GDT: Blues Contenders @ Blackhawk Pretenders, UC, 2 Dec 2019, 7:30 PM CT

[LDF]

It doesn’t make sense. Roster wise I thought Bowman did a great job this offseason. He didn’t go out and get a bunch of great players (except Lehner), but he did get a bunch of good ones. Don’t know what’s keeping these guys from being a good team.

in the off season moves. the 2 d-man he brought in, i thought 1 was better than the other, however it was the other that been doing very good. i was wrong there.

the goalie, i was sure surprise and extremely happy with the pick up.

forward, i hate those moves, esp Nynlander however i been somewhat surprise with the line 4 player.... that player being carpenter.

i really thought they should have traded sikura .

 

[LDF]

Toronto is having an awful year as well, hardly the marker of a good team. Pittsburgh had a ton of injuries. Vegas was in the middle of a bad streak, you didn't include Nashville but they're supposed to be a good team too and it seems like the Hawks game started them on a bad track, Vancouver is a good young team but not on the COL/STL level, the Dallas wins were nice to see, the Carolina game was hardly an example of the Hawks looking good, Buffalo cooled off majorly from another early season hot start.

Don't get me wrong, it was good to see them get the wins that they did. Made me think for a little while that they were finally turning the corner and it just took 20 or so games to build some cohesion. Now we see that's not the case. Inconsistent play and again, good teams don't get the **** kicked out of them by great teams.

The Hawks were totally outclassed these last three games. Colorado and St. Louis are some of the top teams in the league and we got to see exactly how far away we are from them.

outclass is a safe word to use.

 

[LDF]

The lines are a ****ing joke.

it is not the lines but the players that are a freaking joke.

 

[Salvaged Ship]

it is not the lines but the players that are a freaking joke.

Agreed. The magic line combos have been debated to death and it might be time to realize they don’t exist with this roster.

 

[LDF]

Agreed. The magic line combos have been debated to death and it might be time to realize they don’t exist with this roster.

has the heart of these players been misplaced ??

time now that freaking game plan of attack. clearly the team does not have the personnel to execute it.

 

[sugoi88]

From Captain Serious to Captain Gutless.

He's really into growing plants now. He takes that very seriously.

 

[BrianE]

It’s pretty simple to me. Seabrook is a 2M player at best making 6.8M, Lehner makes 5M, Crawford makes 6M. On any given night, that’s about 10M in cap space either sitting on the bench or not performing up to expectations. That puts the Hawks at a significant disadvantage compared to just about every other competitive team in the league.

Bowman brought in good players, but they make good money too. Given the circumstances, if there were more 4-5M quality players making peanuts on ELCs, they’d be more competitive, but they just aren’t there.

He tried to fit 10 pounds of crap into a 5 pound bag and it has spilled.

Good analogy and pretty spot on but add in Toews to your list of wasted space.

 

[BK]

It took years of defending Q before you finally admitted that he had to go and now it is the same with Stan who has proven that he is a lame-duck GM. You know very well that the talent on this team is not what it should be at this point ... but I'm sure you'll post the same ol' excuses. Like the usual pipeline, the pipeline.... the pipeline. Great drafting, the pipeline..... blah... blah ... blah. How long must this go on? Unless a minor miracle occurs this will be the 3rd year in succession that Hawks are out of the playoffs - the team and organization look as dysfunctional as ever.

To be clear, I don’t think Bowman is a lame duck at this point but I do think he needs to let JC go. It is just not working. I moved against Q more during the 16-17 season the. Wanted him canned the year after. Simple matter of everyone time runs out unlike some who claimed he just lucked into the team. Does firing JC put Bowman on the hot seat? Sure but it also identifies that he knows when to move on. Not sure who to hire though.

This team is a WC team talent wise and I said that from the start.

Pipeline has nothing to do with this season so there is no point there but go for it.

 

[LDF]

To be clear, I don’t think Bowman is a lame duck at this point but I do think he needs to let JC go. It is just not working. I moved against Q more during the 16-17 season the. Wanted him canned the year after. Simple matter of everyone time runs out unlike some who claimed he just lucked into the team. Does firing JC put Bowman on the hot seat? Sure but it also identifies that he knows when to move on. Not sure who to hire though.

This team is a WC team talent wise and I said that from the start.

Pipeline has nothing to do with this season so there is no point there but go for it.

you make a lot of valid points, but i would like to submit to you ..... and this is rhetorical, firing JC, will it fix this team of underachievers ??

i say no and this is the conclusion i came to.

 

[BK]

you make a lot of valid points, but i would like to submit to you ..... and this is rhetorical, firing JC, will it fix this team of underachievers ??

i say no and this is the conclusion i came to.

We have no idea unfortunately. It would be a risky move.

 

[LDF]

We have no idea unfortunately. It would be a risky move.

yes sir it would.

but is this a move essential for the success of this fantastical club we call the Bhawks ??

 

[Backyard Hockey]

To be clear, I don’t think Bowman is a lame duck at this point but I do think he needs to let JC go. It is just not working. I moved against Q more during the 16-17 season the. Wanted him canned the year after. Simple matter of everyone time runs out unlike some who claimed he just lucked into the team. Does firing JC put Bowman on the hot seat? Sure but it also identifies that he knows when to move on. Not sure who to hire though.

This team is a WC team talent wise and I said that from the start.

Pipeline has nothing to do with this season so there is no point there but go for it.

I think Bowman is a lame duck for sure.

Think of the success of this team over the last 10 years. Think of the 'cornerstones'. Think of the massive contracts given and the expectation of the returns of those contracts.

Think about the impact of the Hawks on Chicago. There were Hawks stores in Oakbrook Mall and the Aurora Outlet Mall. Interest is waning. Tickets are cheaper. Anyone with kids that play youth hockey knows that mite and squirt numbers are way down (consistent with the Hawks not being as popular). All of that matters.

Losing impacts the marketability and value of the team.

The Hawks were first round exits including a sweep they were absolutely dominated in.

As it looks, they will NOT be making the playoffs.

3 straight seasons with the 'cornerstone franchise guys' in Toews and Kane and the stalwarts like Keith, Crow and Seabrook - and no playoff appearances in 3 years?

That will ABSOLUTELY get any GM - regardless if his last name is Bowman - ousted.

The Hawks won't make the playoffs. JC won't survive the full season. Bowman will be gone at end of the season.

Take that to the bank.

 

[Backyard Hockey]

you make a lot of valid points, but i would like to submit to you ..... and this is rhetorical, firing JC, will it fix this team of underachievers ??

i say no and this is the conclusion i came to.

Not sure. Teams in every sport fire coaches mid season and nothing good happens.

Teams also fire coaches and something good does happen. Witness Berube and Sullivan.

Regardless, keeping JC for this season was a bad choice. I thought he was an interim guy last season and then 'find the right guy' in the offseason. Nothing he did suggested he earned the job for this season.

Keeping him won't get the results the Hawks want, so why keep him around? As of right now, this team is playing horribly and with no heart. They've been outclassed terribly by the good teams in the league. Their ST are a complete disaster. Lines are off. Players aren't being used correctly and most importantly, JC isn't getting the required performance out of his key players. Every single veteran forward on the team outside of Kane is playing poorly - some terribly.

It's the old adage of expecting the same results...

A change is needed and expected.

 

[Salvaged Ship]

Not sure. Teams in every sport fire coaches mid season and nothing good happens.

Teams also fire coaches and something good does happen. Witness Berube and Sullivan.

Regardless, keeping JC for this season was a bad choice. I thought he was an interim guy last season and then 'find the right guy' in the offseason. Nothing he did suggested he earned the job for this season.

Keeping him won't get the results the Hawks want, so why keep him around? As of right now, this team is playing horribly and with no heart. They've been outclassed terribly by the good teams in the league. Their ST are a complete disaster. Lines are off. Players aren't being used correctly and most importantly, JC isn't getting the required performance out of his key players. Every single veteran forward on the team outside of Kane is playing poorly - some terribly.

It's the old adage of expecting the same results...

A change is needed and expected.

The coach needs to go. The GM needs to go. Things is, a new GM should have the opportunity to pick a new coaching staff. If they fire Colliton before Bowman whoever is named coach must only be a temp or “interim” coach.
If they fire Bowman they should also put someone in the position on a temporary basis.

The problem with doing all of this mid season is it limits your choices for replacements. The offseason would likely present many more candidates for the GM and head coach.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

The coach needs to go. The GM needs to go. Things is, a new GM should have the opportunity to pick a new coaching staff. If they fire Colliton before Bowman whoever is named coach must only be a temp or “interim” coach.
If they fire Bowman they should also put someone in the position on a temporary basis.

The problem with doing all of this mid season is it limits your choices for replacements. The offseason would likely present many more candidates for the GM and head coach.

I hope Poile is canned in Nashville. He's a damn good GM.

 

[ColdSteel2]

I hope Poile is canned in Nashville. He's a damn good GM.

He’s been grooming his son to be his successor. Whichever team gets him can end up being set at GM long term and eventually have Poile as a Scotty Bowman like advisor.

 

[Kevin Musto]

Gilbert recalled

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Gilbert recalled

Why'd they mess around with McCoshen instead of just doing this from the start?

 

[Hawkaholic]

Why'd they mess around with McCoshen instead of just doing this from the start?

My guess is McCoshen was just an insurance policy that didn't stand a chance of playing, but now they probably want Gilbert playing instead of KK or Gus.

McCoshen also makes 220$ less than Gilbert, maybe that came into play?

 

[RememberTheRoar]

My guess is McCoshen was just an insurance policy that didn't stand a chance of playing, but now they probably want Gilbert playing instead of KK or Gus.

McCoshen also makes 220$ less than Gilbert, maybe that came into play?

Ahh, that may have been it

 

[LDF]

Not sure. Teams in every sport fire coaches mid season and nothing good happens.

Teams also fire coaches and something good does happen. Witness Berube and Sullivan.

Regardless, keeping JC for this season was a bad choice. I thought he was an interim guy last season and then 'find the right guy' in the offseason. Nothing he did suggested he earned the job for this season.

Keeping him won't get the results the Hawks want, so why keep him around? As of right now, this team is playing horribly and with no heart. They've been outclassed terribly by the good teams in the league. Their ST are a complete disaster. Lines are off. Players aren't being used correctly and most importantly, JC isn't getting the required performance out of his key players. Every single veteran forward on the team outside of Kane is playing poorly - some terribly.

It's the old adage of expecting the same results...

A change is needed and expected.

you and Bk has made some excellent points ..... points that can not be denied nor defended against from this org.

however 2 major points for me, the first one is JC in still under contract and from a fiscal point, let him play out this yr. second do you really i mean really think a new coach in mid season will fix this team problems.......

i say no, it is the GM screw up and his refusal to fix that comedy of errors on the defensive side of the game. SB has too much riding on this season and he will not change. it is the personnel of this team that the problem.

don't get me wrong, i am for moving JC but not until the yr is out. remove the GM and i bet that will send a msg to the players that this is their audition to remaining a Bhawk .......

 

[RememberTheRoar]

you and Bk has made some excellent points ..... points that can not be denied nor defended against from this org.

however 2 major points for me, the first one is JC in still under contract and from a fiscal point, let him play out this yr. second do you really i mean really think a new coach in mid season will fix this team problems.......

i say no, it is the GM screw up and his refusal to fix that comedy of errors on the defensive side of the game. SB has too much riding on this season and he will not change. it is the personnel of this team that the problem.

don't get me wrong, i am for moving JC but not until the yr is out. remove the GM and i bet that will send a msg to the players that this is their audition to remaining a Bhawk .......

Definitely not. The coach doesn't fit these players, but that's not the coach's fault.

 

[LDF]

I think Bowman is a lame duck for sure.

Think of the success of this team over the last 10 years. Think of the 'cornerstones'. Think of the massive contracts given and the expectation of the returns of those contracts.

Think about the impact of the Hawks on Chicago. There were Hawks stores in Oakbrook Mall and the Aurora Outlet Mall. Interest is waning. Tickets are cheaper. Anyone with kids that play youth hockey knows that mite and squirt numbers are way down (consistent with the Hawks not being as popular). All of that matters.

Losing impacts the marketability and value of the team.

The Hawks were first round exits including a sweep they were absolutely dominated in.

As it looks, they will NOT be making the playoffs.

3 straight seasons with the 'cornerstone franchise guys' in Toews and Kane and the stalwarts like Keith, Crow and Seabrook - and no playoff appearances in 3 years?

That will ABSOLUTELY get any GM - regardless if his last name is Bowman - ousted.

The Hawks won't make the playoffs. JC won't survive the full season. Bowman will be gone at end of the season.

Take that to the bank.

ref the bold, this is what will force the owners to make a move now.....

 

[GaryU]

To be clear, I don’t think Bowman is a lame duck at this point but I do think he needs to let JC go. It is just not working. I moved against Q more during the 16-17 season the. Wanted him canned the year after. Simple matter of everyone time runs out unlike some who claimed he just lucked into the team. Does firing JC put Bowman on the hot seat? Sure but it also identifies that he knows when to move on. Not sure who to hire though.

This team is a WC team talent wise and I said that from the start.

Pipeline has nothing to do with this season so there is no point there but go for it.

Colliton was Stan's hire. Firing him not much more than a year into the job makes Stan look bad.

 

[Rick C137]

Poille is such an overrated GM imo.