Are the lightning a superteam?

[Ducati Boy]

Why would the money be divided evenly among the entire roster? The situation is more akin to giving the Islanders Patrick Kane or an equivalent caliber player at the start of playoffs, which would certainly make them better.

If this was analogous to Tampa's situation, true. But it's not and that's the point. Tampa didn't add a star player from another organization with the money. They kept the same roster that they had before.

You could divide the extra 9.5 million among the current Isles any way you wish but assuming that a raise of that sort would somehow magically make the Isles 'better' doesn't work. Like with Tampa, it would be with the same players, just with some earning a bit more than they did before.

 

[RorschachWJK]

This must be a rhetorical question. That team is WELL beyond the cap, WELL beyond.

 

[DrDangles]

When I think of superteams I think of big free agent signings or trading for all-stars to build on top of an already stacked roster. Tampa's core is basically all home grown, I guess they're similar to Golden State before they got KD.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Superteam with 100million cap can't even beat the Islanders smh

 

[FlameChampion]

For me when I think of Superteam, I think Basketball ... where players decide upon themselves that they want to join each other and create a superteam.

For the lightning, they have basically drafted and developed most of their key players. They are obviously a great team but give that organization some credit, they have created a powerhouse.

 

[Tyrus]

If this was analogous to Tampa's situation, true. But it's not and that's the point. Tampa didn't add a star player from another organization with the money. They kept the same roster that they had before.

You could divide the extra 9.5 million among the current Isles any way you wish but assuming that a raise of that sort would somehow magically make the Isles 'better' doesn't work. Like with Tampa, it would be with the same players, just with some earning a bit more than they did before.

That's got to be you being thick on purpose, I can't possibly understand otherwise.

You act as if the Lightning's team wouldn't be different had they not have timely cap space appear out of nowhere to offer raises to their players while retaining their entire roster. You speak as if those players would all still be here but simply playing for less money. That's not what happens, that's the point of the cap. Better players end up having to walk away because your team needs to fit under it. It doesn't matter if said players are already on your team when their market values make them too expensive to retain within the cap, for cap compliant teams they're gone regardless.

I do think the Lightning have highlighted a loophole in the current cap system rules that needs to be addressed. It's not the first time it's been done, obviously, but it's probably the most blatant usage of cap circumvention in a long while and I do expect changes to be made.

 

[Krewe]

It does not account for the retention. So subtract $2.125 M and it's 89.94 total

Savard is 75% retained so more like 89M flat

 

[TropicOfNoReturn]

Technically not,
When players are signing team-friendly contracts that are less than their market value due to the fact that specific state having a significantly less tax bracket compared to others and Canada.

Therefore icing a better team.

Oh I'm well aware of how it works, but state/provincial taxes are not the NHL or the NHLPA's concern. It is a potential nice bonus for certain teams, but it totally unrealistic and honestly ludicrous to say the NHL should factor them into their salary cap and punish certain teams for something they have no control over. Just because of they have lower to no taxes does not mean that a plethora of players are signing there for cheaper than they would elsewhere. I think it happens quite rarely, honestly. How many instances of it can you name?

 

[CupsOverCash]

Not a "super team" just consistently good and consistently a contender. They've been to 6 semi finals in 10 years. If we get back to the finals it will be 3 finals in 10 years. Pretty damn good. It's hard to win the cup but at least have done it once. If they do it this year I'm sure many will want to discredit it with the over the cap stuff but it's not like they are good because of that.

They're good because of their core and have great goaltending. All that is locked up long term. They have depth but they also draft well so when a player goes down or leaves they have another there to take his spot. They're versatile in how they play the game and can win in any style.

I think their problems have been closing out series late in playoffs and an eye will be on them whether they can close this next one out as they're favored but islanders are proving to be a good team too. Also just because you have a good team, doesn't mean you will dominate in playoffs.

Completely different game and lightning have learned this the hard way when they got swept by Columbus. Learned they need to be versatile in how they play. Now we will see if the motivation is there to win another one. I think the talent is certainly there to do it. But takes a lot of will to win it too. That's why it's rare to see back to backs.

 

[DarrylshutzSydor]

76,266,666 Total against salary cap.

 

[shaner82]

I feel like a super team needs to win more than 1 championship. They may end up being a super team, but they need to win it all this year, and possibly once more while being a legit contender every year.

As for the term super team, I also like of feel like it's reserved for those Miami heat situations, where numerous star players join together to create what appears to be a super team

 

[MadLuke]

Their current roster, when healthy I would say yes, a bit like the Hawks before.

They come close to what the Avs, Dallas of the late 90s-early 2000s feel to them, usually cap team do not have the total combo of superstars goaltenders, defenceman, forwards + nice debt like those had back in the days, on those 4 element need to be cut (and I imagine will like for the Hawks with the caps forcing move).

In my view you can be a superteam that does not end up winning all the time (see the 92-93 Pens, 96 Wings, 73 wins 2016 golden state, perfect season until the superbowl Patriots, etc....), just one that if you run multi parallels universe, they would won a significant amount of time versus the regular winners.

 

[BlueMed]

Tampa has a goalie that has not lost two playoff games in a row for over two years, we don't put ourselves into bad situations like the examples you showed

You're right. Tampa has swept every team it's ever played. They didn't even lose a single game against Columbus in 2019.

 

[Number8]

Closer to $19 million over actually

$19 million is nothing. You could add, what a McDavid and a Pasta to your squad with that? Big deal.

 

[the_fan]

Super over the cap team yes

 

[Hockeyholic]

Nope.

Isles will outplay them and win tonight.

 

[User9992]

Nope.

Isles will outplay them and win tonight.

LOL

 

[Ducati Boy]

That's got to be you being thick on purpose, I can't possibly understand otherwise.

You act as if the Lightning's team wouldn't be different had they not have timely cap space appear out of nowhere to offer raises to their players while retaining their entire roster. You speak as if those players would all still be here but simply playing for less money. That's not what happens, that's the point of the cap. Better players end up having to walk away because your team needs to fit under it. It doesn't matter if said players are already on your team when their market values make them too expensive to retain within the cap, for cap compliant teams they're gone regardless.

I do think the Lightning have highlighted a loophole in the current cap system rules that needs to be addressed. It's not the first time it's been done, obviously, but it's probably the most blatant usage of cap circumvention in a long while and I do expect changes to be made.

Just saw this.

Ok, if we take the hypothetical and imagine that Kucherov had been available during the season, the Bolts would have likely had to buy out Johnson and wouldn't have been able to swing the Savard deal. Under those circumstances, Cirelli would have been bridged but still signed. So there's your difference: current Bolts with Mathieu Joseph replacing Johnson and Schenn in over Savard. Not exactly a huge loss.

 

[Xanlet]

Most people will comment they are over the cap, but the thing many people don't seem to realize that the absence of a state tax effectively works to extend their cap too. Players get to keep an extra approximately $1m for every $5m earned by playing in Florida versus playing in a place with high local taxes.

So, not only are they beyond the cap, but players can also take a lower salary and have the same take home pay as higher salaried players on other teams.

 

[Outl4w]

Superteam with 100million cap can't even beat the Islanders smh

This aged perfectly and seasoned ever better.

 

[Outl4w]

Most people will comment they are over the cap, but the thing many people don't seem to realize that the absence of a state tax effectively works to extend their cap too. Players get to keep an extra approximately $1m for every $5m earned by playing in Florida versus playing in a place with high local taxes.

So, not only are they beyond the cap, but players can also take a lower salary and have the same take home pay as higher salaried players on other teams.

So move to a state that doesn't have state taxes .

 

[Outl4w]

LOL

Mahomes,I have 8 reasons to say you are wrong.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Still not a "super team" but this will be the 4th time they've had the 3-2 lead in the semi finals since 2016. They're 1-2 so far in closing it out. We will see if they can do it this time. Either way its still impressive to get to that spot. It sucks when you lose it but it was nice to be on the other side of that last year. I don't know it's been fun being a fan of this team during these years. Especially when we had years of being in the basement. Sy really turned this franchise around.

I know some people have been wanting to discredit this teams success due to the over the cap stuff and that's fine but at the same time this team has been good for a long time. I don't know if it would have mattered if we were under they got such great players on this team and the competitive drive this franchise has is as good as I've seen. A thing that made last offseason tough was a lot of guys have the no trade clause and sy gave these out like candy to keep guys happy to stay in tampa.

Doubt even the great sy could forsee the flat cap coming. Don't expect people to sympathize with that or what I'm about to say but i wonder if part of the issue was/is keeping your word with these guys and keeping them with the team for the runs they were promised with that ntc/nmc. You see Kucherov needs surgery and an opportunity in a shortened season to use ltir to your advantage.

Maybe when the ntc stuff opens up next year and teams are a little more open to deals that aren't gonna bend you over then that is a far easier time to do it. Win or lose with the series going forward tampa has been as competitive as any team out there the last decade. I don't see them stopping anytime soon. Even with the moves they have to make next year and and may set them back a year or two. But the top end talent and their competitive drive will at least keep them at least competitive for a while. Contend here and there.

 

[DistantThunderRep]

Most people will comment they are over the cap, but the thing many people don't seem to realize that the absence of a state tax effectively works to extend their cap too. Players get to keep an extra approximately $1m for every $5m earned by playing in Florida versus playing in a place with high local taxes.

So, not only are they beyond the cap, but players can also take a lower salary and have the same take home pay as higher salaried players on other teams.

This isn't completely true. And a very simplified and basic understanding of how it all works. I expect nothing else from the Toronto Sports network.

 

[5minutemajor]

$30 mill taking into consideration tax advantages. So essentially the Lightning at a 110M cap team versus most other teams 80M. That’s being able to ice a nearly 40% better team than anyone else. It’s no wonder they are stacked.

$30 mill taking into consideration tax advantages. So essentially the Lightning at a 110M cap team versus most other teams 80M. That’s being able to ice a nearly 40% better team than anyone else. It’s no wonder they are stacked.

This.

Add to that the weather/destination factor, so players are actually taking a little bit less money to go there. That is not Tampa’s fault, but is an advantage also.

It still takes a good organization to operate at the level they are operating. They are are just in it with an easy mode settings compared to most others.