Proposal: Blockbuster: VAN + PHILLY

CP4

Registered User
May 13, 2018
577
415
Victoria, BC
Nolan Patrick is a nice piece, but as of right now Horvat holds much more value. That could change in the future obviously, but I don't think adding Letehra would be the deciding factor for this trade.
 
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Flyerfan47

Registered User
Jun 30, 2011
1,930
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Some people giving up on Patrick way too early imo. He'll be every bit as good as Horvat and some.

Those people aren't giving up on Patrick, hey just have no idea what they're talking about because they haven't seen him play. This the same Horvat that's minus 51 in his career ? Patrick is only minus 3 on a pretty poor defensive club seemingly the last 5 years. I'll keep Patrick
 

Starat327

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May 8, 2011
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Those people aren't giving up on Patrick, hey just have no idea what they're talking about because they haven't seen him play. This the same Horvat that's minus 51 in his career ? Patrick is only minus 3 on a pretty poor defensive club seemingly the last 5 years. I'll keep Patrick

Look I wanna defend my prospects too, but this is insane. Horvat is playing top competition on a team that makes the Flyers look competent. Patrick may or may not become better, and its perfectly ok to take the chance on him instead, but to suggest Patrick is better or near Horvat today is absurd.
 

Neutrinos

Registered User
Sep 23, 2016
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Nolan Patrick is a nice piece, but as of right now Horvat holds much more value. That could change in the future obviously, but I don't think adding Letehra would be the deciding factor for this trade.

I thought it was obvious, but Lehtera is just a throw-in to make the salaries match
 

Copenhagen91

Registered User
Jan 28, 2016
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And do you think having the "much better player right now" is what's best for the rebuild?

Having Horvat on the roster this year could be the difference between finishing just outside of the playoffs or being a bottom 3 team with a shot at landing Hughes
At most an 18% of Hughes or their future captain. Hmmm logical
 

GoodbyeLuongo

Registered User
Jun 8, 2012
1,927
638
Seattle
Those people aren't giving up on Patrick, hey just have no idea what they're talking about because they haven't seen him play. This the same Horvat that's minus 51 in his career ? Patrick is only minus 3 on a pretty poor defensive club seemingly the last 5 years. I'll keep Patrick

With the exception of his rookie year Bo Horvat has played on the worst team in hockey the last four years. And if you think your defense is poor you should watch ours
 

innitfam

Registered User
Oct 18, 2017
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WTF???? Lehtera is terrible and a capdump. Horvat is better than Patrick now and its a tossup for the future. Horrible horrible horrible proposal
 

GoodbyeLuongo

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Jun 8, 2012
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Seattle
And do you think having the "much better player right now" is what's best for the rebuild?

Having Horvat on the roster this year could be the difference between finishing just outside of the playoffs or being a bottom 3 team with a shot at landing Hughes

A shot at landing Hughes. Or we’ll just take where we end up and maybe land the best player in the draft at 5 like we did in 2017.
 
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tucson83

Registered User
Sep 30, 2017
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It's not just the #1 pick. The point is, for a rebuilding team like the Canucks, they shouldn't be worried about having the "much better player this year", their focus should be on building through the draft with the highest picks possible

That is how successful rebuilds work

didnt the oilers try to do that and it failed? im telling you, you dont wont to go that route, i knew oilers fans would be telling you the same thing, you have to build around your stars, not keep tanking for them. you have your core now, it's time to add vets around those players, that's how rebuilding works.

that's how my team got out of toilet in 2007, homer build around richards and carter by trading for vet players and this team was in the playoffs the next year.
 
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Neutrinos

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Sep 23, 2016
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didnt the oilers try to do that and it failed? im telling you, you dont wont to go that route, i knew oilers fans would be telling you the same thing, you have to build around your stars, not keep tanking for them. you have your core now, it's time to add vets around those players, that's how rebuilding works.

that's how my team got out of toilet in 2007, homer build around richards and carter by trading for vet players and this team was in the playoffs the next year.

Didn't the Leafs try that and succeed?

The reason the Oilers aren't where they should be right now is because they've made poor personnel decisions. High draft picks aren't to blame, poor management is
 
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Canadian Canuck

Hughes4Calder
Jul 30, 2013
14,223
3,972
Kamloops BC
Those people aren't giving up on Patrick, hey just have no idea what they're talking about because they haven't seen him play. This the same Horvat that's minus 51 in his career ? Patrick is only minus 3 on a pretty poor defensive club seemingly the last 5 years. I'll keep Patrick
Jeez talk about being biased...You think you’re a poor defensive club?? Have you seen the Canucks defense!??? He’s been playing against the top competition every night for the past 4 years, in front of the worst defense in the NHL. Do you want to know our defense last night?

Pouliot-Gudbranson
Hutton-Stetcher
Del Zotto-Biega

But yeah, let’s use plus minus, the most useless stat in hockey history to show that your player is better.
 

Starat327

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Jeez talk about being biased...You think you’re a poor defensive club?? Have you seen the Canucks defense!??? He’s been playing against the top competition every night for the past 4 years, in front of the worst defense in the NHL. Do you want to know our defense last night?

Pouliot-Gudbranson
Hutton-Stetcher
Del Zotto-Biega

But yeah, let’s use plus minus, the most useless stat in hockey history to show that your player is better.

Some people can't help themselves. If it's any consolation, MOST of us understand.
 
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Rowlet

Registered User
Oct 13, 2018
3,227
3,276
Those people aren't giving up on Patrick, hey just have no idea what they're talking about because they haven't seen him play. This the same Horvat that's minus 51 in his career ? Patrick is only minus 3 on a pretty poor defensive club seemingly the last 5 years. I'll keep Patrick

The Canucks have zero top 4 defensemen in the lineup
 

StreetHawk

Registered User
Sep 30, 2017
25,591
9,425
Canucks < Patrick, Lehtera

Flyers < Horvat


Canucks get the younger player with more upside for their rebuild

Flyers get the win-now center on a team-friendly contract

From a Canuck's POV, Bo has trended upwards each season in his 4 years. His PPG last season would have had him around 57 points, up from the 52 from year 3. He'll likely max around in the low 60 something point range as it appears now that Pettersson will be the #1C going forward. Horvat likely gets deployed more along the lines of Kesler where he'll get more ice time than Pettersson.

So, I don't know if it is a lock that Patrick can produce closer to 70 points in a couple of years.

And Lehtera, his production has dropped since his 14-15 when he had 44 points. So, he's not really an incentive chip especially given his contract.

So, at best the Canucks end up with roughly the same level of player, just 3 years younger. But, they take the gamble and don't get much incentive to do so. Easy pass from Vancouver.
 

RebuildinVan

Registered User
Jun 25, 2017
2,245
2,064
Were pretty happy with Bo here.The fan base likes him, trading him for someone who may or may not be better would not go well
 
Feb 24, 2017
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Nolan Patrick is a nice piece, but as of right now Horvat holds much more value. That could change in the future obviously, but I don't think adding Letehra would be the deciding factor for this trade.
Lehtera makes almost 5 mill
He got under 10 points last year
He’s a deciding factor in Van saying no if bo and nolan were equal
 
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Knight53

#6 #9 #17 #35 #40 #43
Jun 23, 2015
9,296
5,540
Vancouver
Horvat isn't going anywhere. One of the most underrated players in the league and after Pettersson is the teams most important player who does the heavy lifting. They have one of the best young centre duos in Pettersson/Horvat in the league right now similar to Sedin/Kesler no way they touch that.

Vancouver would want Provorov back in any deal involving Bo Horvat.
 
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ponder719

Haute Couturier
Jul 2, 2013
6,414
8,280
Philadelphia, PA
Vancouver would want Provorov back in any deal involving Bo Horvat.

I'm sure they would. I'm equally sure that Vancouver doesn't have any single asset that would convince Philadelphia to trade Provorov, given that he's already established as our #1D, is still years away from entering his prime, and we have a bit of a history with drafted defensemen we're trying to overcome (if I'm reading correctly, the last defenseman the Flyers drafted to make an All-Star team as a Flyer was Behn Wilson, who we drafted in 1978.)
 

Nucks for the Cup

Registered User
Jul 28, 2011
314
397
Vancouver
Understand getting younger but why mess with the chemistry that the team is showing right now makes no sense. Also it reminds me of a cleveland browns move just trading one of their better players to hopefully draft a better one
 

tucson83

Registered User
Sep 30, 2017
2,638
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Didn't the Leafs try that and succeed?

The reason the Oilers aren't where they should be right now is because they've made poor personnel decisions. High draft picks aren't to blame, poor management is

you dont think Toronto got lucky with those players they drafted as well? just because one team gets lucky with picks, it doesnt mean another team can do the same, draft is a crapshoot, you have to get lucky and hit on players, you just cant draft busts and expect it to work out like that.

you have to be open with fa, trades regardless of what the situation is on the roster, relying on just drafting players is dangerous.
 

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