Bill Nylander Discussion

[Stephen]

I think he gets one year to build his game back into a core piece or inflate his trade value for the trade out of town. Understanding that he was handcuffed with Brown and Marleau, he was just still way too casual in that Martin Havlat 2000s Senators kind of way that doesn’t fly in the playoffs.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

It is what happens in the dance that resonates with Shanny.

He's firing Babcock ?

 

[Strangle]

And Nylander played well over these past 7 games, other than 1 terrible play. Based off of that he should not get moved.

He played okay for a $4m player

 

[SniperOnTheWing]

I said it a few pages back and stand by it. Nylander played very well CONSIDERING THE ROLE HE WAS GIVEN.

Once Kadri got his annual suspension Willy was left to drag around Marleau and Brown. Any reasonable observer knew that line would not produce no matter how hard Nylander tried. His linemates truly were offensive anchors, even Babcock knew it. Therefor the job that line was given was to keep the puck out of the net and hold the fort while the scoring lines got rested. If they scored it would be a bonus, but the main concern was defense. And they did their job. They were rarely scored on and that is a positive.

Now, if Willy had been playing with Matthews all series and still stunk it up in a pure scoring role (where is the Kappy and Johnsson outrage? They get passes?) then I'd absolutely be dragging him through the coals. That wasn't the case.

He made a few mistakes (he is not a full time center after all) but NOBODY on the team is blemish free after this series.

 

[robertmac43]

Those people who need to be moved are:

1. Nylander
2. Kadri
3. Gardiner
4. Marleau

And we need to find replacement for Connor brown.

Hoping one or both of the defensemen waiting to join the team can replace gardiner.

Marleau I 100% agree with, Gardiner is up and I doubt he is resigned unless he is willing to take a cut on what he will get in the open market, so it doesn't really effect our cap for next year.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

He's firing Babcock ?

who knows? shanny is highly unpredictable. babs is very stubborn. it is so hard to predict how that conversation will go. my guess is shanny has not even figured it out yet. he will talk to everyone first. then he will be definitive in making up his mind. and then who knows where this goes. my guy says Shanny will not let him walk out of org.

 

[Morgs]

Not if your making 7M on apparently a discount

We do realize its been all season showing that when Brown + Marleau are on the ice together nothing good happens.

Why would we expect different from Will? We do realize that was arguably both their best stretch of underlying play all season, and it wasn't because they were playing well.

 

[Morgs]

Johansson (1 point) ... Coyle (4 points) ... Kuhlman (1 point)
vs. 3rd line.

Except he played the Krejci line in game 5 and 7, but thats fine.

 

[Trapper]

Except he played the Krejci line in game 5 and 7, but thats fine.

That’s fine but Boston’s 3rd line didn’t have superior elite talent to Nylander.
As much as everyone hates in Nylander, it’s equally as frustrating how nothing is his problem. He owns both the good and the bad. And he did both all by himself.

The same as Marner owns his or anyone else.

 

[robertmac43]

He did nothing but stay to the perimeter in a half assed “cycle” where the slightest bit of a pressure led to him coughing it up or just blindly throwing it to the corner where no one had penetration

If this is your criticism of Nylander you also got to apply it to every other line cause not one of them had a consistent, effective cycle. I acknowledge that Nylander coughed it up a couple of times but you also have to recognize he maintained possession effectively and used his shift to play to create multiple scoring chances throughout the series.

 

[robertmac43]

You said he played great. Great is a huge reach. I'm afraid Nylander will always be the guy with skill that will throw some points up in the regular season when playing with better players, but will shrivel in the playoffs.

Okay fair. Would you contest me saying he played good. I really don't think he shriveled at all. He played well for someone who was put into a tough role with no prior notice.

 

[GoonieFace]

8 out of the top 9 forwards had underwhelming results. I think people are honestly overrating how good this team actually is.

 

[Mr Knies Guy]

If this is your criticism of Nylander you also got to apply it to every other line cause not one of them had a consistent, effective cycle. I acknowledge that Nylander coughed it up a couple of times but you also have to recognize he maintained possession effectively and used his shift to play to create multiple scoring chances throughout the series.

Absolutely, no line effectively cycled, but some players actually took hits to make plays to effect zone time and didn’t continually skate back and forth between the circle and the blue line where they either cough it up or pass off to a hemmed Dman at the line. He should have either cut in and driven, or taken it deep into corner like we saw others like Matthews, Brown, Moore, Goat, Tavares, and Ennis do. How many times did we see Ennis and Moore get crushed in order to push it deep in the zone instead of just giving the puck up or tossing it blindly?

One thing is for sure, no one supported each other in either zone and that was one of the main issues. I don’t know if that’s system or lack of accountability and engagement from the players. If that doesn’t change, we won’t see any success in playoffs because you saw what supporting play afforded the Bruins

 

[Honest M]

Woooha some of you are so full of **** , blame the low balled third liner that don't pp makes us feel much better. JT, MM aso. was given the leading roles on this teem and they didn't deliver and Babs didn't do his part either.

Now trade Will and sign Marner for 12M so we all can forget about the leafs for a decade again.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

8 out of the top 9 forwards had underwhelming results. I think people are honestly overrating how good this team actually is.

in the parity NHL.

 

[Sweet Leaf]

Funny how all those great advanced stat metrics for Nylander turn into terrible advanced stat metrics when he's not playing with Matthews isn't it?

My thoughts until next year are:

1. As per his current strengths/weaknesses, Nylander can be a force at wing on a sheltered 3rd line if you can afford that luxury.

2. He should not be a top 6 guy playing 20 minutes a night against the other teams best players. He has far too many holes in his game. Kappy should continue to be above him on the depth chart based on Kappy having a way better all around game and bringing things to the top 6 that WN can't IE forechecking, playing heavy, and playing the Hyman role on line #2. WN is far too soft and way too much of a perimeter player to pair him with another skilled winger who isn't proficient at playing a grinding, heavy game.

3. He is nowhere close to being good enough at center to fulfill that role on a contending team.

4. Can he become all the things he is currently not? He's young. It's possible. The progression curve is not looking good. I don't have a lot of confidence he will ever be more than a luxury piece on the 3rd line of a good team.

5. The same mixed opinions we have on Nylander here exist in the the locker room and in management. People are people and they see all the same things we do and have the same variance of opinions. I do believe Nylander was a distraction all season and impacted our season negatively. First the crazy hold out, then the trying to fit him back, juggling lineups constantly trying to figure out how to get him going, a depressed slump ridden kid in the lcokerroom, witnessing the half assed cowardly plays, etc...

It hurt us.

 

[Sweet Leaf]

Woooha some of you are so full of **** , blame the low balled third liner that don't pp makes us feel much better. JT, MM aso. was given the leading roles on this teem and they didn't deliver and Babs didn't do his part either.

Now trade Will and sign Marner for 12M so we all can forget about the leafs for a decade again.

There is literally not one person here blaming Nylander for the series loss. None of this conversation was started based on this series.

We talked about how garbage Nylander was before the series started.

We talked about how garbage Nylander was during the series.

We'll talk about how garbage Nylander is all off season.

 

[Trapper]

Okay fair. Would you contest me saying he played good. I really don't think he shriveled at all. He played well for someone who was put into a tough role with no prior notice.

Nylander (for the most part) played fine. But so do about 100 other guys.
If you are getting sold on elite, you need elite. Fine is just that. For a bigger piece of the Cap.

And he’s not alone. Paging Marner for the series?

We will see next year as this one is done. New year, start from the beginning and not miss time.

 

[Sweet Leaf]

Nylander (for the most part) played fine. But so do about 100 other guys.
If you are getting sold on elite, you need elite. Fine is just that. For a bigger piece of the Cap.

And he’s not alone. Paging Marner for the series?

We will see next year as this one is done. New year, start from the beginning and not miss time.

Yes...context.

I love the idea of WN being on my 3rd line in a sheltered offensive role playing 15 minutes a night. He can be a stick of dynamite in a role like that.

The negative comes in when we start asking questions that relate to ability to afford that AAV in that role and other ways we can spend the money, disagreements on if he is suited and should be doing more that that, effort and attitude and what ramifications that has on team culture, etc...

 

[Sweet Leaf]

Do we want to have a culture like the Bruins? IE a winning one?

Look at what the Bruins do:

"Kessel you are an uber talented young player but you're not Bruins material. Goodbye!"

" Seguin, man are you talented. You're also not really Bruin material though. Goodbye!"

They're not afraid to cut the chord on super talented players that don't fit into a winning culture.

And we laugh at the Bruins for trading away Seguin and they laugh at us after they beat us every year and watch our players head to the golf course.

It''s hard for me to imagine guys like Bergy, Chara, Marchand and CAM NEELY tolerating Michael/William.

 

[Trapper]

Yes...context.

I love the idea of WN being on my 3rd line in a sheltered offensive role playing 15 minutes a night. He can be a stick of dynamite in a role like that.

The negative comes in when we start asking questions that relate to ability to afford that AAV in that role and other ways we can spend the money, disagreements on if he is suited and should be doing more that that, effort and attitude and what ramifications that has on team culture, etc...

In terms of Cap (as many of us have discussed) I think we are structured to go:
Matthews - Marner/Nylander
Tavares - Marner/Nylander

The 3rd and 4th lines will need the salary overhaul and player changes.

On D, it is imperative we replace Gardiner/Hainsey with a top 4 RHD.
Rielly...RHD...Muzzin...Zaitsev

That’s one position we have to shed at forward to invest. Who that is, Kadri/Johnsson/Kapanen/the sudden disappearance of Marleau remains to be seen.

 

[Strangle]

Woooha some of you are so full of **** , blame the low balled third liner that don't pp makes us feel much better. JT, MM aso. was given the leading roles on this teem and they didn't deliver and Babs didn't do his part either.

Now trade Will and sign Marner for 12M so we all can forget about the leafs for a decade again.

I don’t think anyone is blaming nylander, but it’s clear that he is not good enough for his contract. The leafs just can’t afford to keep bad contracts and nylander is one now

 

[robertmac43]

One thing is for sure, no one supported each other in either zone and that was one of the main issues. I don’t know if that’s system or lack of accountability and engagement from the players. If that doesn’t change, we won’t see any success in playoffs because you saw what supporting play afforded the Bruins

We could likely go back in forth on Nylander dealing with contact/ his play in the O-zone all day, so let's just save ourselves that time :p

I do agree with much of the second paragraph. It's tough to accept but there were definitely many issues that arose from lack of support and I'm hoping we see some systematical changes come next season.

 

[socko]

Does a Nylander play for Florida State? I see distinct similarities here. This could have easily been the goal that sends us to overtime in game 6. But apparently Willy had previous commitments and he had to get home early.

 

[Faltorvo]

Blaming Nylander and pointin him out as the reason we lost is as lazy and stupid as Babcock complaining about Muzzin when Dubas traded for him.
This sportsnet panel anti-euro anti-skilled player old school hockey men narrative needs to be extinct asap because the Leafs gonna be a skilled, young team for the forseeable future.

and that dinosaur hockey just beat us in game,,,, 7,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, AGAIN

take your small ,soft, skilled euro crap and stuff it.