Speculation: Armchair GM Thread: I can't believe it's not butter, I can't believe we didn't get Ryan Hartman.

[Tkachuk Norris]

I honestly don’t think there has ever been a NCAA defencemen to put up a PPG in their first two years... He’s putting up historical numbers. Why would you trade Adam Fox for anything less than a top ten pick?

Edit: yeah the price for Hamilton would be painful for the other team. Makes no sense to break up Gio/Ham. I’m starting to think the best ting is to trade Stone and just see what this team is under a different coach. Maybe Brodie if you get a nice FWD back

 

[Ace Rimmer]

Why would you trade Adam Fox for anything less than a top ten pick?

To mitigate against the potential that he sees our defense corps and decides "I have a better shot playing regularly by going UFA"

 

[Lunatik]

Just for the heck of it, what is Hamilton's asking price? Honestly and Fairly?

The only way I see Hamilton going anywhere is for a legitimate 1st line winger and to put this bluntly, the Rangers don't really have anyone that fits that bill. So it would then turn into quantity for quality type deal and for the Flames to bite, the Rangers would have to overpay to make it worth our while.

I'd probably do one of those but both is destroying any future this team has. What about draft picks?

We are just trying to leave a rebuild, why would we trade Hamilton for picks?

 

[GregSirico]

The only way I see Hamilton going anywhere is for a legitimate 1st line winger and to put this bluntly, the Rangers don't really have anyone that fits that bill. So it would then turn into quantity for quality type deal and for the Flames to bite, the Rangers would have to overpay to make it worth our while.

We are just trying to leave a rebuild, why would we trade Hamilton for picks?

Only going by the article saying Calgary desperately wants back the draft because of their lack of draft picks.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Only going by the article saying Calgary desperately wants back the draft because of their lack of draft picks.

I don’t think it is nearly as desperate as some think.

We are still a young team. We still have a solid prospect pool from our rebuild years. Lots of guys like Andersson, Dube, Mangiapane, Foo, Valimaki, Fox that should make the jump soon and finally help our team depth.

 

[Lunatik]

Only going by the article saying Calgary desperately wants back the draft because of their lack of draft picks.

I don't recall "desperately" being used. IIRC that piece also claimed we have no 3rd round pick, which we currently do.

No GM is going to move arguably their most valuable trade piece just to get picks when they are trying to climb out of a rebuild.

 

[herashak]

Getting Mark Stone would be sweet. But a dman doesn’t NEED to get traded this off season.

 

[Lunatik]

Getting Mark Stone would be sweet. But a dman doesn’t NEED to get traded this off season.

excellent point, Andersson is the only defensemen that is NHL ready and we do currently have an open spot on the roster with Bart becoming a UFA. Technically all that is "needed" is a plan to distribute ice-time

 

[InfinityIggy]

I think it's too close too much of a coincidence that Frolik suddenly became bad after his injury to expect that that is simply what he is now. He has had a few really good years with us as a very effective winger in our biggest position of weakness, but because of a relatively short stretch of hockey after coming back from an injury where he was distinctly worse than normal, we want to fire him in the sun?

Frolik is able to help us win next year. If you're trading him, it has to satisfy that same goal.

Totally agree. I mean, you can simply look at the guys point totals over his career and see he is consistent as they come. I for one am definitely marking this as just an off year for him. I have a lot of confidence he will be back to his prior level of play next season.

 

[CamPopplestone]

I also think how aggressive Brad is going after a 1st is being blown out of proportion. All Friedman said is he would like to get a pick. Obviously he'd like to. Doesn't mean he will. Brad was probably doing his job at the GM meetings, and asking around gauging the cost of picks, Friedman heard about it, threw it out there.

Frolik will likely bounce back next year. I don't think he'll be as good as last season, but will be better than this one. I agree he's technically expendable, but we don't have much to easily replace him. Plus he's always in excellent physical condition. He's a good defensive player. And even though he's got a decent cap hit I don't think it hurts us. So I'd keep him in the bottom six to make that better, and in case of injuries, even if we get a top 6 RW

 

[viper0220]

If you have better ideas, shoot them. Otherwise my goal is to add to our forwards without disruption to the core. You also are making a vacuum assumption that young players like Gaudreau, Monahan, Tkachuk, Bennett, Janko, and to a lesser degree Ferland, will not be taking any steps forward. I mean yes, there is a risk that doesn't happen, but I'd say it's a greater risk to disrupt the quality talent we already have in place. I'm all for upgrading Bennett in a package if we get a quality top 6 winger that checks off all the boxes, but his value may not offer us that luxury at this point.

Tkachuk-Monahan-Gaudreau
Not that you were arguing this, but that is a serious top line imo.

Bennett-Backlund-(FA signing)
Imagine placing James Neal in that slot, Bennett has two quality line mates to run with and I imagine he can improve his offensive numbers quite a bit.

Ferland-Janko-Frolik
That is a massive upgrade to our current 3rd line plugs, Frolik is an ideal 3rd liner, same goes for Ferland. Janko should improve with another offseason of training.

XXX-XXX-XXX
We may be able to fill 1-2 of these internally, maybe Shore is a decent option as well. At the end of the day, I can't imagine it's too hard to upgrade on one of the league's most ineffective 4th lines.

Sum all that up and it leads to improvement. Bring in a quality coaching staff and I'm betting this forward group can help us make a decent run in the playoffs. Again, I believe our biggest issue is coaching, that alone will have a massive impact. In addition, make some upgrades to our forward group, and this team should be in much better shape. I'm still one of the fans that wants to be somewhat patient with our roster, try a new coach first. Unless you want to trade one of Gaudreau, Monohan, Tkachuk, Hamilton, or Gio, I'm not sure how you land a massive talent. Even then, subtract any of the players mentioned, does that equate to an upgrade? Who knows I guess. Maybe BT will take the deep dive into massive core changes and we come out of it in way better shape, I just don't see that as the best option.

I never made the assumption that Johnny, Monahan and Tkachuk were not going to take steps forward, of course they will. I was talking about Sam Bennett and to a lesser degree Mark Jankowski, I hope Bennett becomes a very good player but I would not put all my eggs in that basket. Mark Jankowski is a wildcard, he has had his ups and downs. Ferland I think is a 20 goal scorer(he also has had his ups and downs but with GG as the head coach, those downs with every player should be taken with a salt of grain.)

I have given ideas on how to improve the team and that is by getting another good young center instead of a winger(I do this because when Darryl Sutter was on the TSN trade deadline show, he said that on a Stanley Cup team, Backlund and Frolik are 3rd line players.)

In order to become a Stanley Cup Contender, changes need to be made to the core of this team because we should not be going into next season with question marks.

 

[The Gnome]

I never made the assumption that Johnny, Monahan and Tkachuk were not going to take steps forward, of course they will. I was talking about Sam Bennett and to a lesser degree Mark Jankowski, I hope Bennett becomes a very good player but I would not put all my eggs in that basket. Mark Jankowski is a wildcard, he has had his ups and downs. Ferland I think is a 20 goal scorer(he also has had his ups and downs but with GG as the head coach, those downs with every player should be taken with a salt of grain.)

I have given ideas on how to improve the team and that is by getting another good young center instead of a winger(I do this because when Darryl Sutter was on the TSN trade deadline show, he said that on a Stanley Cup team, Backlund and Frolik are 3rd line players.)

In order to become a Stanley Cup Contender, changes need to be made to the core of this team because we should not be going into next season with question marks.

I could be on board with a center upgrade to push Backlund or Monahan down...But the cost may be more than we can afford, unless we could pay in future defensive prospects. We have no picks to use as currency and out of our top players, who do you trade? Is it worth the risk of selling low on Bennett to see him become a top 6 center with another team? The theory holds validity, but getting it done without hurting our roster in other areas is going to be tough.

The dream would be dumping Stone and Brouwer while signing Tavares, but I see pretty much zero incentive for him to come here after the mess of a season we just had.

 

[viper0220]

I could be on board with a center upgrade to push Backlund or Monahan down...But the cost may be more than we can afford, unless we could pay in future defensive prospects. We have no picks to use as currency and out of our top players, who do you trade? Is it worth the risk of selling low on Bennett to see him become a top 6 center with another team? The theory holds validity, but getting it done without hurting our roster in other areas is going to be tough.

The dream would be dumping Stone and Brouwer while signing Tavares, but I see pretty much zero incentive for him to come here after the mess of a season we just had.

Agree with you, Centers are harder to get than wingers. Would people entertain the idea of trading Dougie Hamilton? If a desperate team like the Buffalo Sabres or Florida Panthers made a huge offer for Dougie Hamilton, you have to seriously look at it. Hopefully BT sees what is out there for Dougie Hamilton, you might get a offer that blow off your socks.

 

[DomBarr]

Agree with you, Centers are harder to get than wingers. Would people entertain the idea of trading Dougie Hamilton? If a desperate team like the Buffalo Sabres or Florida Panthers made a huge offer for Dougie Hamilton, you have to seriously look at it. Hopefully BT sees what is out there for Dougie Hamilton, you might get a offer that blow off your socks.

I would entertain trading anybody on this team if the return was the right. For some it would have to be a massive over-payment for most just fair value but there shouldn't be anyone considered untouchable (well maybe Tkachuk) on an underwhelming team.

 

[CamPopplestone]

Bleeding is losing a pick. We didn't "lose" a pick for Cammy, that isn't bleeding. Hunter Smith didn't pan out, and was a questionable pick, but was a pick nevertheless. So that isn't a bled pick either.

 

[lightstorm]

Bleeding is losing a pick. We didn't "lose" a pick for Cammy, that isn't bleeding. Hunter Smith didn't pan out, and was a questionable pick, but was a pick nevertheless. So that isn't a bled pick either.

I listed a bunch of Cammy's comparables who netted multiple picks, Burke got nothing for him. The H.Smith pick was a waste the second it was announced.

End result is the same, less picks = weaker prospect pool = weaker depth.

Even the Canucks board has had enough intellectual honesty to criticize Benning for failing to move Hamhuis and throwing in valuable picks in a bunch of meh trades (Gudbranson, Kassian, Sutter, Vey etc)

 

[JPeeper]

I get more triggered when I see Flames fans offering Dougie trade offers than I do when I see Bennett trade proposals.

Why would the Flames trade a 24/25 year old #2 defenseman with #1 potential, who is top 5 offensive d-man in the league for anything. Like what is the point of trading Hamilton for Nylander or Marner (for example cause I see it a lot from Flames fans). Those guys will put up maybe 10-15 more points than Dougie will, yet they are top line forwards. It's ridiculous how underrated Dougie is by pretty much everyone.

Just because some f***nuckle media reporter thinks it might happen doesn't mean this organization isn't high on him. The media knows absolute f*** all when it comes to the Flames.

Unless you're offered Eichel, Barkov, MacKinnon (which obviously will never happen) or other top 10 players in the league, Dougie shouldn't be traded. Thinking Dougie for Marner is a good deal is asinine.

 

[Rangediddy]

I'd be open to trading Gio. Do what we should have done with Iginla and trade him while he has value. He'd return more than Brodie and any team serious about contending would be smart to add him. I just don't know what teams could trade a meaningful player for him.

 

[DomBarr]

I listed a bunch of Cammy's comparables who netted multiple picks, Burke got nothing for him. The H.Smith pick was a waste the second it was announced.

End result is the same, less picks = weaker prospect pool = weaker depth.

Even the Canucks board has had enough intellectual honesty to criticize Benning for failing to move Hamhuis and throwing in valuable picks in a bunch of meh trades (Gudbranson, Kassian, Sutter, Vey etc)

I have no problem with a management team that sets a market price and sticks to it. It is a strategy that works out sometimes. I am not sure the Flames would be any different if they had received a 3rd for him in the 2014 draft.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

I get more triggered when I see Flames fans offering Dougie trade offers than I do when I see Bennett trade proposals.

Why would the Flames trade a 24/25 year old #2 defenseman with #1 potential, who is top 5 offensive d-man in the league for anything. Like what is the point of trading Hamilton for Nylander or Marner (for example cause I see it a lot from Flames fans). Those guys will put up maybe 10-15 more points than Dougie will, yet they are top line forwards. It's ridiculous how underrated Dougie is by pretty much everyone.

Just because some ****nuckle media reporter thinks it might happen doesn't mean this organization isn't high on him. The media knows absolute **** all when it comes to the Flames.

Unless you're offered Eichel, Barkov, MacKinnon (which obviously will never happen) or other top 10 players in the league, Dougie shouldn't be traded. Thinking Dougie for Marner is a good deal is asinine.

Because we think that we have high end D prospects to fill the gaps. I don’t think we have that up front. Dube will be good. And Foo and Mangiapane show some promise. But we could clearly use another scorer imo. A Marner would help a guy like Tkachuk. I think that duo with Backlund at C would be ridiculous.

Look at Nashville. They traded Jones for Johansen. Even though they clearly lost that trade it made them even better because they needed a FWD big time and had the D to fill in.

Also, they are under team control longer.

 

[Bounces R Way]

The guy leads the league in goals from the blue line. 24 years old. Why trade him unless for the moon??

"Skates like a deer." -Brian Burke

Brodie needs to remember who he is and skate like that. Lead a rush maybe. Try to beat people every once and a while. For the Flames I think you add one more 30G scorer if you can and you try to do it initially through FA. As much as a whiff Brouwer was, I think that's how you should be doing it.

Thought for a second it was going to be Michael Ferland this year, sadly not even close. Closer than it came to me thinking it was going to be Sam Bennett. Those two need Matthew Tkachuk. Or worse comes to worse Backlund takes care of them. Somebody who engages in the game.

Kovalchuk or Tavares would be gravy, although there's some other guys around the league I could see them wanting at maybe a little less term. Don't really care who it is as long as they score goals. Maybe you find him in Ottawa, kind of seems like a year they might be seeing a lot of turnover.
Plugs like Glass, Stewart, Bartkowski, they add nothing. These roster spots should be given to promising young players that can score. Travelling with the team, preparing with the team. Look at what Boston, Tampa, Washington, and Winnipeg are doing. Pittsburgh for ages. Scoring through the lineup.

This franchise is perpetually stuck in the past. That kind of nosedive was actually pretty spectacular, the kind of gut punch that maybe you stay down for a second. I hope on the list of people to call this summer Treliving has is the owners. Tell them they need to break ground on a new rink as soon as possible.

 

[Iggys Dome]

If we trade Dougie without getting a monumental return we deserve to be stuck in mediocrity like we have been for 30 years. Elite skater, elite offensive talent, big body, RHD, not the best defensively but that can be worked on with a better coaching staff.

edit: Has there been any speculation by reputable sources that we're trading Dougie, or is just fans playing armchair GM?

 

[DFF]

I have no problem with a management team that sets a market price and sticks to it. It is a strategy that works out sometimes. I am not sure the Flames would be any different if they had received a 3rd for him in the 2014 draft.

What if that 3rd was Brayden Point? but you are probably right, Tod Button is a incompetent moron. The pick would have been useless anyway.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

I would do Hamilton for Svechnikov.

Gaudreau-Monahan-Svechnikov
Tkachuk-Backlund-Foo
Bennett-Janko-Ferland
Mangiapane-Shore-Frolik
Brouwer(popcorn)- Hathaway

Giordano-Brodie
Kulak-Hamonic
Valimaki-Andersson
Wotherspoon

Smith
UFA/Rittich/other young goalie with upside

Eventually I’d want Valimaki-Andersson to take tougher matchups.

 

[Mr Snrub]

The guy leads the league in goals from the blue line. 24 years old. Why trade him unless for the moon??

"Skates like a deer." -Brian Burke

Brodie needs to remember who he is and skate like that. Lead a rush maybe. Try to beat people every once and a while. For the Flames I think you add one more 30G scorer if you can and you try to do it initially through FA. As much as a whiff Brouwer was, I think that's how you should be doing it.

Thought for a second it was going to be Michael Ferland this year, sadly not even close. Closer than it came to me thinking it was going to be Sam Bennett. Those two need Matthew Tkachuk. Or worse comes to worse Backlund takes care of them. Somebody who engages in the game.

Kovalchuk or Tavares would be gravy, although there's some other guys around the league I could see them wanting at maybe a little less term. Don't really care who it is as long as they score goals. Maybe you find him in Ottawa, kind of seems like a year they might be seeing a lot of turnover.
Plugs like Glass, Stewart, Bartkowski, they add nothing. These roster spots should be given to promising young players that can score. Travelling with the team, preparing with the team. Look at what Boston, Tampa, Washington, and Winnipeg are doing. Pittsburgh for ages. Scoring through the lineup.

This franchise is perpetually stuck in the past. That kind of nosedive was actually pretty spectacular, the kind of gut punch that maybe you stay down for a second. I hope on the list of people to call this summer Treliving has is the owners. Tell them they need to break ground on a new rink as soon as possible.

I agree with the vast, vast majority of your post but I've seen a lot of posters mention how much they want Kovalchuk and I'm not sure he's the solution/how good of a hockey player he still is. He's leading the KHL in points but Nigel Dawes is third and Linden Vey is fifth. Kovy's also 35 in a week. It's entirely possible he comes over and is a bottom-sixer.