Player Discussion Bobby Ryan Part VII

[Tuna99]

Why are reasons automatically penciled as excuses?

I mean if an Olympic runner breaks his leg and can’t make the Olympics anymore, is it an excuse or a reason? It’s the same for every sport, your performance will heavily depend on your physical status.

Yes exactly, Ryan isn't a top conditioned athlete and his GM and he both admitted he could work harder. Fingers aside, Ryan hasn't put in a $7.5 million effort in his time in Ottawa, he's the poster child for being a great junior player based on skill and size only and not putting in the effort and off seasons needed to get the most out of your talents

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I hate Ryan's guts, but if there is any part of him that has one more "good" season left, please let it be this year.

Pretty strong emotion there. Seems like a pretty nice guy to me. His best game is pretty good. Better than many on this team.

 

[Filatov2Kovalev2Bonk]

Ryan is a flake.
This is at least the second time he injures his hand in pre-season, blocking a shot in pre-season in a completely irrelevant game. He's had multiple questions on whether changing his gloves or hand protection would benefit him and he's demurred on the topic.
If he misses any time because of this, Dorion needs to step in and work with Bobby to get him proper hand and wrist coverage before he spends another 20-30 games on IR.

 

[Stylizer1]

I hate Ryan's guts, but if there is any part of him that has one more "good" season left, please let it be this year.

That's a little harsh. lol

 

[harrisb]

Seriously, when you have a history of hand issues it's probably not a good idea to go down on one knee to block a shot with your hand facing the shooter. Stand up man and don't flamingo and you'll be fine.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

I thought he was fine last night, obviously that's not good enough for a guy making that much but what can you do about that now?

 

[Alex1234]

Ryan is a flake.
This is at least the second time he injures his hand in pre-season, blocking a shot in pre-season in a completely irrelevant game. He's had multiple questions on whether changing his gloves or hand protection would benefit him and he's demurred on the topic.
If he misses any time because of this, Dorion needs to step in and work with Bobby to get him proper hand and wrist coverage before he spends another 20-30 games on IR.

If it has not been addressed after 8 hand injuries theres a problem somewhere
Gotta question the sanity of the people involved (player,trainers,doctors,equipment guy,coach)
Also

S
L
O
W
N
E
S
S

 

[GrantLemons]

I thought he was fine last night, obviously that's not good enough for a guy making that much but what can you do about that now?

Could toss him on waivers to send a message, as is Sens tradition with their well respected veterans.

 

[Engineer]

ok

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

I thought he was fine last night, obviously that's not good enough for a guy making that much but what can you do about that now?

i WISH he plays the rest of his contract the way he played that game.

 

[JungleBeat]

Ryan is the king of theatrics. Always on the ice rolling, gloves flying and on the bench head down.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Ryan said in pre season he worked with staff and had more padding put on back and sides of gloves.​

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Ryan said in pre season he worked with staff and had more padding put on back and sides of gloves.​

Why not use a pair like this. They didn't seem to hamper his hands any.

 

[Tuna99]

Ryan is the king of theatrics. Always on the ice rolling, gloves flying and on the bench head down.

Does anyone want to ask who blocks shots with their hand directly in the shooting lane? Can we start there?

It’s almost intentional at this point, I’ve seen him take 3 slap shots 1 shoot off the ice that hit him directly in the hands - dumb

 

[Xspyrit]

Let's keep up with the bashing and insults! After all, it's totally permitted on HF.

Yes exactly, Ryan isn't a top conditioned athlete and his GM and he both admitted he could work harder. Fingers aside, Ryan hasn't put in a $7.5 million effort in his time in Ottawa, he's the poster child for being a great junior player based on skill and size only and not putting in the effort and off seasons needed to get the most out of your talents

I don't think you could say those things (not just this post) to people in the hockey world with a straight face. I also wouldn't believe if you told me that you put a lot of thought into this.

Ryan started his NHL career in 2007-08, let's take a look at some stats outside of junior since (among active forwards) :

- 25th in Shootouts Goals with 21

- He scores on 34% of his shootouts attempts. Believe me, it's more than the vast majority of NHL players who are given the opportunity to take a SO shot.

- 35th in Total Points with 505

- 31st for Even Strength Points with 379

- 42nd best PPG among active forwards with at least 400 NHL Games.

But yeah, great in junior but not in the NHL

Let's look at every season to see where his PPG was ranked among forwards with at least 62 games (lowest he played outside of his rookie season and the lockout year. I'll do a proportion for 2012-13)

2008-09 : 20th (0.89)
2009-10 : 33rd (0.79)
2010-11 : 23rd (0.87)
2011-12 : 53rd (0.70)
2012-13 : 60th (0.65)
2013-14 : 63rd (0.69)
2014-15 : 58th (0.69)
2015-16 : 63rd (0.69)
2016-17 : 179th (0.40)
2017-18 : 142nd (0.53)

30 teams
1st to 90th : 1st line production (45th is the median)
91st to 180th : 2nd line production (135th is the median)
181st to 270th : 3rd line production (225th is the median)

Bobby Ryan was a 2nd OA pick, peaked really early and was an Elite forward in his first 3 years, then a 1st line forward in his next 5 years and finally a low end 2nd liner in his last 2 years (when healthy). Ryan is NOT a power forward, he is a skill/finesse player who had a really good shot before the rash of injuries. Since his shot is not as dangerous as before, he has to rely mostly on playmaking, dekes and IQ/vision.

It's not surprising to see a player decline with age and injuries. That's exactly how NHL players (and sports athletes in general) decline... If you have followed the NHL for years and don't know that by now... I really don't know what to tell you

Ryan doesn't have the heart or the love for the game, injuries all athletes have to deal with, but the warriors manage them and treat them so they can get back to excellence.

IMO Ryan got his huge contract he was playing for and it killed his motivation. To me, my guess is he welcomes the injuries at this point so he has an excuse to hide behind and a reason to not play.

Ryan signed his contract October 2, 2014

3 seasons before : 0.70, 0.65 and 0.69 PPG
2 seasons after : 0.69 and 0.69 PPG

How do you explain that? He "welcomes" the injuries?

The "warriors" like you say are extremely rare. I can only think of Bergeron and Crosby (who are among the elite of the elite) who went through significant injuries but were able to go back to their level of excellence. Most of the time, careers get derailed by injuries. On top of my head : Michalek, Havlat, Gaborik, Spezza, Healtey, Ryan, Arvedson, MacArthur, Cowen.... Look at Zetterberg this year, Corey Perry, Shea Weber... so many good/great players who decline in a hurry because of injuries. Do you need to see a list? It's countless.

Ryan is also a warrior I guess because he fights through it and always come back, and even play through those injuries (as it has been reported many times before), the only thing is that it is extremely foolish to expect him to EXCEL like he did during his peak...

 

[topshelf15]

Why not use a pair like this. They didn't seem to hamper his hands any.

What a player,Patrick Kane of his time

 

[Stylizer1]

It's incredible how insulting and disrespectful people can be behind the anonymity of the internet. It reeks of young people emotionally frustrated that just use this tool to vent.



I don't think you could tell those things (not just this post) to people in the world of hockey with a straight face outside of the internet. I also wouldn't believe if you told me that put a lot of thought into this.

Ryan started his NHL career in 2007-08, let's take a look at some stats outside of junior since (among active forwards) :

- 25th in Shootouts Goals with 21

- He scores on 34% of his shootouts attempts. Believe me, it's more than the vast majority of NHL players who are given the opportunity to take a SO shot.

- 35th in Total Points with 505

- 31st for Even Strength Points with 379

- 42nd best PPG among active forwards with at least 400 NHL Games.

But yeah, great in junior but not in the NHL

Let's look at every season to see where his PPG was ranked among forwards with at least 62 games (lowest he played outside of his rookie season and the lockout year. I'll do a proportion for 2012-13)

2008-09 : 20th (0.89)
2009-10 : 33rd (0.79)
2010-11 : 23rd (0.87)
2011-12 : 53rd (0.70)
2012-13 : 60th (0.65)
2013-14 : 63rd (0.69)
2014-15 : 58th (0.69)
2015-16 : 63rd (0.69)
2016-17 : 179th (0.40)
2017-18 : 142nd (0.53)

30 teams
1st to 90th : 1st line production (45th is the median)
91st to 180th : 2nd line production (135th is the median)
181st to 270th : 3rd line production (225th is the median)

Bobby Ryan was a 2nd OA pick, peaked really early and was an Elite forward in his first 3 years, then a 1st line forward in his next 5 years and finally a low end 2nd liner in his last 2 years (when healthy). Ryan is NOT a power forward, he is a skill/finesse player who had a really good shot before the rash of injuries. Since his shot is not as dangerous as before, he has to rely mostly on playmaking, dekes and IQ/vision.

It's not surprising to see a player decline with age and injuries. That's exactly how NHL players (and sports athletes in general) decline... If you have followed the NHL for years and don't know that by now... I really don't know what to tell you



Ryan signed his contract October 2, 2014

3 seasons before : 0.70, 0.65 and 0.69 PPG
2 seasons after : 0.69 and 0.69 PPG

How do you explain that? He "welcomes" the injuries?

The "warriors" like you say are extremely rare. I can only think of Bergeron and Crosby (who are among the elite of the elite) who went through significant injuries but were able to go back to their level of excellence. Most of the time, careers get derailed by injuries. On top of my head : Michalek, Havlat, Gaborik, Spezza, Healtey, Ryan, Arvedson, MacArthur, Cowen.... Look at Zetterberg this year, Corey Perry, Shea Weber... so many good/great players who decline in a hurry because of injuries. Do you need to see a list? It's countless.

Ryan is also a warrior I guess because he fights through it and always come back, and even play through those injuries (as it has been reported many times before), the only thing is that it is extremely foolish to expect him to EXCEL like he did during his peak...

Ryan sucks.

 

[Xspyrit]

I gathered these facts when posting in another thread

Ryan PTS/GP on the Sens through the years (not counting small sample sizes of course)

2013-14 : 5th (5th in TOI/GP among forwards)
2014-15 : 4th (2nd in TOI/GP among forwards)
2015-16 : 4th (5th in TOI/GP among forwards)
2016-17 : 7th (8th in TOI/GP among forwards)
2017-18 : 6th (8th in TOI/GP among forwards)

It’s incredible that the last 2 years, since Boucher has been here, that players like Pageau, Smith and even Pyatt have had more TOI/GP. Of course those players played on the PK but their EV TOI/GP has been similar

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Ryan is the king of theatrics. Always on the ice rolling, gloves flying and on the bench head down.

Lmaooooo i know right.

He is a genius in his ability to get people think it's his hand injuries getting in the way of his production instead of his brutal decision making and his terrible possession/compete level on the boards.

 

[Boud]

Lmaooooo i know right.

He is a genius in his ability to get people think it's his hand injuries getting in the way of his production instead of his brutal decision making and his terrible possession/compete level on the boards.

Plain an simple, Ryan is a good player when he wants to be. It's not about the hand injuries, when you have hand injuries you can still skate, hit, make passes and just overall be in the right place at the right time.

It's odd that Ryan had never played with such passion and drive until we got to the playoffs last season. He had legitimately never played like this in Ottawa, he was engaged, physical and making very smart plays. When it's the regular season, you get regular season Bobby. Simple as that.

On top of it the guy is extremely stupid. Doesn't take extra protection on his hands, doesn't protect his hands whsn blocking shots. What do you expect? It's almost like he does it on purpose. As stupid as it sounds I've never seen a player expose his hands like that. He's in front of the goalie with both hands just there, he's blocking shots with his hand covering his legs..... Like can you not be smarter than that? Anyways.

 

[Alex1234]

Find someone in NHL with 3 significant finger injuries

He’s had 8 ...

 

[coladin]

Would love for him to shove it all the MSM faces with 30 goals. If he can stay with Duchene, and get more PP time, it can happen.

And then there is the fingers...

 

[Mingus Dew]

Would love for him to shove it all the MSM faces with 30 goals. If he can stay with Duchene, and get more PP time, it can happen.

And then there is the fingers...

Bobby Ryan will never score 30 goals again.

20 would be a great season IMO.

 

[Xspyrit]

lol some posts are very perplexing. When you have an injury history, of course it's possible that you just reinitiate it or aggravate it. If you played sports and have been injured, it's possible that you have experienced that.

I got a knee operation and even though it is "fixed" in theory, I can assure you that some days it still hurts badly. It's weird but I also find that I'm not as good as I was before my operation. Maybe I am not "tough" enough

Would love for him to shove it all the MSM faces with 30 goals. If he can stay with Duchene, and get more PP time, it can happen.

And then there is the fingers...

Don't think it's possible because his shot is not as great as before (age + injuries). But I can see him pot over 50+ pts. IMO, he would do it easily on some teams playing with a lot of talent, assuming he doesn't miss too many games of course.

Just last year he had a 0.53 PPG, which is 44 pts per 82 games, so not even that far from a 50 pts pace, in an "horrible" season.

 

[Boud]

Would love for him to shove it all the MSM faces with 30 goals. If he can stay with Duchene, and get more PP time, it can happen.

And then there is the fingers...

Ryan said it himself, and Boucher talked about it at the beginning of last season: Ryan is more of a playmaker than a goal scorer. You can easily see that by the way he plays, he's more of a passer than a shooter and was that in Anaheim as well. The difference is that he was playing with an All-star quality playmaker in Ryan Getzlaf. That will naturally make you score more goals since all Bobby had to do is get in position to get his shot off and wait for a Joe Thornton-esque pass.

I don't see any way Ryan could score 30 goals on this team. We don't have anyone that can make plays like Getzlaf and our best playmaker (Turris) wasn't even able to get 30 goals out of him. Duchene is not a playmaker either, he's more of a shooter/in your face/ do it all on his own type of player which is why he usually plays better with complimentary players than very good players.

If Ryan plays with Duchene, which would not be a terrible idea, I wouldn't be surprised to see Duchene score more goals. If Ryan hits 20 this year it will be a massive win for the team. Hoping he can score 30 but at this point it's just not a realistic scenario. It's like hoping Dion Phaneuf would score 15 goals and play 1rst pairing again.