Online Series: Arrested Development Season 5 has DROPPED!

Shareefruck

Registered User
Apr 2, 2005
28,875
3,570
Vancouver, BC
Season 5 is a victim of the standard this show has set. Calling the season bad is a very relative assessment. Season 5 is more entertaining than 99% of any season of any comedy show in the history of the medium. That's how good the original run is (S1-3). Judging this show against itself doesn't seem fair. It's the Gretzky phenomenon.
I don't think this season is aggressively unwatchable or anything, but this type of assumption has always been a major pet peeve of mine that annoys the crap out of me. Everything with a name attached to it that falls off the rails is apparently better than 99% of television. This, Season 5 of Game of Thrones, Season 4 of Community, even the 15+ seasons of terrible new Simpsons episodes gets defended this way.

It's only true if you're counting entire genres that are expected to be terrible by default, like reality TV, soap operas, throw-away sitcoms on networks that don't matter, etc. If that's the barometer, saying that something is better than 99% of everything isn't very meaningful at all. It's not like the latest season is superior to its comparable peers or anything and it's just being judged on a completely different scale or something.

On top of that, you're just baselessly assuming easy-to-dismiss bias entirely because you disagree with something. You can easily do that with anything. It's honestly not any less likely to assume that people are instead going too easy on the season and not viewing it critically enough because they WANT to like the show due to all of the good-will that the good seasons have earned it, and that nobody would even bother spending time on it/acknowledging it/looking for positives to point out, if it were hypothetically a new show named something else.

Assuming bias in either direction gets nobody anywhere. Just disagree with the criticism and leave it at that.
 
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Jussi

Registered User
Feb 28, 2002
91,022
10,992
Mojo Dojo Casa House
I don't think this season is aggressively unwatchable or anything, but this type of assumption has always been a major pet peeve of mine that annoys the crap out of me. Everything with a name attached to it that falls off the rails is apparently better than 99% of television. This, Season 5 of Game of Thrones, Season 4 of Community, even the 15+ seasons of terrible new Simpsons episodes gets defended this way.

It's only true if you're counting entire genres that are expected to be terrible by default, like reality TV, soap operas, throw-away sitcoms on networks that don't matter, etc. If that's the barometer, saying that something is better than 99% of everything isn't very meaningful at all. It's not like the latest season is superior to its comparable peers or anything and it's just being judged on a completely different scale or something.

On top of that, you're just baselessly assuming easy-to-dismiss bias entirely because you disagree with something. You can easily do that with anything. It's honestly not any less likely to assume that people are instead going too easy on the season and not viewing it critically enough because they WANT to like the show due to all of the good-will that the good seasons have earned it, and that nobody would even bother spending time on it/acknowledging it/looking for positives to point out, if it were hypothetically a new show named something else.

Assuming bias in either direction gets nobody anywhere. Just disagree with the criticism and leave it at that.

You do know what site you're on? :laugh:
 

The Macho King

Back* to Back** World Champion
Jun 22, 2011
48,610
28,847
I don't buy the "victim of its own success" angle one bit. The fact that it may be more enjoyable than the Big Bang Theory or whatever other sitcom trash doesn't excuse its staleness.
 

Shareefruck

Registered User
Apr 2, 2005
28,875
3,570
Vancouver, BC
You do know what site you're on? :laugh:
Don't get me wrong, I think that criticism should be argued against and dismantled based on how unreasonable it is, I just don't think there's any reason to assign faulty made up motivations that explain why the other person's opinion might be compromised.
 
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Nalens Oga

Registered User
Jan 5, 2010
16,780
1,053
Canada
I quite liked the 4th season and won't bother with the remix. But this is amazing news, The Good Place is the only sitcom I'm really enjoying these days since all the good ones ended and B99, The Middle, BBT, etc are all past their peaks and The Good Place + Always Sunny are on break.

I really needed a sitcom.
 

Big McLargehuge

Fragile Traveler
May 9, 2002
72,188
7,741
S. Pasadena, CA
I finally finished it last night and I was quite happy with it. Obviously it's not on the same level as seasons 1-3, but I think it's somewhere between that and season 4, which I still think was damn fine, even if jarring.
 

Nalens Oga

Registered User
Jan 5, 2010
16,780
1,053
Canada
3 episodes in, not really that good, season 4 was better for me. I think the characters on this have been pretty much played out and it's all repetition at this point.
 

Nalens Oga

Registered User
Jan 5, 2010
16,780
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Canada
I've realized that part of the problem with this season is that it's so friggin difficult to follow. So much time has elapsed since season 4 but asides from that, it's hard to get some jokes when the references are obscure and I'm not talking about hidden jokes. Just causes a very poor flow and I'm having trouble staying focused throughout.
 

Nalens Oga

Registered User
Jan 5, 2010
16,780
1,053
Canada
I'm on episode 7 and I dunno what the f*** they're talking about half the time now, it's gotten very confusing. And repetitive.
 

Prairie Oyster

Registered User
Feb 24, 2015
63
125
The actress that plays Maebe was the star of the first 8 episodes. It felt like she actually cared whereas some mailed it in nearly the entire time.
 

Spring in Fialta

A malign star kept him
Apr 1, 2007
25,087
14,270
Montreal, QC
On my first run of this show. It's cute and amusing but I'm starting to find a big pet peeve when it comes to a lot comedy shows - pick a direction and go with it. It always rubs me the wrong way when you see characters and premises be based almost entirely on the mean-spiritedness and self-absorbtion of various characters only to consistently have them live what are supposed to be heartening and overtly kitschy moments with one another. I mean, it's like they shoe-horn them in to remind you that hey, we understand you still gotta have something to root for! I find it grating. Still a fun watch with some imaginative set-ups.
 

ucanthanzalthetruth

#CatsAreCooked
Jul 13, 2013
27,069
28,843
Oh man the rest of season 5 just dropped and it's a disaster, this show needs to end (who thought anyone would say that 12 years ago)
 

DCDM

Da Rink Cats
Mar 24, 2008
38,094
6,426
Calgary
Oh man the rest of season 5 just dropped and it's a disaster, this show needs to end (who thought anyone would say that 12 years ago)
This was my biggest fear. I'm finding it very hard to be motivated to watch the end when the first half of S5 was straight up forgettable.
 

RayP

Tf
Jan 12, 2011
94,110
17,878
After watching season 4 I just made the decision to believe the show ended after 3 and be happy.

Same. I watched S4 when it came out and hadn't watched 1-3 anytime recent. I thought S4 at the time was ok. Then a year or two later did a rewatch starting from S1 and when I got to S4 realized just how bad the drop off was and quit watching it just a few episodes in because it was that bad. I never bothered with S5.
 

Shareefruck

Registered User
Apr 2, 2005
28,875
3,570
Vancouver, BC
On my first run of this show. It's cute and amusing but I'm starting to find a big pet peeve when it comes to a lot comedy shows - pick a direction and go with it. It always rubs me the wrong way when you see characters and premises be based almost entirely on the mean-spiritedness and self-absorbtion of various characters only to consistently have them live what are supposed to be heartening and overtly kitschy moments with one another. I mean, it's like they shoe-horn them in to remind you that hey, we understand you still gotta have something to root for! I find it grating. Still a fun watch with some imaginative set-ups.
I don't think it's a completely untouchable show, but I would strongly disagree with these specific criticisms. The overly kitschy moments are meant to be a PART of the self-absorption, and those moments are egregiously exaggerated and laid on extra thick in order to make fun of itself/its characters and other shows that do that, not to have its cake and eat it too, IMO.

It's mostly done in an intentionally half-***ed, tongue-in-cheek "this is all part of the obnoxious degenerate front they all put up for various reasons" way. As the series progresses, you start to realize how disingenuous and deceptively self-righteous/holier than thou Michael's whole "I care about everyone" act is (which is why those kitschy moments exist in the first place), and how most of that stuff is complete bull-**** to feed his own ego. He's probably the worst of all of them in reality, and I'm pretty sure it's by design. When it comes to characters like George/GOB, their willingness to embrace those cheesy moments so easily despite being willing to completely **** others over for their own self interest is just added lack of self awareness and inability to hold themselves responsible for anything they do that I think is played for tragic humor, not actual heart-felt sentimentality. When it comes to Lucille, those moments are not-so-subtle-y deliberate manipulative deception, and when it comes to Lindsay, those moments are probably subconsciously manipulative deception that everyone is aware of except herself. The fact that those heartfelt cheesy moments are probably only received with totally genuine sincerity from George Michael, who kind of tragically totally buys it (and from Maeybe, who totally doesn't buy it and usually sees right through everything) is part of the humor.

In fact, thinking about it, in typical Arrested Development fashion, the dynamics of all of that seems almost too cleverly conceived. From how those moments show a self-sustaining pattern of family members taking advantage of one another's weak-points, right down to how each of their motivations make structurally perfect sense when you think about the parent/child dynamics that created them (GOB is the unfortunate product of George's behavior while being scrutinized by Lucille, Lindsay is the unfortunate product of Lucille's behavior while being coddled by George, Michael's like the most dangerous combination of the two, George-Michael is the product of Michael's persuasive deception, and Maeybe's the product of Lindsay's unpersuasive deception. And those deceptively cheesy moments come from those ****ed up dynamics which ultimately keeps the family together.

My only real criticism of Arrested Development is that while it's creatively exhilarating how clever yet ridiculous its mechanics can be, sometimes I do feel that its cleverness can risk the danger of feeling a bit like glorified pun-y dad-jokes that can feel grating when they don't fully land. I mean.. a lot of the show's humor revolves around puns and word-play-- that's pretty hard to consistently pull off without feeling lame.
 
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