Nino33
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Yeah he already clarified (see below)
You don't see that opinion very often! From what I've seen there might be more players on Team Europe 2016 than fans of the idea they existed HaHa
Bettman: NHL wants to make another world cup, players Association seems to have no interest
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robertmac43
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When it comes to international hockey I have just come to the conclusion that the World Juniors are the most meaningful thing I'll get.
Nino33
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It doesn't bother you the best players in the world (for that age group) aren't there? Why not enjoy the Worlds too? Or the 2018 Olympics? or any other international tournament (including other tournaments full of teenagers) that's not best-in-best? What makes the World Juniors the most meaningful hockey tournament?
Just curious...you of course have every right to your view (many people like the World Juniors)
Not having the NHL season disrupted in mid season for the Olympics...doesn't bother me at all.
Having the World Cup, is kinda meaningless now. Before when we had fewer Europeans in North America it would unique and exciting. Now, not nearly as apppealing.
Same with the junior tourney. Years ago, few Europeans spend their junior years in North American. Seeing these unknown players was interesting/exciting. Now since so many play here, the tourney has lost much of its intrigue.
Having the World Cup, is kinda meaningless now. Before when we had fewer Europeans in North America it would unique and exciting. Now, not nearly as apppealing.
Same with the junior tourney. Years ago, few Europeans spend their junior years in North American. Seeing these unknown players was interesting/exciting. Now since so many play here, the tourney has lost much of its intrigue.
SpinningEdge
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Look this is simple:
The players WANT to represent their country in the Olympics. It’s important to a lot of players and more important than even winning with their own NHL team.
NHL Said no to the players for Olympics — which is fine and their right - but now players are saying no chance to NHL’s tournament (which is their right) as they view (and are correct) that it’s a much lesser and inferior tournament than the Olympics.
Again, pretty cut and dry. Typical you don’t do something important for us - so we aren’t doing something for you.
The players WANT to represent their country in the Olympics. It’s important to a lot of players and more important than even winning with their own NHL team.
NHL Said no to the players for Olympics — which is fine and their right - but now players are saying no chance to NHL’s tournament (which is their right) as they view (and are correct) that it’s a much lesser and inferior tournament than the Olympics.
Again, pretty cut and dry. Typical you don’t do something important for us - so we aren’t doing something for you.
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What if Bettman decided to hold the World Cup as direct competition to the Olympics.. at the same time as the Olympics. 6 teams.. Canada, USA, Russia, Sweden, Finland, Europe. Which hockey games would you most likely end up watching? Olympic or WC? I'm betting WC.
SpinningEdge
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No return?
People who are only already nhl fans will be the only ones to watch the nhls World Cup. It’s basically a extended all star game.
People who never watch hockey or have ever got into it will watch Olympic hockey - just like people watch Olympic skiing, snowboarding, etc. The Olympics generates more viewers than a NHL ran thing ever could.
To gain NEW fans at a international scale - the Olympics is 100x better than the World Cup. EVERYONE watches the Olympics - only current nhl fans watch the World Cup.
Pretty much.
I can see the point for all the parts involved.
The NHL owners want money. Fair enough.
The IOC has no interest whatsoever in giving special concessions to the NHL, concessions that no other participant in the olympics has ever had. Plus they very well know that NHL players or not, most of the people out there will watch the games anyways. Fair enough.
Players want to participate to the Olympics (or probably an equivalent meaningful event would be ok as well, I guess) but they are unwilling to get a crappy deal in exchange for participation. Fair enough.
I guess we* have a problem.
*the one of us that would want to watch a good best on best international tournament every now and then.
I side with the players on this one, i dont care about the WC at all and why should the guys give up 2-3-4 weeks of their summer for peanuts
You are going to need a source to back up those claims as the NHL has stated that they see no growth. I can tell you from all my years in the UK that very few people care about hockey when the Olympics are on (this correlates with the NHL claims). People with no interest in hockey are not that likely to watch hockey during the Olympics because they rather watch other sports they are interested in.
Also, it is expensive to watch NHL games in Europe. You have to pay for the subscription service and then you have to stay up late...really late to watch most games.
robertmac43
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I enjoy the Worlds and I enjoyed the Olympics to an extent, and obviously loved the older Olympics. For me at this point in time (subject to change) the WJC are the most fun to watch because the meaning is clearly seen in the players. The World Championships is the second choice for the Canadian players at least and that can suck some life from it.
I don't think it comes down to quality of players for me but more the intensity those players bring. The kids at the WJC will do anything to bring home Canadian glory.
Ultimately I'll watch whatever International hockey is on, the WJC is just my fav at the moment.
Nino33
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That's why last year all those NHLers (led by Ovechkin) left their NHL to play in the Olympics
Nino33
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Outside of the Olympics the those viewers never watch professional hockey/skiing/snowboarding/etc between Olympics either
I have no idea how popular the winter Olympics are in Africa/South Korea/etc but in the US they're about the same as American Idol was (or about 20% of the viewers that a Super Bowl gets) - clearly everyone doesn't watch the winter Olympics
And the Olympics are now famous for corruption, overspending/harm to host cities and drug cheats & almost no city want to host them...the prestige is fading fast
Nino33
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The TV money the IOC gets from the world outside of NA is enough?
Because ratings in NA are dropping (worst ever this past Olympics)...I've read how China/NBC want the NHL involved so I'm not sure how the IOC (who brings nothing to the table) has any clout
The IOC is changing/giving in LOTS as they struggle to find cities willing to host the Olympics...I don't see how this is any differnent
Burke the Legend
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Drytoast
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Gagarin cup is a bit less prestigious than the most prestigous domestic league trophy, Stanley cup. Well for some people it might be more prestigious.
No-one outside of Canada remembers a player who won the cup 10 years ago. Olympic winners are the real heroes, they will be remembered.
Yeah I tried to get a bunch of fatfead decals of Team canada players from the last olympics, they said " who?"
You know who will be remembered ? the players who, in a competiton of the BEST players on the planet, came out on top.
Beukeboom Fan
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I get your perspective from a "big picture" perspective. My "no return" is based on the NHL being primarily a gate driven league that has seen little to no impact in ticket sales (and thus revenue) from Olympic involvement. I get that hockey in the Olympics are a HUGE deal for international NHL fans, but those fans don't really represent a significant revenue stream for the NHL. For North American fans, Canada is already saturated from a hockey perspective, so there really isn't a potential lift there, and over the last 20 year the U.S. team's performances haven't been good enough to make a difference in fan growth.
It's obvious the NHL is trying to grow their brand overseas (NHL regular season games in Europe cities), but those are relatively "low impact" efforts for the NHL compared to shutting down the league for 2.5 weeks in the middle of the play-off push. Add in the risk of injury during exhibition games (Tavares lost for remainder of season in 2014), and I think that most people will acknowledge why the NHL doesn't want to participate in the Olympics.
To summarize, the reason why the NHL doesn't want to participate in the Olympics is that they don't see growth (or potential future growth) to justify the cost and effort involved. The NHL might be make a bad decision, but they have access to MUCH more data than we do, and a 20 year timeframe is a long enough period to make that decision. If it means enough to the NHLPA to be involved (probably less than 20% of the NHLPA member actually participate), then they can negotiate the ability to participate as part of the CBA.
Weird conjecture you have going on here.
Olympics weren't particularly special before Nagano, and they weren't special when the NHL wasn't sending their best.
Doubt anyone really cared who won the Olympic Gold last time.
Don't know if it's common knowledge who won it the Olympics leading up to Nagano.
Wings won the cup in 2008. Lidstrom Datsyuk and Zetterbergs last.
The NHL players are what made the Olympics special. It's a pretty crappy tournament without them.
I think they are enough. Even if ratings are goin down, we are still talking about the olympics.
Now, I am too lazy to go and check the figures for the various area since it does not seem possible to get worldwide date, but if I remember correctly the Tv data were lower than Sochi in Europe, but the streaming shattered records. I also remember reading something about record viewers in Asia and Australia , but that I think is related mainly to the time zone. Bbc also had some record numbers.
Anyways, hockey is just one of the many events in the olympics, the nhl presence is not that likely to affect the figures significantly on a global scale.
Of course, other factores are, as you said, so it is very much possible that the ratins will continue to drop, I just do not think that the nhl can affect that.
Anyways it seems that now they have been forced to go to the right direction, both Milan and Stockholm presented very cheap and "sustainable" candidatures, that rely mostly on already existent structure scattered over quite a vast area.
Nino33
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I asked about TV money, not ratings (I was wondering if a disproportionate amount of the money the IOC gets for the winter Olympics is from the US)
My understanding is Stockholm's bid is the first ever that is completely privately funded (amazing they can do this given every other time it's costed billions in public money...makes me think it's not a realistic bid) & the Milan-Cortina bid has no money from the Italian government (apparently the local governments are so rich they're going to fund an Olympics...doesn't sound very realistic either) - these bids reek of desperation, the IOC bending/breaking bidding rules as it goes to save the Olympics
The previous World Cup was a gimmick and a joke, I'm not surprised that the players have no appetite for it.
The only way that the world cup is going to work is if the NHL collaborates with IIHF and creates something similar to the FIFA World Cup(no gimmick teams, more national teams involved, more cities involved).
The only way that the world cup is going to work is if the NHL collaborates with IIHF and creates something similar to the FIFA World Cup(no gimmick teams, more national teams involved, more cities involved).
The whole break argument is moot now seeing as the owners agreed to provide the players with two weeks off in the season. So now the vast majority wouldn't get anything our of it.
