ATD2019 Lineup Assassination Thread

The Macho King

Back* to Back** World Champion
Jun 22, 2011
48,759
29,250
I'll get the ball rolling.Keep in mind I don't know your players as much as you're supposed to know them.I'm throwing some comments and take them as an opportunity to correct me and teach about your team.



1st line: Ambivalent, but I see merit in putting ''rockets'' like Bure and Jackson with Nighbor so he can do his thing near center ice and send them off to score goals.Still, Nighbor usually had more help on the backcheck from his wingers than he will receive from Jackson and Bure.Overall, while I'm on the fence, I lean towards liking this original and bizarre line structure.

2nd line: I like Robitaille-Trottier and Trottier-Drillon, but I don't like Robitaille-Trottier-Drillon.This is putting too much pressure on Trottier, though at least he will see more 2nd pairings than he normally would.In real life the line was Gillies-Trottier-Bossy, and you could have used a Gillies there.

3rd line: Excellent 3rd line.Bergeron and a pair of insufferable pests.A great playoff type of line.

4th line: I'm usually a hater for offense-only 4th lines, but with Nighbor-Trottier-Bergeron upfront, I guess you could afford it.The question of TOI is still relevant, and that line sucks balls defensively, but again you could afford it.I like Kapustin and he was a steal.

1st pairing: Cleghorn was probably the steal of the draft in hindsight.Not sure why he fell.Him and Clapper are good all-arounders.Average #1 high-end #2 type of pairing, like the Gadsby-Chelios pairing of Habsfan18's team.A solid 1st pairing.

2nd pairing: Not a fan.Konstantinov is a mistake I made in my first ever draft in 2011, so I sympathize.But he is always overrated where he is taken, and Lutchenko is not good enough to compensate.This is a weakness on your team.I don't understand why you think Konstantinov was one of your best pick, when it was one of your worst.

3rd pairing: Would need to think more about Hedman.Not sure I'm up to date on his ATD value, so I will refrain.

Leadership: Average

PP: OK but nothing more

PK: Nighbor and Bergeron are great there, though I would probably find a place for Trottier somewhere.

Cleghorn and Clapper are hard to gauge as PP quarterbacks and PK defenders.I'd say they're solid but nothing more in both role, but others should chime in on that, am curious.

Goalie: Benedict is average and I like him.

Overall: IMO one of the best entry from a rookie.Strenght are insane two-way play from your top 3 centers, a solid 1st pairing and a prototypical playoff 3rd line.Weakness are the 2nd line and 2nd pairing.
Thanks for this. I 100% agree on the second line. I believe I mentioned it, but this was me going for a "better" player over a better fit. I dont think it will be a disaster, but it forces Trottier to do more work defensively on the line than is ideal. I almost kicked around swapping Tikkanen and Robitaille to have him be the glue guy on that line (he does have a season as a winger for 99 with some good goal finishes), but I think that would weaken what i think is my best constructed line.

I do disagree on the second pairing. I think its constructed as a solid puck moving line with some strong D. I mean - its certainly not the best second pair in the project, but i think it's one that compliments the defensive centers well and can get the puck up to the wings for quick counter attacks. I figured with my wingers, having D that can push the puck up was going to be a premium, and outside of Horner they are all capable of that.

Also I think we spoke earlier about my first line. It's weird but when i drafted Nighbor i knew i was going to have to be creative in getting offense from the top line with so few two way wingers at the top of the draft. There were more standard and "ideal" players available, but even in a 20 player draft they are tough to come by.
 

tony d

Registered User
Jun 23, 2007
76,594
4,555
Behind A Tree
Thanks @BenchBrawl for the review. Post your roster here and I'll return the favor. Can't argue with what you said. I know goalie's a weakness on my team. In hindsight I wish I had went with Dryden instead of Blake in Rd. 4.
 

Dreakmur

Registered User
Mar 25, 2008
18,617
6,878
Orillia, Ontario
1st line: Not getting Boucher really hurt you more than the actual difference between Apps and Boucher, mostly because Apps' defensive game is in question.Glancing quickly at your bio I see nothing to change my mind, but mayne I missed.As a whole, I love the 1st line, as in offensively and on the physical level.How good was Bill Cook defensively? There again, I don't think he was a strong defensive player, but maybe I just don't know him enough (he's still on my wishlist for an ATD).Denneny was OK defensively, but clearly the weakest defensive player on those Ottawa team.Both Denneny and Cook in particular will make this a heavy physical line.Overall I love it, but lacking defense.

Agreed. I don't think any of these players would be called better than average defensively, but none below average either. Certainly not a defensive line, though I don't think it's a weakness that can be exploited either.

2nd line: I love Jean Ratelle, but he appears to be your top defensive player inside your Top 6.Isn't that a problem on a Punch Imlach team? I'm asking from a position of ignorance.Perry is not bad defensively, but I'm guessing Roy Conacher is? Overall the 2nd line is good structurally, like the first line, but the Top 6 as a whole has questionable defense.

I went back and forth between Ratelle and Stastny for a while. I was very sure Ratelle was better, but Stastny is always ranked higher. Every time I went back to look, Ratelle still looked better, so that's who I went with.

I couldn't find anything that says Conacher was good or bad defensively. I would assume he wasn't particularly good, since his all-star voting record doesn't match his scoring output.

Corey Perry is weak on a 2nd line. I picked my entire 3rd line before him, and he was the last guy who added the grit I though Ratelle needed.

As for the lack of defensive, it doesn't seem to have been the main stickler for Imlach. From what I have gathered, he seemed to mostly focus on motivating his players rather than focusing on structured play. He has two main "dislikes" - players who don't work hard, and players who are too individualistic.

3rd line: An excellent 3rd line, providing everything you'd ask for, from offense, defense, size, physicality, leadership, playoffs heroics.

Yeah, I really like this line.

1st pairing: Shore is a stud and Laperriere is good enough to support him.Lappy's role will be simple as the stay-at-home D, so even though he's a weak #2, he's not a problem there for me and the pairing is strong.Laperriere was like some sort of Doug Harvey-lite, controlling the flow and making passes, calming the atmosphere.He was a big guy, so the more I think of it, the more perfect he looks to play wit hShore; basically a superior version of Hitchman, with a bit less intimidating factor but more hockey sense, an easy tradeoff to make.

Yeah, I like this mix.

2nd pairing: Strong on a talent level.Thomson had a good ''first pass'', so even though the pairing is not strong offensively and both are more stay-at-home types, transition should run smooth enough.

Thomson's offense is very surprisingly good. Considering his reputation as a stay at home guy, his first pass might be elite.

3rd pairing: Obviously Gonchar is weak at ES.Harper is solid stay-at-home and physical D to protect him.

Weak defensively? Sure. Weak overall, hell no.

Just because you make defensive mistakes doesn't mean you can't make a positive overall impact. Look at guys like Jake Gardiner or PK Subban.

Coach: Above-average, but ambivalent about fit.I like the Imlach-Armstrong connection, just wondering about the defense from the Top 6.

As mentioned above, Imlach wasn't really a defensive structure coach. He was a hard work kind of coach. That does include working hard defensively, but all those guys are willing workers, right?

PP: Solid 1st, weakish 2nd.

I think Ratelle, Conacher, and Thomson are all quite strong on 2nd PP units. Laperriere isn't ideal. Perry and Stevens are OK net front guys.

Thanks for the assassination.
 

Habsfan18

The Hockey Library
May 13, 2003
30,677
8,767
Ontario
Thanks @BenchBrawl for the review of my team. I’ll respond some time tonight or tomorrow. Such a busy time here! Packing for a move with my wife (we sold our house and bought a new one) all while taking care of our 3 month old!
 

Stoneberg

Bored
Nov 10, 2005
3,947
73
Halifax
Halifax Mooseheads

Coach: Tommy Ivan

Alex Ovechkin (A) - Peter Forsberg - Bryan Hextall Sr.
Sid Abel (C) - Nels Stewart - Theo Fleury
Bob Gainey (A) - Walt Tkaczuk - Nick Metz
Dick Duff - Ryan Getzlaf - Ken Hodge

Slava Fetisov (A) - Art Coulter
Borje Salming - Jack Crawford
Barry Beck - Bob Goldham

Charlie Gardiner
John Vanbiesbrouck

Spares:
Rick Martin (LW), Bob Bourne (F), Andrei Markov (D), Ken Randall (RW/D)

PP1
Stewart (net) - Forsberg - Hextall
Ovechkin - Fetisov

PP2
Hodge (net) - Abel - Fleury
Ovechkin - Salming/Getzlaf

PK1
Tkaczuk- Gainey
Salming - Crawford

PK2
Metz - Fleury
Fetisov - Coulter

Beck - Goldham​
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,903
3,557
Edmonton
boston-bruins-facebook-cover-timeline-banner-for-fb.jpg


Coach: Toe Blake
Captain: Ted Kennedy
Alternates: Valeri Vasiliev, František Pospíšil

Syd Howe --- Dale Hawerchuk --- Gordie Howe
Paul Kariya --- Ted Kennedy (C) --- Alex Maltsev
George Hay --- Vladimir Petrov --- Odie Cleghorn
John Madden --- David Backes --- Eddie Oatman

Valeri Vasiliev (A) --- Pierre Pilote
Cyclone Taylor --- Sylvio Mantha
František Pospíšil (A)--- Joe Hall

Roy Worters
Billy Smith

Spares: Bobby Holik (C/LW), Vitaly Davydov (D), Patrick Sharp (F), Boris Mayorov (LW)

PP1: Taylor - Pilote - Kariya - Maltsev - G.Howe
PP2: Pospíšil - Hawerchuk - S.Howe - Petrov - Hay
PK1: Vasiliev - Mantha - Kennedy - Madden
PK2: Pospíšil - Pilote - Holik - Backes
 

BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
30,880
13,671
MONTREAL CANADIENS

:habs


GM: BenchBrawl

Captain: Eddie Gerard
Assistant: Doug Harvey
Assistant: Jarome Iginla
Assistant: Derian Hatcher


HEAD COACH

Hap Day

ROSTER

Alex Yakushev - Frank Boucher - Jarome Iginla (A)
Baldy Northcott - Mike Modano - Marian Hossa
Jamie Benn - Frank Fredrickson - Dave Taylor
Don Marcotte - Ken Mosdell - Bobby Rousseau
Joe Pavelski, Blake Wheeler

Doug Harvey (A) - Eddie Gerard (C)
Derian Hatcher (A) - Drew Doughty
Bobby Rowe - Bullet Joe Simpson
Glen Harmon, Ted Harris

Jacques Plante
Miikka Kiprusoff

PP1:
Yakushev-Boucher-Iginla
Harvey-Rousseau

PP2:
Fredrickson-Modano-Hossa
Gerard-Simpson

PK1:
Modano-Marcotte
Hatcher-Harvey
Plante

PK2:
Boucher-Mosdell
Gerard-Doughty
Plante

PK extras: Hossa, Northcott, Rousseau, Taylor

Forwards Estimated TOI
PlayerESPPPKTOT
Boucher134320
Modano133420
Iginla134017
Yakushev134017
Hossa133016
Fredrickson133016
Benn130013
Northcott130013
Taylor130013
Rousseau74*011
Marcotte70411
Mosdell70310
TOT13825*14177*
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Defensemen Estimated TOI
PlayerESPPPKTOT
Harvey185528
Gerard182222
Doughty180220
Hatcher160521
Simpson123015
Rowe100010
TOT9210*14116*
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
*Rousseau plays on the PP point
 

Johnny Engine

Moderator
Jul 29, 2009
4,979
2,361
Halifax Mooseheads

Coach: Tommy Ivan

Alex Ovechkin (A) - Peter Forsberg - Bryan Hextall Sr.
Sid Abel (C) - Nels Stewart - Theo Fleury
Bob Gainey (A) - Walt Tkaczuk - Nick Metz
Dick Duff - Ryan Getzlaf - Ken Hodge

Slava Fetisov (A) - Art Coulter
Borje Salming - Jack Crawford
Barry Beck - Bob Goldham

Charlie Gardiner
John Vanbiesbrouck

Spares:
Rick Martin (LW), Bob Bourne (F), Andrei Markov (D), Ken Randall (RW/D)

PP1
Stewart (net) - Forsberg - Hextall
Ovechkin - Fetisov

PP2
Hodge (net) - Abel - Fleury
Ovechkin - Salming/Getzlaf

PK1
Tkaczuk- Gainey
Salming - Crawford

PK2
Metz - Fleury
Fetisov - Coulter

Beck - Goldham​

Coaching and Leadership: I'm sure a few other GMs were cursing you under their breaths when you picked Ivan - he's the very best of the nice-guy coaches ATD teams use to smooth things out with problematic prima donnas, and you don't really even have anyone on the team who needs him. Ovechkin's a bit of a free spirit, and Fleury was personally unstable, but there's little to suggest they're any more than quirky as far as the coach is concerned. That said, he's a good one, above average and can coach a variety of player types. Abel is an excellent captain, and Fetisov and Gainey are even further ahead of the curve as alternates. I'm not sure why Ovechkin has an additional letter other than time served, but he's not hurting you.

Top Six Forwards: Both the pieces and the fit work well here. A finisher, a passer and a power forward on the first line, with two solid defensive players and one very poor one. You've also given Stewart a great pair of corner men - Abel can win battles, protect the puck and slow the game down while Stewart gets in position, and Fleury has the jump to beat out dump ins and the skill to feed Stewart. I don't think there are any pieces who are out of their depth here. Strictly speaking, Forsberg's below average for a first line centre in a 20 team ATD, but he's only the second best player on his line, so I wouldn't be worried.

Bottom Six Forwards: The third line has to be one of the best if not the best defensive third lines in the league, but probably one of the worst at creating offence. Tkaczuk has a nice little peak as a playmaker, and it's not like he constantly played with his team's top talent in real life, but his frequent linemates Balon and Fairbairn both have a more productive track records than either of his ATD linemates, which isn't usually the case for players moving up a league. I'd still expect this line to be effective and frustrating, but I'd apply some context before calling it a "two-way line" in playoff series debates. The fourth line is made up of two guys who can own the corners in much the same way Abel can, and a spark plug who's an OK finisher. Not the guy I'd really have to stay on my toes for when matching up 4th line shifts, but plenty of skill and grit all the same. Much like your first two lines, two of these guys are solid defensively, the other isn't.

Defense: A very good #1, an excellent-if-not-quite-overqualified #1, and a good #3, a solid #4, and a couple of ATD jobbers on the bottom pair. You've got the handedness balanced, too. Fetisov and Coulter are a pair you can throw out in any situation stylistically, and your second pair is more of the same. I'd have to be sold on Beck as a puck mover and skater on the bottom pair, as Goldham doesn't give you much in that regard - I know Beck's a giant side of beef with a cannon from the point, so he'll create chances for you that way.

Goaltending: I have Gardiner as almost exactly league average here, but I tend to view that as more of a plus than a wash - in most hockey leagues, things tend to shake out so 3 quarters of the teams are driven by great goaltending and the bottom quarter is scrambling trying to find some stability. You're on the right side of that. I think Vanbiesbrouck is scraping the barrel in a 20 team league, but not disastrously so.

Special Teams: You've got two of the very best stand-in-one-place weapons on your first power play, and one of those guys playing on the second pair too. The rest of the pieces look good to me - Forsberg and Hextall are both left shots, so it'll be a little harder for them to protect the puck on the right side when Ovechkin gets cocked and loaded on the left side, but they're both strong, talented guys who can make it work. Speaking of strong talented guys who are right shots, Hodge doesn't seem like the guy for your primary net front role. If Ovechkin's going to stay out there for the back half of your powerplays, that's a guy who can protect the puck and feed it across to the Ovi spot. Getzlaf too, and I'm not sure he isn't actually a better option for that role. Fleury is a guy who'll be tenacious in the slot, despite being very short. You've got a surplus of extra point men - if you're going to keep Ovechkin out there, rotating Salming with a forward strikes me as risky. It's a bit of a waste not to have Beck get any power play time, but I don't think he's better in that quarterback role than either of the two main guys. The penalty kill is by and large excellent, although maybe lacking the elite crease-clearer some teams have on defense.

TLDR: A team that's going to kill on the cycle, with a great set of weapons up front, a solid defensive group, and decent goaltending. The bottom six lacks some finish, but should do their jobs well.
 
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Johnny Engine

Moderator
Jul 29, 2009
4,979
2,361
boston-bruins-facebook-cover-timeline-banner-for-fb.jpg


Coach: Toe Blake
Captain: Ted Kennedy
Alternates: Valeri Vasiliev, František Pospíšil

Syd Howe --- Dale Hawerchuk --- Gordie Howe
Paul Kariya --- Ted Kennedy (C) --- Alex Maltsev
George Hay --- Vladimir Petrov --- Odie Cleghorn
John Madden --- David Backes --- Eddie Oatman

Valeri Vasiliev (A) --- Pierre Pilote
Cyclone Taylor --- Sylvio Mantha
František Pospíšil (A)--- Joe Hall

Roy Worters
Billy Smith

Spares: Bobby Holik (C/LW), Vitaly Davydov (D), Patrick Sharp (F), Boris Mayorov (LW)

PP1: Taylor - Pilote - Kariya - Maltsev - G.Howe
PP2: Pospíšil - Hawerchuk - S.Howe - Petrov - Hay
PK1: Vasiliev - Mantha - Kennedy - Madden
PK2: Pospíšil - Pilote - Holik - Backes

Coaching and Leadership: Spectacular. The second best coach out there, a top-tier captain, and two guys who wouldn't be bad captains themselves wearing As.

Top Six Forwards: Howe-Haw-Howe is a great line name, and a reasonable balance of skillsets, but Gordie is carrying the load practically by himself as first lines go. The second line is a familiar setup for Kariya - two fast, soft wingers who can both pass and shoot, and a not-so-fast centre who does all the hard work. In terms of 1-through-6 personnel, it's not one of the stronger top-sixes, but Howe can take over a game by himself.

Bottom Six Forwards: As third lines go, this one would have to be above average offensively and below average defensively, but it's got a little of everything - speed from Hay, physicality from Cleghorn, and a versatile, intelligent centre. The 4th line is basically an energy line in this league, offering a good combination of speed (particularly Madden) and strength (particularly Backes).

Defense: Just incredible. Pilote and Taylor you'd have to regard as solid #1s, Vasiliev can be a #2, Mantha is a good #3 and Pospisil would be one of the better #4s if all those guys weren't being bumped down the lineup. You don't have a guy who absolutely demands 25+ minutes, so you can rotate these pairs without worrying too much, and Pilote can spell Hall for a few if he needs more. Vasiliev actually played on the right more often, but he's left-handed so he should have no problem playing where you put him.

Goaltending: A balanced tandem, which positions you better than some others who missed out on a top starter. Your superior team leadership might come in handy when the guy who's going to play 45 games for you loses his job to the guy who started 37 in the playoffs. It's not a strength, but you did your best to insulate yourself.

Special Teams: The guys you have available as point men puts you in an interesting situation. Taylor, Hawerchuk and Kariya are all nominally forwards who can play there, though you wouldn't want the latter two on the same unit. Your best defense-only players in that role are Pilote and Pospisil...but the latter sticks out as being much, much less potent. What about Kariya and Taylor as your first pair, and Pilote and Hawerchuk as your second? Do you trust Taylor as the last guy back when you turn the puck over, and is it worth promoting someone like Cleghorn, Kennedy or Oatman to the second unit instead of Pospisil? And how does that effect the minutes all those horses you have on the back end are pulling? In terms of talent, I'd say the first unit is very good and then it drops off sharply, but reading through the assassinations, that seems like the case for almost everyone.
Your first PK is excellent, you need to fix your second PK, because Holik is a scratch, and not even an overly good PKer to begin with. Oatman or Petrov seem usable for that.

TLDR: A bit spotty up front and in goal, but the defense is a wagon, and you have Howe.
 

markrander87

Registered User
Jan 22, 2010
4,216
61
Coaching and Leadership: I'm sure a few other GMs were cursing you under their breaths when you picked Ivan - he's the very best of the nice-guy coaches ATD teams use to smooth things out with problematic prima donnas, and you don't really even have anyone on the team who needs him. Ovechkin's a bit of a free spirit, and Fleury was personally unstable, but there's little to suggest they're any more than quirky as far as the coach is concerned. That said, he's a good one, above average and can coach a variety of player types. Abel is an excellent captain, and Fetisov and Gainey are even further ahead of the curve as alternates. I'm not sure why Ovechkin has an additional letter other than time served, but he's not hurting you.

Top Six Forwards: Both the pieces and the fit work well here. A finisher, a passer and a power forward on the first line, with two solid defensive players and one very poor one. You've also given Stewart a great pair of corner men - Abel can win battles, protect the puck and slow the game down while Stewart gets in position, and Fleury has the jump to beat out dump ins and the skill to feed Stewart. I don't think there are any pieces who are out of their depth here. Strictly speaking, Forsberg's below average for a first line centre in a 20 team ATD, but he's only the second best player on his line, so I wouldn't be worried.

Bottom Six Forwards: The third line has to be one of the best if not the best defensive third lines in the league, but probably one of the worst at creating offence. Tkaczuk has a nice little peak as a playmaker, and it's not like he constantly played with his team's top talent in real life, but his frequent linemates Balon and Fairbairn both have a more productive track records than either of his ATD linemates, which isn't usually the case for players moving up a league. I'd still expect this line to be effective and frustrating, but I'd apply some context before calling it a "two-way line" in playoff series debates. The fourth line is made up of two guys who can own the corners in much the same way Abel can, and a spark plug who's an OK finisher. Not the guy I'd really have to stay on my toes for when matching up 4th line shifts, but plenty of skill and grit all the same. Much like your first two lines, two of these guys are solid defensively, the other isn't.

Defense: A very good #1, an excellent-if-not-quite-overqualified #1, and a good #3, a solid #4, and a couple of ATD jobbers on the bottom pair. You've got the handedness balanced, too. Fetisov and Coulter are a pair you can throw out in any situation stylistically, and your second pair is more of the same. I'd have to be sold on Beck as a puck mover and skater on the bottom pair, as Goldham doesn't give you much in that regard - I know Beck's a giant side of beef with a cannon from the point, so he'll create chances for you that way.

Goaltending: I have Gardiner as almost exactly league average here, but I tend to view that as more of a plus than a wash - in most hockey leagues, things tend to shake out so 3 quarters of the teams are driven by great goaltending and the bottom quarter is scrambling trying to find some stability. You're on the right side of that. I think Vanbiesbrouck is scraping the barrel in a 20 team league, but not disastrously so.

Special Teams: You've got two of the very best stand-in-one-place weapons on your first power play, and one of those guys playing on the second pair too. The rest of the pieces look good to me - Forsberg and Hextall are both left shots, so it'll be a little harder for them to protect the puck on the right side when Ovechkin gets cocked and loaded on the left side, but they're both strong, talented guys who can make it work. Speaking of strong talented guys who are right shots, Hodge doesn't seem like the guy for your primary net front role. If Ovechkin's going to stay out there for the back half of your powerplays, that's a guy who can protect the puck and feed it across to the Ovi spot. Getzlaf too, and I'm not sure he isn't actually a better option for that role. Fleury is a guy who'll be tenacious in the slot, despite being very short. You've got a surplus of extra point men - if you're going to keep Ovechkin out there, rotating Salming with a forward strikes me as risky. It's a bit of a waste not to have Beck get any power play time, but I don't think he's better in that quarterback role than either of the two main guys. The penalty kill is by and large excellent, although maybe lacking the elite crease-clearer some teams have on defense.

TLDR: A team that's going to kill on the cycle, with a great set of weapons up front, a solid defensive group, and decent goaltending. The bottom six lacks some finish, but should do their jobs well.

Wow thank you so much for taking the time to review our team!! Really tough to argue with much at all. One quick thing i'll respond to is the bolded regarding the PP.

I believe our 1st unit PP is the strength of our team. Think of the umbrella up top with Fetisov. Ovechkin is obviously on his off wing loaded up for the shot. Nels Stewart has to be one of the better net presences available for the PP. Hextall is the key to this as he is a RW but a left hand shot...He will be completely opposite Ovechkin on the right hand side boards (again as a left hand shot) also prepping for his tower of a shot and also lending a hand to Forsberg who is one of the ultimate playmaking puck winning centers who will distribute along with Fetisov and also win the pucks in the corners.
 

Johnny Engine

Moderator
Jul 29, 2009
4,979
2,361
Wow thank you so much for taking the time to review our team!! Really tough to argue with much at all. One quick thing i'll respond to is the bolded regarding the PP.

I believe our 1st unit PP is the strength of our team. Think of the umbrella up top with Fetisov. Ovechkin is obviously on his off wing loaded up for the shot. Nels Stewart has to be one of the better net presences available for the PP. Hextall is the key to this as he is a RW but a left hand shot...He will be completely opposite Ovechkin on the right hand side boards (again as a left hand shot) also prepping for his tower of a shot and also lending a hand to Forsberg who is one of the ultimate playmaking puck winning centers who will distribute along with Fetisov and also win the pucks in the corners.

That's an interesting bit of exposition regarding the 1st power play unit. When I do up my special teams, I always list the PPs in a 1-3-1 formation like you're referencing, not because I expect all units to behave that way, but because it does a good job of clarifying who's the most conservative point man in the group, who's expected to make plays from the outside, who's attacking the inside, and - if you have a second defenseman on there - which defenseman is taking risks and pinching more often. The ATD gives one a lot of interesting options for those flank spots, whether it's forwards with point experience (Ovechkin, Hawerchuk, Hull and Bondra for me), old-school rovers, multiposition players like Mohns or Pitre, or even mostly-defensemen like Housley or Hollett. In your case, if you're setting Hextall up the way Kucherov currently plays - a mirror image one-timer, that means Forsberg either finds himself right in the middle - which we both know is the wrong place for your best playmaker - or the lowest guy in the zone, the "1" in the 1-3-1. I think most people look at rosters written up that way and assume the lowest guy in the zone is the net front, but the way Washington sets up is a good template for the horses you've got - with a guy (Kuznetsov last time I saw them) sagging below the goal line looking to thread the needle over to OV, and Oshie (read, Stewart) looking for the short pass to the middle. Turning Forsberg backwards like that also solves a bit of a handedness issue too.
I think the most conventional way to set these guys up would be Stewart as the "1", Hextall in the middle, and Forsberg as a flank, but the way I described above (which I think is what you're seeing) is better.
 

Johnny Engine

Moderator
Jul 29, 2009
4,979
2,361
MONTREAL CANADIENS

:habs


GM: BenchBrawl

Captain: Eddie Gerard
Assistant: Doug Harvey
Assistant: Jarome Iginla
Assistant: Derian Hatcher


HEAD COACH

Hap Day

ROSTER

Alex Yakushev - Frank Boucher - Jarome Iginla (A)
Baldy Northcott - Mike Modano - Marian Hossa
Jamie Benn - Frank Fredrickson - Dave Taylor
Don Marcotte - Ken Mosdell - Bobby Rousseau
Joe Pavelski, Blake Wheeler

Doug Harvey (A) - Eddie Gerard (C)
Derian Hatcher (A) - Drew Doughty
Bobby Rowe - Bullet Joe Simpson
Glen Harmon, Ted Harris

Jacques Plante
Miikka Kiprusoff

PP1:
Yakushev-Boucher-Iginla
Harvey-Rousseau

PP2:
Fredrickson-Modano-Hossa
Gerard-Simpson

PK1:
Modano-Marcotte
Hatcher-Harvey
Plante

PK2:
Boucher-Mosdell
Gerard-Doughty
Plante

PK extras: Hossa, Northcott, Rousseau, Taylor

Forwards Estimated TOI
PlayerESPPPKTOT
Boucher134320
Modano133420
Iginla134017
Yakushev134017
Hossa133016
Fredrickson133016
Benn130013
Northcott130013
Taylor130013
Rousseau74*011
Marcotte70411
Mosdell70310
TOT13825*14177*
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Defensemen Estimated TOI
PlayerESPPPKTOT
Harvey185528
Gerard182222
Doughty180220
Hatcher160521
Simpson123015
Rowe100010
TOT9210*14116*
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
*Rousseau plays on the PP point

Coaching and Leadership: I like Day a lot, and have him as well above average. Your players are responsible and hardworking, to a man, so he'll like all of them. As with Halifax and Tommy Ivan, you went for a coach that ATDer's often use to smooth out a problem - Ivan with his people skills, Day with his willingness to occasionally unleash unorthodox offensive prodigies - even though you really didn't need to, but again it's not something that should cost you points. If anything, you just know there's someone else in the league trying to make some diva play for a unflexible coach and wishing they had one of those guys. Sucks for them. Gerard is a top-tier captain, your alternates less so, but they all belong.

Top six forwards: Kind of run of the mill as far as personnel goes, but better than you might expect on a Harvey-Plante team. The first line has Boucher looking to set up a couple of net-crashers with big shots, and you've got a fantastic shutdown second line with some balanced offense from both your centre and right wing. I think this gives you (and me, hey) an advantage to be able to use a defensive unit for a good chunk of minutes at even strength without stapling your good players to the bench. In a 20-team league, are either of those left wingers good for their roles? I'm used to seeing them where they are, but we may be at the point where they're weak links.

Bottom six forwards: Your third line is gritty and responsible, with more skill than some of the shutdown lines being thrown out there, but maybe without the kind of ringer present you'd want on a "dagger" line. Federickson might be that guy, or you could look at him as just another very good centre pushed down in a 20 team league. Consequently, you're giving them a big load at even strength and almost no special teams time. Seems about right. The 4th line should be able to kill 7 minutes without much happening, they're solid.

Defense: Harvey requires no explanation, and you could have put just about anybody next to him. You've placed a qualified player at each of the spots 2 through 6, and the sides are balanced. I like seeing prototypical dead-puck defenseman Hatcher paired with protypical post-lockout defenseman Doughty. Just to think about how things have changed and all that fun stuff. The top 4 leans conservative - you've got two guys in Harvey and Doughty who visibly controlled the play in their own eras, without cheating for extra offense, and you've given them primarily stay-at-home partners (or in Hatcher's case, entirely stay-at-home). Simpson is the closest thing you have to a gambler, and he's on the bottom pair.

Goaltending: I go back and forth on who I consider the best goalie of all time, but Plante is my favourite goalie of all time. Kiprusoff...eh, he belongs. On the bench.

Special Teams: This has to be one of the weaker first unit power plays in a 20 team ATD. Harvey, Boucher and Iginla are good to excellent pieces, but none stick out as being guys that bring added value on the power play. Yakushev and Rousseau I can buy as power-play roll-fillers, but...after reviewing teams with Ovechkin, Howe, etc...this is a step behind. The second unit looks better than average in terms of personnel but I don't get as strong a sense of having a few killer scoring options from specific places in the zone - I think this is a consequence of having a consistently good forward group with few weaknesses. Love the penalty killing units. Harvey and Hatcher is as good a combination of star and specialist as you'll find in the ATD, and I like how you've got one of your thoroughbred centres on each unit.

Spares: Noticed I didn't review these for the other teams. They're fine, they all belong. You don't really have a defense-focused spare forward if someone like Marcotte goes down, but you have more than enough guys to promote from within when it comes to killing penalties.

TLDR: A pretty solid, somewhat homogenous forward group in front of a killer #1D and goaltender.
 
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Johnny Engine

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On the PP I have this vision in my mind of them gaining the zone and having to wait for the forwards to catch up!

:laugh:
That is a funny mental image, I have to admit, but does it really square with how power play zone entries actually happen? All Mikhailov and Zetterberg have to do when the opposing team ices the puck is stay on side - we wouldn't need all 5 guys chasing the puck when Coffey's going to get there first and bring it back. And they wouldn't really be blowing across the blueline at full speed either - usually it takes some side-to-side movement or a drop pass to beat a competent defender there.
Either way, I've got 3 exceptional skaters on the first unit in Hull, Coffey and Perreault, and two ATD-average ones in Mikhailov and Zetterberg, so it's not like I'm trying to do something crazy like pairing Orr and Esposito.
 

Johnny Engine

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Jul 29, 2009
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upload_2019-2-3_13-12-33-jpeg.182377


GM: Claude the Fraud
Coach: Pat Burns
Captain: Mark Messier
Alternates: Rod Langway, Brian Leetch

Roster
#7 Keith Tkachuk - #11 Mark Messier - #88 Patrick Kane
#61 Rick Nash - #13 Mats Sundin - #9 Lanny McDonald
#19 Shane Doan - #18 Pavel Datsyuk - #26 Jere Lehtinen
#10 Gary Roberts - #25 Joe Nieuwendyk - #16 Trevor Linden
Spares: #29 Lynn Patrick - #27 Reggie Leach

#2 Brian Leetch - #4 Rob Blake
#5 Rod Langway - #56 Sergei Zubov
#3 Flash Hollett - #52 Adam Foote
Spares: #55 Ulf Samuelson - #28 Reed Larson

#33 Patrick Roy
#31 Grant Fuhr

Powerplay
#7 Keith Tkachuk - #11 Mark Messier - #88 Patrick Kane
#2 Brian Leetch - #56 Sergei Zubov

#61 Rick Nash- #13 Mats Sundin - #9 Lanny McDonald
#3 Flash Hollett - #4 Rob Blake

Shorthanded
#26 Jere Lehtinen - #18 Pavel Datsyuk
#5 Rod Langway - #52 Adam Foote

#19 Shane Doan - #25 Joe Nieuwendyk
#2 Brian Leetch - #4 Rob Blake​
Coaching and Leadership: You've got some strong personalities in the room here, with tough guy Burns, and your two best players are likely diagnosable psychopaths. Strictly on paper, you've got a below-average coach and a top-3 captain, and run-of-the-mill alternates. The roster is mostly full of good guys absent of any real complainers. Nash is a bit of a floater who requires some motivation, but he's got plenty of that from his teammates. I see one possible real-world conflict, and another guy who won't fit in at all, but we'll get to that later.

Top six forwards: Average first line, very weak second line. Between Messier, Kane and Tkachuk, there's a nice mix of passing and shooting skill, and brute force from two of them, allowing Kane to sit high in the zone and gather the puck after his linemates shake it loose. Messier's the only one to write home about defensively, but you've got another line for that. The second line is what happens when you don't look at half of the players available to you, and I think you know that and will be ready next time. Sundin's average at best in his role, McDonald an acceptable 3rd wheel if you need a speedy shoot-first grinder, and Nash is a guy we've been using as a 2nd line 3rd wheel in 32-team drafts, so a marginal power play specialist at best in a league this size. It's not any stronger in terms of personnel than the third line, but perhaps with some soft matchups Sundin could do some damage.

Bottom six forwards: Lots of good, solid Pat Burns kind of players. Datsyuk and Lehtinen is two thirds of a killer checking line, and Doan is kind of a space-filler there. The fourth line includes three guys who aren't really as good as you'd think they are once the entire history of the game is taken into account, but it hangs together fine and having an all time great faceoff man on that line can be useful. While you'd never mistake him for Marty St. Louis, Linden being a converted centre gives you some help in setting up the atypically shoot-first Nieuwendyk, and I can't help but think about what Blake Wheeler would have looked like in that spot. Also, can we talk about Linden on a Messier team? Part of me thinks it'd be fine in this context, as Linden strikes me as quite conflict-adverse, and Linden isn't coming into this team as the previously anointed leader, but it still could be a sore spot.

Defense: Leetch is a budget #1 defenseman, but the depth improves in the 2, 3 and 4 spots. So I'd call this an average to good top 4. And you'd better hope their good, because with a riverboat gambler #5 and very weak defensive #6, Burns is going to go to great lengths to never use his bottom pair, and play the hell out of his top four. Hollett picking up a few shifts on Sundin's line is an intriguing thought, though I'm not sure Burns ever did something like that. Others have noted the lack of a true defensive presence on the top pair, but there's at least some diversity in their skillsets (Blake can take the man, Leetch should have decent instincts for where to go when he does), and it's still the best arrangement possible for the guys you have. You have a variety of forward line options to pair them with, so you can send Datsyuk in to help out, or go all out with Messier, and so on.

Goaltending: Roy is a top-3 goaltender, any way you look at it. Fuhr is another example of a guy who has an added benefit you don't really need - Roy's as clutch as starters come. Either way, great #1, good #2, you're set.

Special Teams: Hey, I recognize that first unit! Except Kovalev is calling himself "Kane" and Graves is calling himself "Tkachuk". Good talent, good diversity of skills, and you've actually got two defensemen worthy of the role. In fact, you've got 4 power play ready defensemen on your team, and that's the main strength of your second unit. Your weak second line looks a little better here, as a lot of teams are starting off their 2nd units with their 5th most dangerous forwards instead of their 4th - had you promoted Sundin to the top unit, a Nash-Nieuwendyk-McDonald group would be pretty smelly. The first PK unit has three strong pieces and a seat-filler, and the second unit is nothing but seat-fillers. Would Blake bullying people at net-front look better next to Langway than Foote? Is that just moving deck chairs around? At least the second unit can win faceoffs.

Spares: Poor, poor Lynn Patrick. You've got "twinkletoes" sitting in the press box on a team coached by an ex-cop, captained by an alpha male egomaniac, with a nearly-equal alpha male egomaniac for a starting goalie. Patrick won't be a problem for your dressing room, but your dressing room will be a problem for him. If anything, he'll function as a whipping boy to scare Nash, Hollett and others into doing what Burns wants. The other spares are solid. You don't have an extra centre, but I don't think the ones you have are injury prone, and Linden can move sideways if needed.

TLDR: The team has a few big holes that should serve as a teachable moments for next year, but Messier and Roy can win the right matchup by themselves.
 

ImporterExporter

"You're a boring old man"
Jun 18, 2013
18,845
7,870
Oblivion Express
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GM - Art Vandelay - "He's an importer/exporter of hockey talents"

Head Coach - Jaroslav Pitner
Associate Head Coach - Vladimir "The Lock" Kostka


Captain
- Sidney Crosby
Alternate - Bobby Clarke
Alternate - Lester Patrick
Alternate - Martin Brodeur (yeah G's are peopleleaders too)




Anatoli Firsov - Sidney Crosby - Mark Recchi
Jiri Holik - Bobby Clarke - Phil Kessel
Craig Ramsay - Doug Gilmour - Larry Aurie
Jack Walker - Marty Barry - Dirk Graham


Guy Lapointe - Lester Patrick
Ching Johnson - Brent Burns
Jim Schoenfeld - Lennart Svedberg


Martin Brodeur
Braden Holtby


Bench:
Vaclav Nedomanksy
Steve Shutt
Nikolai Sologubov


Power Play 1:
Firsov-Crosby-Recchi
Burns-Lapointe


Power Play 2:
Gilmour-Clarke-Barry
Svedberg - Patrick


Penalty Kill 1:
Ramsay-Clarke
Schoenfeld-Johnson


Penalty Kill 2:
Walker-Gilmour
Lapointe-Patrick


Team will deploy the left wing lock, created by Vlad Kostka. Kostka was the brains behind the rise of the Czech hockey machine in the 60's and beyond. He often was behind the scenes which is exactly why I brought in real life coaching partner and friend, Jaroslav Pitner.

The Metro's have a big defensive advantage when looking at F's, especially down the middle and at LW which is critical to make the LWL work. You have elite defensive players in Clarke, Ramsay, Walker with players in the good to great category in Gilmour, Holik, and Graham. Crosby, Firsov, Barry, and Aurie are certainly above average with Kessel being the one true non factor defensively.

While I don't have a traditional #1 Dman, I have supplemented that by, one, using a defensive minded system with players who overwhelmingly fit to a T, and two, have the best puck handling goal tender of all time who will act as an extra Dman, just as he did in real life. Teams will struggle greatly to consistently enter the zone and dumping the puck simply isn't a great option with Marty B back in net.

The Metro's have more than enough offense (especially down the middle with a murderes row of C's) to counter attack teams and obviously have the personnel to deploy the LWL effectively against anyone they meet.​
 

Johnny Engine

Moderator
Jul 29, 2009
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images


GM - Art Vandelay - "He's an importer/exporter of hockey talents"

Head Coach - Jaroslav Pitner
Associate Head Coach - Vladimir "The Lock" Kostka


Captain
- Sidney Crosby
Alternate - Bobby Clarke
Alternate - Lester Patrick
Alternate - Martin Brodeur (yeah G's are peopleleaders too)




Anatoli Firsov - Sidney Crosby - Mark Recchi
Jiri Holik - Bobby Clarke - Phil Kessel
Craig Ramsay - Doug Gilmour - Larry Aurie
Jack Walker - Marty Barry - Dirk Graham


Guy Lapointe - Lester Patrick
Ching Johnson - Brent Burns
Jim Schoenfeld - Lennart Svedberg


Martin Brodeur
Braden Holtby


Bench:
Vaclav Nedomanksy
Steve Shutt
Nikolai Sologubov


Power Play 1:
Firsov-Crosby-Recchi
Burns-Lapointe


Power Play 2:
Gilmour-Clarke-Barry
Svedberg - Patrick


Penalty Kill 1:
Ramsay-Clarke
Schoenfeld-Johnson


Penalty Kill 2:
Walker-Gilmour
Lapointe-Patrick


Team will deploy the left wing lock, created by Vlad Kostka. Kostka was the brains behind the rise of the Czech hockey machine in the 60's and beyond. He often was behind the scenes which is exactly why I brought in real life coaching partner and friend, Jaroslav Pitner.

The Metro's have a big defensive advantage when looking at F's, especially down the middle and at LW which is critical to make the LWL work. You have elite defensive players in Clarke, Ramsay, Walker with players in the good to great category in Gilmour, Holik, and Graham. Crosby, Firsov, Barry, and Aurie are certainly above average with Kessel being the one true non factor defensively.

While I don't have a traditional #1 Dman, I have supplemented that by, one, using a defensive minded system with players who overwhelmingly fit to a T, and two, have the best puck handling goal tender of all time who will act as an extra Dman, just as he did in real life. Teams will struggle greatly to consistently enter the zone and dumping the puck simply isn't a great option with Marty B back in net.

The Metro's have more than enough offense (especially down the middle with a murderes row of C's) to counter attack teams and obviously have the personnel to deploy the LWL effectively against anyone they meet.​

Coaching and leadership: Definitely not one of the best coaches out there, but at least you have a clear system where the coaching staff should be in agreement on how to play, and no one that sticks out as overly inappropriate for the system. This might be a better group of lettermen than Resilient Beast has, and that's saying something. Kessel and Burns stick out as the black sheep on the team, but my limited persepective on Burns is that his presence in San Jose has been a big help to other oddball personalities who feel welcomed and wanted in the big hairy man's dressing room.

Top six forwards: I suppose this is the best way to split up your forwards, no? Recchi and Kessel are the only forwards who are heavily offense-biased on the team, and they're both in the top six. The first line is an excellent blend of hustle, playmaking and shooting, though it does lack the real retriever dog types Crosby has had at his side over the years. There's puckwinning by committee though, so it's not a big issue. The fit on the second line is good, though in the top-6 of a 20 team ATD, Kessel would still have to be a below average finisher, and Holik close to an offensive black hole. Everyone has their jobs though, and Clarke is overqualified at his. It'd be interesting to see how well Kessel is insulated compared to the very worst defensive forwards in the ATD. On the other teams I've assassinated, Ovechkin has Forsberg and Hextall, Kariya and Maltsev have Kennedy, and Kane has Messier. Clarke and Holik edge out Mark and Stoneberg's group on the defensive side of the puck, and I'm sure there are other lines that provide comparables too.

Bottom Six forwards: For pure value, is this the best third line in the game? It's got backchecking across the board, meanness from Gilmour and sort of Aurie, playmaking from Gilmour and a little finish from Aurie. It's also kind of a munchkin line, which doesn't make it bad, but it does mean they're going to have to skate their asses off to cover the amount of ice needed in a checking role. Perhaps restricting their shift length and overall ice time a little so they can explode off the bench would help. Which leads me to Jack Walker and Marty Barry, who are not best served by taking leftover shifts on a fourth line. Graham, meh, he's fine in his role, but in order to get the most out of your depth, you'll have to find a way to get it on the ice as much as possible. Can either of those two take some of Kessel's shifts in the defensive zone? How much can you scale back on Royce Da Five Foot Line (stolen from Leafs Reddit, I'm unashamed) before you're underusing them? Great players here, I want to here more about how you can use them.

Defense: You outlined ways your team can mitigate your weaker top pair, so you know it isn't good by 20-team standards. And there are some passable but not ideal fits here. Patrick is known primarily for his puck movement, and so is Lapointe, but at least they're both intelligent defenders, and Patrick is a giraffe of a man who should be able to break up passes well. Normally I'd be wary of pairing a one-dimensional gronk like Johnson with a freelancer like Burns - neither is conducive to quick, supported breakouts, but you've got forwards who can swing back and help, and the coaching staff to do it. I'm picturing someone like Firsov frequently coming back deeper than Burns when getting ready to move up ice. Schoenfeld and Svedberg is a good bottom pair, and the handedness checks out for your whole group.

Goaltending: Somewhere between the 4th and 7th best in the league. Sell me on where Holtby should rank by now. I like that he's a stabilizing franchise goaltender who's been good longer than Kiprusoff, hasn't been horrible like Bobrovsky sometimes is, has been healthier than Price, and hasn't bounced around like Beezer, to name some recently assassinated backup goalies and direct peers. But has he had a better career than any of those guys? I haven't personally taken stock on that, sell me on it.

Special Teams: The power play is lacking a standard net presence, but the talent is there. Burns is in his element as having Lapointe at the very top of the zone allows him to pinch and get aggressive. Why not have Kessel on the second unit instead of one of those defensemen? He's not a pointman per see, so you'd have to decide who's lining up a few feet back on faceoffs, but he does have a laser from the outside, which isn't a skill that's duplicated by either of the forwards. The penalty kill forwards are exceptional, and I like that you separated Clarke and Gilmour to keep both units threatening. You have a PK specialist in Graham who's not doing anything, so why not form a 3rd unit with Holik? The PK defensemen are reasonable enough, but if you mentally sub a Robinson or Chara instead of any of these guys, you start to see why I'm not going to call them anything like above average.

Spares: So that's where all the slot guys went. This is a weird set of forward spares because they don't resemble anything else you have in your lineup, so the composition of the team changes more dramatically than you'd think if anyone gets injured. If your coach wants to experiment, big Ned in for Graham makes you more dangerous without disrupting much. Shutt, I'm not sure about. If the system is going to hold, this guy's getting stapled to the bench at even strength, which at least provides some more ice time for whichever centre has to play left wing. Sologubov is a good #7.

TLDR: Lots of talent up front and many more questions to answer. Defense isn't strong but the goaltending helps a lot.
 

ImporterExporter

"You're a boring old man"
Jun 18, 2013
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Oblivion Express
Coaching and leadership: Definitely not one of the best coaches out there, but at least you have a clear system where the coaching staff should be in agreement on how to play, and no one that sticks out as overly inappropriate for the system. This might be a better group of lettermen than Resilient Beast has, and that's saying something. Kessel and Burns stick out as the black sheep on the team, but my limited persepective on Burns is that his presence in San Jose has been a big help to other oddball personalities who feel welcomed and wanted in the big hairy man's dressing room.

Top six forwards: I suppose this is the best way to split up your forwards, no? Recchi and Kessel are the only forwards who are heavily offense-biased on the team, and they're both in the top six. The first line is an excellent blend of hustle, playmaking and shooting, though it does lack the real retriever dog types Crosby has had at his side over the years. There's puckwinning by committee though, so it's not a big issue. The fit on the second line is good, though in the top-6 of a 20 team ATD, Kessel would still have to be a below average finisher, and Holik close to an offensive black hole. Everyone has their jobs though, and Clarke is overqualified at his. It'd be interesting to see how well Kessel is insulated compared to the very worst defensive forwards in the ATD. On the other teams I've assassinated, Ovechkin has Forsberg and Hextall, Kariya and Maltsev have Kennedy, and Kane has Messier. Clarke and Holik edge out Mark and Stoneberg's group on the defensive side of the puck, and I'm sure there are other lines that provide comparables too.

Bottom Six forwards: For pure value, is this the best third line in the game? It's got backchecking across the board, meanness from Gilmour and sort of Aurie, playmaking from Gilmour and a little finish from Aurie. It's also kind of a munchkin line, which doesn't make it bad, but it does mean they're going to have to skate their asses off to cover the amount of ice needed in a checking role. Perhaps restricting their shift length and overall ice time a little so they can explode off the bench would help. Which leads me to Jack Walker and Marty Barry, who are not best served by taking leftover shifts on a fourth line. Graham, meh, he's fine in his role, but in order to get the most out of your depth, you'll have to find a way to get it on the ice as much as possible. Can either of those two take some of Kessel's shifts in the defensive zone? How much can you scale back on Royce Da Five Foot Line (stolen from Leafs Reddit, I'm unashamed) before you're underusing them? Great players here, I want to here more about how you can use them.

Defense: You outlined ways your team can mitigate your weaker top pair, so you know it isn't good by 20-team standards. And there are some passable but not ideal fits here. Patrick is known primarily for his puck movement, and so is Lapointe, but at least they're both intelligent defenders, and Patrick is a giraffe of a man who should be able to break up passes well. Normally I'd be wary of pairing a one-dimensional gronk like Johnson with a freelancer like Burns - neither is conducive to quick, supported breakouts, but you've got forwards who can swing back and help, and the coaching staff to do it. I'm picturing someone like Firsov frequently coming back deeper than Burns when getting ready to move up ice. Schoenfeld and Svedberg is a good bottom pair, and the handedness checks out for your whole group.

Goaltending: Somewhere between the 4th and 7th best in the league. Sell me on where Holtby should rank by now. I like that he's a stabilizing franchise goaltender who's been good longer than Kiprusoff, hasn't been horrible like Bobrovsky sometimes is, has been healthier than Price, and hasn't bounced around like Beezer, to name some recently assassinated backup goalies and direct peers. But has he had a better career than any of those guys? I haven't personally taken stock on that, sell me on it.

Special Teams: The power play is lacking a standard net presence, but the talent is there. Burns is in his element as having Lapointe at the very top of the zone allows him to pinch and get aggressive. Why not have Kessel on the second unit instead of one of those defensemen? He's not a pointman per see, so you'd have to decide who's lining up a few feet back on faceoffs, but he does have a laser from the outside, which isn't a skill that's duplicated by either of the forwards. The penalty kill forwards are exceptional, and I like that you separated Clarke and Gilmour to keep both units threatening. You have a PK specialist in Graham who's not doing anything, so why not form a 3rd unit with Holik? The PK defensemen are reasonable enough, but if you mentally sub a Robinson or Chara instead of any of these guys, you start to see why I'm not going to call them anything like above average.

Spares: So that's where all the slot guys went. This is a weird set of forward spares because they don't resemble anything else you have in your lineup, so the composition of the team changes more dramatically than you'd think if anyone gets injured. If your coach wants to experiment, big Ned in for Graham makes you more dangerous without disrupting much. Shutt, I'm not sure about. If the system is going to hold, this guy's getting stapled to the bench at even strength, which at least provides some more ice time for whichever centre has to play left wing. Sologubov is a good #7.

TLDR: Lots of talent up front and many more questions to answer. Defense isn't strong but the goaltending helps a lot.

Leadership is so important in sports, especially hockey IMO. My teams here have generally been top dog or near there in that category. Just a personal preference but looking back at the great SC winners, you can see a slew of the greatest leaders of all time. And I don't think for one second that titles alone makes the person a great leader. It helps enhance the case but folks like Beliveau, Messier, Gretzky, Yzerman, Sakic, Crosby, Clarke, etc all had different/similar styles and a crap load of evidence to support them being extremely respected by teammates, opponents, coaches, etc.

Which is why when you draft the sort of odd ball character (Kessel/Burns) you can go back to the leaders you have on the team to help bring everyone together. With my roster I really love the balance Sid and Clarke bring. Sid is a more reserved, "boring" character. His on ice determination and work ethic speak volumes (much like a Yzerman). Clarke is that rambunctious, balls to the wall type leader. He'll snarl at you, get in your face and use words, along with actions to inspire. It's a nice run to either end of the spectrum.

The top line has a guy, Recchi, who played extensively (and did very well I might add) with Sid in his first 2 years in the league. I think that adds a bit of stock to the line's ability to work in a setting like this. Recchi might not have been a big dude or a major thumper, but one of his best attributes was being tough as nails, playing bigger than his size, digging pucks in the corners and high traffic areas. And then obviously having high IQ in the Ozone. Sid's balance as a scorer really helps when you have somebody like Recchi who was slanted towards playmaking. Firsov reads like another guy who was very balanced as well. The line doesn't have a sniper but all 3 guys are very high IQ guys, especially Sid and Firsov.

The reason I went with Kessel late was because, A, the value was, IMO, quite good. I think it was TDMM who said Kessel should really be going around the time of Palffy and I don't disagree at all. I think Phil was taken about 120 picks after ZP. The other reason I grabbed Phil was his offense is more along the lines of a 2nd line player here and despite his weakness as a defensive player, playing next to Clarke (elite defender) and Holik (good, if not great here) should really mitigate the concern IMO. Phil will also see a few of his shifts taken by Aurie who is a much better 2 way player and good enough offensively to not drag down a 2nd line.

You touched on the 3rd line needing to skate a bit heavier to play a checking role. I don't disagree but it's a line that should be considered among the best in the league at doing exactly that. Checking. But I did grab Barry with the notion of giving him more than normal 4th line minutes. Creating mismatches down the middle is something I wanted to do from the get go. And I think my C's will do that consistently. A few teams can match (or even beat) Sid at top. But you'll be very hard pressed to win battles from the 2-4 spots. There isn't a weak defensive C (Have an elite, a good to great one and 2 average to above average guys). They're all above the mean offensively for the line they represent.

The left wing lock really forces teams to try and make waves. If you have the players for it (I think I certainly do) it can really force the opposition into a more dump style attack. Which benefits me given I have Brodeur manning the goal. I want teams to be forced into that style and given I can bang bodies (Clarke, Gilmour, Ramsay, Aurie, Graham) and play very strong positionally (all those plus Walker, Holik) will be able to make life very difficult for any type of attack.

Conversely, I still retain a lot of offensive firepower in counterattack. Crosby, Clarke, Firsov, Gilmour, Barry (all exceed their respective positional average) and Recchi (average) give the Metro's a good corp and depth among scorers. I don't have a black hole in the top 6, and the one guy (Holik) who is certainly near the bottom of 2nd line LW, closes the gap with some because he's strong defensively.

I'll add more later but I have a fantastic high going on and Floyd playing, so a break is in order! :nod:
 

Habsfan18

The Hockey Library
May 13, 2003
30,677
8,767
Ontario
Thanks @BenchBrawl for the review of my team. I’ll respond some time tonight or tomorrow. Such a busy time here! Packing for a move with my wife (we sold our house and bought a new one) all while taking care of our 3 month old!

Just a quick follow up on this - sorry it has been super hectic here packing for our move and taking care of our son. Not a lot of free time at the moment. Will still be around for voting though.

Thanks again for the review of my team. I agree that Markus Naslund isn’t ideal for that 2nd line, but so many of my LW targets went before I had the chance to take them and I sort of had to settle there. Was looking for a strong offensive winger to pair with Malkin (playmaking, offense) and Alfie (two-way) and figured Naslund had a strong enough peak to fit in okay there even if it’s not ideal.

Sittler I think is a very strong 3rd line C even if he isn’t a typical shut down checker. He’ll provide some decent scoring and two-way play with Lewis and Nevin on that 3rd unit. With Sittler it was hard to pass up on him at that point in the draft.

I agree that my top 6 is pretty soft. I feel I built a pretty talented and well rounded team, but I’ll take this as a learning experience to try to make sure I have more sandpaper up front going forward.

I’m very happy with my goaltending tandem. Broda is known to be extremely clutch come playoff time. I will try to make a point to not wait as long to select a goaltender next year though. It’s a balance..I personally don’t want to select one too early but at that same time you don’t want to risk being left in the dust as one of the last guys to select one either..

All in all I feel like I built a much better team than last year and one that can be a contender. I’m sure everyone feels that way about their own team though. We leave it in the voters hands! And even if my team doesn’t do so well, I’ll treat every year as a learning experience to get better.
 

tony d

Registered User
Jun 23, 2007
76,594
4,555
Behind A Tree
As promised @BenchBrawl a review of your team with my commets in bold:

MONTREAL CANADIENS

:habs

GM: BenchBrawl

Captain: Eddie Gerard
Assistant: Doug Harvey
Assistant: Jarome Iginla
Assistant: Derian Hatcher

HEAD COACH

Hap Day

ROSTER

Alex Yakushev - Frank Boucher - Jarome Iginla (A)
Baldy Northcott - Mike Modano - Marian Hossa
Jamie Benn - Frank Fredrickson - Dave Taylor
Don Marcotte - Ken Mosdell - Bobby Rousseau
Joe Pavelski, Blake Wheeler

Doug Harvey (A) - Eddie Gerard (C)
Derian Hatcher (A) - Drew Doughty
Bobby Rowe - Bullet Joe Simpson
Glen Harmon, Ted Harris

Jacques Plante
Miikka Kiprusoff

PP1:
Yakushev-Boucher-Iginla
Harvey-Rousseau

PP2:
Fredrickson-Modano-Hossa
Gerard-Simpson

PK1:
Modano-Marcotte
Hatcher-Harvey
Plante

PK2:
Boucher-Mosdell
Gerard-Doughty
Plante

PK extras: Hossa, Northcott, Rousseau, Taylor

Leadership:

A solid group of leaders to this team, I particularly like Harvey and Iginla with letters, I think both could be captains on some other teams around the league so for you to get both as alternates is a feather in your cap.

Coaching:

I think Day is one of the top coaches of all time so a good pick for your team.

Forward Line 1:

What is Yakushev's role here? I can see very defined roles here for both Boucher (Playmaker) and Iginla (Muscle) but will Yakushev score the goals? If so this could be a very good line as both Boucher and Iginla will do quite well in their roles.

Forward Line 2:

This line looks to be more of a defensive 2nd line than offensive but they should be able to provide offense when needed. For my money even in a smaller draft Modano's one of the best 2nd line centres here. Hossa's one of my favorite players of all time. So overall a solid 2nd line that will produce results for your team that you will be pleased with.

Forward Line 3:

Jamie Benn's one of my favorite active players, he can score points and also play tough as well. Frank Fredrickson could be the victim of a 20 team league in seeing his role reduced. Still he's going to be good for your team. I like Dave Taylor a lot as wel, type of guy every team should have. Overall a good 3rd line.

Forward Line 4:

This looks like your run of the mill 4th line with all 3 players able to play well defensively. I had Rousseau's name spelled out when I picked Ed Westfall. While I decided not to go with him he's still a solid player.

Defense Pairing 1:

Doug Harvey is Doug Harvey so that automatically makes this a strong pairing. I'm not familiar on Eddie Gerard but he's still a favorite around here. Given Doug Harvey is his partner he should do well.

Defense Pairing 2:

This pairing has 2 of the better defensive defensemen on it so it should be a not so fun pairing for opposing offenses to get through. Doughty will chip in offensively as well as an added bonus.

Defense Pairing 3:

I'm not familiar on Rowe but I do know about Simpson, from my research he may be your best offensive defenseman so that's good to have on your bottom pairing, a 3rd pairing that certainly won't hurt your team.

Goaltending:

Plante is among the best goalies ever so that's a huge get for your team, Kipper was my backup goalie in a 40 team ATD in 2011 so he's going to be a weak backup in this league but with Plante as your #1 anyone could have been the backup and your goaltending would have been good.

Extras:

4 good extras here, Pavelski and Wheeler are among the top players in the NHL right now. I'd buy both Harmon and Harris as starters on a defense even in a 20 team draft.

Special Teams:

Your 1st PP speaks to a weakness on your team and that is the lack of a top goal scorer, Yakushev's good but is he good enough to be a goal scorer on a top PP in the ATD? Also Bobby Rousseau should be nowhere near an ATD 1st unit PP especially in a smaller draft than normal. I really would put Simpson on the 1st PP if I were you. The 2nd PP unit should work well though.

Your PK is better than your PP so good job there.

Summary:

Overall a good group, still the lack of a top goal scorer will hurt, other than that it's a good group. Good luck to you in this.



 
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ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,903
3,557
Edmonton
How many more days for assassinations? I kinda checked out for work but I hope to try and at least mini-assassinate every team
 

Hawkey Town 18

Registered User
Jun 29, 2009
8,251
1,643
Chicago, IL
I was waiting to post my team until I did a couple bios, but I've just been so swamped at work that I haven't gotten to them, so hopefully will be adding those later this week...

Chicago Shamrocks

Coach: Fred Shero

Patrick Elias - Milt Schmidt (A) - Guy Lafleur
Sweeney Schriner - Joe Malone - Cecil Dillon
Brad Marchand - Neil Colville - Claude Provost
Zach Parise - Edgar Laprade - Ryan Kesler
Spares: Pat Lafontaine, Bob Davidson

Scott Stevens (C) - Red Kelly
Herb Gardiner - Georges Boucher (A)
Jim Neilson - P.K. Subban
Spares: Red Dutton, Rod Seiling


Vladislav Tretiak
Rogie Vachon



Special Teams
PP1: Schriner - Malone - Lafleur - Subban - Kelly
PP2: Elias - Schmidt - Parise - Gardiner - Boucher

PK1: Kesler - Provost - Stevens - Neilson
PK2: Laprade - Colville/Dillon - Gardiner - Boucher
Extra F: Provost, Schmidt, Marchand
Extra D: Kelly




Estimated Minutes
Forwards
PlayerESPPPKTotal
P. Elias13215
M. Schmidt15318
G. Lafleur15520
S. Schriner13518
J. Malone14*418
C. Dillon13215
B. Marchand1212
N. Colville13215
C. Provost12315
Z. Parise628
E. Laprade639
R. Kesler6410
TOTAL1382114173
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
*Joe Malone will play some shifts at LW on the top line

Defense
PlayerESPPPKTotal
S. Stevens20424
R. Kelly20525
H. Gardiner162321
G. Boucher163322
J. Nielson10414
P.K. Subban10414
TOTAL921414120
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
 
Last edited:

The Macho King

Back* to Back** World Champion
Jun 22, 2011
48,759
29,250
Yeah I'm swamped and wouldn't mind another few days. I'd like to try my hand at one or two at least.
 

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