Blues Trade Proposals 2019-2020

[BleedBlue14]

Would you trade Kyrou for a potentially equal young cost controlled player at LHD??

I’m trying to figure out where he’s going to fit on this roster even a year from now.

He’s projected to play his natural RW position. Entering the 2020-21 season the Blues will have 10 players in Tarasenko, Perron, Thomas, Schwartz, Blais, Fabbri, Barbashev, Sanford, Steen, & Sanford vying for 8 positions not including Kyrou..

If Schenn is gone and Thomas moves to C it’s still 9 wingers. They will also have Kostin and possibly Poganski, MacMac, & Toropchenko challenging for a spot.

I like Kyrou a lot but it’s just crazy depth which is what the organization is lacking at LHD.

If they traded for a young LHD it would give them Dunn + the new person long term to fill out the top 2 pairings.

Short answer no.

Long answer: I think we really need to figure out what our 3 d pairings are going to look like.

Something tells me two of Parayko Faulk Pietro will be playing together quite a bit this season. If this is the case absolutely not.

If this doesn’t work out we still have options and a lot of depth on the left side.

I think the plan with Kyrou is dependent on what we see happen with Schenner. I would be more shocked if we Re-upped Schenner than if we let him walk. To me the most logical future plan as some guys move on or fade out is the following (assuming Pietro and Schwartz re-sign)

Schwartz - Thomas - Tarasenko
XXX - God - Perron
XXX - Bozak Kyrou
Barbie - Sunny - Steen/replacement once contract is up.

Dunn - Pietro
JBo - Parayko
Gunnar - Faulk
Bort

Defensive pairings will be a mix and match and I can almost assure you someone on the right will be playing on the left from time to time to get more minutes. As we saw last season I don’t think management is completely comfortable using Dunn as an all situations top 4 and moreso as an offensive spark plug. We still have the flexibility to move him up/down but can also do the same with Faulk I’d imagine.

The XXX on the forward groupings are confusing to me after this camp. I really like Blais and what he brings to the table. I also really like Kostin and how impactful he can be on the game. I’m not too high on Sanford, however he has had success at times with 90-57 and I’d imagine short term he’s slotted in. Most of our other prospects are probsbly best suited as injury call ups and or fourth liners.

As always things will change and players will move teams and regress and improve. But if I had money on what the plan going forward is. This would be it.

I really like our injury call up options right now in Borgman-Mikkola- Poulot- Reinke. I think adding another doesn’t make a lot of sense.

 

[Nathaniel Lauharn]

Would you trade Kyrou for a potentially equal young cost controlled player at LHD??

I’m trying to figure out where he’s going to fit on this roster even a year from now.

He’s projected to play his natural RW position. Entering the 2020-21 season the Blues will have 10 players in Tarasenko, Perron, Thomas, Schwartz, Blais, Fabbri, Barbashev, Sanford, Steen, & Sanford vying for 8 positions not including Kyrou..

If Schenn is gone and Thomas moves to C it’s still 9 wingers. They will also have Kostin and possibly Poganski, MacMac, & Toropchenko challenging for a spot.

I like Kyrou a lot but it’s just crazy depth which is what the organization is lacking at LHD.

If they traded for a young LHD it would give them Dunn + the new person long term to fill out the top 2 pairings.

No. I would trade Bozak to make room for Thomas at center. That makes room for Kyrou, who has the highest ceiling of our current winger prospects.
Tarasenko, Perron and Kyrou down the top 9 right wing.
Schenn O'Reilly and Thomas down the middle. Kostin Fabbri, Sanford and Blais, etc will compete for middle 6 left wing. Whoever loses can be traded for picks or prospects or waived.

Dunn Mikkola, Gunnarsson can fill out the left d. Armstrong was apparently happy with Mikkola's and Borgman's camp.


My ideal lineup next season:
Schwartz Schenn Tarasenko
Kostin O'Reilly Perron
Fabbri Thomas Kyrou
Barbashev Sunny Steen

Dunn Petro
Mikkola Parayko
Gunnarsson Faulk.

Bottom lines and pairings could get pushed out by other prospects as needed.

O'Reilly's line could end up the "3rd line*" due to his emphasis on defense, especially if Thomas can break out offensively.

Usage* not necessarily by minutes.

 

[Bluesin7]

No. I would trade Bozak to make room for Thomas at center. That makes room for Kyrou, who has the highest ceiling of our current winger prospects.
Tarasenko, Perron and Kyrou down the top 9 right wing.
Schenn O'Reilly and Thomas down the middle. Kostin Fabbri, Sanford and Blais, etc will compete for middle 6 left wing. Whoever loses can be traded for picks or prospects or waived.

Dunn Mikkola, Gunnarsson can fill out the left d. Armstrong was apparently happy with Mikkola's and Borgman's camp.


My ideal lineup next season:
Schwartz Schenn Tarasenko
Kostin O'Reilly Perron
Fabbri Thomas Kyrou
Barbashev Sunny Steen

Dunn Petro
Mikkola Parayko
Gunnarsson Faulk.

Bottom lines and pairings could get pushed out by other prospects as needed.

O'Reilly's line could end up the "3rd line*" due to his emphasis on defense, especially if Thomas can break out offensively.

Usage* not necessarily by minutes.

Sheeeesh, you're betting on a lot of inexperienced guys to step up and fill in those spots.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Now that Bokk is not in our prospect pool, I say we hold onto all forward prospects and veterans.

Do not trade Bozak.

Who are you talking about anyway @Nathaniel Lauharn ?

 

[Nathaniel Lauharn]

Sheeeesh, you're betting on a lot of inexperienced guys to step up and fill in those spots.

"Inexperienced" dynamic players with high end skills replacing aging veterans Bozak and Bouwmeester, and 24 yo Sanford with a career high of 20 points.
We still have Sunny to step up a line if Thomas is slow to adapt and Barbashev can center the 4th line temporarily.

To be clear, the primary purpose of trading Bozak is to clear cap space and re-signing Schenn. Steen would be preferable, but he has a full ntc and isn't going to waive it.

 

[simon IC]

"Inexperienced" dynamic players with high end skills replacing aging veterans Bozak and Bouwmeester, and 24 yo Sanford with a career high of 20 points.
We still have Sunny to step up a line if Thomas is slow to adapt and Barbashev can center the 4th line temporarily.

To be clear, the primary purpose of trading Bozak is to clear cap space and re-signing Schenn. Steen would be preferable, but he has a full ntc and isn't going to waive it.

I am not sure Schenn is in our long term plans.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

I am not sure Schenn is in our long term plans.

Agreed. I think Schenn is trade package bait.

 

[The Note]

I am not sure Schenn is in our long term plans.

Yup. My immediate reaction after the Faulk trade was that it spelled the end of Petro’s time here. As we’ve gotten further away, I think it likely means Schenn is gone and Thomas slides into center.

 

[Nathaniel Lauharn]

Agreed. I think Schenn is trade package bait.

Please cite where Armstrong said he wasn't in our plans. It makes no sense to move on from a 28 year old center who is one year removed from 70 points and could easily hit it again with a healthy Tarasenko, especially as Schwartz regresses back towards his career shooting percentage. Especially when the biggest cap hindrances are Bozak, Steen, and Allen. Same people complaining about the inexperience of Kostin and Kyrou seem to be going all in on a relatively inexperienced Thomas with a career high of 33 points. Thomas will be a top center, but he isn't there yet.
Is it possible he prices himself out by asking for something crazy like $10 million? Sure. If that's where he's at, we should trade him. Otherwise,we can easily clear space for a $3+million raise. The cap will continue to increase, especially as the NHL negotiates a new TV deal in 2021 and Seattle joins the league. More cap space can be cleared for Thomas when Steen is off the books and by offering Seattle a pick and prospect to take Faulk.

 

[Stealth JD]

Please cite where Armstrong said he wasn't in our plans. It makes no sense to move on from a 28 year old center who is one year removed from 70 points and could easily hit it again with a healthy Tarasenko, especially as Schwartz regresses back towards his career shooting percentage. Especially when the biggest cap hindrances are Bozak, Steen, and Allen. Same people complaining about the inexperience of Kostin and Kyrou seem to be going all in on a relatively inexperienced Thomas with a career high of 33 points. Thomas will be a top center, but he isn't there yet.
Is it possible he prices himself out by asking for something crazy like $10 million? Sure. If that's where he's at, we should trade him. Otherwise,we can easily clear space for a $3+million raise. The cap will continue to increase, especially as the NHL negotiates a new TV deal in 2021 and Seattle joins the league. More cap space can be cleared for Thomas when Steen is off the books and by offering Seattle a pick and prospect to take Faulk.

Yeah - it's risky to think Thomas can endure a full season of NHL physicality and replace the production that Schenn provides today. I'd be shocked if that was the plan. You don't trade your talent because you've got problem-contracts preventing the re-signing of a core player. You do whatever you can to move the problem-contracts first. The good thing about having 10 guys fighting for four spots is that you can include some of those guys in deals required to off-load an asset. A team might have no interest in Bozak on his own...but you include a guy like Sanford who may be worth something in their eyes and suddenly you've got Schenn money. I think speculation about the loss of either Pietrangelo or Schenn is short-sighted and will prove to be patently wrong.

 

[MortiestOfMortys]

Can’t believe people are sleeping on Sanford. Put some respeck on his name

 

[BadgersandBlues]

Can’t believe people are sleeping on Sanford. Put some respeck on his name

I dunno man, he looked pretty passive for long stretches in the regular season and playoffs. He had some nice production in the Final, but there were still a lot of times he was within a stick length of the puck and was simply watching the play go by. If Binnington doesn't come up with a couple of key saves, Sanford would have looked like a goat on a number of plays.

Not to mention he doesn't seem to score unless he's attached to O'Reilly and Perron. Usage matters, but it's not like he's shown enough for me to pen him in as a top 6 LW. I think we should have him and Fabbri rotating to start the season.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Please cite where Armstrong said he wasn't in our plans. It makes no sense to move on from a 28 year old center who is one year removed from 70 points and could easily hit it again with a healthy Tarasenko, especially as Schwartz regresses back towards his career shooting percentage. Especially when the biggest cap hindrances are Bozak, Steen, and Allen. Same people complaining about the inexperience of Kostin and Kyrou seem to be going all in on a relatively inexperienced Thomas with a career high of 33 points. Thomas will be a top center, but he isn't there yet.
Is it possible he prices himself out by asking for something crazy like $10 million? Sure. If that's where he's at, we should trade him. Otherwise,we can easily clear space for a $3+million raise. The cap will continue to increase, especially as the NHL negotiates a new TV deal in 2021 and Seattle joins the league. More cap space can be cleared for Thomas when Steen is off the books and by offering Seattle a pick and prospect to take Faulk.

Cite?

APA style?

With footnotes?

I said “think”, not “Armstrong said...”.

Ok Professor?

 

[Blueston]

Yup. My immediate reaction after the Faulk trade was that it spelled the end of Petro’s time here. As we’ve gotten further away, I think it likely means Schenn is gone and Thomas slides into center.

I think preference is to resign both. If they extend Schenn I think Bozak is one who is dealt to allow Thomas to slide over to center. In time as Thomas continues to improve and he centers 1 of top 2 lines, Schenn can slide to wing (or 3c even). Only way Schenn is dealt this season I think is if this year goes poorly and they deal him rather than lose him.

 

[Beauterham]

I've been thinking. After acquiring Faulk, I feel trading Bortuzzo should be an option.

Con Bortztrade:
- Trading Bortuzzo after trading Edmundson means we lose a lot of physical presence in our D-core.

Pro Bortztrade:
- After the Faulk-trade we have 3 righthanded defenseman that are clearly better then Bortz, if Berube doesn't plan to play one of them on their offside, Bortuzzo will be a healthy scratch most of the season (Pietrangelo, Parayko and Faulk didn't miss a lot of regular season games the last couple of years);
- Borgman, Mikkola and Pouliot had/are having good trainingcamps and all of them are clearly good enough to be the 7th D. or to be a injury replacement. Borgman and/or Mikkola can also fill that 'physical presence' on the D if we lose Bortuzzo. If we really want a righthanded injuryreplacement we can also call up Reinke or Dotchin. However, both Mikkola and Borgman are able to play on their offside;
- Bortuzzo's caphit is 1.375 million. Borgman and Pouliot's caphit is 700.000. Mikkola's caphit is 843.500. Replacing Bortz with, for example, Borgman will free up another 675.000 cap in case of need;
- Bortuzzo is probably not worth a lot, but we might be able to get a pick or even a prospect for him. Our prospect pool is running really thin, so I guess that's always welcome.

 

[Blueston]

I've been thinking. After acquiring Faulk, I feel trading Bortuzzo should be an option.

Con Bortztrade:
- Trading Bortuzzo after trading Edmundson means we lose a lot of physical presence in our D-core.

Pro Bortztrade:
- After the Faulk-trade we have 3 righthanded defenseman that are clearly better then Bortz, if Berube doesn't plan to play one of them on their offside, Bortuzzo will be a healthy scratch most of the season (Pietrangelo, Parayko and Faulk didn't miss a lot of regular season games the last couple of years);
- Borgman, Mikkola and Pouliot had/are having good trainingcamps and all of them are clearly good enough to be the 7th D. or to be a injury replacement. Borgman and/or Mikkola can also fill that 'physical presence' on the D if we lose Bortuzzo. If we really want a righthanded injuryreplacement we can also call up Reinke or Dotchin. However, both Mikkola and Borgman are able to play on their offside;
- Bortuzzo's caphit is 1.375 million. Borgman and Pouliot's caphit is 700.000. Mikkola's caphit is 843.500. Replacing Bortz with, for example, Borgman will free up another 675.000 cap in case of need;
- Bortuzzo is probably not worth a lot, but we might be able to get a pick or even a prospect for him. Our prospect pool is running really thin, so I guess that's always welcome.

Been thinking same thing. Well said.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

I dunno man, he looked pretty passive for long stretches in the regular season and playoffs. He had some nice production in the Final, but there were still a lot of times he was within a stick length of the puck and was simply watching the play go by. If Binnington doesn't come up with a couple of key saves, Sanford would have looked like a goat on a number of plays.

Not to mention he doesn't seem to score unless he's attached to O'Reilly and Perron. Usage matters, but it's not like he's shown enough for me to pen him in as a top 6 LW. I think we should have him and Fabbri rotating to start the season.

It surprised me in Dom’s write up to see him cite stats showing Sanford to be one of the team’s better defenders, and quotes about him needing to add offense to that package. I think it’s a case of stats being tilted by protected usage, but he was on O’Reilly’s wing so how protected could he be?

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

Cite?

APA style?

With footnotes?

I said “think”, not “Armstrong said...”.

Ok Professor?

Well, Armstrong said re-signing both Pietro and Schenn was the intention, at the Faulk presser. For what that’s worth.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

I've been thinking. After acquiring Faulk, I feel trading Bortuzzo should be an option.

Con Bortztrade:
- Trading Bortuzzo after trading Edmundson means we lose a lot of physical presence in our D-core.

Pro Bortztrade:
- After the Faulk-trade we have 3 righthanded defenseman that are clearly better then Bortz, if Berube doesn't plan to play one of them on their offside, Bortuzzo will be a healthy scratch most of the season (Pietrangelo, Parayko and Faulk didn't miss a lot of regular season games the last couple of years);
- Borgman, Mikkola and Pouliot had/are having good trainingcamps and all of them are clearly good enough to be the 7th D. or to be a injury replacement. Borgman and/or Mikkola can also fill that 'physical presence' on the D if we lose Bortuzzo. If we really want a righthanded injuryreplacement we can also call up Reinke or Dotchin. However, both Mikkola and Borgman are able to play on their offside;
- Bortuzzo's caphit is 1.375 million. Borgman and Pouliot's caphit is 700.000. Mikkola's caphit is 843.500. Replacing Bortz with, for example, Borgman will free up another 675.000 cap in case of need;
- Bortuzzo is probably not worth a lot, but we might be able to get a pick or even a prospect for him. Our prospect pool is running really thin, so I guess that's always welcome.

I think Armstrong would rather spend that 600K today right now on defensive depth, if you gave it back to him. Pretend he already did and keep Bortuzzo as the 7th man. Faulk will play some left side, we’ll see how much. Bortuzzo will get to play enough between injuries and Berube rotating him in periodically. Mikkola absolutely needs to play regularly right now. Borgman benefits from AHL play too. Pouliot is the only one I’d say is ‘done’ developing, and could be the 7th man. He’s the new Butler.

But as I said, that cap hit is better spent on depth. I’m certain Armstrong thinks so. What would the Blues spend 600K of Cap on now? Nothing that improves the team. It would be a hope for a trade deadline addition. But there are other ways to create the necessary cap space at that time if something becomes available. And I think we’ve seen that expensive rentals are not a big part of the plan here.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Well, Armstrong said re-signing both Pietro and Schenn was the intention, at the Faulk presser. For what that’s worth.

The intention.

I, for one, am disappointed to lose Bokk from the prospect pool and am on board with keeping as many offensive assets as possible, like Bozak.

There has been some trade talk here.

I think Schenn has the potential garner a ready-now roster player and an offensive prospect to replace Bokk for a lower cost.

Potential candidates? Haven’t thought that far ahead yet. So glad I don’t have to make these decisions.

 

[Blueston]

It surprised me in Dom’s write up to see him cite stats showing Sanford to be one of the team’s better defenders, and quotes about him needing to add offense to that package. I think it’s a case of stats being tilted by protected usage, but he was on O’Reilly’s wing so how protected could he be?

I think Sanford is strong defensively when so inclined. It is his inconsistent engagement that frustrates me.

 

[Ranksu]

The intention.

I, for one, am disappointed to lose Bokk from the prospect pool and am on board with keeping as many offensive assets as possible, like Bozak.

There has been some trade talk here.

I think Schenn has the potential garner a ready-now roster player and an offensive prospect to replace Bokk for a lower cost.

Potential candidates? Haven’t thought that far ahead yet. So glad I don’t have to make these decisions.

I don't believe Bozak is Army's trading block. I think its more like Steen + Allen who will be dealt next offseason.

 

[kimzey59]

I've been thinking. After acquiring Faulk, I feel trading Bortuzzo should be an option.

Con Bortztrade:
- Trading Bortuzzo after trading Edmundson means we lose a lot of physical presence in our D-core.

Pro Bortztrade:
- After the Faulk-trade we have 3 righthanded defenseman that are clearly better then Bortz, if Berube doesn't plan to play one of them on their offside, Bortuzzo will be a healthy scratch most of the season (Pietrangelo, Parayko and Faulk didn't miss a lot of regular season games the last couple of years);
- Borgman, Mikkola and Pouliot had/are having good trainingcamps and all of them are clearly good enough to be the 7th D. or to be a injury replacement. Borgman and/or Mikkola can also fill that 'physical presence' on the D if we lose Bortuzzo. If we really want a righthanded injuryreplacement we can also call up Reinke or Dotchin. However, both Mikkola and Borgman are able to play on their offside;
- Bortuzzo's caphit is 1.375 million. Borgman and Pouliot's caphit is 700.000. Mikkola's caphit is 843.500. Replacing Bortz with, for example, Borgman will free up another 675.000 cap in case of need;
- Bortuzzo is probably not worth a lot, but we might be able to get a pick or even a prospect for him. Our prospect pool is running really thin, so I guess that's always welcome.

Bortz is certainly a candidate to be traded.
The reason I lean against that option is that I don’t know if he brings enough of a return to make it worthwhile. Yes, we can get something for him; but is the quality of asset really going to be worth it?


As bad as it might look from an optics viewpoint, I think Gunnar is more at risk. It’s not a good look to trade someone you just signed, but Gunnar might still have value as a supplementary top 4 guy and teams have a bad habit of overpaying for those types of players. You probably get more for Gunnar than you would think you would.

I agree that the #6/7 spot is probably going to be cleaned up a bit, but I think Gunnar is more at risk than Bortz is. Bortz can play either side and brings an edge that Gunnar doesn’t, but Gunnar probably gets a better return because of his ability to play a top 4 role when healthy.

 

[Brockon]

Bortz is certainly a candidate to be traded.
The reason I lean against that option is that I don’t know if he brings enough of a return to make it worthwhile. Yes, we can get something for him; but is the quality of asset really going to be worth it?


As bad as it might look from an optics viewpoint, I think Gunnar is more at risk. It’s not a good look to trade someone you just signed, but Gunnar might still have value as a supplementary top 4 guy and teams have a bad habit of overpaying for those types of players. You probably get more for Gunnar than you would think you would.

I agree that the #6/7 spot is probably going to be cleaned up a bit, but I think Gunnar is more at risk than Bortz is. Bortz can play either side and brings an edge that Gunnar doesn’t, but Gunnar probably gets a better return because of his ability to play a top 4 role when healthy.

Not that I disagree with the sentiment or any point you laid out, but how is trading Bortuzzo inked to his 3 year extension on Dec 15th vs Gunnarson's 2 year deal inked on June 27th different?

I mean, trading a guy who scored a key GWG in the playoffs for you before they play a single game under their new contract looks bad no matter what. The only difference I see between the Gunny vs Bortz argument is that Gunny was extended after we hoisted the cup... Trading either is going to look bad optically, especially now that we're beginning to look more appealing as a free agency destination.

 

[shpongle falls]

I really hope they don't trade Schenn it'd be a huge mistake to let him go. I'm hopeful Army will find a way to re-sign both him and Petro.