Blues Schwartz Leaving To The Dub?

[Hanji]

Less practice time and usually less work-outs. The only thing stoping schwartz right now is his lack of bulk for a guy his size. CC apparently has a good strength/conditioning program which is really good for him to bulk up.

....not to mention NCAA hockey (particularly WCHA) is generally a slightly higher level of play due to the age difference.
Considering his NCAA stats, I think he'd absolutely destroy the CHL.

 

[Bjorn Le]

....not to mention NCAA hockey (particularly WCHA) is generally a slightly higher level of play due to the age difference.
Considering his NCAA stats, I think he'd absolutely destroy the CHL.

If he would tear up the CHL, it would be because hes talented, not because he was playing in the NCAA. He'd be going up to tougher competition, not worse, or else there would be little point in going and no NCAA kids would leave for the CHL and we all know that happens a lot.

 

[Hanji]

If he would tear up the CHL, it would be because hes talented, not because he was playing in the NCAA. He'd be going up to tougher competition, not worse, or else there would be little point in going and no NCAA kids would leave for the CHL and we all know that happens a lot.

I don't think I've heard any ex-NCAA player say he left for the CHL because the competition was too low. It generally is because of development issues.

Of course every player is different, but I think the CHL is the best route for NHL development, however that doesn't mean its a higher level of competition because, frankly, its not.
In fact there are several players who left for CHL because they weren't getting quality ice time in NCAA.


Apples and oranges

 

[Celtic Note]

Speculation usually has some truth to it. It would probably do him well to go the WHL. Just like it would do Jones, Grimaldi, Trouba to all go to the CHL, which I think they'll all do.

Why?

 

[William H Bonney]

Speculation usually has some truth to it. It would probably do him well to go the WHL. Just like it would do Jones, Grimaldi, Trouba to all go to the CHL, which I think they'll all do.

He may bolt to the WHL. He may not. All I'm pointing out is Strickland didn't really tell us anything you'd need sources to know. He even points out that just because his "sources" tell him the Blues would prefer him in the WHL it doesn't mean they're going to force the issue. So basically, Tri-City wants him (as they did last year) and the Blues would prefer him in the WHL (as they probably did last year and made that known to Jaden). Strickland doesn't really offer up any reasons why he, or anyone, has a feeling Schwartz may leave. Schwartz' whole family is very big on college education and all 3 kids play in the NCAA. Jaden is on record saying his dad is the one who educated him on the WCHA and college hockey in general. He's been committed to CC since he was 15 and moved to Nebraska to play in the USHL. He plays with his brother at Colorado College. So what's changed for Jaden that would make him leave? Because Tri-City pursuing him isn't some new development. For example, if Strickland said something like "My sources tell me Schwartz doesn't get along with Scott Owens" or "Jaden's parents now feel he'd be better served closer to home and in the WHL" then there would be an obvious spark to a potential fire. Right now, it's just a rumor based apparently solely on this article which doesn't really tell us anything, if there is anything to even tell.

Strickland is basically speculating off of a factor that existed before Schwartz even played for CC. Could he or someone know more? Sure but right now it just seems like Strickland is taking advantage of Schwartz' hype off of the BC game and is looking to draw in readers based on reporting essentially nothing.

...Grimaldi isn't going to the WHL. He's been adamant about that since he was 15. I don't like to speak in absolutes but the odds on that are about 0.01%. A lot of the American prospect followers do expect Trouba and Jones to end up in the CHL though.

 

[Celtic Note]

I don't think I've heard any ex-NCAA player say he left for the CHL because the competition was too low. It generally is because of development issues.

Of course every player is different, but I think the CHL is the best route for NHL development, however that doesn't mean its a higher level of competition than the NCAA; because, frankly, its not. In fact there are several players who left for CHL because they weren't getting quality ice time in NCAA.


Apples and oranges

Entirely depends on the player.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

He could do that in the AHL which would be more of a challenge than tearing it up against junior players. Personally I don't think it makes much sense as an option, he should either stay in college where he gets the benefits of education and more weight room time or go pro and have the rigors of a tough schedule and tougher opponents.

Exactly. There is zero reason for a player to transfer to the CHL unless he is struggling academically or simply does not like college. I guess if the guy sucks and can't get ice time, it would be a reason, too.

Would be silly to go and play against smaller, younger players in the WHL.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I don't think I've heard any ex-NCAA player say he left for the CHL because the competition was too low. It generally is because of development issues.

Of course every player is different, but I think the CHL is the best route for NHL development, however that doesn't mean its a higher level of competition because, frankly, its not.
In fact there are several players who left for CHL because they weren't getting quality ice time in NCAA.


Apples and oranges

Simply not true. No other response is warranted by such a comment, either.

 

[WesternCollegeHockey]

I think that he would get the benefit of playing a much tougher schedule... I could see 120 points from him next year easily.

Yeah, sounds killer.

 

[Celtic Note]

He may bolt to the WHL. He may not. All I'm pointing out is Strickland didn't really tell us anything you'd need sources to know. He even points out that just because his "sources" tell him the Blues would prefer him in the WHL it doesn't mean they're going to force the issue. So basically, Tri-City wants him (as they did last year) and the Blues would prefer him in the WHL (as they probably did last year and made that known to Jaden). Strickland doesn't really offer up any reasons why he, or anyone, has a feeling Schwartz may leave. Schwartz' whole family is very big on college education and all 3 kids play in the NCAA. Jaden is on record saying his dad is the one who educated him on the WCHA and college hockey in general. He's been committed to CC since he was 15 and moved to Nebraska to play in the USHL. He plays with his brother at Colorado College. So what's changed for Jaden that would make him leave? Because Tri-City pursuing him isn't some new development. For example, if Strickland said something like "My sources tell me Schwartz doesn't get along with Scott Owens" or "Jaden's parents now feel he'd be better served closer to home and in the WHL" then there would be an obvious spark to a potential fire. Right now, it's just a rumor based apparently solely on this article which doesn't really tell us anything, if there is anything to even tell.

Strickland is basically speculating off of a factor that existed before Schwartz even played for CC. Could he or someone know more? Sure but right now it just seems like Strickland is taking advantage of Schwartz' hype off of the BC game and is looking to draw in readers based on reporting essentially nothing.

...Grimaldi isn't going to the WHL. He's been adamant about that since he was 15. I don't like to speak in absolutes but the odds on that are about 0.01%. A lot of the American prospect followers do expect Trouba and Jones to end up in the CHL though.

Even if this were true, the travel distance difference is like 50-100 miles. So its not really that much closer.

 

[Stealth JD]

Exactly. There is zero reason for a player to transfer to the CHL unless he is struggling academically or simply does not like college. I guess if the guy sucks and can't get ice time, it would be a reason, too.

Would be silly to go and play against smaller, younger players in the WHL.

Could be as simple as he wants to earn money for his family, but doesn't feel as though he's ready for the AHL/NHL. He could leave college, sign an entry level contract from St. Louis, collect a significant signing bonus and report to junior for a final season of "free" development, contract-wise. Don't forget his sister Mandi has cancer, and $150k (plus whatever he could pull from Tri-City) may go a long way to helping make ends meet.

Or not...100% pure speculation on my part.

 

[leoleo3535]

I deal with Andy alot.....and he does not make things up.
He knows his hockey and is very well connected throughout the league....with the Blues and in addition with many other hockey people.

Many NHL teams approach NCAA players and suggest that them moving to the CHL would be good for their development.
In most cases I agree.

Having said this the player, his family and his agent will make the call.

Most listen to the NHL team.

 

[leoleo3535]

Exactly. There is zero reason for a player to transfer to the CHL unless he is struggling academically or simply does not like college. I guess if the guy sucks and can't get ice time, it would be a reason, too.

Would be silly to go and play against smaller, younger players in the WHL.

Most hockey people would disagree strongly.

 

[David Dennison]

Could be as simple as he wants to earn money for his family, but doesn't feel as though he's ready for the AHL/NHL. He could leave college, sign an entry level contract from St. Louis, collect a significant signing bonus and report to junior for a final season of "free" development, contract-wise. Don't forget his sister Mandi has cancer, and $150k (plus whatever he could pull from Tri-City) may go a long way to helping make ends meet.

Or not...100% pure speculation on my part.

Certainly as legitimate a reason as any. I know her cause had gotten a lot of (monetary) support from the hockey world, but Im not sure what proportion goes to the family and what goes to medical research groups and other charities.

I would be surprised if he ditched his brother at CC to play in the WHL, but family money problems would make some sense.

Personally, I think it would be best for Schwartz's development to stay at Colorado College. We all know that he can score, and he will probably do it regardless of what league he plays in. He does, however, have a lot of work to do in the weight room, and the NCAA gives him the best opportunity to do this.

 

[STL fan in MN]

If he would tear up the CHL, it would be because hes talented, not because he was playing in the NCAA. He'd be going up to tougher competition, not worse, or else there would be little point in going and no NCAA kids would leave for the CHL and we all know that happens a lot.

I would say the exact opposite. IMO, I would say that the overall base talent level is a bit higher in the CHL than in the NCAA but you can't ignore the age gap. College players are on average 3 years older than Jr players and those 3 years of experience, maturity, development and growth make a huge difference. Check out the stats - the average NCAA roster is 21.5 yrs of age while the average WHL roster is 18.3. You can't ignore those extra 3 years, on average, college players have on Jr players when comparing the level of competition. It's ridiculous how disrespected college hockey is sometimes around here. How it the world would Schwartz be challenging himself with tougher competition by taking his game to the WHL? He did VERY well in the NCAA this year as an 18 yr old in a league primarily of 19-22 yr olds whereas next year, if he were to play in the WHL, he would be 19 in a league primarily of 17-19 yr olds. Jaden would absolutely torch the Dub. Jaden might take his game there, I don't know, but I doubt it would be to face tougher competition because that's simply not true. Both routes have their pros and cons and which route is better depends on the kid. It's a case by case basis. IMO, the thing Jaden needs to work on the most is his strength and that's something that he should actually be able to do more of in college since they typically only play on the weekends. Again though, only Jaden knows for sure. All we can do is speculate. I'll add though that this is what Jaden had to say about it back in June...perhaps his thoughts have changed though.
LINK

McKeen's: With all the other guys picking the major junior route from that team, what was it that made you decide to go the college route instead?

Schwartz: It was a tough decision for me. I think it is for any kid growing up. But, me and my family put a lot of thought into it. It wasn't something we decided overnight or anything. We looked at both ways and visited Kennewick there in Washington and I went visited "The Springs" in Colorado (Colorado Springs). So, I just liked everything about it. I felt like I fit in, in Colorado. I like the coaching staff, the style of play there. Everything about it, I just kind of liked. In the end, I think it was a pretty easy decision for me, after I saw it all.

As for why some players go from the NCAA to CHL, there are a few reasons but I would say that for most, it's because they weren't ready for college hockey yet, not because the competition wasn't good enough. The ones that leave the NCAA for CHL are typically the ones that struggled as freshmen finding their place on a team with a lot of upperclassmen. It's hard for some 18 yr olds, even very talented ones with NHL potential, to make a significant impact on college teams sometimes. Jaden was going to dominate no matter where he went but but some, I do think the Jr route is better. What you're saying doesn't make a lot of sense IMO though. BTW, if the NCAA would allow it, I'm sure there would be tons of kids going from the CHL to NCAA as well.

 

[Celtic Note]

Most hockey people would disagree strongly.

Link? Citation?

 

[Celtic Note]

I would say the exact opposite. IMO, I would say that the overall base talent level is a bit higher in the CHL than in the NCAA but you can't ignore the age gap. College players are on average 3 years older than Jr players and those 3 years of experience, maturity, development and growth make a huge difference. Check out the stats - the average NCAA roster is 21.5 yrs of age while the average WHL roster is 18.3. You can't ignore those extra 3 years, on average, college players have on Jr players when comparing the level of competition. It's ridiculous how disrespected college hockey is sometimes around here. How it the world would Schwartz be challenging himself with tougher competition by taking his game to the WHL? He did VERY well in the NCAA this year as an 18 yr old in a league primarily of 19-22 yr olds whereas next year, if he were to play in the WHL, he would be 19 in a league primarily of 17-19 yr olds. Jaden would absolutely torch the Dub. Jaden might take his game there, I don't know, but I doubt it would be to face tougher competition because that's simply not true. Both routes have their pros and cons and which route is better depends on the kid. It's a case by case basis. IMO, the thing Jaden needs to work on the most is his strength and that's something that he should actually be able to do more of in college since they typically only play on the weekends. Again though, only Jaden knows for sure. All we can do is speculate. I'll add though that this is what Jaden had to say about it back in June...perhaps his thoughts have changed though.
LINK


As for why some players go from the NCAA to CHL, there are a few reasons but I would say that for most, it's because they weren't ready for college hockey yet, not because the competition wasn't good enough. The ones that leave the NCAA for CHL are typically the ones that struggled as freshmen finding their place on a team with a lot of upperclassmen. It's hard for some 18 yr olds, even very talented ones with NHL potential, to make a significant impact on college teams sometimes. Jaden was going to dominate no matter where he went but but some, I do think the Jr route is better. What you're saying doesn't make a lot of sense IMO though. BTW, if the NCAA would allow it, I'm sure there would be tons of kids going from the CHL to NCAA as well.

I would add, as we have discussed before,that he needs to work on his quickness/footwork and his defensive game. The NCAA is better for players working on the kinds of things that Jaden should be working on IMO.

 

[leoleo3535]

Link? Citation?

I don't know how anyone would put a link to this.

Most teams encourage this and if you don't believe this that is certainly your right.

 

[Celtic Note]

I don't know how anyone would put a link to this.

Most teams encourage this and if you don't believe this that is certainly your right.

I keep hearing this but have yet to see evidence, so I will continue to mark it down as an opinion until I see otherwise.

 

[USA!]

I deal with Andy alot.....and he does not make things up.
He knows his hockey and is very well connected throughout the league....with the Blues and in addition with many other hockey people.

Many NHL teams approach NCAA players and suggest that them moving to the CHL would be good for their development.
In most cases I agree.

Having said this the player, his family and his agent will make the call.

Most listen to the NHL team.

Andy is a blogger and nothin more. Prove that NHL teams want the prospects to move to the CHL! Most kids who leave school for the CHL can't get any ice time in school yet go to the CHL and most do well. Seems odd huh.

 

[Bjorn Le]

Well documented teams tell kids go to the CHL...

Lots of stuff on Julian Melchiori of the Rangers being told by Atlanta from this summer. You're in denial.

 

[BennyBST]

Well documented teams tell kids go to the CHL...

Lots of stuff on Julian Melchiori of the Rangers being told by Atlanta from this summer. You're in denial.

MTL told Tinordi to go play in London instead of going to Notre Dame. They wanted him to play a more rigorous schedule vs. 2 games per week.

But couldn't Schwartz go play in Peoria next year? If he plays less than 9 NHL games it won't count as a full season.

 

[R S]

I keep hearing this but have yet to see evidence, so I will continue to mark it down as an opinion until I see otherwise.

The poster you are quoting deals with players and NHL/CHL team staff on a daily basis, I would trust his judgement. Just because their is no "link" doesn't mean it's false.

 

[wej20]

Well documented teams tell kids go to the CHL...

Lots of stuff on Julian Melchiori of the Rangers being told by Atlanta from this summer. You're in denial.

Pens love kids who go to college.

 

[leoleo3535]

Andy is a blogger and nothin more. Prove that NHL teams want the prospects to move to the CHL! Most kids who leave school for the CHL can't get any ice time in school yet go to the CHL and most do well. Seems odd huh.

Whatever.

Andy is :

- an award winning reporter
- an award winning broadcaster
- hosts his own radio show on 590 The Fan KFNS
- coaches hockey

In addition he has personal relationships with dozens of NHL, AHL players, players at other levels, connections with mgmt. throughout pro hockey etc.

You can call him a blogger if you want.