Any chance that McDavid could be the GOAT?

[Sky04]

Any chance he had was lost when he got drafted by the Oilers, that franchise is a complete gong-show. It's amazing how little they have to show for the last 15 years.

 

[Craig Button]

God NO

 

[Soundwave]

To answer the OP question simply no. Unbelievable, great player. But so far he hasn't reached even the levels of peaks Ovi, Malkin etc. Forget about Lemieux and Gretzky.

But at the same time, some people who post here and blame his defense are just laughable... Don't act like Lemieux and Gretzky were amazing defensive players lol. On top of that for the big chunk of their careers they played in All Star teams especially Gretzky. Prime Ovy, Crosby, Malkin, McDavid never had talents around them like him.

Gretzky is the GOAT, but it is fair to say he never won anything team wise in the NHL without a virtual All-Star team around him.

The Oilers were so good they won a Cup even without Gretzky. Gretzky played 11 seasons away from Edmonton and never won a Cup, making a Finals only once.

Lemieux had problems making the playoffs even until he had an All-Star team around him.

Crosby and Malkin won a Cup early but were kind of a disappointing in the years afterwards, not being able to get back to the Finals until they were gift wrapped a third top end All-Star caliber forward in Kessel.

So it's a tough league, a lot depends on how much help you have. If Gretzky didn't have such a loaded team like he did in Edmonton, maybe he only has 1 or 2 Cups. If Pittsburgh didn't get gift wrapped Kessel, maybe Crosby/Malkin are still sitting on that one Cup.

It was easier too in the 80s/90s with no salary cap and lower salaries ... the Penguins stacked the deck around Mario Lemieux with Coffey and other top players with no concern for a salary cap.

 

[DANTHEMAN1967]

Mario Lemieux

 

[HolyGhost]

Not till he gets out if Edmonton

 

[Paul4587]

Zero. He won’t break the top 4. Has an outside chance at 5 with great longevity and minimal injuries.

 

[jonlin]

Depends on the criteria. If we're talking stats, then there's no way in hell, no one will ever touch Gretzky. But it's pretty obvious that if you take McDavid and place him in his era, he would put up the same stats and perhaps even more. Go watch a vintage game and see how the goalies play and then watch a goalie today, it's pretty hilarious how terrible goalies were back then. I'm pretty sure Lucic today could score 50 in a season back then.

Give McDavid a wooden stick, 70-80`s skates and equipment and put him on the ice - I bet Gretzky is better than him.

 

[ref19]

Give McDavid a wooden stick, 70-80`s skates and equipment and put him on the ice - I bet Gretzky is better than him.

Haaaaa

 

[ref19]

In a word: yes.

 

[Troubadour]

I mean, the crux of this rhetorical question is based on a semi-coast to coast goal which I therefore expected to at least touch this one:



Didn't happen.

 

[Primary Assist]

Kucherov's 128 point season hurts McDavid's legacy a bit. You would expect the consensus best player of his generation, let alone all time, to have the highest scoring season league wide during his career. Obviously McDavid has time to surpass 128, but it's far from guaranteed.

At the same time let's not forget just how ridiculously talented McDavid is, even if he won't go down as the greatest ever.

 

[DearDiary]

0%. This is why. There is still time to teach him and fix this, sure, but if were talking the greatest of all time, you dont need to be taught this.

This is pitiful defensive awareness.

Why didn't he just skate to the bench instead?

 

[KevinRedkey]

Gretzky had 183 points when 2nd place had 108. Lemieux was on pace for 139.

108 is absolutely at attainable number by a number of current NHL players but there's no way I'm hell McDavid is getting 183 points. Gretzky was just on another level.

 

[Johnnybegood13]

Zzzzzz, another thread on how great McDavid is

 

[Xspyrit]

McDavid is one of the sexiest players of all of time. Personally, in this generation (or just before whatever), I take Crosby so the answer to the poll is no

 

[MetalheadPenguinsFan]

No way.

 

[Eisen]

When the GOAT comes you don't ask this question. It will be convincingly clear once he steps on the ice.

 

[Deas]

Depends on the criteria. If we're talking stats, then there's no way in hell, no one will ever touch Gretzky. But it's pretty obvious that if you take McDavid and place him in his era, he would put up the same stats and perhaps even more. Go watch a vintage game and see how the goalies play and then watch a goalie today, it's pretty hilarious how terrible goalies were back then. I'm pretty sure Lucic today could score 50 in a season back then.

Very original and encompassing take

 

[PaulD]

Did gretzky ev er lose the art ross/hart to a teammate?

No. But I think he lost 3 Con Smythes to team mates.

McDavid has a long way to go before he is in the conversation with Mario and Gretz. Or Crosby for that matter.

 

[PaulD]

*posted how McDavid hasn’t won every scoring title since starting his career like Gretzky, gets a response of how he won a Hart and Art Ross in year 2 and a “wut?”*

Gretzky won the Hart each of his first 8 seasons, while adding 5 Pearsons (let’s not forget that he wasn’t given a Pearson during a season he set the assists and points record again while lapping Mario by 74 points because players were tired of voting for him) and 7 Art Rosses during the same timeframe (he lost the goals tiebreaker as a rookie, otherwise it would have been 8 in a row).

Led the league in assists for his first 13 and the other hundred ways he flexed his dominance.

Forget the raw numbers, he straight up bodied the competition for a decade straight.

McDavid has had one of the best 5 year starts ever, but let’s not pretend he’s lapping the competition even a tenth of what Gretzky did.

McDavid is in every hockey pool Im in.

Gretz wasn't permitted in any.

Simply because if you had Gretz you won the pool before a game was played.

 

[PaulD]

And that is not a random stat.

From 80-81 to 86-87 Gretzky won 7 straight scoring titles averaging 198 points per year. The runners up in those years averaged 131 points per year. That means Gretzky scored 51% more points than the 2nd place finishers over that 7 year time frame.

and all those 2nd place finishers were super star players !

Hell in the 80s they referred to the team as : "Gretzky and the Oilers"

He toured North America. ha!

 

[PaulD]

Any chance he had was lost when he got drafted by the Oilers, that franchise is a complete gong-show. It's amazing how little they have to show for the last 15 years.

Incredible.

If the Oil can keep this up they may surpass the Maple Leafs as the cursed franchise of the league.

Cant win for losing.

 

[Larry Hanson]

He is the best consistently for these past few years but he doesn’t have the separation on his peers that Gretzky and Lemieux had

Is he?
I suppose the answer might be yes but it's hardly by some undisputable margin. Even many Oiler fans have a hard time calling him the best player on the team. He has been outscored and outplayed by multiple players during what are his prime scoring years and it's not like he offers anything but scoring.

 

[Larry Hanson]

McDavid is in every hockey pool Im in.

Gretz wasn't permitted in any.

Funny, I had almost forgotten about that. For awhile Gretzky was excluded then shortly after Lemieux was excluded from most pools.

 

[PaulD]

Not just the scoring, but in 1986/87 you also had just three non-Canadian players in the top 25. In 2016/17 there were 17. The pool of players that Gretzky had to beat was a lot smaller, already Lemieux missing a bunch of games had a huge impact on the statistical outcome. I don't think McDavid is anywhere close, but these comparisons based on 1980s stats can be quite misleading.

To you maybe.