Babcock

[Gabriel426]

I think one thing Babs has done very well and gone unnoticed is the way he is taking criticisms from everyone. It seems like fans and even the medias are not crapping over bad games toward players(Game 7 Jake aside).

Whenever the Leafs are not doing well, Babs gets all the attentions but when they are doing well, players are getting all the credits.

 

[SHANNYPLAN]

HYMAN - MATTHEWS - MARNER
KADRI - - TAVARES - - KAPANEN
MARLEAU - LINDHOLM - BROWN
LEIVO - GAUTHIER - JOHNSSON

OR

KADRI - MATTHEWS - KAPANEN
HYMAN - - TAVARES - - MARNER

TRY THIS PLEASE​

 

[Tak7]

HYMAN - MATTHEWS - MARNER
KADRI - - TAVARES - - KAPANEN
MARLEAU - LINDHOLM - BROWN
LEIVO - GAUTHIER - JOHNSSON

OR

KADRI - MATTHEWS - KAPANEN
HYMAN - - TAVARES - - MARNER

TRY THIS PLEASE​

Playing one of your centers as a winger, completely eliminates the depth that this team has at C.

The one thing he can try, is elevating Johnsson, but honestly, the issues start in their own end - until they figure out a consistent way to break the puck out of their own zone, they are going to have issues creating offense.

 

[Nithoniniel]

TRY THIS PLEASE

That third line would get absolutely owned by pretty much every single team in the league. I don't think Babcock will ever entertain the thought of going in that direction.

 

[Stephen]

I think one thing Babs has done very well and gone unnoticed is the way he is taking criticisms from everyone. It seems like fans and even the medias are not crapping over bad games toward players(Game 7 Jake aside).

Whenever the Leafs are not doing well, Babs gets all the attentions but when they are doing well, players are getting all the credits.

Yeah, he's creating the safe environment for the kids to succeed.

One thing that's kind of annoying about hockey and coaching in general is how easy it seemed for Babcock to turn Parenteau, Grabner and that 2016 garbage into a structured, consistent effort type of team very early on but it's another to reign in and mould the young talent into something resembling a hard to play against, all weather contender. Kinda like how Pat Burns could get so much out of a veteran group, while Bowman had so many growing pains to deal with in Detroit before they figured it out.

 

[Gabriel426]

Yeah, he's creating the safe environment for the kids to succeed.

One thing that's kind of annoying about hockey and coaching in general is how easy it seemed for Babcock to turn Parenteau, Grabner and that 2016 garbage into a structured, consistent effort type of team very early on but it's another to reign in and mould the young talent into something resembling a hard to play against, all weather contender. Kinda like how Pat Burns could get so much out of a veteran group, while Bowman had so many growing pains to deal with in Detroit before they figured it out.

That’s the diff between vets that’s been around in the league for years and young talented players

 

[Prospero]

I don't care for the Egocock nickname. It's brutally unclever. If you can't rhyme, at least keep it to the same number of syllables. Mecock, or Icock, would both be better.

But you'd be much more respectable calling him Blah-blah-blab-cock. Or how 'bout Stabcock, or Grabcock, or Jabcock, or Flabcock?

But you want to say he's blinded by hubris? He thinks he knows better than Joe Leaf Fan? If against all evidence, he is too proud to admit that Joe Leaf Fan is right and the mighty Psych Flabcock is wrong, please don't call him Egocock.

It hurts my intellect.

 

[saltming]

I don't care for the Egocock nickname. It's brutally unclever. If you can't rhyme, at least keep it to the same number of syllables. Mecock, or Icock, would both be better.

But you'd be much more respectable calling him Blah-blah-blab-cock. Or how 'bout Stabcock, or Grabcock, or Jabcock, or Flabcock?

But you want to say he's blinded by hubris? He thinks he knows better than Joe Leaf Fan? If against all evidence, he is too proud to admit that Joe Leaf Fan is right and the mighty Psych Flabcock is wrong, please don't call him Egocock.

It hurts my intellect.

The term is testiment to the few that use it

 

[GBLeaf]

Yeah, he's creating the safe environment for the kids to succeed.

One thing that's kind of annoying about hockey and coaching in general is how easy it seemed for Babcock to turn Parenteau, Grabner and that 2016 garbage into a structured, consistent effort type of team very early on but it's another to reign in and mould the young talent into something resembling a hard to play against, all weather contender. Kinda like how Pat Burns could get so much out of a veteran group, while Bowman had so many growing pains to deal with in Detroit before they figured it out.

I think largely it's an age thing.

There truly is no substitute for experience. It's just a case of trying to put an old head on young shoulders.

I coach my nephew's young soccer team, and 2/3 of them have real natural talent. But teaching them that sometimes the best action is a 5 yard pass over a 30 yard pass, or that a give and go is better than taking a player on yourself is the hardest thing to do.

Not saying it's exactly the same with the Leafs, but I think there is some truth to it. Sometimes it's easier to structure a more experienced and sometimes, less talented group.

People are forgetting how young this team still is. So much talent and so much for them to still learn and develop.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Did you see the goals? I already posted them. If you didn't actually watch the game it's not that hard to go on NHL.com and see the highlights.

You will see on every non empty net Blues goal it is preceded by an atrocious Dermott board battle. I recommend you watch if you did not catch it live. It's not like the goal happened 20 seconds after a Dermott gaffe. It was lose board battle, puck in back of net within seconds.

These are not small mistakes. These are not mistakes that were overcome. They lost us the game.

are you going to flip flop on your opinion that taking Dermott out was the right choice now that he looks like he's still in?

 

[TMLS]

Matthews played with Brown and Hyman most of the playoffs. Matthews and Nylander played on the 2nd PP unit. Maybe if Babcock stacked the lines and stacked the PP, like many of us wanted, we would have beat Boston.

Yes, I hate Babcock because he's a bad coach. That's the reason. We have an elite offensive roster, but a horrible coach. Pretty frustrating watching Babcock neuter our offense.

Nah didnt you get the memo. 2nd and 3rd year plan was to lose in the first round of the playoffs on purpose. Reason why he played plugs on top lines. 4th year gonna be same plan. There is a reason why Hyman doesnt play with Matthews anymore after he met with Babcock. Too bad he with JT/Marner line instead of 3rd or 4th line where he belongs.

 

[PuckMagi]

I don't care for the Egocock nickname. It's brutally unclever. If you can't rhyme, at least keep it to the same number of syllables. Mecock, or Icock, would both be better.

But you'd be much more respectable calling him Blah-blah-blab-cock. Or how 'bout Stabcock, or Grabcock, or Jabcock, or Flabcock?

But you want to say he's blinded by hubris? He thinks he knows better than Joe Leaf Fan? If against all evidence, he is too proud to admit that Joe Leaf Fan is right and the mighty Psych Flabcock is wrong, please don't call him Egocock.

It hurts my intellect.

I call him Babcrap.

Kind of a loose south park reference to when the boys were making fun of Ms. Chokesondick's name.

 

[Nithoniniel]

This was interesting: It’s no stretch: Playing the long game pays off for Leafs | The Star

According to thepointhockey.com, the Maple Leafs led the league last season in stretch pass attempts (1,564) and were worst in the league in stretch-pass completion percentage (59.4 per cent).
The thing is, the Leafs’ 929 completed passes — second in the league — led to far more scoring chances for than the missed passes led to scoring chances against.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yeah, he's creating the safe environment for the kids to succeed.

One thing that's kind of annoying about hockey and coaching in general is how easy it seemed for Babcock to turn Parenteau, Grabner and that 2016 garbage into a structured, consistent effort type of team very early on but it's another to reign in and mould the young talent into something resembling a hard to play against, all weather contender. Kinda like how Pat Burns could get so much out of a veteran group, while Bowman had so many growing pains to deal with in Detroit before they figured it out.

Yeah I've thought this many times and I just don't get it. When we were last overall I was watching and admiring the structure of our play and was thinking oh boy, wait until our kids arrive who know how to put the puck in the net. Now there here, we're putting the puck in the net but WTF happened to our structure?

Frustrating as hell. Is it really because the kids just can't be bothered to listen? If that's it, start benching some of them I guess, not sure what else Babcock can do. Wait until they figure it out on their own?

This was interesting: It’s no stretch: Playing the long game pays off for Leafs | The Star

Not enough facts in that article to draw any conclusions.

"led to far more scoring chances for than the missed passes led to scoring chances against."

How many more is "far more"? Not only is that a subjective term but what's completely missing is an analysis of opportunities missed by not trying something else. What we need to have an opinion here is some precise numbers on chances for and against and then, a reasonable projection on how many chances for and against we would have had we done something other than a stretch pass in those situations.

 

[sxvnert]

HYMAN - MATTHEWS - MARNER
KADRI - - TAVARES - - KAPANEN
MARLEAU - LINDHOLM - BROWN
LEIVO - GAUTHIER - JOHNSSON

OR

KADRI - MATTHEWS - KAPANEN
HYMAN - - TAVARES - - MARNER

TRY THIS PLEASE​

Would do that when the leafs are playing at home. If Willy ever signs then Kadri can move back.

 

[m1ker]

1. MARLEAU - KADRI - MARNER
2. HYMAN - TAVARES - BROWN
3. KAPANEN - MATTHEWS - NYLANDER

That top line already proved they can play against top lines in tight games, not just by shutting them down but by out scoring them. If playoffs started next week this would be my goto but obviously babs can't piss off Matthews by putting him on 3rd line and Tavares by taking marner away. I would love to see these thrown together midway in a game that we are getting shut down.

 

[HolyCrap]

I call him Babcrap.

Kind of a loose south park reference to when the boys were making fun of Ms. Chokesondick's name.

Off topic but one time when I was a kid my dad had to stop his old pickup truck on the side of road to point out and laugh at a name on a mailbox. That name was Gobbledick. Lol. I still remember as a kid not getting it and him laughing.

 

[Mr Hockey]

You guys are debating people that do not understand that the others teams are playing systems also, it comes down to players.

 

[Nithoniniel]

How many more is "far more"? Not only is that a subjective term but what's completely missing is an analysis of opportunities missed by not trying something else. What we need to have an opinion here is some precise numbers on chances for and against and then, a reasonable projection on how many chances for and against we would have had we done something other than a stretch pass in those situations.

Absolutely, but it's a good conversation starter.

 

[White Shadow]

are you going to flip flop on your opinion that taking Dermott out was the right choice now that he looks like he's still in?

It amazes me that in an anti Babcock thread people would be opposed to a coach preaching accountability.

 

[therealkoho]

 

[Stephen]

Yeah I've thought this many times and I just don't get it. When we were last overall I was watching and admiring the structure of our play and was thinking oh boy, wait until our kids arrive who know how to put the puck in the net. Now there here, we're putting the puck in the net but WTF happened to our structure?

Frustrating as hell. Is it really because the kids just can't be bothered to listen? If that's it, start benching some of them I guess, not sure what else Babcock can do. Wait until they figure it out on their own?

You see that consistently successful franchises (not necessarily championship caliber but just regular playoff teams) have an easier time breaking in the young guns than rebuilding teams. A guy like David Pastrnak can slot into an already structured Bruins team and build up his game, whereas with a total rebuild there is a learning everything from scratch and rebuilding that structure from the ground up. One of those cultural dynamics you can't overlook, or import, or expect to have over night. All things considered we have it pretty great here in Toronto. It's not like Buffalo or Edmonton.

 

[Gary Nylund]

You see that consistently successful franchises (not necessarily championship caliber but just regular playoff teams) have an easier time breaking in the young guns than rebuilding teams. A guy like David Pastrnak can slot into an already structured Bruins team and build up his game, whereas with a total rebuild there is a learning everything from scratch and rebuilding that structure from the ground up. One of those cultural dynamics you can't overlook, or import, or expect to have over night. All things considered we have it pretty great here in Toronto. It's not like Buffalo or Edmonton.

That makes sense I guess. Still, if in 2016 we were able to implement a new system with little talent, it's hard to understand why we seem to having such a hard time doing so now.

 

[saltming]

That makes sense I guess. Still, if in 2016 we were able to implement a new system with little talent, it's hard to understand why we seem to having such a hard time doing so now.

The players have to play it is the bottom line

 

[Gary Nylund]

The players have to play it is the bottom line

I agree. So WTF is the matter with them?