way (2 injuries that season) : 18 GP, 1 Goals, 4 Assists, 5 Points, -4

2015-16 :

To start the season : 52 GP, 19 Goals, 26 Assists, 45 Points, -1 (0.87 PPG = 71 pts per 82 games)

Rest of the way (2 injuries that season) : 29 GP, 3 Goals, 8 Assists, 11 Points, -8

2016-17 :

To start the season : 8 GP, 3 Goals, 2 Assists, 5 Points, +1

Rest of the way (5 injuries that season) : 54 GP, 10 Goals, 10 Assists, 20 Points, -4

 

[L'Aveuglette]

We don't need a Bobby resurgence, and he's untradeable regardless.

Hopefully he's finally healing himself on all levels, but for Ottawa this is a lost cause.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

Seems like a lot of people dont understand the depth of what ryan has been going through.

Hes way overpaid, and unreadable based on that. So why dont we all just hope he collects himself and plays somewhat decently for the rest of his contract.

What does piling on the guy accomplish?

Hes here. Hes not going anywhere. Hopefully he gets back to the 50ish point player he still can be

 

[RaMai]

Seems like a lot of people dont understand the depth of what ryan has been going through.

Hes way overpaid, and unreadable based on that. So why dont we all just hope he collects himself and plays somewhat decently for the rest of his contract.

What does piling on the guy accomplish?

Hes here. Hes not going anywhere. Hopefully he gets back to the 50ish point player he still can be

Absolutely agree, let's hope he can play again with this team. The guy deserves some love after all he's been through, I hope the organization and the fans will give it to him.

 

[Agent Zub]

Seems like a lot of people dont understand the depth of what ryan has been going through.

Hes way overpaid, and unreadable based on that. So why dont we all just hope he collects himself and plays somewhat decently for the rest of his contract.

What does piling on the guy accomplish?

Hes here. Hes not going anywhere. Hopefully he gets back to the 50ish point player he still can be

He is here, but that doesn't mean he should automatically be a regular.

It's refreshing having a roster that works hard every shift and Ryan is the anti thesis of that.

And if it's because his head isn't into it. All the more reason for him to not be a regular.

 

[Stylizer1]

Seems like a lot of people dont understand the depth of what ryan has been going through.

Hes way overpaid, and unreadable based on that. So why dont we all just hope he collects himself and plays somewhat decently for the rest of his contract.

What does piling on the guy accomplish?

Hes here. Hes not going anywhere. Hopefully he gets back to the 50ish point player he still can be

You don't think people have been hoping he played better? That's all we hoped for when we had an average team. Unfortunately we are beyond that. This team and fan base has already moved forward.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

His contract is only for two more years after this season. At this point, he isn't going to harm a rebuild, and we likely need his salary to reach the cap floor. If he can bring a solid veteran presence, it's a good thing for us.