Bettman says no expansion or relocation; why were Conferences made unequal?

[Grudy0]

Re these statements made recently by Bettman, if there are no plans for expansion or relocation, why were the East and West Conferences recently reorganized to have an unequal number of teams? I thought this was because expansion or relocation was anticipated in the near future.

No. The NHL's preferred alignment in December 2011 was scuttled by the NHLPA one month later. Therefore, the NHL had to adjust this (using today's names):

Metropolitan CONFERENCE: CAR NJD NYI NYR PHI PHI WAS
Atlantic CONFERENCE: BOS BUF FLA MON OTT TBL TOR
Central CONFERENCE: CHI CLB DAL DET MIN NSH STL WPG
Pacific CONFERENCE: ANH CGY COL EDM LAK PHX SJS VAN

Each team within any given conference would play two games against non-conference foes, and the remaining games would be in-conference

Playoff qualification would be a strict top-four per conference qualification, with strict in-conference meetings for the first two rounds; the conference winners would then be placed in some kind of bracket, so it was possible to get a Rangers-Kings and Bruins-Blackhawks semifinal.

To appease the NHLPA, it was changed so that:
1) Playoffs weren't strictly top-four in four conferences, but top-three from each 'division', with two wildcards from each of the two conference
2) that change to playoff qualfication mitigated a change in the scheudle, as each conference would play against the other conference twice, the other division within the conference three times, and the rest in-division. Because you'd have to play three games against teams in your in-conference division, that ruled out Detroit and Columbus playing from the Western Conference because they'd have 12 games two or more time zones away, so...
3) Detroit and Columbus were moved from the Western Conference so that all 16 teams in the Eastern Time Zone were now in the Eastern Conference

With the above stated, does anyone truly believe today's setup was actually put in place to make room for two new teams? It's there to placate the NHL's members that had issues with the old alignment, and more importantly, to placate the NHLPA's desire to have a wild-card.

 

[KingsFan7824]

Still though, the original arrangement left both Detroit and Columbus in the West, apparently both content with that.

It left them both in the Central, not necessarily the West. The split was 8-8-7-7. When the split became essentially 16/14, because of the wild card idea, that's when Detroit and Columbus made their move to get out.

If Detroit and Columbus don't do that at the time, they may be giving up their logical spots in the East to two as of yet to exist expansion teams in, say, Quebec and Toronto. Then if the wild card idea remains in place, and who knows if other things change after that, the Wings and Jackets could be stuck.

Like the Leafs in the late 90's, if you see your chance, you take it.

 

[MoreOrr]

It left them both in the Central, not necessarily the West. The split was 8-8-7-7. When the split became essentially 16/14, because of the wild card idea, that's when Detroit and Columbus made their move to get out.

I certainly accept that very valid correction. But in so doing, I will take opportunity to emphasize a fact that I always point out myself: That the Central, or CTZ, is Not the West. Though most always seem to argue that anything which isn't ETZ is west...

 

[Section337]

Hard to deny Columbus and Detroit's concerns about staying in the non-Eastern Timezone conference. I propose that, if there is no non-Eastern Timezone team expansion and everybody wants to get rid of the conference imbalance for fairness reasons, then the only fair approach is to cycle through each Eastern team so that once every 16 years they are in the Western conference.

 

[gstommylee]

Hard to deny Columbus and Detroit's concerns about staying in the non-Eastern Timezone conference. I propose that, if there is no non-Eastern Timezone team expansion and everybody wants to get rid of the conference imbalance for fairness reasons, then the only fair approach is to cycle through each Eastern team so that once every 16 years they are in the Western conference.

not going to happen

 

[KingsFan7824]

I certainly accept that very valid correction. But in so doing, I will take opportunity to emphasize a fact that I always point out myself: That the Central, or CTZ, is Not the West. Though most always seem to argue that anything which isn't ETZ is west...

No question there. You've had more than enough realignment ideas that show you might not even consider the west as being west of anything. It's been an interesting few years is what I'm saying.

Hard to deny Columbus and Detroit's concerns about staying in the non-Eastern Timezone conference. I propose that, if there is no non-Eastern Timezone team expansion and everybody wants to get rid of the conference imbalance for fairness reasons, then the only fair approach is to cycle through each Eastern team so that once every 16 years they are in the Western conference.

I don't know about every team, but certainly the big market teams that could handle something like that would be fair game for such an idea. Obviously no chance that would happen, but walking in another person's shoes and all that.

 

[Section337]

not going to happen

Oh, I know that. More commenting on how fairness is multi-fold in a case like this. I am also not surprised that the fairness factor that took precedence probably had the best revenue generation behind it.

 

[MoreOrr]

With the above stated, does anyone truly believe today's setup was actually put in place to make room for two new teams? It's there to placate the NHL's members that had issues with the old alignment, and more importantly, to placate the NHLPA's desire to have a wild-card.

I don't think the PA particularly wanted a wildcard; they wanted a wildcard or at least something akin to that because a 4-way split meant that the teams in each of the Divisions wouldn't all have an equal opportunity of gaining a Playoff spot. If the League was going to go with unbalance, when balance could actually be had, then the PA felt that there needed to be something to compensate for that.

 

[PensBeerGeek]

No. The NHL's preferred alignment in December 2011 was scuttled by the NHLPA one month later. Therefore, the NHL had to adjust this (using today's names)

I always took the NHLPA's rejection of realignment as posturing before a pending lockout; in essence, they wouldn't have agreed to a proposal that said the sky was blue because it would make them look weak.

 

[Mc5RingsAndABeer]

Ya but points against flames and oilers shouldn't count anyhow.

The Flames have a winning record against the ****** eastern conference

Combined with the Oilers, they have a 9-11-2 record. The two worst teams in the West end up almost break-even against the East

 

[Acesolid]

Meh, if there's an expansion discussed and announced, it'll be when Bettman decides, and we wont know about it a single second earlier.

 

[Kimota]

Funny thing, Bettman say something and not too long after Daily is interviewed and say the opposite. Never fails.

I guess they play the good cop/bad cop thing.

 

[canadiancreed]

Remember, a lawyer made that statement. That should help set the amount of truth that it possesses.

 

[Hoser]

Exactly, ... Well no, not exactly!

This is rehashing old an topic, but there were a number of teams which wanted their alignment fixed, but it seemed like an impossible task to get enough teams satisfied within the confines of the 6-Division arrangement. So Mr Bettman came up with the idea that the League try a 4-Division alignment, which initially a majority were against, but eventually most came round to liking it. Still though, the original arrangement left both Detroit and Columbus in the West, apparently both content with that. And then came the original ideas from us, the peanut gallery, that the League must have plans to expand to QC and perhaps southern Ontario (wasn't my thinking), why else have two vacancies in the East? But the saga didn't stop there, because the PA didn't approve of the alignment, and ultimately, with some tinkering to satisfy the PA, and also a bit more time to reconsider the alignment, the League then, only then, decided to put both Detroit and Columbus in the East. And once again came the speculation that that must mean that the League has plan for two expansion sites in the West; when actually it should've caused some to question if the League had any specific expansion plans at all, since first it left two vacancies in the East, then two in the West, yada, yada, ya...

Ultimately, it's as you say, neither Detroit nor Columbus wanted to stay the lone ETZ team in the West; either both or neither.

MOD

I said it before and I'll say it again: for years and years there were four divisions, and one of them had six teams in it while the others had five. Nobody really *****ed at the time: nobody CARED. It wasn't interpreted as a sign that the league was going to expand by three to even it all out, or to contract a team and reshuffle the divisions. It just so happened the divisions were uneven. It didn't matter in any particular way at all.


Why are the conferences set up with 14 in the west and 16 in the east? Because the Campbell Conference had 10 and the Wales Conference had 11: it worked out that way to satisfy teams' travel requirements and to suit time zones for TV vroadcast purposes. Otherwise who ****ing cares?

 

[tony d]

I think that Bettman will eventually change his mind. I mean the conferences are unequal and the game is currently in a period of growth, why not expand?

 

[powerstuck]

Gary Bettman : There were never plans to relocate, but you bet that if Glendale didn't cough up $50M and a generous arena deal we would have relocated the team faster than it took to put it there in first place, but no we are absolutely not talking about relocation.

 

[Grudy0]

I think that Bettman will eventually change his mind. I mean the conferences are unequal and the game is currently in a period of growth, why not expand?

I think Bettman is lobbying the Board of Governors for Seattle and Quebec. Ultimately, the decision to expand lies with the Board of Governors.

It's kinda like how the plan to expand to 28 teams was initially led by the NHL's BoG at the time, and the execution of the plan started with John Ziegler when teams were awarded to Ottawa and Tampa in 1990. By the time Bettman was commissioner, the NHL had 26 franchises, and was tasked to help bring in the next set of teams.

 

[Alberta]

I find it funny that any team in the East would be out of the playoffs if they were in the West (even Boston).

 

[JLP]

Thanks for all the responses, I learned stuff.

If you had to guess, what year might we see NHL expansion or relocation? 2015?

 

[Grudy0]

Thanks for all the responses, I learned stuff.

If you had to guess, what year might we see NHL expansion or relocation? 2015?

Relocation? Not until 2018, as the only team that would be portable at that time would be the Coyotes.

Expansion? It could happen at any time, but I'd think it was most likely to occur no earlier than 2015, when Quebec has their new arena online, and most likely 2016, when Seattle should have theirs online.

 

[PCSPounder]

This seems contradictory I seem to remember Daly saying the NHL was looking at expansion including a franchise in Seattle.

There's a difference between looking at it and looking to do it.

 

[LadyStanley]

2015... Las Vegas is building new arena (AEG control). Houston has a new arena on the board (but apparently slated for AHL/ECHL use).

 

[No Fun Shogun]

New arena in Houston's not going to be nearly large enough to even act as a temporary NHL venue, so they're still a non-starter as long as Alexander's around and not interested.

 

[Hardnell]

This.

This post needs to be "stickied" somehow, just so I could use it to shoot down all the stupid expansion threads that get started here.

I said it before and I'll say it again: for years and years there were four divisions, and one of them had six teams in it while the others had five. Nobody really *****ed at the time: nobody CARED. It wasn't interpreted as a sign that the league was going to expand by three to even it all out, or to contract a team and reshuffle the divisions. It just so happened the divisions were uneven. It didn't matter in any particular way at all.


Why are the conferences set up with 14 in the west and 16 in the east? Because the Campbell Conference had 10 and the Wales Conference had 11: it worked out that way to satisfy teams' travel requirements and to suit time zones for TV vroadcast purposes. Otherwise who ****ing cares?

Who cares... the one team and their fanbase in the east who doesn't make the playoffs in place of the undeserving team in the west who does

 

[yoteshot]

Who cares... the one team and their fanbase in the east who doesn't make the playoffs in place of the undeserving team in the west who does

Considering the top 8 teams in the NHL right now are from the West, I doubt that will be a problem.