Blues #1 goaltender race Allen vs. Binnington vs. Husso?

[trevorftw]

Every time I start to think Binnington isn’t a fluke I see a sobering stat. Like tonight, where he now shares a record with 2 other Blues goalies to get 2 shutouts in their first ten games... Brent Johnson and Curtis Sanford.

Just saying CuSan was pretty great until all of the groin injuries.

 

[PiggySmalls]

Every time I start to think Binnington isn’t a fluke I see a sobering stat. Like tonight, where he now shares a record with 2 other Blues goalies to get 2 shutouts in their first ten games... Brent Johnson and Curtis Sanford.

I get your hesitance but I find it hard to compare JB to Brent Johnson, especially considering the team he had around him and how the league has changed over the past 18 years, along with the style of goaltending. Sanford's 2 shutouts were spread out between the end of the 02/03 season and the 05/06 big gap. Biggest different I see between JB and those two are his games where he didn't get a shutout, he still plays and looks really good (outside of LA game).

 

[Vladys Gumption]

Binnington is officially not a fluke. Pencil him in as our starter next year.

We shouldn’t be announcing him the starter next year. He’s played a grand total of 13 games. No GM in their right mind is going to hand him a starter’s job.

Having said that, he’s absolutely earned the right to compete for a significant role next year.

 

[ItsOnlytheRiver]

I get your hesitance but I find it hard to compare JB to Brent Johnson, especially considering the team he had around him and how the league has changed over the past 18 years, along with the style of goaltending. Sanford's 2 shutouts were spread out between the end of the 02/03 season and the 05/06 big gap. Biggest different I see between JB and those two are his games where he didn't get a shutout, he still plays and looks really good (outside of LA game).

Thanks for the perspective. I guess I’m just trying to keep everything grounded and not get too excited until this lasts a little longer. As I said in the GDT, he definitely has some confidence and swagger right now.

I’m really interested to see his anger come out a little bit. I want to see one of our goalies get a little feisty for once after putting up with Quick and Crawford all these years.

 

[Ranksu]

We need to find new tandem for Binny. Trade Allen away.

 

[DeuceNine]

His numbers in Vancouver are nearly identical to his career in Buffalo. He was a God in 2009/10, but other than that his numbers were that of an average-to-slightly-above average legitimate starter. That's almost exactly what he did in Vancouver and he is posting very strong numbers in a backup role in Anaheim in his late 30s. Unless you are only looking at the year he won the Vezina (which was an extreme outlier and happened more than 3 years before he joined the Blues), it is just not true to say he never replicated his play in Buffalo. He was bad here and has been good at every other stop. His Vancouver career was almost exactly what he was on Buffalo from 2010-2014: a good goalie on a bad team.

Snark aside from my end, this is what I'm saying: We gave up too soon. Probably, some of that was from his end also, but I think we should have just said hey, here's the keys for three years. What do you want to stay?

 

[Ranksu]

 

[GoldenSeal]

Binnington is fearless

 

[Metroid]

Has Bennington been playy more games than Allen recently? Or is he still sorta on the backup roll?

 

[The Note]

Has Bennington been playy more games than Allen recently? Or is he still sorta on the backup roll?

For all intents and purposes Binnington is the starter right now. Allen will likely play tomorrow on the B2B though.

 

[attackfan71]

Every time I start to think Binnington isn’t a fluke I see a sobering stat. Like tonight, where he now shares a record with 2 other Blues goalies to get 2 shutouts in their first ten games... Brent Johnson and Curtis Sanford.

What do all three of these goalies have in common? All three are product of the Owen sound attack.

 

[ItsOnlytheRiver]

What do all three of these goalies have in common? All three are product of the Owen sound attack.

I’m gonna need more info. What other goalies came out of there that might give me some hope?

 

[BlueDream]

I remember a few years ago on this board there was a thread about who would be our future #1 guy between Allen, Binnington, and Husso.

I picked Binnington in the poll just as a hunch.

Needless to say, the last 2 years I’ve felt kinda dumb about that vote.

But dammit I’m taking credit for it now. f*** it.

 

[Ranksu]

I remember a few years ago on this board there was a thread about who would be our future #1 guy between Allen, Binnington, and Husso.

I picked Binnington in the poll just as a hunch.

Needless to say, the last 2 years I’ve felt kinda dumb about that vote.

But dammit I’m taking credit for it now. **** it.

 

[ItsOnlytheRiver]

Not sure there is any better comparison right now than Binningtons save on a wrap around yesterday compared to Allen’s allowed goal on one (and bailed out by Dunn on another).

 

[attackfan71]

I’m gonna need more info. What other goalies came out of there that might give me some hope?

Other goalies that have came out of Owen sound that have played in the nhl. Jamie storr, kevin weekes, Dan lacosta, and micheal McNiven who has been called up a few times in Montreal to be backup, he is still very young and a fe years away till we see what he really is. So if I’m being completely honest Owen sound has produced a cpl average to good backups at the nhl level ( Brent Johnson, Curtis Sanford) a 1B starter in keven weeks.And one complete bust compared to what he was to become drafted 7th overall(storr)and one that had a cup of coffee in lacosta. But also being honest the two I will say have the best shot at being a starter is binnington and McNiven. They both have a very calm demeanour.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Should have kept Halak

Agreed but it is true, there wasn't a good reason to trade Halak, the team needed a C not a different netminder

Agreed. The entire premise of getting Miller was based on the notion that Elliott couldn't be trusted to carry the team through the postseason based on the 2 series losses vs. Los Angeles and the idea that Halak was so flaky he couldn't be relied upon either - but Ryan Miller ... he was a great goalie just stuck on a bad team, put him on our team and we might as well start planning the guaranteed parade down Market Street!

We needed a quality center to help with scoring. We ended up with Steve Ott.

I can't tell if you're being serious, but revisionist history would be to not have traded Elliott or to not have traded Bishop, or to not trade for Miller.

Bishop was either getting traded or walking for nothing. Better revisionist history would have been "if we hadn't brought in Elliott, Bishop would have shined as the backup to Halak and possibly carried the Blues deep into the postseason in 12 and 13 and we never have to trade for Miller and we've got a #1 all along and never have to deal with Allen's issues."

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Should have kept Miller if at all possible, and rolled with him and Elliott. But, hindsight and stuff

Miller had zero desire to stay here. We weren't keeping him short of offering him nearly the league max and giving him a plane to fly back and forth so he didn't have to be around on the team's off days. He wanted to be closer to his wife, which is why he's since played for Anaheim and Vancouver. If he can't play for a West Coast team, he'll hang it up.

There are a couple names between that pick and ours in the 2nd round used to draft Vince Dunn. But really the one that has had the biggest NHL impact you could say we perhaps "missed out on" is Sebastian Aho. But would we have even drafted him if we had retained that pick? That's a question we can't answer.

Sure we can. Don't we do that every time we talk about something like the 2006 draft? It's well if we had taken Staal/Toews/Backstrom/Kessel/whoever, look how much better we would have been / we could have won a Cup long ago! as if any of those players would have done on the Blues what they've done elsewhere. You know, kind of like you'd then assume that some other team taking EJ would have seen him get hit by teammates on the golf course the summer after his rookie year and tear up his knee and miss the entire '08-09 season as a result, and so on and so forth.

[lots of sarcasm in that, BTW]

 

[Frenzy31]

If we had kept Miller, we would have sent another first rounder to Buffalo.

 

[Brian39]

Hawks just signed Delia to a 3 year, $1 mil AAV deal. The last few weeks has been fantastic in terms of keeping our AAV down on Binny moving forward. Anyone concerned about Koskinen's dumpster fire of a contract ruining the market should be breathing easy. Since that contact, Delia got $1 mil AAV (3 years), Copley got $1.1 mil AAV (3 years), and Stalock got $785k AAV (3 years). 10 days before Koskinen's contract, DeSmith got $1.25 mil AAV (3 years). It is getting more and more clear that the market for late-blooming goalies with limited NHL experience is extremely team-friendly. Edmonton either let a lame-duck GM give out his last awful contract or elite-level KHL experience is viewed much more favorably than AHL success. Either way, there is not a ton of reason to be concerned about Binny's next deal.

He's either going to keep building his resume and be an RFA with little leverage or he misses his starts threshold and won't have the resume for a team to heave money at him in UFA. My gut tells me that these agents know how fickle/unpredictable goaltending can be and are advising their clients to take $3 mil of guaranteed money based on a partial-season stretch instead of taking a 1 year risk contract and banking on still being relevant/hot when that deal expires. After all, these are mostly guys who have been on 2 ways deals in the minors earning significantly less than NHL salaries. These contracts can be the difference between never "needing" to work again and having to potentially retire from hockey with a good start, but not set for life if things go sideways. Great news for the Blues.

 

[bluesfan94]

What do all three of these goalies have in common? All three are product of the Owen sound attack.

Hey now. Johnson and Sanford were Platers

 

[attackfan71]

Hey now. Johnson and Sanford were Platers

Lmao you are correct sir I stand corrected lol. At my age the memory is the first to go. I remember Sanford from his days in jr c hockey. I was the trainer on the team and he was very young. It was still a pretty rough league back then I remember sitting down with him telling him if you get hit or banged into stay down I’ll come out and give you time to get your bearings. And regroup. I’ll never forget his answer. Told me flat out if I can’t handle this I’ll never make the nhl. And I’m going to play In the nhl. I told his dad Gary that kid will make it he has more determination and drive then any kid I have ever met. Even though he never established himself for long career it sure was great watching him and seeing him fulfill the dream.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Hawks just signed Delia to a 3 year, $1 mil AAV deal. The last few weeks has been fantastic in terms of keeping our AAV down on Binny moving forward. Anyone concerned about Koskinen's dumpster fire of a contract ruining the market should be breathing easy. Since that contact, Delia got $1 mil AAV (3 years), Copley got $1.1 mil AAV (3 years), and Stalock got $785k AAV (3 years). 10 days before Koskinen's contract, DeSmith got $1.25 mil AAV (3 years). It is getting more and more clear that the market for late-blooming goalies with limited NHL experience is extremely team-friendly. Edmonton either let a lame-duck GM give out his last awful contract or elite-level KHL experience is viewed much more favorably than AHL success. Either way, there is not a ton of reason to be concerned about Binny's next deal.

The difference between Binnington's situation and all the others?
-- Copley is clearly a backup to Holtby.
-- Delia will still be a backup to Crawford.
-- Stalock is clearly a backup to Dubnyk.
-- DeSmith will still be a backup to Martin.
-- Binnington is not going to be the backup to Allen. The way things are going, there's a high probability he earns the #1 spot to start next season.

That's why I'd be shocked if he settled for $1M and change. With every start that he looks solid and confident in net, his price tag for next season just ticks up a little more.

 

[MissouriMook]

The difference between Binnington's situation and all the others?
-- Copley is clearly a backup to Holtby.
-- Delia will still be a backup to Crawford.
-- Stalock is clearly a backup to Dubnyk.
-- DeSmith will still be a backup to Martin.
-- Binnington is not going to be the backup to Allen. The way things are going, there's a high probability he earns the #1 spot to start next season.

That's why I'd be shocked if he settled for $1M and change. With every start that he looks solid and confident in net, his price tag for next season just ticks up a little more.

While Binnington may not be the backup to Allen next year, I think there is a very good chance he is the backup to someone. There just isn’t enough runway left in this season to anoint Binnington the #1 going into next season, barring a deep playoff run where he excels.

 

[mw2noobbuster]

So yeah. What do we do with Husso since Binnington is holding it down now?