Bill Clement says the owners and NHLPA are not as far apart as we all think

Discussion in 'Fugu's Business of Hockey Forum' started by GKJ, Dec 15, 2004.

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  1. GKJ

    GKJ Global Moderator

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    Saw this on ESPNnews


    Offers probably the most intelligent opinion I've seen. He didn't even take one side or the other.


    He beleives essentially that everyone is talking smack, they're going to agree to talk next week. There won't be raplacement players. The major things he said:


    -Wayne Gretzky (as an icon of the game, former player turned owner), Mario Lemeiux (player AND owner) and Mike Barnett (agent turned GM) need to start speaking up to both sides, the media and whoever will listen

    -There will be hockey this year because the NHL and players know if they lose this season they'll never get that money back and irreputable damage will be done to the sport.


    -Made some lame analogies about air supply I didn't get but it sounded good

    -There is no point in having replacement players or a players league.


    -Neither side wants an arbitrator because of the fear of the unknown
     
  2. Gert B Frobe

    Gert B Frobe Registered User

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    That's good to hear - Clement is pretty credible and seems to personally know alot of the parties involved. I just hope he is right. I like the Eagles and all - but three meaningless games and a bye week before the playoffs will be so painful without hockey. Maybe I'll have to watch the Sixers... :cry:
     
  3. Cropduster

    Cropduster Registered User

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    I heard the 94 season lockout/strike/whatever ended January 11th??? Is this true?
     
  4. Doc Hollywood

    Doc Hollywood Registered User

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    January 13th
     
  5. 417

    417 Registered User

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    Thank you!

    i've said this all along, everybody thinks this is all doom and gloom, but truely IMO, they're closer than we all think, come'on fellas, the NHL will not be the only professional sports organization to lose a complete season to a work stoppage, it just won't happen...if anything, the NHL of all the major sports is the one with the most tradition, this would hurt their image way too much
     
  6. 417

    417 Registered User

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    and on december 14th 1994, the players association stated that there would be no season, and that all talks were off...they were back talking as of December 28th and a deal was reached 2 weeks afterwards, don't worry, there will be a season
     
  7. GKJ

    GKJ Global Moderator

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    I forgot to mention this:

    Clement also said that the owners and Bettman can want their salary cap all they want. There are still going to be owners who will spend over the cap to win. Fans of teams know what teams they are.


    The Flyers are definetaly one of them. The Rangers are another and so are the Maple Leafs to name a few.
     
  8. Doc Hollywood

    Doc Hollywood Registered User

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    Depends on the penalties that will occur of over the Cap. The NFL can fine the team up to 2 million and take away draft picks. We can't just say those teams will spend over the cap. We would have to see the penalties for the infraction.
     
  9. Charge_Seven

    Charge_Seven Registered User

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    I'd have to say it definitely is better than we all think it is.

    The players offer, whether you think it's smoke and mirrors, or a sincere offer, was a very good offer. I don't think anyone should/could debate that. The owners offer, although they did not move as far as the players did from their standpoint, was also decent, but everyone knows why it had to be shot down, the NHLPA cannot simply agree to dropping 35% of their high end clients money.

    I wish they'd negotiate out of the public eye a bit, get something decent done, get footholds on the new potential deal, before getting our hopes up.
     
  10. GKJ

    GKJ Global Moderator

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    So then what makes it any different from some alternative luxury taxes suggested by posters right here at hfboards.com
     
  11. FLYLine27*

    FLYLine27* BUCH

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    The RANGERS?!?!?!? No..................... :eek:

    ;)

    I just hope not. Money dont work. I want a DEVELOPED TEAM like Tampa!
     
  12. NomadManderson

    NomadManderson Registered User

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    Hope so. It makes sense. It is in no ones best interests to have the entire season cancelled. If the owners think the economics of the sport are bad now, just imagine what they will have to deal with after they need to rebuild the league after they burned it to the ground, if that happens. For the players, it's obviously in their best interests to get something done now, and there are enough of them with enough brain power to figure that out.
     
  13. struckmatch

    struckmatch Registered User

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    What gets forgetten in the midst of all this pessimism is that this exact situation existed in 1994 as well, and the sides seemed as far apart as ever.

    IMO, I think the players will capitulate, and finally be willing to discuss cost certainty, there are too many players who don't want to cancel en entire season, and basically, they must now realize that there will be cost certainty, and thats a fact. They can't avoid it, the owners have no motivation to open the doors, and to fold their argument.

    It's a situation where the players must decide whether they want cost certainty right now, or in 2 years time. Bob Goodenow should go to the players and say that cost certainty is the best he can get them, agree to a salary cap, and try and get the UFA age lowered, the minimum salary increased, and maybe even push for a franchise players type system like in the NFL.

    A soft cap is the best Goodenow can do. If the players don't understand that cost certainty is inevitable, then god help their souls, and the fans of the NHL, because we won't see hockey until the players can comprehend that.
     
  14. Bring Back Bucky

    Bring Back Bucky Registered User

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    Thanks for posting this, nice to see an opinion that isn't obviously biased to one position. :)
     
  15. Stronso

    Stronso Piker

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    God i hope that this gets resolved......... I am dyin without hockey....

    I have made plans to go see the Quad City Mallards game when I am visiting family in central Illinois to get some of my hockey fix.

    These guys are not that far apart ..... let's get it done!!
     
  16. GKJ

    GKJ Global Moderator

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    He also said that he is optimisitc because he doesn't truly beleive that everyone is so far apart. the PA wants like 54% ov the revenue and the owners want like 51% to go to the players or something? It will only take some creativity by someone for that to happen and to make sure that is guarenteed
     
  17. SENSible1*

    SENSible1* Guest

    The PA does not want 54% of the revenue. They offered 57% as a bribe in hopes of maintaining the inflationary system that would see their % continue to rise.

    If the PA really only wanted 54% and to keep it there, this would be already decided.
     
  18. Doc Hollywood

    Doc Hollywood Registered User

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    Exactly, so close but yet so far apart. If the difference is only that 2 or 3 % then this would have been signed already. The Leagues proposal maintains the 54% throughout the CBA and the PA doesn't give any such thing. The only way is up for the NHLPA. Salaries will just increase again.
     
  19. The Band? Did it sound something like, "I ca'nt fight this feeling anymore. I can't remember what were fighting for? (something sappy and unitelligible) and I just can't fight this feeling anymore."
    http://www.minibite.com/romance/cantfight.htm

    Death penalty should go to the jackass that signed them to a recording deal.


    Oh wait, you mean he was talking about oxygen! :amazed:

    EDIT: and this just goes to show that I am not into ****** music. The song I referenced is REO Speedwagon. :dunce:
     
  20. FLYLine27*

    FLYLine27* BUCH

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    Clement, Clement...head of Cement.


    Hes dreaming...there will be no season.
     
  21. struckmatch

    struckmatch Registered User

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    ^ The players need to accept reality, the gravy train is over. The sooner they do that, the sooner we can all enjoy NHL hockey again. Bob Goodenow is not a moron, he must know that cost certainty is inevitable, they will meet again to try and salvage the season.
     
  22. I in the Eye

    I in the Eye Drop a ball it falls

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    I take comfort in the fact that just because an agreement is hard to see right now, doesn't mean that an agreement doesn't exist...

    IMO, right now, both sides (and us fans) are looking for the 'perfect' agreement for them(our)selves... As such, each 'perfect' agreement only exist in their (and our) minds... We are seeking perfection in a nothing... and nothing can be perfect where nothing exists...

    In truth, all the NHL, the NHLPA, and us fans need is a perfect enough agreement to get both sides playing hockey... and IMO, we've got to be reasonably close... The dollars work out virtually the same (which is half the battle) - only one is guaranteed (certain), the other isn't... There's a creative solution that exists here somewhere... Perhaps some sort of semi-guarantee...
     
  23. struckmatch

    struckmatch Registered User

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  24. SENSible1*

    SENSible1* Guest

    The ironic thing is that as soon as the players agree to cost certainty their gravy train will be full steam ahead.
     
  25. Slewfoot

    Slewfoot Registered User

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    Gary Bettman will not accept a 'soft' cap. He only wants a 'hard' cap.
     
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