News Article: Bettman "Oilers a well run, well owned team"

joestevens29

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Apr 30, 2009
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Like Katz, Bettman probably doesn't care about the on-ice product if the financials are booming.
I wouldn't say that. If the guy didn't care why would he fire TM and PC? Both guys are making millions. Now he has to replace them, which cuts into his financials.

Financials doing well helps ease the pain no doubt, but I'd be shocked if fan boy isn't pissed off about the on ice product.
 

McDNicks17

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Jul 1, 2010
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I wouldn't say that. If the guy didn't care why would he fire TM and PC? Both guys are making millions. Now he has to replace them, which cuts into his financials.

Financials doing well helps ease the pain no doubt, but I'd be shocked if fan boy isn't pissed off about the on ice product.

They'd likely lose more money by keeping them and driving fans away.

And I guess I shouldn't say doesn't care. Just that I'm sure they care far more about the financials.
 

Drivesaitl

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Didn't Katz flew back to Edmonton to fire Mclellan? Pretty sure Katz does care

If one reflects, even momentarily, on Katz investment plays and financial *winning* in relation to his ownership and the club record on the ice its pretty clear where due diligence has been applied.

Even as far as the OBC they been milking the anniversaries, the get togethers, the celebrations and so that OBC, itself are actual events at Rogers including Reunions, Fuhr documentary etc. This is in essence content creating content. Serial spinoffs. So that its not just the current games, people pay money to see balding 50yr olds muse about their decades ago success.

The owner quite clearly cares about the original team and the events related to that old team increased substantially under his ownership as did all the OBC hangers on here. Guys like Anderson, Coffey, Mess, Gretz didn't show up much when the org had previous owners. But when buddy Katz became owner suddenly they're back in tow. The only ones that returned before that were Klowe, MacT, Semenko, Simpson.

btw a thank you to past players like Jari Kurri, Esa Tikkanen etc that have avoided these charades and endless celebration of the past. I have respect for that.
 

Drivesaitl

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They'd likely lose more money by keeping them and driving fans away.

And I guess I shouldn't say doesn't care. Just that I'm sure they care far more about the financials.

You bring in profile names because that's what orgs do for optics to maintain or increase the look of success. Which does not need to be connected with actual success. The addition of Chiarelli and McLellan brought the org 4 yrs of an appearance of hope. Its amazing even after that, and what a failure that the tenure has been that the guy who hired these fails is under no apparent hot seat and just that "we'll take our time and get it right this time" Oh sure you will..

Its seemingly endless carte blanche. Nicholson will leave here when its for better opportunity, not due to his performance or competence.

It hilarious even that the org can get credit for both the hires and fires as if these are disconnected. So that 4 popularity points occur. Firing/Hiring of Chia, and of McLellan. With a 5th throw in being the hiring of Hitchcock. It could be argued even that calamity, rather than stability may be better at creating soap box interest and hits. Which transcends interest just in the games.

Everybody, even non hockey fans discuss moves like the above, even those who don't even watch the games.
 

Drivesaitl

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I wouldn't say that. If the guy didn't care why would he fire TM and PC? Both guys are making millions. Now he has to replace them, which cuts into his financials.

Financials doing well helps ease the pain no doubt, but I'd be shocked if fan boy isn't pissed off about the on ice product.

In terms of relative costs, even given the coach and GM were highly paid those expenses are almost trivial compared to the entire holdings that include the Entertainment district investments.

It would be like a homeowner complaining about the costs of such things as replacing appliances every 15yrs as the value of the house has multiplied several times.
 

rboomercat90

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What a loaded thread this is going to be. I got excited when I read the title. I have so many thoughts on this. I’m going to read through it before I start. Kudos Drivesaitl for starting it.
 
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Todd from Leduc

Connor “The Next Great One” McDavid
Nov 15, 2017
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The Fake News doesn’t want the people to know that Edmonton has a great team. I know lots of hockey people, many many hockey friends, tremendous hockey people, and they all say Mr. Katz how did you build such a great hockey team? This team is going to win a big beautiful championship. But the Fake News doesn’t want you to know that. Sad!
 
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Hynh

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Katz is lucky that Melnyk is such a shitshow because otherwise he'd be the worst owner by a bigger margin than Gretzky's Art Ross wins.
 

Aerchon

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Jul 20, 2011
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Not sure if anybody caught the statement at the ASG but according to Bettman;

NHL commissioner Gary Bettman defends Edmonton Oilers organization

“To suggest that the Edmonton Oilers are in disarray or in trouble, I think is a gross overstatement,” said Bettman. “That franchise is well owned, well run, but they have some issues to deal with.”


“This is an incredibly competitive league and everybody wants to win,” Bettman said. “I know Daryl Katz and Bob Nicholson are committed to winning. The team is being provided with all the resources, but it’s tough to win.”

These are crucial thoughts coming from the commish, who either see's no problems here or isn't saying so. In anycase the comments are putting lipstick on a pig. Telling Oilers fans "its tough to win" is like throwing salt in wounds. As if we wouldn't know. The Oilers lose more than any team in the league in the current CBA.

But its startlingly tonedeaf that Bettman, in 2019, would opine with "Well run, well owned team"

But when one considers business side the comments become more clear. This is a team with a deep pockets owner that has a new funded arena, all proceeds of that arena, with improved revenue streams, and that has several arena district collorary projects that have given him some great return. Katz has already sold Edmonton Tower, which has been largely leased by the City of Edmonton, to an Alberta Crown Corp investment arm. Disclosures are that Katz made huge turn around on this deal in a very short time frame. It should be noted the City, and provinces(indirect) involvement in Edmonton Towers huge profits to this point.

As many have understood is its the real estate and property plays Katz has made in the Entertainment district that really transform revenues. Edmonton, that has historically had an office and tower suites glut has suddenly (I wasn't sure this was coming) become an investment darling in the portfolio of real estate investment and holdings that have seen huge pricing in Vancouver and Toronto. Suddenly Edmonton is touted as the value add for investors and development fund managers. With almost every tower touting attractive relative to Vancouver and Toronto pricing. So that the rental and lease towers being built in the district are selling a lot faster than could be expected. Mainly due to influx of outside investment coming to this market. This all spells gold to Katz who has hit a gusher on these developments.

In turn the Oilers Forbes valuations are higher than ever, and spectacular considering a perennial non playoff team.

David Staples: 'Any other market besides Edmonton would have abandoned the Oilers a long time ago': Sports business expert

Worthy to note the valuation of the Oilers franschise is now 540M, Over 5 times as much as it was in the 2004 season. Oilers revenues are twice as much as they were even in the Pronger cup final year, and the valuation of the org 4X increased in value in a mere 12 years.

So when Bettman is talking "well owned" he's talking dollars and cents. But when he's saying this org has good people that will figure out the on ice team he's talking out of his ass.

This thread exhibits that the actual performance of a club doesn't even matter, it doesn't even factor. In todays pro sports environments of massive corollary investments the on ice performance hardly even factors in the bottom line.
.
Take a look at the chart. The valuations and revenue in the respective years that this club made the playoffs barely did anything to move numbers forward. The biggest change that led to the Oilers being valuated differently, and the franchise worth much more, is the Arena and Entertainment (and real estate) district. It would be less sexy if it was just called the Real Estate district but its what the whole investment play is about.

One of my biggest complaints about our fanbase is that overall most think winning in the nhl is easy.

For our time in the league the Oilers are a very successful franchise and most fans just expect winning and Stanley cups to come raining down.

TB didn't make the playoffs 2 years ago with a strong team and now are the best in the league by a fair margin.

Parity is real. It's extremely hard to win in today's NHL.

McDavid level players on any hockey team does not mean crap any more. Worse teams can and do much better than the Oilers. And better teams worse.

Just the way it is and Oilers fans have a hard time wrapping thier heads around this, despite the decade of darkness.

Not a pass for what is clearly terrible management but at the same time it also bothers me how many EXPECT winning.
 
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Drivesaitl

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One of my biggest complaints about our fanbase is that overall most think winning in the nhl is easy.

For our time in the league the Oilers are a very successful franchise and most fans just expect winning and Stanley cups to come raining down.

TB didn't make the playoffs 2 years ago with a strong team and now are the best in the league by a fair margin.

Parity is real. It's extremely hard to win in today's NHL.

McDavid level players on any hockey team does not mean crap any more. Worse teams can and do much better than the Oilers. And better teams worse.

Just the way it is and Oilers fans have a hard time wrapping thier heads around this, despite the decade of darkness.

Not a pass for what is clearly terrible management but at the same time it also bothers me how many EXPECT winning.

In Wins, win %, rank ordinal, any team results stat you want the Oilers are the worst team in the NHL during this CBA. The worst. When I state winning, I don't mean winning it all, I simply mean an ability to put together even a half ass club that makes the playoffs once in awhile and with 16/30 or 31 Clubs making the playoffs each year that should be a better than average probability. Really even an average club should expect 7-8 playoff appearances in 14 seasons. To have 1 is disgraceful.

It could conversely be said that being the perennially worst org is hard to accomplish as well. Its really an inordinate accomplishment without parallel. Even Ottawa, as bad as they are now had a very recent SC final appearance and seasons that were successful.

Bettmans comment that its hard to win in the NHL, I don't take that to mean winning it all. I mean having any winning season once in awhile would be nice, and I'm talking over real .500, not Bettman .500 TM.

This btw is the Oilers overall record since the lockout in 2004.

Primary team Edmonton:
Wins: 797
Losses: 853
Ties: 102
OTLosses: 86
SOLosses: 64
Goals for Edmonton: 5160
Goals against Edmonton: 5634

Its astounding, actually, that in a 3pt NHL that any org could even pull off such a losing record across 14 seasons. Its worse that the team in question had an unparalled 4 top picks and STILL not a winning club.
 
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Hynh

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Jun 19, 2012
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Dude just accept being garbage for decades lol

Like, Tampa had a bad season once so 2 playoff appearances in 16 years is the same bro

The chef said cooking steak is hard so here's a steaming turd lmao
Apparently even being first round fodder like the Wild is way too much for Katz' cronies to deliver.
 

Beerfish

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Apr 14, 2007
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The owner does not want to win because wanting to win means doing everything possible to win. The current owner only wants to win with his old boys are with the team. A fable that he wants to 'win'.
 

Drivesaitl

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btw this is the record of the club that everybody thinks has a worse record than us. Since lockout the Panthers record is comparable to the Oilers. (still deplorable though, but at least an expansion club)

Primary team Florida:
Wins: 766
Losses: 788
Ties: 119
OTLosses: 101
SOLosses: 88
Goals for Florida: 4890
Goals against Florida: 5386


heres another of our weak kneed contemporaries but they have the excuse of poor revenue, non hockey market and ownership difficulties;

Primary team Win Jets/Pho/Arizona:
Wins: 816
Losses: 820
Ties: 100
OTLosses: 84
SOLosses: 63
Goals for Win Jets/Pho/Arizona: 4966
Goals against Win Jets/Pho/Arizona: 5479

Heres another club that has been almost as bad as the oilers since the cap, but they are now a successful club (thanks to the Oilers)


Primary team NY Islanders:
Wins: 771
Losses: 858
Ties: 89
OTLosses: 84
SOLosses: 63
Goals for NY Islanders: 5083
Goals against NY Islanders: 5710


those are the only 3 NHL clubs out of 31 that are even in a league of as bad as the Oilers. All of those markets have revenue problems.
 
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Drivesaitl

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The owner does not want to win because wanting to win means doing everything possible to win. The current owner only wants to win with his old boys are with the team. A fable that he wants to 'win'.

yep, in what world does commitment to winning = losing more than anybody else?

That's doublespeak at least.
 

Stoneman89

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Feb 8, 2008
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One of my biggest complaints about our fanbase is that overall most think winning in the nhl is easy.

For our time in the league the Oilers are a very successful franchise and most fans just expect winning and Stanley cups to come raining down.

TB didn't make the playoffs 2 years ago with a strong team and now are the best in the league by a fair margin.

Parity is real. It's extremely hard to win in today's NHL.

McDavid level players on any hockey team does not mean crap any more. Worse teams can and do much better than the Oilers. And better teams worse.

Just the way it is and Oilers fans have a hard time wrapping thier heads around this, despite the decade of darkness.

Not a pass for what is clearly terrible management but at the same time it also bothers me how many EXPECT winning.
If there was real parity, we would have a team that would make the playoffs more than once every 10 years. The Oilers are the exception to Gary Bettman's parity dream by their incredible incompetence.
 

Drivesaitl

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Katz' record as Oilers owner since '08:

308-386-92

.392 win%

.450 points%

LOL

Its worse than that. The context that this is during the 3pt NHL realistically needs to be factored in to give a look at how bad the club is because .450% isn't accurate with 3 pt games.

This is what I got;

Primary team Edmonton: 338-416-47-48 in these games.
Goals for Edmonton: 2243
Goals against Edmonton: 2645

Keep in mind the last 3 columns are all losses. The NHL plays some trickery by counting OTW, Shoot out as Wins but separates out losses.

So really the Oilers record in Katz era is 338W 511L

Its impossible to determine what the actual record would look like if OT did not exist and games that were ties remained ties because again games won in extra time are calculated as W's. No source I know of separates the columns sensibly.

I do agree though that's around what the win percentage actually is. But even that number is supported so heavily by games won in extra time.

During the Katz era this team has been pathetic at winning games in regulation time.
 

Stoneman89

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Feb 8, 2008
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I believe Katz does want to win, and he does want to make money. The fact that this team continually misses out on the playoff gravy, and has to continually pay people that don't work for them, means it is helping to balance out his full houses and other revenue. But his addiction and blind devotion to the higher ups running his hockey ops seem to outweigh any logical business decisions that would have had them all changed out years ago.
 

Hynh

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Katz runs the Oilers exactly how someone that hates the team would run them. Imagine that he was a Vancouver fan in the 80s. What sweeter revenge could there be than what he is doing?

A) Forcing the city and province to buy you an arena by threatening to relocate
B) Charging Edmonton fans ridiculous prices for the privilege of watching a last place team
C) Icing the worst team for a over a decade
D) Destroying all goodwill the 80s stars had and forever sullying the dynasty by associating them with unparalleled incompetence
E) Making so much money you will never have to sell the team

I'm not saying he is but what else is left?
 

Drivesaitl

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Katz runs the Oilers exactly how someone that hates the team would run them. Imagine that he was a Vancouver fan in the 80s. What sweeter revenge could there be than what he is doing?

A) Forcing the city and province to buy you an arena by threatening to relocate
B) Charging Edmonton fans ridiculous prices for the privilege of watching a last place team
C) Icing the worst team for a over a decade
D) Destroying all goodwill the 80s stars had and forever sullying the dynasty by associating them with unparalleled incompetence
E) Making so much money you will never have to sell the team

I'm not saying he is but what else is left?

This too is thread worthy.

Yep, its too funny. If an Owner secretly HATED Edmonton, and the Oilers, it would look like this.

Threatening to sell the club to Seattle should be its own point, or, getting a CEO/GM specifically to get rid of some of our recent stars.

One core player on the roster has longterm survived the cull here. We have a lineup so bereft of talent its like expansion clubs used to look like. Except those get better at some point..
 
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Aerrol

༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ
Sep 18, 2014
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The Media almost uniformly praises Bettman, sadly. I think he gets a little too much crap for following his directives from the Owners very well, but it'd be nice to see someone call out such painfully obvious BS in an actual article or interview. Alas, the last time anyone challenged Bettman (Ron Maclean re: lockwards IIRC), he got reprimanded pretty harshly behind the scenes IIRC. No one wants to lose their cushy relationship with the NHL - it's unfortunate but unexpected at this point.

If it helps any, I'm pretty sure Bettman hasn't even expressed any concern about Melnyk in Ottawa, who is probably the only owner worse than Katz, as he's f***ing over hockey ops AND sewering a new arena deal AND failing to spend to cap.
 

thadd

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Jun 9, 2007
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It's official, Gary drinks while he's on the clock.
Man would it ever a take a ton of drinks to get me to admit to that.
 

MikeGrier99

Registered User
May 20, 2017
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Talk about all time best time to be an Oiler/NHL fan. The Oilers botched their 3rd (arguably 4th) rebuild in a row, despite having one of the greatest hockey talents of all time on an ELC and 10 years of prospect capital. Rule changes are in a complete state of disarray, no one knows what goalie interference or other minor penalties are anymore. The Oilers one playoff run in a decade was mired in controversy over officiating. Former players have thrived on other teams in different circumstances. Katz is printing money because of investments that the city of Edmonton paid for. The international game is dead, which were some of the best hockey moments of my life. That's just the tip of he ice berg. I believe Oiler fan apathy is the absolute lowest it has probably ever been.

Oh and if all that isn't enough the Flames, Leafs, and Jets are all tearing it up. Even Vancouver ahead of us in their first rebuild attempt. This organization knows no shame.
 
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Dohilers

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From an economic standpoint, they're a well-run, well-owned team. They're just not a well-managed team. At all.
 

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