At 6th Overall the Red Wings Take Filip Zadina

[Lampedampe]

Pronman: Re-ranking the NHL Draft Class of 2018

Zadina 10th in Pronman's 2018 draft re-draft.

Slipping a bit, but not too harsh.

Top4 like it was.

5. Quinn Hughes - VAN
6. Barret Hayton - ARI
7. Grigori Denisenko - FLO
------------------------ talent drop
8. Noah Dobsom - NYI
9. Vitali Kravtsov - NYR
10. Filip Zadina - DET
11. Adam Boqvist - CHI
12. Evan Bouchard - EDM
13. Joel Farabee - PHI
------------------------ talent drop

Didn't realise that Pronman had Dobson at 20, but atleast he bumped him up abit this time around.

The toughest part for me when watching Zadina vs the Islanders was seeing Dobson consistently kill it out there, he even looked great while QB their PP which was something people thought he'd never be capable of.

 

[BinCookin]

I really wanted Dobson. But Zadina falling to us was a gift, kinda like puljujarvi to Edmonton.

People are forgetting, its only been 1 year since the kid was drafted. Maybe you should all lower your expectations on EVERYONE we select. Seider looks nice, but he wont make the team this year... and he might not make the team next year either. Veleno might not make the team this year... and maybe not next year either.

These kids have to be good. And right now Erne looks good. And i wonder how Svechnikov and Rasmussen look in comparison to our younger prospects.

Zadina will probably make the NHL. But it would be nice for people to realize that Veleno killed it vs freakin kids, and that is NOT all that impressive. And Zadina struggled a bit vs men, but it is about equally impressive to me, as Veleno.

ALL prospects are gambles.... Bergren, McIsaac, Smith, Grewe.. whoever you think should rank 7th or 8th on our prospect list.... I expect NONE of them to make the NHL. But i HOPE they do.

EXPECT vs HOPE. Expect nothing, and you wont be so disappointed all the time in regards to these prospects.

 

[MBH]

On draft day, if someone said to you that Zadina would have been an easy pre-season cut in Sept. 2019, would you have believed it?

 

[HisNoodliness]

On draft day, if someone said to you that Zadina would have been an easy pre-season cut in Sept. 2019, would you have believed it?

I would have been very doubtful, but prospects are pretty unpredictable regardless.

 

[Dotter]

On pace for 12 goals and 27 points. Shows flashy puck skills, but his shot is lacking -- looks like his shot has actually regressed! He rarely tries to pull off other types of creative scoring plays.

His confidence is lull and apparently I overrated his hockey IQ. I was really expecting to see 40-50 points out of this kid this season. Guess we are seeing the reasons why he fell to us in the draft.

My Christmas wish is he improves his shot (and deception), gets much stronger, hopefully some confidence builds creativity, and maybe earns a chance to play with better offensive players.

 

[RedWingzz]

On pace for 12 goals and 27 points. Shows flashy puck skills, but his shot is lacking -- looks like his shot has actually regressed! He rarely tries to pull off other types of creative scoring plays.

His confidence is lull and apparently I overrated his hockey IQ. I was really expecting to see 40-50 points out of this kid this season. Guess we are seeing the reasons why he fell to us in the draft.

My Christmas wish is he improves his shot (and deception), gets much stronger, hopefully some confidence builds creativity, and maybe earns a chance to play with better offensive players.

Yeah, he has no confidence at all right now. You can just tell by his demeanour and body language that he's not a confident player. Honestly, I think he thought he was better than he actually is, and is now realizing that compared to the other best players in the world, he's nothing special.

I don't know if he's ever gonna figure it out to be honest....Wouldn't be shocked if he's traded out of Detroit eventually. He's not part of the long-term team in my opinion. He doesn't drive the play enough, and while he shows glimpses of his skill, he makes too many mistakes, and still over-handles the puck way too much. I think in junior hockey he had much more success due to the wider range of skill in the league. In the NHL, everyone is fast and skilled, and everyone has good vision and can shoot, and he's starting to realize that he's just not that good.

I had high, high hopes for him. Sometimes in the sports industry, things don't work out.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Yeah, he has no confidence at all right now. You can just tell by his demeanour and body language that he's not a confident player. Honestly, I think he thought he was better than he actually is, and is now realizing that compared to the other best players in the world, he's nothing special.

I don't know if he's ever gonna figure it out to be honest....Wouldn't be shocked if he's traded out of Detroit eventually. He's not part of the long-term team in my opinion. He doesn't drive the play enough, and while he shows glimpses of his skill, he makes too many mistakes, and still over-handles the puck way too much. I think in junior hockey he had much more success due to the wider range of skill in the league. In the NHL, everyone is fast and skilled, and everyone has good vision and can shoot, and he's starting to realize that he's just not that good.

I had high, high hopes for him. Sometimes in the sports industry, things don't work out.

Kind of in agreement with this whole thing, sadly. I can't think of a single game this season where I thought Zadina was one of the top 5 players on the Wings that night. His season also isn't helped by Vrana being out. The two had very good chemistry in the 11 games that Vrana was in the lineup.

I'm hoping that he can salvage this year and change our minds, but if not then I'd vote to salvage it the same way Yzerman did the Drouin pick.

 

[Dotter]

Yeah, he has no confidence at all right now. You can just tell by his demeanour and body language that he's not a confident player. Honestly, I think he thought he was better than he actually is, and is now realizing that compared to the other best players in the world, he's nothing special.

I don't know if he's ever gonna figure it out to be honest....Wouldn't be shocked if he's traded out of Detroit eventually. He's not part of the long-term team in my opinion. He doesn't drive the play enough, and while he shows glimpses of his skill, he makes too many mistakes, and still over-handles the puck way too much. I think in junior hockey he had much more success due to the wider range of skill in the league. In the NHL, everyone is fast and skilled, and everyone has good vision and can shoot, and he's starting to realize that he's just not that good.

I had high, high hopes for him. Sometimes in the sports industry, things don't work out.

I sometimes wonder if he would have benefited from playing top line minutes in the AHL to tear it up down there, with occasional short stints to taste the NHL to fill in for injuries (overripen). That would probably give him:

1) the expectations that he's not overly special when competing against the best players in the world.
2) help keep his confidence up.
3) dangle a carrot in front of his nose.

He's not a 4th line player and isn't resilient enough for the 3rd line. If he's not a contributing top 6 winger, I really see no point of him staying in Detroit.

That said, I'm not ready to trade him yet unless Stevie Y can get some amazing return. He's not going to return anything close to what Drouin did.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

"I was rooting for you! We were all rooting for you! How dare you!" - Tyra Banks

 

[Dotter]

"I was rooting for you! We were all rooting for you! How dare you!" - Tyra Banks

...and still am rooting for Zadina.

He's 22 and, as far as I am concerned, can still filip the switch.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

...and still am rooting for Zadina.

He's 22 and, as far as I am concerned, can still filip the switch.

This is true, but for me this was the season that Zadina should be demonstrating his potential and value to the team. A full season, with training camp, and with guys like Seider and Raymond helping bear some of the offensive and defensive burden gives Zadina zero excuses. If he cannot get it going this season, I am very concerned about what his actual ceiling is.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

I sometimes wonder if he would have benefited from playing top line minutes in the AHL to tear it up down there, with occasional short stints to taste the NHL to fill in for injuries (overripen). That would probably give him:

1) the expectations that he's not overly special when competing against the best players in the world.
2) help keep his confidence up.
3) dangle a carrot in front of his nose.

He's not a 4th line player and isn't resilient enough for the 3rd line. If he's not a contributing top 6 winger, I really see no point of him staying in Detroit.

That said, I'm not ready to trade him yet unless Stevie Y can get some amazing return. He's not going to return anything close to what Drouin did.

What does that even mean?

 

[Dotter]

This is true, but for me this was the season that Zadina should be demonstrating his potential and value to the team. A full season, with training camp, and with guys like Seider and Raymond helping bear some of the offensive and defensive burden gives Zadina zero excuses. If he cannot get it going this season, I am very concerned about what his actual ceiling is.

Yeah Zadina feels like a poor man's winger version of Valtteri Filppula. Shows signs of potential, but never finds that 2nd gear. Keeps you constantly wanting more.

 

[TheMule93]

going thru this thread from the beginning was quite entertaining...so much enthusiasm!

I remember how hyped i was for our 2018 draft. 3 and a half years later, only Berggren has met/exceeded my expectations and he hasnt done shit in the NHL yet, so he's a big question mark himself.

 

[Dotter]

What does that even mean?

In summary, it means he was the perfect candidate to overripen in the AHL. I was giving my opinions why.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

Yeah, he has no confidence at all right now. You can just tell by his demeanour and body language that he's not a confident player. Honestly, I think he thought he was better than he actually is, and is now realizing that compared to the other best players in the world, he's nothing special.

I don't know if he's ever gonna figure it out to be honest....Wouldn't be shocked if he's traded out of Detroit eventually. He's not part of the long-term team in my opinion. He doesn't drive the play enough, and while he shows glimpses of his skill, he makes too many mistakes, and still over-handles the puck way too much. I think in junior hockey he had much more success due to the wider range of skill in the league. In the NHL, everyone is fast and skilled, and everyone has good vision and can shoot, and he's starting to realize that he's just not that good.

I had high, high hopes for him. Sometimes in the sports industry, things don't work out.

If you are looking to move on from all players who do not drive the play, you are going to end up with a roster of one. There are a lot of guys who need help from their line mates to generate offense. He isn't a novelty in that regard.

Personally, I don't think he has the boots to play the game the way that he wants to at his size in the NHL. He needs to rethink how he is going to score in the NHL and needs to spend way more time down low around the net. He isn't going to beat NHL goalies from 20 feet out on a regular basis. He shouldn't think of himself as a "skilled" player at the NHL level. It is time for him to get dirty and greasy.

 

[sepster]

Zadina has been very disappointing so far, to be sure. While his play and body language don't indicate much at this point, my only hope is to tell myself that at 22yo Nyquist had just finished 3 years at Maine and was starting a full season in GR, and Tatar was starting his 4th season in GR.

 

[SuperScript29]

It's evident that the kid is talented, but I feel like this is a situation where we need to part ways with.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

This is true, but for me this was the season that Zadina should be demonstrating his potential and value to the team. A full season, with training camp, and with guys like Seider and Raymond helping bear some of the offensive and defensive burden gives Zadina zero excuses. If he cannot get it going this season, I am very concerned about what his actual ceiling is.

That's it. Not every young player comes hot onto the scene like Seider and Raymond but they show flashes of their true potential. We saw that with Bert, we saw that with Mantha, Hronek and other guys that became good but not stars.

We're not seeing these flashes from Zadina. He's not getting real quality scoring opportunities. He's not just snakebitten. He's been bad.

 

[raymond23]

I don't really see the talent level... his best attribute is his compete level but everything else about his game is incredibly average

I really feel for the kid and want him to succeed so bad, you definitely can't blame him for lack of trying

 

[Dotter]

Zadina has been very disappointing so far, to be sure. While his play and body language don't indicate much at this point, my only hope is to tell myself that at 22yo Nyquist had just finished 3 years at Maine and was starting a full season in GR, and Tatar was starting his 4th season in GR.

If someone takes a time machine to tell us that Zadina might turn out to be a Nyquist or Tatar level of player, I don't think many would be happy with him as 6th OA pick.

I remember wanting Dobson before Zadina fell to us. And looks like Wahlstrom is turning out to be pretty good also, though he wasn't as big on my radar at the time.

Hindsight isn't fair, though. I can not and will not fault Ken Holland for snagging Zadina based on what we knew at the time.

 

[GMR]

What about trying him on the top line until Bertuzzi comes back? If he can't play with Larkin or Raymond, he won't score on the second line either. If anything, it may increase his productivity and his confidence.

 

[Barry Amsterdam]

What about trying him on the top line until Bertuzzi comes back? If he can't play with Larkin or Raymond, he won't score on the second line either. If anything, it may increase his productivity and his confidence.

Z-Larkin-Ray looked good in preseason

 

[TheOctopusKid]

I mean this is the same issue I have with Rasmussen. They are fine hockey players but when you look at their comparative prices and the roles/opportunities given to them based upon their draft price - they both fall short and we keep making excuses for them by sliding down our expectations.

We are now at the point of starting at Herculean, Monster Joe Thornton 2.0 with Ras to - Maybe he could be a good 4C in a Shutdown Role? (except he's not particularly physical, easy to knock of the puck, etc.)

And Zadina is now: He's young and tries really hard and you can see all his skill in entirely non-quantifiable ways.

When we drafted him, he was a falling - maybe he was falling for a reason. He was supposed to be a shoot first, ask questions later, all fire and attitude 1st Line Winger. I was expecting Patrick Sharp - Alex Semin - slick wristers and snapshots, fist pumps and flash. We've seen none of that.

And I get that we want it to work, but it's okay to accept that it's not working out and move on.

 

[ricky0034]

fun fact: Zadina only has 5 points less in his first 113 NHL games than Tatar did, 11 less than Larkin, 12 less than Bertuzzi