ATD Chat Thread XVII

[The Macho King]

It's funny how much better I do feel about my PP after that exchange. Like I said, it was the fact of not having done any real team building exercises that was making me feel hemmed in. Obviously, when I'm watching games, I can see who's playing on power plays and penalty kills, but I've never paid much attention to the makeups of those units, because I've never had to. Now, realizing that I can shuffle those positions more than I was giving myself liberty to do, I like that build MUCH better. That one thing is a huge weight off.

One thing I unconsciously do in these is I tend to sing 2D setups for this, mainly because I think 4F 1D is objectively better, but historically 3F2D was probably the norm until relatively recently.

 

[overpass]

One thing I unconsciously do in these is I tend to sing 2D setups for this, mainly because I think 4F 1D is objectively better, but historically 3F2D was probably the norm until relatively recently.

4F 1D was also the norm in the Original 6 era and was common in the 30s too. 3F 2D was the norm from 1980 through 2010, which is a long time but it only covers a minority the history of the power play.

 

[Johnny Engine]

One thing I unconsciously do in these is I tend to sing 2D setups for this, mainly because I think 4F 1D is objectively better, but historically 3F2D was probably the norm until relatively recently.

I'd like to see some more work done on this, but I'm actually under the impression that teams started swinging towards 3F2D more often around the 80s. I can't really back that up or say why, but I think that might be at least partially true.

I think my biggest pet peeve about contemporary hockey fans talking about hockey history (or history in general) is that we tend to assume history happens in two phases, now and not now, and what ever change happens between those two basically goes in one direction. So the idea that giving roster spots to goons who can't play NHL-level hockey is an 80s and 90s thing as opposed to a time honored tradition might not cross their mind, and I think power play trends may be a little bit similar.

That's not a shot at you, I think every GM in the ATD discusses hockey history at a higher level than the people I'm thinking about.

 

[Johnny Engine]

4F 1D was also the norm in the Original 6 era and was common in the 30s too. 3F 2D was the norm from 1980 through 2010, which is a long time but it only covers a minority the history of the power play.

This guy sounds more confident than me about it.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

I never plan 3 or 4 forwards on the PP in advance. I decide as my roster comes together.

 

[Johnny Engine]

I never plan 3 or 4 forwards on the PP in advance. I decide as my roster comes together.

This is probably the correct approach, and so often the correct answer ends up 7F and 3D rather than 8+2 or 6+4.


...to say nothing of all those crazy rovers you gotta place somewhere

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

That said, when I drafted Geoffrion in Round 2, I was locked into 4 forwards on PP1

 

[VanIslander]

E (or C) easily.

Certainly not Cowley or Seguin as 3rd line pivot!

 

[Professor What]

I never plan 3 or 4 forwards on the PP in advance. I decide as my roster comes together.

Had I looked at it in a similar manner, I probably never would have been so stressed over my PP.

 

[overpass]

This guy sounds more confident than me about it.

I ran the numbers by seasons for F vs D on the PP and posted them here.

Forwards playing the point on PP

In 1971, defencemen had 25% of on-ice PPGF. In 1981, 34%. In 1998, 35%. In 2017, 27%.

 

[BraveCanadian]

FYI There is another thread here were people list some of the forwards who played point on the PP.. I referenced it a few times when I was backed into a PP point man corner before drafting Rousseau (and later Bubla).

forwards playing the point on the pp

 

[The Macho King]

FYI There is another thread here were people list some of the forwards who played point on the PP.. I referenced it a few times when I was backed into a PP point man corner before drafting Rousseau (and later Bubla).

forwards playing the point on the pp

Modern, but does any team still use two guys at the point on the PP?

For instance, when healthy the Bolts run -

Palat below the goal line
Stamkos - Point - Kucherov
Hedman as the only guy at the point.

I wonder if 4F setups back in the day were similar.

 

[tinyzombies]

South Korea bought millions of doses from four different companies.

+ it'll be free for Koreans AND foreign residents

- people will not be informed which of the four they are receiving (though the gov't will be documenting it: guinea pig double-blind study on a society scale.

f*** that. I'll wait 2 years, read the research and get the most effective/least dangerous one, even if i have to then go back home or pay for it.

This billion dollar industry has emerged overnight and companies have rushed to market "product" based on time-limited studies out of "the public interest" (and corporate profit).

We have never such a confluence of corporate and public interest. It could go swimmingly or it could go sidewards. I suspect a bit of both. An opps or two in the mix. We shall certainly see...

Pfizer is the one that also reduces transmission by lowering the viral load that is carried and it works against all variants in preliminary testing. Canada is going to end up with 76 mil of those, which is enough for everyone x2. Canada just decided against taking up our option to buy another round of Moderna. Pfizer is working like a charm in Israel and the numbers are dropping sharply after vaccination began.

 

[VanIslander]

Pfizer is... lowering the.. load that is carried and it works ...

Indeed. It has a track record of doing so.

 

[VanIslander]

But seriously, did you know Pfizer has had an R&D center in Wuhan since 2010.

R&D | Pfizer

 

[The Macho King]

Can you not bring nonsense conspiracy theories here?

 

[tinyzombies]

But seriously, did you know Pfizer has had an R&D center in Wuhan since 2010.

R&D | Pfizer

Well, thankfully there is a vaccine that works, that's what matters right now. The pandemic has also slowed down climate change and given time for disruptive tech to take hold in the market. EV's aren't the total answer and need to be replaced by Hydrogen eventually, but it's a huge step.

 

[VanIslander]

Charles Pfizer, the founder of the company, moved from Germany to New York as a 24 year old and got rich making medicine to treat stomach worms, and it did indeed work as such, only, it was toxic and caused side effects like vision problems, sometimes blindness and death and was discontinued. He used the money to buy real estate in New York and his many children continued the business into new medicinal products.

Note: I have no conspiracy theory on COVID19. I do worry about rushing a product to market without enough time to test for side effects, efficacy and longer-term consequences. History is full of such.

There is a lot of research in the history of science on unintended consequences and on the assumption of command and control over nature. The fact is it is unchartered territory (barely charted at least), like using Vasco da Gama's map of his voyage to India to try and replicate the journey under different weather conditions and less than most accurate measements.

I counsel caution, and if you decide it's worth the risk (given the death rate by age, older people should consider the vaccine a risk worthwhile ASAP. I personally will wait a year or two and see the science on one vaccine versus another, then choose accordingly.

 

[tinyzombies]

Charles Pfizer, the founder of the company, moved from Germany to New York as a 24 year old and got rich making medicine to treat stomach worms, and it did indeed work as such, only, it was toxic and caused side effects like vision problems, sometimes blindness and death and was discontinued. He used the money to buy real estate in New York and his many children continued the business into new medicinal products.

Note: I have no conspiracy theory on COVID19. I do worry about rushing a product to market without enough time to test for side effects, efficacy and longer-term consequences. History is full of such.

There is a lot of research in the history of science on unintended consequences and on the assumption of command and control over nature. The fact is it is unchartered territory (barely charted at least), like using Vasco da Gama's map of his voyage to India to try and replicate the journey under different weather conditions and less than most accurate measements.

I counsel caution, and if you decide it's worth the risk (given the death rate by age, older people should consider the vaccine a risk worthwhile ASAP. I personally will wait a year or two and see the science on one vaccine versus another, then choose accordingly.

It went through the same rigorous testing phases, the only short-cut was production/deliveries. It's peer-reviewed. The casualties have been chalked up to secondary causes, the thing works and is safe. It's not really a vaccine, it's a synthetic vaccine, it contains none of the original virus. My gf's 77yo mother took it and she's fine. I have finally talked my own mother into it.

 

[BraveCanadian]

Really interesting article about the evolution of goaltending equipment and the selection for size being done in the NHL now. Comparisons to the big man era of the NBA.

Hockey Has a Gigantic-Goalie Problem

 

[tinyzombies]

Jack Han has a new book coming called Hockey Tactics Retrospective where he breaks down old games and talks about the systems, tactics, etc. used and I assume will analyze some of the players. I just got Chapter one by email and he analyzes game 6 of the 75 finals.

His other stuff breaks down the systems of teams these days and proposes new types of systems that could be effective. Very interesting stuff.

 

[Johnny Engine]

Jack Han has a new book coming called Hockey Tactics Retrospective where he breaks down old games and talks about the systems, tactics, etc. used and I assume will analyze some of the players. I just got Chapter one by email and he analyzes game 6 of the 75 finals.

His other stuff breaks down the systems of teams these days and proposes new types of systems that could be effective. Very interesting stuff.

Been meaning to pick this up at some point, I like Jack's writing a lot.

 

[tinyzombies]

Been meaning to pick this up at some point, I like Jack's writing a lot.

Reading about the Box-Plus-1 powerplay now. Good stuff. Have to fix my own ATD PP...

 

[Dreakmur]

Reading about the Box-Plus-1 powerplay now. Good stuff. Have to fix my own ATD PP...

box plus 1 is also a very common defensive zone scheme

 

[tinyzombies]

box plus 1 is also a very common defensive zone scheme

The pp box plus 1