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Porter Stoutheart

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You wont have fans in the stands if the season starts in September. I think that's why this idea appeals to the league so much. They will recoup some of this years revenue via TV money and then be able to resume revenue from ticket sales with a delayed 2021 season.
I wonder how sure they are of that. I mean, we are "just" 2 months into things now, and everybody is already in a rush to re-open. The consequences of doing so are still TBD. But it is still 4 more months until the exhibition season would normally start in September. 4 more months is a looooong time relative to what has gone on so far.

Governments are pushing the other leagues to go back... they probably care less about hockey, and maybe hockey just has some more progressive leadership than others, I don't know. Maybe they are already firmly committed to not having fans in the stands until December, no matter what. I guess I'd be astonished if that was the case. I'd applaud their caution and sensibility. But still be astonished, in the current climate. :dunno:
 

Predsanddead24

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Mar 7, 2019
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My guess is that it's simply hedging their bets against a disruption for next season. I guess the question is even with fans in stands for all of next season regardless of the start it may be possible they would make more money from the 24 team tournament plus a shortened next season versus a full season. I also wonder if its just needing this cash desperately for a lot of teams to stay afloat. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but signing bonuses will still pay out regardless of what happens right? So for us we have almost $18 mil in signing bonuses to pay out. If we don't get the revenue from some sort of tournament we may be in a rough spot to pay those out and I imagine many other teams have similar situations.
 

Porter Stoutheart

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My guess is that it's simply hedging their bets against a disruption for next season. I guess the question is even with fans in stands for all of next season regardless of the start it may be possible they would make more money from the 24 team tournament plus a shortened next season versus a full season. I also wonder if its just needing this cash desperately for a lot of teams to stay afloat. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but signing bonuses will still pay out regardless of what happens right? So for us we have almost $18 mil in signing bonuses to pay out. If we don't get the revenue from some sort of tournament we may be in a rough spot to pay those out and I imagine many other teams have similar situations.
This may very well be the case. Although that said, I guess I'd also wonder how these businesses get away with having no contingency or reserve like that, as with a lot of other businesses out there, big and small. If these millionaires and billionaires actually can't ride out a few months of lost revenue and are in danger of sinking, then it's certainly something they ought to think about addressing in terms of how they operate going forward. Planning for disruptions should be a part of the annual budget. Could be an epidemic, or floods/hurricanes/civil unrest/who knows... but cutting margins so close that you need every penny you forecasted coming in every day or you go belly up... that shouldn't be a an acceptable business plan moving forward. Or anyway, if that's how you want to operate, you are going to be in the minority and nobody is going to have any sympathy for you the next time a disruption comes along.

If we can't pay out $18M... well, that's sad. Even if it's "sad but true", still sad. :(
 

Porter Stoutheart

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It sounds like this thing has passed the PA vote now.

A closer look at the NHL’s 24-team Return to Play proposal - TSN.ca

Frankly I think I'd rather be in the group that gets the play-in games instead of the bye. It's going to be a strange dynamic, but Arizona and then Vegas wouldn't be the worst possible outcome for us. Interesting notes about 17% of players being overseas right now, and about players demanding a 3-week training camp before starting this.
 

hockey diva

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Arizona has given us trouble, I am not confident we’d get past them. I just don’t want the blosers repeating or the pens winning.
 

Porter Stoutheart

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I have no idea what the odds-makers are going to do with this. If it's anything like the NHL pre-season, the whole first round play-in is going to be a parade of groin injuries. And who knows what the second round will look like. Some teams will find new grooves that they never hit in the regular season, some teams won't be able to get their mojo back in time before they are eliminated. It's going to be totally unpredictable.

In which case... well, I like this better for us overall than where we were before. Because before, even with some mildly positive signs near the end, it was reasonably predictable that we weren't going anywhere. Now it's a magical mystery tour.

What they really need to do for the 7 non-playoff teams now is change the draft lottery so that only those 7 teams are in it.
 

adsfan

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Arizona has given us trouble, I am not confident we’d get past them. I just don’t want the blosers repeating or the pens winning.

That is true. It is also motivation. I can see the Preds winning 4-2 or 3-1 against the 11th seed Coyotes.

Playing in Las Vegas won't make much difference if the arena is empty. Maybe the games will be in St Paul? That would be neutral.
 

adsfan

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I have no idea what the odds-makers are going to do with this. If it's anything like the NHL pre-season, the whole first round play-in is going to be a parade of groin injuries. And who knows what the second round will look like. Some teams will find new grooves that they never hit in the regular season, some teams won't be able to get their mojo back in time before they are eliminated. It's going to be totally unpredictable.

In which case... well, I like this better for us overall than where we were before. Because before, even with some mildly positive signs near the end, it was reasonably predictable that we weren't going anywhere. Now it's a magical mystery tour.

What they really need to do for the 7 non-playoff teams now is change the draft lottery so that only those 7 teams are in it.

That gives the Preds a better chance because they have the best AHL team to help them. You had better believe that the Admirals players would want a shot at playing for the Stanley Cup after not getting the chance to play for the Calder Cup, which they were likely to win.
 

Super Cake

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Jun 24, 2013
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It sounds like this thing has passed the PA vote now.

A closer look at the NHL’s 24-team Return to Play proposal - TSN.ca

Frankly I think I'd rather be in the group that gets the play-in games instead of the bye. It's going to be a strange dynamic, but Arizona and then Vegas wouldn't be the worst possible outcome for us. Interesting notes about 17% of players being overseas right now, and about players demanding a 3-week training camp before starting this.

Possibly Vegas. The top 4 seeds will be playing a round robin for re-seeding purposes.
 

Porter Stoutheart

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I wonder if this kind of 24-team playoff might almost serve as a dry-run for future "normal" years... it seems like something that could be a bit of a money-maker when things get back to normal too.

People will complain about anything, really, but amongst those complaints, having just 16 teams out of 31 (soon to be 32) in the playoffs has been a complaint, and no-reward-for-finishing-at-the-top-of-the-standings has been a complaint. So if you went permanently to the 24-team format, then you've got 24 of 32 teams playing, you've got the top 8 rewarded with a week off to recharge and heal up while the other 16 teams have to play. I mean, do away with the top-4 round robin in this version, of course. And there has also been the complaint that "what if one division is just waaaay stronger than the other and the 6th place team in one is actually better than the 3rd place team in another and has to miss the playoffs." They could solve all those complaints doing the playoffs like this every year to pull in a little extra revenue at no real cost to anything. :dunno:
 

Porter Stoutheart

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Yuck. Why have an 82 game regular season just to eliminate 8 teams? Teams and players get complacent midseason as it is.
Answer: $$$

Although a second order answer is probably: parity. There's really hardly any difference between the teams that finish 14th and 20th these days. Of course you can draw that line just about anywhere. Hardly any difference between 24th and 25th either. The extra 8 teams get eliminated in a week anyway. I dunno, just if this tourney is successful this season and owners see any potential $$$ they can find other reasons to rationalize it all, I'm sure.
 

Scoresberg

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Answer: $$$

Although a second order answer is probably: parity. There's really hardly any difference between the teams that finish 14th and 20th these days. Of course you can draw that line just about anywhere. Hardly any difference between 24th and 25th either. The extra 8 teams get eliminated in a week anyway. I dunno, just if this tourney is successful this season and owners see any potential $$$ they can find other reasons to rationalize it all, I'm sure.

Not a fan of the idea, there's a system like that in the Finnish League, where just about any team gets into the playoffs. Of course, the parity isn't as high and the top teams usually handle the first round with a relative ease. But the system has led to a fall in attendance numbers in the regular season because the top teams and the mid-tier teams essentially play meaningless for almost two last months of the season.

I like the idea in that the top teams in the regular season should get more advantage in the playoffs as they do now. But part of that makes the NHL playoffs so great and doesn't really allow complacency to settle in for the top teams. I do get your point and agree the money is a reason they could go for it.. Ultimately, they could lose some of the revenue from the regular season games and gain some back in the expanded playoffs but I don't know what kind of an upside there is.
 

Porter Stoutheart

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Not a fan of the idea, there's a system like that in the Finnish League, where just about any team gets into the playoffs. Of course, the parity isn't as high and the top teams usually handle the first round with a relative ease. But the system has led to a fall in attendance numbers in the regular season because the top teams and the mid-tier teams essentially play meaningless for almost two last months of the season.

I like the idea in that the top teams in the regular season should get more advantage in the playoffs as they do now. But part of that makes the NHL playoffs so great and doesn't really allow complacency to settle in for the top teams. I do get your point and agree the money is a reason they could go for it.. Ultimately, they could lose some of the revenue from the regular season games and gain some back in the expanded playoffs but I don't know what kind of an upside there is.
Well maybe if next season starts in December, and they are already going to be losing regular season money for a little while no matter what, it might at least get a longer look than just this summer.

Not saying I'm a fan of the idea at all, either, btw. Just speculating.
 
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hockey diva

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I am concerned about how they are going to mute the players. There are some pretty vulgar things that get said. And if someone uses a “trigger” word, it could get ugly.
 

Porter Stoutheart

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I am concerned about how they are going to mute the players. There are some pretty vulgar things that get said. And if someone uses a “trigger” word, it could get ugly.
2 mins for unsportsmanlike conduct. And that becomes the new bete noir of the 2020 NHL playoffs, for sure. :)

Actually they would probably get pretty darn good ratings with a completely mic'ed up and uncensored game. If a network would show it that way. But why not these days? HBO or whoever isn't censoring anything. Kids... well... right... but... I don't know, start the games at 8pm and no kids who are too young should be up through those games anyway, right? :oops:
 

Porter Stoutheart

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I wonder if we have any players who are candidates to not return for this summer tournament?

I'm thinking, more veteran family men, perhaps especially if they are home overseas? Say a Granlund heading to UFA, or maybe an Ekholm, or Holzer? Yannick Weber might have his hands full with the PA duties this summer handling all this. But if somebody doesn't have much term or the $$$ don't matter that much to them, just reading the comments from elsewhere like Gudas or Eller, could some players actually choose to take a pass on these playoffs? :dunno:
 

PredsV82

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I'm guessing that getting paid more of their salary for this year is contingent upon playing. Plus I'm guessing it doesnt send a good message to a team you want to pay you millions for many years that you would bail in a situation like this
 

Porter Stoutheart

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I'm guessing that getting paid more of their salary for this year is contingent upon playing. Plus I'm guessing it doesnt send a good message to a team you want to pay you millions for many years that you would bail in a situation like this
Yeah, I don't say it would be a simple matter at all. A player who decides this is at minimum going to get suspended, or may have his contract terminated entirely and lose out on his future earnings. And they may carry more or less of a black mark against their name for a while, from fellow players or from NHL GMs. But still. If the league really is going to lock the players down for 2 months with no family, this isn't really what they signed up for.

Like Eller, if his wife is due to give birth during that time, is he going to choose to stay isolated in a hotel in Vegas for 2 months while all that goes on, or is he going to say screw that, I'm staying home to be with my family? A lot of different variables in play, but if I had millions in the bank and felt I'd have no trouble gaining employment down the road if they terminated my contract, I'd probably stay with my family if that's what my wife wished. Maybe he's not the best example if he lives near DC now, but amongst the 17% of players overseas, is there somebody else in that boat? Or somebody who simply doesn't want to come back into the pandemic chaos in the USA for whatever reason?

There are limits to what the NHL can really do to force players to play. I would not criticize any player who chose to stay home. Apparently there was some contention along those lines during the PA vote. I don't think this is a situation where a voting majority can really dictate what any individual chooses to do, however. There's going to be plenty of players eager to play and no team will have any trouble icing a lineup. But if there are 1 or 2 individuals who aren't onboard, if I was team owner/GM, I would just respect their wishes to stay home and sit this one out.
 

jumb0

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Feb 3, 2017
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I am concerned about how they are going to mute the players. There are some pretty vulgar things that get said. And if someone uses a “trigger” word, it could get ugly.


Add in crowd noise to the broadcast like the Bundesliga is doing. Or broadcast the games on a heavy delay so they can mute the audio when needed.
 

LCPreds

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But still. If the league really is going to lock the players down for 2 months with no family, this isn't really what they signed up for.

I can absolutely say as a fan that I would be fine with any player who decided to not participate if it requires a 2 month quarantine away from family. I'd be surprised if any of the veteran players with families would have an issue with it either.
 
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PredsV82

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players don't get paid in the playoffs. Bonuses yes, salary, no.

Two points. First, I'm guessing that paychecks stopped when play stopped. If that's the case then part of the agreement to resume play would likely be getting paid for the rest of the season. Second even if they arent getting paid, the revenue the league generates is tied to the escrow of the players salary and so if they dont come back for the playoffs and thus no TV revenue, the escrow for next year would be that much bigger
 
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