Around Hockey XXII (All Non-Jackets Hockey talk in here)

[DarkandStormy]

You can be predatory once, or consistently. In all of those hits the opposing player was vulnerable.

Not sure why you’re so upset? Just saying we have had players who sometimes ‘attempt to injure.’

Not upset, but your insinuation that the Jackets have employed multiple players as bad as Wilson is completely laughable.

 

[MoeBartoli]

This is shocking. The Rangers look like a rising team and a fun team to watch. It makes no sense.

 

[Viqsi]

This is shocking. The Rangers look like a rising team and a fun team to watch. It makes no sense.

The impression I'm getting is that if you follow the NBA and specifically the Knicks, it makes all too much sense. I don't know this for myself as I'm not a fan of basketball, but apparently Dolan has a pretty well established reputation that comes into play here.

 

[rotsbu]

The impression I'm getting is that if you follow the NBA and specifically the Knicks, it makes all too much sense. I don't know this for myself as I'm not a fan of basketball, but apparently Dolan has a pretty well established reputation that comes into play here.

No tears forthcoming from me if the owner derails what is looking like a good thing cooking with the NYR. I've felt they are on the cusp of being really good, happening to coincide with Ovi + Caps and Crosby/Malkin + Pens windows closing

 

[Viqsi]

No tears forthcoming from me if the owner derails what is looking like a good thing cooking with the NYR. I've felt they are on the cusp of being really good, happening to coincide with Ovi + Caps and Crosby/Malkin + Pens windows closing

Oh, to be sure, I'm feeling the schadenfreude. I'm just keeping quiet about it because, well, having gone through a horror season, my empathy levels are up.

 

[rotsbu]

Oh, to be sure, I'm feeling the schadenfreude. I'm just keeping quiet about it because, well, having gone through a horror season, my empathy levels are up.

Indeed - I'm not going to actively cast stones, but if things go less well than most of us figured for the NYR fine by me!

Regarding those empathy levels, are you sure? I'm thinking about your responses to all the ridiculous Laine (and associated CBJ sucks, Torts sucks, etc.) posts on the trade forum...

 

[Viqsi]

Indeed - I'm not going to actively cast stones, but if things go less well than most of us figured for the NYR fine by me!

Regarding those empathy levels, are you sure? I'm thinking about your responses to all the ridiculous Laine (and associated CBJ sucks, Torts sucks, etc.) posts on the trade forum...

Empathy levels for folks getting screwed over by circumstances, not for dimwitted thickskulls who keep asking for it...

 

[EspenK]

Why does anyone want one of the brick by brick guys back? One story I read said Dolan (Rangers CEO) was tiring of that philosophy and wanted to see more immediate results. Rangers fire president John Davidson, GM Jeff Gorton in stunning shakeup

Maybe we could ship a 40 goal guy to them them for Lafreniere and Kakko.

 

[Viqsi]

Why does anyone want one of the brick by brick guys back? One story I read said Dolan (Rangers CEO) was tiring of that philosophy and wanted to see more immediate results. Rangers fire president John Davidson, GM Jeff Gorton in stunning shakeup

Maybe we could ship a 40 goal guy to them them for Lafreniere and Kakko.

Owner, not CEO.

And if James Dolan is your idea of an owner with reasonable expectations... y'know, I'm just going to stop there.

 

[Cowumbus]

Well I hate the Rangers but this is...

Makes sense now

 

[Cowumbus]

Not upset, but your insinuation that the Jackets have employed multiple players as bad as Wilson is completely laughable.

You seem to be the one assuming my comrade. I’m simply saying/showing we have have instances in the past and have had quite a few players who played with an edge.

Might not agree with them in the moment, but when they are teetering the line you love them. That’s how I feel about Wilson.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

Why does anyone want one of the brick by brick guys back? One story I read said Dolan (Rangers CEO) was tiring of that philosophy and wanted to see more immediate results. Rangers fire president John Davidson, GM Jeff Gorton in stunning shakeup

Maybe we could ship a 40 goal guy to them them for Lafreniere and Kakko.

Davidson is a snake oil salesman. He's always "long term". Which, of course, never arrives. As the overrated economist John Maynard Keynes used to say, "in the long run we are all dead".

CBJ been there, done that, got the JD Tshirt. One is enough for the collection.

 

[majormajor]

I agree.

Panarin jumped on Wilson to defend a teammate. But when you jump on someone's back, you should expect some serious payback. Panarin didn't get hurt-except superficially. Wilson could dismember a weakling like Panarin in two seconds if he wanted to.
.

You don't punch a player who is lying face-down on the ice. That's not classic tough guy stuff, it's just sickening and dangerous. You think Don Cherry would be loving that? This is not some namby-pamby vs classic hockey thing.

Do you think Tom Wilson so perfectly calibrated his takedown of Panarin so that Panarin's head would hit the ice but not cause a serious concussion? I think that was an inch or two away from being absolutely catastrophic. You can't let close calls like that go unaddressed.

I was angered when I saw the video of Wilson being Wilson and angrier when I heard the league gave him the equivalent of a parking ticket. I was so incensed, which is uncharacteristic of me.

How bad do I hate Tom Wilson? If he ever became a Jacket, I’d cease being a fan.

When they say "you wish you had him" I think that there is a risk I might fall into that trap, if he was on my team. We all have that tribalist nature. But I really don't want to be that person, like those Caps fans who debase themselves everytime Wilson crosses the line. I don't wish for that at all.

You seem to be the one assuming my comrade. I’m simply saying/showing we have have instances in the past and have had quite a few players who played with an edge.

Might not agree with them in the moment, but when they are teetering the line you love them. That’s how I feel about Wilson.

Punching someone who is face down on the ice doesn't inspire love for me. And neither by the way does Max inspire love when he sucker punches someone who has their gloves on. I love tough guys and fighting and nasty games, but you got to play with honor. I think I admire personal risk more than anything else. Attacking vulnerable players, fighting people who can't fight back, that's just bullying.

 

[EspenK]

Owner, not CEO.

And if James Dolan is your idea of an owner with reasonable expectations... y'know, I'm just going to stop there.

Why Rangers owner Jim Dolan fired John Davidson, Jeff Gorton

Please also inform Larry Brooks that he is not CEO but rather the owner. Also if you really want to get specific he's also the CEO & Chairman of Madison Square Garden as well as executive chairman and CEO of Madison Square Garden Sports and Madison Square Garden Entertainment and executive chairman of MSG Networks. Which one of those groups also owns the Knicks. Now you can at least have the correct info when you correct us dumb asses.And P.S.I know he owns all of those groups with the possible exception of the network.

And you are also a mind reader? Not a very good one at that. Where did I say that I thought Dolan was an owner (or CEO ) with reasonable expectations? He is not. In fact I think he seems like a guy who could actually make the Blue Jackets worse.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

How did the situation turn so ugly so quickly?

League executive: “Wilson turned around and didn’t really know who it was because Panarin jumped on his f***ing back. Like he should have stayed out of it or just sort of grabbed him. Tom Wilson would not have done that to Panarin, I think, if he didn’t jump on his back and there was a whole shitstorm going on. And I’m the last person to defend this guy. I really am.
“To be honest I’m watching it now as we’re talking and I’ll tell you what, it could have been a lot worse. He didn’t even drop his gloves. Yeah, you get caught up in that. Yeah, he f***ing threw him down. His helmet came off. Panarin should not have jumped on his f***ing back.
“If you don’t want to get involved in that stuff, that’s your decision. But don’t bring a knife to a gunfight. Don’t go at Tom Wilson and expect him to treat you with kid gloves because of who you are. He’s not going to, so don’t go in there.”

Former player: “When players engage, is Panarin allowed to do what he wants with Wilson, then Wilson is allowed to do what he wants with Panarin? There’s that. There’s a huge scrum and Panarin is overly active in it. I love that he got involved for his teammate.”

What was your initial reaction to the incident?

Longtime player turned NHL executive: “I didn’t think it was as bad as everyone said it was. I guess maybe because I waited to see it, I blew it up in my own mind. And what was in my mind was a lot worse.”
Former player: “I was going to time how long that entire incident took. You would swear that we had World War V. It’s one of those ‘blink of an eye’ things. And I saw all kinds of bullshit things (on social media).”
NHL team executive: “I’m really surprised on this one. I thought this was an opportunity for the league to make some sort of statement. They’re lucky that Panarin didn’t get seriously hurt there. When was the last suspension in the league? Was it Edler/Hyman, (Vancouver’s Alex Edler was suspended for two games for kneeing Toronto’s Zach Hyman) which happened during the course of the game, right? This didn’t even happen during the course of play. That’s an interesting one. That’s a challenge.”

'He’s going to hurt someone and the league knows it': Hockey experts weigh in on the Tom Wilson incident

 

[Byrral]

Sorry JD lost his job but someone should have known better and he's the President of Operations so he falls. I have no interest in his return. Jarmo may be on his way out if he doesn't turn the ship around so might as well wait and see.

 

[KCbus]

Davidson is a snake oil salesman. He's always "long term". Which, of course, never arrives. As the overrated economist John Maynard Keynes used to say, "in the long run we are all dead".

CBJ been there, done that, got the JD Tshirt. One is enough for the collection.

I wholly disagree with the "snake oil salesman" thing. I think JD is a well-respected hockey man who did really good things when he was here.

That said, he left. He left Columbus to take another job. I don't want to be his consolation prize. We've moved on.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

CBJ been there, done that, got the JD Tshirt. One is enough for the collection.

I am assuming it’s unbuttoned halfway down?

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

I wholly disagree with the "snake oil salesman" thing. I think JD is a well-respected hockey man who did really good things when he was here.

That said, he left. He left Columbus to take another job. I don't want to be his consolation prize. We've moved on.

Have we though?

We've gone downhill quite a bit since he left. Maybe there is a connection, maybe there isn't.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Saw a replay of the opening faceoff of the Rangers/Caps game tonight with 3 fights at puck drop. My only question is why wasn't there 5 or 6?

 

[Viqsi]

Saw a replay of the opening faceoff of the Rangers/Caps game tonight with 3 fights at puck drop. My only question is why wasn't there 5 or 6?

Because there's only so many people who can be on the ice at any given time.

 

[majormajor]

Saw a replay of the opening faceoff of the Rangers/Caps game tonight with 3 fights at puck drop. My only question is why wasn't there 5 or 6?

The players probably negotiated it and figured three was enough because they couldn't find someone who wanted to fight Chara.

In all seriousness, actually, there was a segment on Sportsnet in the Habs Oilers game about negotiated fights. They showed Josh Anderson challenge Chiasson in warm-up. Kassian said no, you can't fight him, you're mine. And Chiasson ended up having to fight another guy in his weight class.

Bieksa said this kind of negotiation is normal when players want retribution. They have to figure out who is the right matchup.

In today's game the Rangers had to save Brendan Smith for the Wilson fight. He's their only heavyweight. Otherwise maybe he fights Chara.

 

[Viqsi]

Where did I say that I thought Dolan was an owner (or CEO ) with reasonable expectations? He is not. In fact I think he seems like a guy who could actually make the Blue Jackets worse.

Fair enough, mea culpa.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Because there's only so many people who can be on the ice at any given time.

Well including the goalies there are 12.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

With Pavel Buchnevisch now getting a game misconduct for cross checking Mantha in the face, he should just write his fine check for double whatever the league makes it just so he can pre-pay for the middle finger he should give George Parros on the zoom call.