Babcock

[La Cosa Nostra]

This is how I see it:

If Babcock wanted to coach a competitive team next season he would just stay in Detroit.
If he wanted to coach close to his "hometown" he would have went to Edm
If he wanted a challenge but with the promise of coaching a phenom he would have went to Edm.

We no these two teams are probably not in the cards at this point. So,

He could go to Buffalo to get a similar situation as he could get in Edm. But I'm going to go ahead and assume he wasn't interesed in Edm so really why Buffalo? Its not a first class city either lets face it.
Sure maybe he wins a cup one day in Buffalo. Great. Will anyone outside Buffalo really care?
Im trying to use deductive reasoning here.

So for me that leaves TOR and Philly. Unless a wild card blindsides everyone, such as Montreal firing their coach and hiring Babcock.

Will anyone outside Buffalo really care? Well consider they are one of the best hockey markets and by far the best hockey market when it comes down to person for person yes people would care. Buffalo has the combine. They built harbor center. Pegula has dropped billions the last couple years buying both teams, on free agency this past year and for building the harbor center. We have a thousands long season ticket waiting list. We get thousands of people for playoff games at the arena... To watch them OUTSIDE ON A TV. We have by far the best prospect pool in the league (currently have the #1 prospect not in the nhl right now in Reinhart) and are adding Jack Eichel and picks #21,31 and 51 at the draft.

So yeah, Buffalo is a far more attractive landing spot then you are admitting. Far better then Toronto. At least Buffalos rebuild is over and they are set with the foundation. Toronto will be rebuilding for another 3 years minimum and by then Kessel and Lupul are average by then .

question I understand the giving up drafts now to sigh coaches but whats with this when coaches contract is done?

whats with givign up draft picks for babcock if his expires this year? kinda dumb if u ask me.

To assure yourself a top 3 coach >>>>>>> a 3rd round pick

 

[Dragao6]

To assure yourself a top 3 coach >>>>>>> a 3rd round pick[/QUOTE]

Yes but after this year hes out of contract so why woudl a team have to give up anything? just sounds weird to me

 

[obey86]

If a team was given permission to talk to him before his contract was up, and signs him after his contract is finished, do they still lose a 3rd?

Yes.

Because talking to him early is still an advantage, even if he isn't signed till later.

 

[SlavaKozlov]

Yes but after this year hes out of contract so why woudl a team have to give up anything? just sounds weird to me

Because they want a coach in place before July 1st, when Babcock is actually out of his contract with Detroit. And Babcock probably wants to know where he will be next year as soon as possible so he can start thinking about what his plans will be for next season and get on with the relaxing part of his summer.

It's fine if a team doesn't want to give up a pick to sign Babcock and potentially wait until he is a free agent to talk to him, but he will very likely have a new contract before his current one expires, whether it is in Detroit or not.

Just like when teams trade a draft pick for a pending UFA before July 1st to get exclusive negotiating rights.

 

[r0bert8841]

While people speculate that Babcock wants to join a set roster and win now, I believe the opposite. Babcock wants more power over personnel, and I believe that will be the deciding factor in which team he goes with. If he were to join a rebuilding team, he could finally build the type of team he wants and can win with it for years to come. I am just praying he stays out of the East. Or at least the Atlantic.

 

[Syckle78]

The only source that proves he may be interested in Buffalo is the fact that he visited the team.

Now it is. But that's sure as hell not the sources you guys were using prior. To now blow those same sources as speculation is ridiculous. Sorry we don't all have the memory of a goldfish.

 

[Beerz]

Now it is. But that's sure as hell not the sources you guys were using prior. To now blow those same sources as speculation is ridiculous. Sorry we don't all have the memory of a goldfish.

No. It was all speculation before. Everything Bobby Mac, Friedman and Dreger was saying before the visit was purely them speculating. I challenge anyone to find a respected insider that mentioned anything about Babcocks interest in a team who was using info and not just looking at teams situations and the teams own interest in Babcock.

 

[Jerkini]

Will anyone outside Buffalo really care? Well consider they are one of the best hockey markets and by far the best hockey market when it comes down to person for person yes people would care. Buffalo has the combine. They built harbor center. Pegula has dropped billions the last couple years buying both teams, on free agency this past year and for building the harbor center. We have a thousands long season ticket waiting list. We get thousands of people for playoff games at the arena... To watch them OUTSIDE ON A TV. We have by far the best prospect pool in the league (currently have the #1 prospect not in the nhl right now in Reinhart) and are adding Jack Eichel and picks #21,31 and 51 at the draft.

So yeah, Buffalo is a far more attractive landing spot then you are admitting. Far better then Toronto. At least Buffalos rebuild is over and they are set with the foundation. Toronto will be rebuilding for another 3 years minimum and by then Kessel and Lupul are average by then .





To assure yourself a top 3 coach >>>>>>> a 3rd round pick

You know, the fact that Detroit isn't really a bustling metropolis probably helps Buffalo's chances. But I have to admit your post made me chuckle.

 

[Flapjack]

To assure yourself a top 3 coach >>>>>>> a 3rd round pick

Yes but after this year hes out of contract so why woudl a team have to give up anything? just sounds weird to me

Same reason teams trade picks for UFAs right before July 1st.

 

[Bps21*]

Now it is. But that's sure as hell not the sources you guys were using prior. To now blow those same sources as speculation is ridiculous. Sorry we don't all have the memory of a goldfish.

You are literally describing when they speculated about what might happen. Now we have what actually happened. Assign the weight of meaning as you see fit.

 

[Dotter]

Take this with a grain of salt, and I don't even know if I believe it, but "someone who knows someone in Torontos inner-circle", has just told me they believe he will be coaching in TO next season.

Like I said, I don't know how reliable this person is and there is a high probability it is BS, but I thought I would report it.

Yeah I'd take it with a grain of salt... especially considering they haven't asked to talk with him nor showed any interest in him.

 

[oobga]

True that Toronto and Buffalo are the only teams that have asked for permission to talk to Babcock? Think I heard someone say that on TSN this morning before the WHC games.

 

[FamilyGuy716]

You can't be ****ing serious right now. Now it's speculation after using those same sources to prove he was interested in buffalo?

I'm deadly serious but I'm just speculating and not using any sources, just my humble opinion which I hope is allowed.

Edmonton is a serious destination for any coach or player with all that talent. I watched a lot of Edmonton games this year (hoping they would win being a Sabres fan) and they we're in them all and lost in the end because of defense and goaltending. They were very entertaining to watch and have a lot of talent up front. I'm sure they'll upgrade the D and goaltending in the next few years (Nurse if going to be real good) and be a SC contenders for years to come.

 

[TalkingProuder]

I'm deadly serious but I'm just speculating and not using any sources, just my humble opinion which I hope is allowed.

Edmonton is a serious destination for any coach or player with all that talent. I watched a lot of Edmonton games this year (hoping they would win being a Sabres fan) and they we're in them all and lost in the end because of defense and goaltending. They were very entertaining to watch and have a lot of talent up front. I'm sure they'll upgrade the D and goaltending in the next few years (Nurse if going to be real good) and be a SC contenders for years to come.

True that. Edmonton's goaltending can only go up. If they get a decent starter in the off-season and acquire 2 more veteran top 4 D they will be at least 30 points better.

 

[Ginu]

This is how I see it:

If Babcock wanted to coach a competitive team next season he would just stay in Detroit.
If he wanted to coach close to his "hometown" he would have went to Edm
If he wanted a challenge but with the promise of coaching a phenom he would have went to Edm.

We no these two teams are probably not in the cards at this point. So,

He could go to Buffalo to get a similar situation as he could get in Edm. But I'm going to go ahead and assume he wasn't interesed in Edm so really why Buffalo? Its not a first class city either lets face it.
Sure maybe he wins a cup one day in Buffalo. Great. Will anyone outside Buffalo really care?
Im trying to use deductive reasoning here.

So for me that leaves TOR and Philly. Unless a wild card blindsides everyone, such as Montreal firing their coach and hiring Babcock.

Huh? There are several competitive teams out there looking for a coach that are far ahead of Detroit.

For me this sounds like the pipe dream of a Toronto fan trying to rationalize why Babcock will choose Toronto.

For example, if he wants to be competitive, in terms of stage of rebuild you have (low to high):
San Jose
Detroit
Philly
Buffalo/Edmonton
Toronto

If Montreal fires Therrien it gets really interesting. Unlikely though.

 

[Habsawce]

True that Toronto and Buffalo are the only teams that have asked for permission to talk to Babcock? Think I heard someone say that on TSN this morning before the WHC games.

I thought Philadelphia asked as well, could be wrong though.

 

[Derrty]

Yeah I'd take it with a grain of salt... especially considering they haven't asked to talk with him nor showed any interest in him.

As far as I knew, they have already spoke to him. But as I said, probably all BS anyway.

My own personal Eklund if you will

LOL

 

[SlavaKozlov]

While people speculate that Babcock wants to join a set roster and win now, I believe the opposite. Babcock wants more power over personnel, and I believe that will be the deciding factor in which team he goes with. If he were to join a rebuilding team, he could finally build the type of team he wants and can win with it for years to come. I am just praying he stays out of the East. Or at least the Atlantic.

I think people underrate how much of a voice he had in the Wings personnel decision and overrating how much power he wants, but we won't know until he makes his decision on where he is going next season.

Babcock has always said he has a voice on the things the Wings do, but that Ken Holland is the GM and he makes the decisions. Babcock tells Holland the kinds of players he wants, and Holland does the work trying to bring them in. I don't think Babcock has any interest in working the phones to negotiate trades/contracts.

Now, we all know he was unhappy with Ouellet going down to GR to start the year, and we know he isn't a fan of some of the players on the roster (like Kindl, Weiss, Smith sometimes, etc...), and he ended up slotting Legwand as a 4th line wing after Holland brought him in as a deadline rental and some of their centers got healthy, but I don't believe Babcock and Holland are as at odds with each other as some believe.

On a team like Buffalo, they have many good prospects and plenty of cap room to add complementary pieces to. Babcock would give his thoughts on what kind of team he would like them to build toward, sure, but I doubt he wants to do that work himself. Just like he does with the Wings. The Wings already have their identity, and Holland tries to find pieces that can complement that. It doesn't always work out.

 

[RoofIt5hole]

I think people underrate how much of a voice he had in the Wings personnel decision and overrating how much power he wants, but we won't know until he makes his decision on where he is going next season.

Babcock has always said he has a voice on the things the Wings do, but that Ken Holland is the GM and he makes the decisions. Babcock tells Holland the kinds of players he wants, and Holland does the work trying to bring them in. I don't think Babcock has any interest in working the phones to negotiate trades/contracts.

Now, we all know he was unhappy with Ouellet going down to GR to start the year, and we know he isn't a fan of some of the players on the roster (like Kindl, Weiss, Smith sometimes, etc...), and he ended up slotting Legwand as a 4th line wing after Holland brought him in as a deadline rental and some of their centers got healthy, but I don't believe Babcock and Holland are as at odds with each other as some believe.

On a team like Buffalo, they have many good prospects and plenty of cap room to add complementary pieces to. Babcock would give his thoughts on what kind of team he would like them to build toward, sure, but I doubt he wants to do that work himself. Just like he does with the Wings. The Wings already have their identity, and Holland tries to find pieces that can complement that. It doesn't always work out.

That's why I think Buffalo would be a good fit. It seems Murray & Babcock had a good working relationship in Anaheim. In Buffalo Babcock could have a major role in molding the teams identity seeing as it's pretty nothing but prospects and elite potential at the moment.





P.s. Just seeing the name Slava Kozlov made me shudder. Damn Hasek trade.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

I thought Philadelphia asked as well, could be wrong though.

I don't think anybody knows what's going on between the Flyers & Babcock. It's been tough to get any info out of the Flyers organization ever since Hextall took over. Our media here are idiots so they're no good & guys like McKenzie & Friedman have been having a tough breaking through also.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

While people speculate that Babcock wants to join a set roster and win now, I believe the opposite. Babcock wants more power over personnel, and I believe that will be the deciding factor in which team he goes with. If he were to join a rebuilding team, he could finally build the type of team he wants and can win with it for years to come. I am just praying he stays out of the East. Or at least the Atlantic.

If a team is silly enough to give Babcock that much power (something he has denied wanting for the record in terms of ultimate roster say) I will gladly keep him in division. The players he likes around the league and the way he has divided up minutes and roles over the years makes me think that roster is going to be atrocious if he is the man putting it together.

He wants his vote to count more.... But I am not sure he wants that much power in terms of his own statements. If he does in fact move in that direction this could be a really bad hire for somebody.

 

[bobber]

Do people actually think Babcock guarantees any championships? Doesn't matter who the coach is if you don't have the players to win a cup.

 

[TalkingProuder]

If a team is silly enough to give Babcock that much power (something he has denied wanting for the record in terms of ultimate roster say) I will gladly keep him in division. The players he likes around the league and the way he has divided up minutes and roles over the years makes me think that roster is going to be atrocious if he is the man putting it together.

He wants his vote to count more.... But I am not sure he wants that much power in terms of his own statements. If he does in fact move in that direction this could be a really bad hire for somebody.

I don't see Tim Murray as someone that wants to be his personal assistant. Not worried if Buffalo gets him.

 

[MikeModano9]

Do people actually think Babcock guarantees any championships? Doesn't matter who the coach is if you don't have the players to win a cup.

I believe it's more about the respect he garners around the league. Not only from the players but management teams etc. There's 29 coaches who lose every year. Nobody is expecting him to just walk in and win a cup.

 

[Habsawce]

I don't think anybody knows what's going on between the Flyers & Babcock. It's been tough to get any info out of the Flyers organization ever since Hextall took over. Our media here are idiots so they're no good & guys like McKenzie & Friedman have been having a tough breaking through also.

Interesting. Just thinking logically, it would make sense that they've at least extended interest, but who knows I guess.