Friedman: Bergevin’s asks for Pacioretty

[Vancouver Canucks]

or anyone who didn't get suckered into overpaying for a player who was declining. Which given the total lack of interest by Hab fans to keep him....is likely the case here.

to me that is the most damning evidence of all. I've been a hockey fan for almost 50 years and I've never seen a fan base want to trade a former star away after one poor year, this badly ever. You'd think he killed someone. Why would anyone want a player so unwanted by his own fans...?

I've known Washington fans who wanted to trade Holtby away, just because he had one bad season.

 

[smirob]

or anyone who didn't get suckered into overpaying for a player who was declining. Which given the total lack of interest by Hab fans to keep him....is likely the case here.

to me that is the most damning evidence of all. I've been a hockey fan for almost 50 years and I've never seen a fan base want to trade a former star away after one poor year, this badly ever. You'd think he killed someone. Why would anyone want a player so unwanted by his own fans...?

I actually would be fine keeping Max, but unfortunately we have too many needs and not enough valuable assets to fill those needs.

Say all you want about Habs fans wanting to see Max traded, it doesn’t reduce his actual trade value or negate the fact that he’s a valuable goal scorer that a lot of teams would want

 

[NotProkofievian]

Can’t win with them. If Bergevin would’ve asked for less, fans would’ve said the return was too low.

Honestly, I’d want my GM to get the highest return possible. Pacioretty still has one year left on his contract wether he got moved at deadline or draft is irrelevant. We need a good return, and should be patient.

I'm not sure how asking for impossible returns is coherent with this wish.

Make me GM, I'll only ever try to trade for McDavid. It'll be tremendous.

 

[BB88]

You're entitled to that opinion but I don't share it. They have weak organizational quality depth, however, they have some assets they can move. Only one way to find out.

#1C's don't get traded for 4-5 player packages(thanks Chia).

 

[Howboutthempanthers]

I mean, let's say that Trocheck was getting traded to another team. The requirements for that to happen is not Pacioretty.

 

[Omar]

or anyone who didn't get suckered into overpaying for a player who was declining. Which given the total lack of interest by Hab fans to keep him....is likely the case here.

to me that is the most damning evidence of all. I've been a hockey fan for almost 50 years and I've never seen a fan base want to trade a former star away after one poor year, this badly ever. You'd think he killed someone. Why would anyone want a player so unwanted by his own fans...?

You’ve obviously not paid attention at all about why we want to trade him. We don’t want to get rid of him. But we’ve all come to terms with the need to trade him because he’s one of the only assets we have with enough valuable to help change this team. It’s not out of disgust that we can’t wait to get rid of him. And it doesn’t mean we’ll give him away because you don’t see that. If that’s your analysis after 50 years of following hockey, that’s pretty sad.

 

[Bazeek]

Said anyone who regrets undervaluing a player who’s had one bad year in their career and bounces back.

That's true. How many teams are kicking themselves for not pursuing Eric Staal right now? But as always it's that risk weighed against the risk of them doing exactly what you expect them to. The Wild are very risk-intolerant when it comes to vets on big contracts.

 

[topshelf15]

I think they resign him TBH,a high scoring winger like that...Will be very hard to replace,besides his highest value would have been at the TD ....Why trade him for less at the draft??

 

[lamp9post]

I think they resign him TBH,a high scoring winger like that...Will be very hard to replace,besides his highest value would have been at the TD ....Why trade him for less at the draft??

The Habs just need to focus on value at this point. If a re-signed Pacioretty represents more value than what he could fetch in a trade, then they should re-sign him. No point in giving him away when his value is at the lowest.

 

[BlueBaron]

The Habs just need to focus on value at this point. If a re-signed Pacioretty represents more value than what he could fetch in a trade, then they should re-sign him. No point in giving him away when his value is at the lowest.

IF he would re-sign don't you think he'd demand a No trade?

Not the NBA guys, this sign and trade stuff just is not a reality in the NHL with one or two exceptions.

 

[lamp9post]

IF he would re-sign don't you think he'd demand a No trade?

Not the NBA guys, this sign and trade stuff just is not a reality in the NHL with one or two exceptions.

A no-trade clause is a bargaining chip for both sides. If he really wants it, then he might have to lower his salary demands in exchange.

I've never suggested a sign-and-trade btw. I'm suggesting a sign-and-keep if they don't get full value via trade.

 

[BlueBaron]

A no-trade clause is a bargaining chip for both sides. If he really wants it, then he might have to lower his salary demands in exchange.

I've never suggested a sign-and-trade btw. I'm suggesting a sign-and-keep if they don't get full value via trade.

It is, but with the team as it is he has all the leverage.

I'm of the mind they need to do a real rebuild. I think they would have been better off trading him for Vilardi straight up.

 

[ImNeverWrong]

He's not as bad as his 37 pts or whatever he got this year. But he's clearly declining. 99.9% of forwards decline at this age.

 

[72hockey guy]

You’ve obviously not paid attention at all about why we want to trade him. We don’t want to get rid of him. But we’ve all come to terms with the need to trade him because he’s one of the only assets we have with enough valuable to help change this team. It’s not out of disgust that we can’t wait to get rid of him. And it doesn’t mean we’ll give him away because you don’t see that. If that’s your analysis after 50 years of following hockey, that’s pretty sad.

oh I have but all I see is excuses. You all say max is all you have to trade which is an outright lie. What Gallagher can't be traded? Or Galchenyuk, or Drouin, certainly they have value.. Your first round pick certainly has more value than Pacioretty. Yet most Hab fans go to the convenient lie and say Pacioretty is the one who must go. I expect that from you Omar and Draft day because everyone knows you're limited in your understanding but this isn't a team with no history. This is the Canadiens Led Habitants, a team with a rich owner, a great following. And storied history. Certainly somebody has more than the same bogus excuses.

Like I said before you have no valid reason to trade him other than he had a bad year. So why would anyone want him when you dont? People aren't stupid, they see through your excuses. Even though you foolishly think they dont. You have other assets to trade you just don't want to. You just want to trade max.

its gotten to the point that you have trashed Paciorettys value with your dogged insistance that he be the one traded. other teams see just how much you wat him gone, so they wonder is there something wrong with him. is it physical, is he finished, or just not in it anymore? why would anyone want him if thats the case. and its hab fans that have done this completely, with all the excuses. its time to stop because only you hab fans are buying them

 

[HabsForHire]

obviously YOU are the one with no idea what the word declining means

I will provide it for you since you quite obviously are either ignorant or dont know how to use a dictionary

present participle: declining
1.
(typically of something regarded as good) become smaller, fewer, or less; decrease.
"the birth rate continued to decline"

NEXT

Most people including myself consider declining in the sense of sports is getting worse and worse as the years go on. One bad year on a complete garbage fire team is not declining

 

[72hockey guy]

Most people including myself consider declining in the sense of sports is getting worse and worse as the years go on. One bad year on a complete garbage fire team is not declining

thats fair for you, but the word means what it means

and you must admit every single hab fan, seemingly wants him gone. so that is bound to affect his perceived value

the average fan sees that and says why do they all want to get rid of their star player, whats wrong with him that i dont know about? its human nature, then when you say you have no choice, when obviously you do have other choices of players to trade, it just trashes him further.

other teams would keep him and let him rebuild his value, but seemingly hab fans have no interest in that, further bolstering the impression that theres something seriously wrong with Pacioretty. why would anyone want that?

its the perception that virtually every hab fan is giving, and perceptions especially on a site like this, do affect values, they just do, to deny it is foolish. its not other teams fans that are trashing Pacioretty....its habs fans with all the excuses

you dont need to make excuses for great players. the only ones you make excuses for are bad ones

thats just logical is it not

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I think they resign him TBH,a high scoring winger like that...Will be very hard to replace,besides his highest value would have been at the TD ....Why trade him for less at the draft??

Not to mention prices are very high at the draft. GMs fall in love with particular players.

 

[72hockey guy]

I've known Washington fans who wanted to trade Holtby away, just because he had one bad season.

thats true but not to this extent, virtually every single hab fan wants him gone, and they all make excuses.

that affects perception

and perception affects value

 

[72hockey guy]

Not to mention prices are very high at the draft. GMs fall in love with particular players.

exactly you re-sign him let him rebuild his value a bit, and then trade him if you must

why trade him after his own fans have trashed him all year

like Ive said Great players dont need excuses, bad ones do

 

[smirob]

and you must admit every single hab fan, seemingly wants him gone. so that is bound to affect his perceived value

the average fan sees that and says why do they all want to get rid of their star player, whats wrong with him that i dont know about? its human nature, then when you say you have no choice, when obviously you do have other choices of players to trade, it just trashes him further.

other teams would keep him and let him rebuild his value, but seemingly hab fans have no interest in that, further bolstering the impression that theres something seriously wrong with Pacioretty. why would anyone want that?

its the perception that virtually every hab fan is giving, and perceptions especially on a site like this, do affect values, they just do, to deny it is foolish. its not other teams fans that are trashing Pacioretty....its habs fans with all the excuses

you dont need to make excuses for great players. the only ones you make excuses for are bad ones

thats just logical is it not

His perceived value, on here, has nothing to do with his actual value.

I’ve seen numerous Habs fans admit that we don’t have a ton on players worth what Pacioretty is, which is the main reason we need to trade him.

Something has to give. We won’t get a whole heck of a lot by trading Lehkonen. Drouin, Gallagher, Galchenyuk are all young enough to fill needs on the wings long term.

We NEED something to be done and Max is our most valuable trade chip imo.

I think, based on Bergevins press conference, that he is as good as gone. Come trade deadline we shall see what this declining, aging player we all make excuses for returns in a trade....

 

[72hockey guy]

His perceived value, on here, has nothing to do with his actual value.

I’ve seen numerous Habs fans admit that we don’t have a ton on players worth what Pacioretty is, which is the main reason we need to trade him.

Something has to give. We won’t get a whole heck of a lot by trading Lehkonen. Drouin, Gallagher, Galchenyuk are all young enough to fill needs on the wings long term.

We NEED something to be done and Max is our most valuable trade chip imo.

I think, based on Bergevins press conference, that he is as good as gone. Come trade deadline we shall see what this declining, aging player we all make excuses for returns in a trade....

yes we will, and it will be one hell of a lot less than the 2 firsts and a top prospect, hab fans first proposed way back, when the first pacioretty trade thread was posted

and you cant deny that

you were late to the party smirob. some of us were here from the very beginning and know exactly what was asked

St Louis fans were asked for Thomas, Kyrou and a 1st
winnipeg was asked for Connor and a first
Edmonton was asked for Klefbom and a 1st

and there were many more that hab fans will deny when he finally is traded

 

[smirob]

yes we will, and it will be one hell of a lot less than the 2 firsts and a top prospect, hab fans first proposed way back, when the first pacioretty trade thread was posted

you were late to the party smirob. some of us were here from the very beginning and know exactly what was asked

St Louis fans were asked for Thomas, Kyrou and a 1st
winnipeg was asked for Connor and a first
Edmonton was asked for Klefbom and a 1st

and there were many more that hab fans will deny when he finally is traded

Yeah people propose horrible trades all the time on here, so what...

I don’t recall ever seeing that ask from St.Louis, it was one or the other not both of Thomas/Kyrou - and if it was proposed, that’s a bad one.

Connor does nothing for us, we have an abundance of wingers so again that would be a bad one, which I’ve never seen proposed....but admittedly I don’t spend a ton of time on here and am often late to the party..

Time will tell, but please do me a favour and save all of the bad proposals by Habs fans and when a trade does happen, you can be the life of the party and drop the bombshell on the entire forum!

 

[72hockey guy]

they already know, Im sure im not the only one who has them, i know a few St louis fans like colt 55 who is just dying to show them, Ill just be glad to see one of my alltime favorite players get out from under unwarranted criticism

Ive maintained that bergevin ruined Patches by trading Subban and not re-signing Markov. he never needed a center before, he doesnt now, but he does need defensemen who can get him the puck in the right spots

 

[belair]

I think they resign him TBH,a high scoring winger like that...Will be very hard to replace,besides his highest value would have been at the TD ....Why trade him for less at the draft??

They kind of inadvertently did with the Drouin acquisition. You can't give Pacioretty $8m+ next summer with the depth you already have at his position. They missed a good opportunity to capitalize on his value at the deadline from a desperate playoff team. They can't continue to be gunshy.

Bergevin needs to get some futures for #67 this summer and he needs to tackle his center depth in the biggest way. Sitting on his hands is wasting the quality playing years from Shea Weber and Carey Price--two players the Habs have committed a significant amount of resources to employ.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threa...iased-look-at-the-montreal-canadiens.2440619/

 

[72hockey guy]

They kind of inadvertently did with the Drouin acquisition. You can't give Pacioretty $8m+ next summer with the depth you already have at his position. They missed a good opportunity to capitalize on his value at the deadline from a desperate playoff team. They can't continue to be gunshy.

Bergevin needs to get some futures for #67 this summer and he needs to tackle his center depth in the biggest way this summer. Sitting on his hands is wasting the quality playing years from Shea Weber and Carey Price--two players the Habs have committed a significant amount of resources to employ.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threa...iased-look-at-the-montreal-canadiens.2440619/

why cant he do the same With Gallagher Drouin or Galchenyuk, why must it always be Pacioretty? hes already committed his future to 2 similiarly aged players in Price and Weber ?

what has pacioretty done to be the one cast aside?

im sure other teams would pay more for Drouin