Bears and NFL Talk Thread LIV: Khalil Mack's a Bear!

[piteus]

You feel pretty good but others including me feel pretty "Meh" about what we saw from kid last year

For a #2 overall pick he was abysmal

He better show himself to be real deal because Bears and fans will have serious doubts about the future of position if he struggles again

Given what Bears gave up for him and the spot he was taken in draft its not unreasonable to be concerned or disappointed with him thus far

Since when did Bears fans ever have confidence at the QB position? I might be the most optimistic of them all and I'm still cautious.

Sorry, it's not like Solomon Thomas is killing it for SF. He's a run stopping DE as the #3 pick. The Bears did not give up that much for Trubisky. Look how much Buffalo, the Jets, and Phoenix gave up to move up 3 or 4 slots. The better question: did the Bears have to give up anything at all for Trubisky? Probably not ... but there's no guarantee Cleveland wasn't looking to move up either.

Let's put it this way, would you rather have drafted:

* Deshone Kizer and Baker Mayfield
* Mitchell Trubisky and Roquan Smith

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

That is poor question as Bears wouldn't draft QB two straight years high if they selected

Also Bears had options to trade down in 1st round if they weren't going QB and could have also done this

Lattimore + additional picks/assets + Trading for Jimmy G during season + Roquan Smith

So your hypothetical is poor

 

[Illinihockey]

That is poor question as Bears wouldn't draft QB two straight years high if they selected

Also Bears had options to trade down in 1st round if they weren't going QB and could have also done this

Lattimore + additional picks/assets + Trading for Jimmy G during season + Roquan Smith

So your hypothetical is poor

Hypotheticals are easy in hindsight.

 

[piteus]

That is poor question as Bears wouldn't draft QB two straight years high if they selected

Also Bears had options to trade down in 1st round if they weren't going QB and could have also done this

Lattimore + additional picks/assets + Trading for Jimmy G during season + Roquan Smith

So your hypothetical is poor

1. Belichick was NEVER trading Jimmy G except to the 49ers. He wasn't an option.

2. Lattimore would have been great, but then Fuller wouldn't have become one of the better CBs in the NFL. Lattimore was also the 11th pick. 10 teams passed on him. And if I'm not mistaken, the consensus was the Bears to pick either Thomas or Adams. That's reality.

3. Without Mitch Trubisky, Mike Glennon would still be our starting QB. Maybe the Bears get a top 5 pick this year and draft Josh Allen or Josh Rosen.

4. There were rumors the Browns would trade 2 first round picks and 1 second round pick for SF's #2 ... perhaps even more compensation.

If the Bears don't pick Mitchell Trubisky, we have no QBs this year except Mike Glennon. Perhaps the Bears draft Josh Rosen ... and drafted Adams last year.

Without Trubisky do you sign Matt Nagy and Vic Fangio who both said that Trubisky was a big reason they came to Chicago? Do you sign Burton, Robinson, and Gabriel with Glennon at QB? Remember, free agency is before the NFL Draft.

Let's say the Browns traded 2 first and a second to move up to pick Trubisky. That would give them ...

* Garrett, Trubisky, and perhaps Saquon Barkley this year.

Is that better than their current picks:

* Peppers, Njoku, Kizer (since traded), Mayfield, and perhaps more picks traded for the #2 pick?

If you're a Bears fan, would you rather have:

* Jamal Adams, Josh Rosen, +3rd round pick given up.
* Mitchell Trubisky, Roquan Smith (and all the free agents signed in offense).

People seem to forget the positive off season impact Trubisky had.

This isn't the perfect comparison ... but I'm trying to show you the opportunity cost of NOT drafting Trubisky last year.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

Former Dolphin/Raider HC

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

Cant believe its football season already

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Second year in a row that I'm insanely low energy about the start of the NFL season.

 

[BK]

Second year in a row that I'm insanely low energy about the start of the NFL season.

I don't have huge hopes but at least there is light this year imo.

 

[ChiHawks10]

I don't have huge hopes but at least there is light this year imo.

I'd be cool with 8-8 and being fun to watch.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

At very least we can be happy that Fox is not around

Such a terrible coach

Still cant believe he challenged that fumble into endzone that ended up turning ball over as touchback

The opposing coaches and team showed no desire to challenge play and Bears should have simply ran a play

Fox had so many terrible moments

 

[BK]

At very least we can be happy that Fox is not around

Such a terrible coach

Still cant believe he challenged that fumble into endzone that ended up turning ball over as touchback

The opposing coaches and team showed no desire to challenge play and Bears should have simply ran a play

Fox had so many terrible moments

I agree. I thought he would change the culture of the Bears but he did not.

There is hope now with a modern minded coach in Nagy and I think Pace is starting to hit his stride as GM (I like how he has drafted (White's injuries are not predictable)). Pace is still on the hot seat but now he has his coach and has no more excuses.

 

[piteus]

Now the Roquan holdout is slowly becoming an issue. He needs to come in by Monday.

 

[BK]

Now the Roquan holdout is slowly becoming an issue. He needs to come in by Monday.

I don't get why there is even a hold out. Why play hardball?

 

[clydesdale line]

I don't get why there is even a hold out. Why play hardball?

Hub Arkush said on Wednesday morning that it isn't the player or the team, it is the agency. he said all of the remaining unsigned picks are CAA clients.

 

[piteus]

Hub Arkush said on Wednesday morning that it isn't the player or the team, it is the agency. he said all of the remaining unsigned picks are CAA clients.

Joey Bosa was a CAA client too. They are trying to empower the NFL player like they did with the NBA. The NFL is having none of it. The Bears are going to be supported by other NFL owners in this situation.

 

[Illinihockey]

Hub Arkush said on Wednesday morning that it isn't the player or the team, it is the agency. he said all of the remaining unsigned picks are CAA clients.

It takes two to tango, so its the agency (the player) and the team

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

I don't have huge hopes but at least there is light this year imo.

I'd be cool with 8-8 and being fun to watch.

Yeah this year, I'm a lot more interested. There's definitely some upside this season. Hopefully Mitch takes the next step and Nagy shows he belongs. Of course it's possible neither of those happens and then look out, lol.

I'll be happy with a functional NFL offense and being around .500. The division is going to be brutal, but the schedule outside of that doesn't seem to bad.

 

[clydesdale line]

Joey Bosa was a CAA client too. They are trying to empower the NFL player like they did with the NBA. The NFL is having none of it. The Bears are going to be supported by other NFL owners in this situation.

Yea they're trying to show players they can get an edge in regard to off-set language and how their signing bonus is allotted if they sign with their agency. There's a rumor that he'll be in the building Sunday so something will likely get done by then... hopefully.

 

[HawksBeerFan]

Yeah this year, I'm a lot more interested. There's definitely some upside this season. Hopefully Mitch takes the next step and Nagy shows he belongs. Of course it's possible neither of those happens and then look out, lol.

I'll be happy with a functional NFL offense and being around .500. The division is going to be brutal, but the schedule outside of that doesn't seem to bad.

Yeah, hard to gauge what would be a "successful" bears season, especially given the decision. I think if they aren't playing meaningful games in December, then that would be a failed season. They need to win at minimum 7 games.

 

[ChiHawks10]

Yeah, hard to gauge what would be a "successful" bears season, especially given the decision. I think if they aren't playing meaningful games in December, then that would be a failed season. They need to win at minimum 7 games.

Given what decision? And to me, it's not that hard to gauge. The team needs to be .500 or better, or I'd call the season a failure. This team should not lose more than half their games. Not based on their schedule this year. They should be able to take one from each of the Packers and Lions. They should also be able to beat Buffalo, Miami, Cincinnati, NYJ, NYG, and San Francisco. There are other games that are also "tweeners" that I think they could win, like Tampa Bay, or Kansas City, or Arizona. So to me, less than 8-8 is a failed season for this team.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Given what decision? And to me, it's not that hard to gauge. The team needs to be .500 or better, or I'd call the season a failure. This team should not lose more than half their games. Not based on their schedule this year. They should be able to take one from each of the Packers and Lions. They should also be able to beat Buffalo, Miami, Cincinnati, NYJ, NYG, and San Francisco. There are other games that are also "tweeners" that I think they could win, like Tampa Bay, or Kansas City, or Arizona. So to me, less than 8-8 is a failed season for this team.

I'm personally not there. I just want to see Mitch get better and Nagy show that he's a real coach. .500 is in play and a reasonable goal, but I could see real growth on a team that wins less than that.

As for the actual schedule, I think you have a more favorable view than I do. I'd expect 4 losses from GB and Min. NE, LAR, and Buff were all playoff teams last year.

There are a lot of winnable games on the schedule for sure though, but I think it's going to be hard for them to get to 8 wins.


(Bears don't play KC, not sure who that was meant to be)

 

[ChiHawks10]

I'm personally not there. I just want to see Mitch get better and Nagy show that he's a real coach. .500 is in play and a reasonable goal, but I could see real growth on a team that wins less than that.

As for the actual schedule, I think you have a more favorable view than I do. I'd expect 4 losses from GB and Min. NE, LAR, and Buffwere all playoff teams last year.

There are a lot of winnable games on the schedule for sure though, but I think it's going to be hard for them to get to 8 wins.

Ok, so you expect 4 losses from GB and Minny. I was only expecting the Bears to win one of those 4 games. And I think they will. GB isn't exactly a powerhouse right now. And the Bears usually play Minnesota tough. Then you can probably throw 2-0 in favor of the Bears against the Lions, as they're not very good.

So one from the 4 games against Minny/GB. 2 from Detroit, plus Miami, Cincinnati, NYJ, NYG, San Francisco. That's 8 wins there. And it's not that much of a reach for them to beat all those teams. They're not very good at all. Then to think that they'll lose to all of Buffalo, New England, LA, Arizona, TB, or KC...

Just not that much of a stretch for 8 wins IMO. Especially with the upgraded offense, and the potential for winning "shootout" games where it's all offense on display by both teams. With this year's schedule, 8-8 should be easy. They had a .500 defense last year, IMO, at the least. Not outrageous to think they'll be .500 with the revamped offense.

 

[piteus]

Ok, so you expect 4 from GB and Minny. I was only expecting the Bears to win one of those 4 games. And I think they will. GB isn't exactly a powerhouse right now. Then you can probably throw 2-0 in favor of the Bears against the Lions.

So one from the 4 games against Minny/GB. 2 from Detroit, plus Miami, Cincinnati, NYJ, NYG, San Francisco. That's 8 wins there. And it's not that much of a reach for them to beat all those teams. They're not that good. Then to think that they'll lose to all of Buffalo, New England, LA, Arizona, TB, or KC...

Just not that much of a stretch for 8 wins IMO. Especially with the upgraded offense, and the potential for winning "shootout" games where it's all offense on display by both teams. With this year's schedule, 8-8 should be easy.

I don't think 8 is going to be easy. Our division is a bear. Minnesota is a legit Super Bowl contender and the Bears have to play Rodgers and Stafford 4x. That is NOT easy for any team.

It's more about beating the teams we should beat and Trubisky's growth for me this year. 8 wins should be the goal. However, I'm not going to cry if they win 6 or 7 and lose a lot of close games while Trubisky looks good.

To me, 2019 is the season. It's Trubisky's 3rd year and Nagy's 2nd. The Bears better make the playoffs. I look at this as a 2 year process. I'm trying to be realistic.

 

[ChiHawks10]

I don't think 8 is going to be easy. Our division is a bear. Minnesota is a legit Super Bowl contender and the Bears have to play Rodgers and Stafford 4x. That is NOT easy for any team.

It's more about beating the teams we should beat and Trubisky's growth for me this year. 8 games should be the goal for the team this year. However, I'm not going to cry if they win 6 or 7 and lose a lot of close games while Trubisky looks good.

To me, 2019 is the season. It's Trubisky's 3rd year and Nagy's 2nd. The Bears better make the playoffs.

GB is not very good. The Lions are not very good. The only legitimately good team in the division is Minnesota. To say the division is a bear is a gross exaggeration. I expect splits in both those series. The other teams I listed... those should all be wins. So even at that, you're talking 7 wins. Then it's very, very possible they get at least a win against one of Arizona, NE, Tampa, Buffalo, KC, LA, or Seattle. To say it would be disappointing to finish anything less than .500 is not that much to ask with that schedule, IMO.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Ok, so you expect 4 from GB and Minny. I was only expecting the Bears to win one of those 4 games. And I think they will. GB isn't exactly a powerhouse right now. Then you can probably throw 2-0 in favor of the Bears against the Lions.

So one from the 4 games against Minny/GB. 2 from Detroit, plus Miami, Cincinnati, NYJ, NYG, San Francisco. That's 8 wins there. And it's not that much of a reach for them to beat all those teams. They're not that good. Then to think that they'll lose to all of Buffalo, New England, LA, Arizona, TB, or KC...

Just not that much of a stretch for 8 wins IMO. Especially with the upgraded offense, and the potential for winning "shootout" games where it's all offense on display by both teams. With this year's schedule, 8-8 should be easy.

Obviously time will tell. 8-8 is in play. I just think that would be more on the high end of expectations.

But I look at it like this.

Most likely losses: @Min, Min, @GB, GB, NE, LAR. I think all of these teams are a step above the Bears. GB was 5-2 with Rodgers starting and beat us with Hundley.

Winable: @Det, Det, SEA, @Mia, @Buf, @ SF, @Ariz. I could see the results of any of these games going either way. I'd expect 1-1 vs Det.

Most likely wins: TB, NYJ, @NYG

Basically, I just don't trust the Bears to go 5-1 vs that middle group. Hopefully I'm wrong. But hey, I'm breaking down the schedule in July, which is a heck of a lot more than I was doing last year. The excitement level is up for me and I'll take that.