Another Lockout

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by SupremeTeam16, Aug 10, 2019.

  1. Hattrickkane88

    Hattrickkane88 Registered User

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    I see your point but I don’t think the young kids that choose what sport they play are the ones making any leagues, the kids making the leagues these days are the ones who’s parents chose for them before they are even born.
     
  2. hmc1987

    hmc1987 Registered User

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    I'm okay with this so long as it's a max 3 year bridge, giving players option to work toward ufa years without what is becoming yearly RFA holdouts
     
  3. Voight

    Voight #winning

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    Because before 1998 NHL players were not allowed to go....................

    In 2018 the players wanted to go but Bettman & Co. tried to strong arm them.
     
  4. Treebeard

    Treebeard Registered User

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    You're wrong. There a tons of multi-sport athletes who have to choose between their options. Hockey is less popular, and I don't see having the lowest salaries improving that.

    Your viewpoint is very naive if you think these guys are all in it for the love of the game and that they don't take their career options seriously.

    Do you really think there are no athletes that were exceptional hockey and baseball/football players at the teenage level and couldn't have made any of the 3 leagues? Baseball and football are the two most common for obvious reasons.
     
  5. justafan22

    justafan22 Registered User

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    Bettman would only allow them to go if they extended the CBA, which obviously was a no go.
     
  6. Treebeard

    Treebeard Registered User

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    How can I name them now that they are fully developed and in their 20's or 30's?

    The choice usually happens right before the college years. You're correct in saying that hockey is probably the least likely of all the convert sports, but I still think having much lower salaries and marketability impacts the level of talent in the game. Some 16 year old athletic freak in high school in Minnesota would be dumb to develop as a hockey player compared to baseball or football.
     
  7. Beville

    Beville #ForTheBoys

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    If there’s a lockout then this league really is showing up to be the biggest embarrassment in the world.

    What would I like to see though? A limit to signing bonus, say 10% of the contract (as an example).

    Am I in part saying this because my owner (Melnyk) is cheap? Yes but it also brings parity to the league, which is the whole idea behind the salary cap.

    How many teams, really, can afford a $10 million dollar upfront payment, potentially over multiple years? I’m willing to bet it’s less than half.
     
  8. Voight

    Voight #winning

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    AKA tried to strong arm them
     
  9. justafan22

    justafan22 Registered User

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    Well exactly. One way or another, the CBA won't have the same power come a year or so from now when we will know whether there will be a lockout in 2020.
     
    Voight likes this.
  10. lomiller1

    lomiller1 Registered User

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    What’s to understand? Calling money earned by other businesses run by the owners "league revenue" is fundamentally wrong.
    No. All league revenue is, by definition, hockey related. Revenue the owners make on other business is neither hockey related revenue nor is it league revenue.
     
  11. lomiller1

    lomiller1 Registered User

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    Someone needed to pay for the insurance so that players would continue to collect their multi-million dollar NHL salaries if they were injured at the Olympics.

    The players did not want to go to the Olympics badly enough to pay for this insurance out of their own pockets, nor did they want to go badly enough to forgo their NHL paychecks in the case of an injury. They certainly didn’t want to go badly enough to compensate the owners for the money lost by shutting down the league for 2 weeks.

    So yeah, NHL players wanted to play at the Olympics, but not badly enough to pay for any of the costs involved. Clearly it's all the NHL's fault for not donating the $...

    Why is it a no-go? If the players try to get significant concessions from what’s in the current CBA they are all but guaranteeing a lockout, and they still won’t get the concessions so why do it?
     
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  12. Nino33

    Nino33 Registered User

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    Yeah I know, I said "I don't remember" because I was actually alive and following following hockey from 1976 forward (and so it's no big deal to me not to have NHLers at the Olympics because that's the way it's been the majority of my life)

    Given how much of the Olympic hockey was incredibly dull/defensive from 1998-2014, and how many teams were unnecessarily included for a best-on-best, I didn't care that the NHL didn't go in 2018 and don't care if they ever go back to the Olympics



    The reality is the players could have gone, chose not to. The NHLPA made negotiating for more money/benefits the priority over Olympic hockey (that's why I don't believe at all "the players" as a whole actually care much about the Olympics; those that actually "care" are the minority)
     
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  13. Nino33

    Nino33 Registered User

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    If there are "tons" of such athletes could you give a few dozen examples?

    How many teenagers are playing in the USHL or in Major Junior in Canada and are also playing elite level baseball or football? Or any baseball/football?




    I think it's incredibly rare (the opposite of tons of athletes).
    For elite teenagers hockey's a year round sport, so is baseball (that's them taking their career options seriously).

    For the exceptional football/baseball players, I suspect very few of them can even skate at a house league teenage level let alone elite (and the vast majority can't skate at all)
     
    Butch 19 likes this.
  14. Lazlo Hollyfeld

    Lazlo Hollyfeld Pitter Patter

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    No, all league revenue is not by definition hockey related. Maybe in your world, but in the NHL, the elements that are considered "Hockey Related Revenue" is a negotiated and agreed upon thing in the CBA. And players get 50% of what is deemed Hockey Related Revenue.

    I've already given you multiple examples of grey area with revenue. Seriously, read up on HRR if you're interested. I'm not stating an opinion here. I'm presenting facts.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019
  15. Lazlo Hollyfeld

    Lazlo Hollyfeld Pitter Patter

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    While I agree that the Olympics probably only really appeals to a smaller group of players, the offer to extend the CBA came in the middle of the season. Not exactly an ideal time for the NHLPA to present the idea to 700+ players scattered over two countries and try and get them to come to a decision.

    It wasn't exactly bargaining in good faith by the NHL.
     
  16. JTmillerForA1stLOL

    JTmillerForA1stLOL Registered User

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    I am 100% certain there will be another lockout.
     
  17. Thedogo

    Thedogo Dogs are superior to humans in every way

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    This upcoming season or the one after?
     
  18. SabresSharks

    SabresSharks Registered User

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    I'd be interested in Anders Lee's opinion on that.
     
  19. Nino33

    Nino33 Registered User

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    It didn't come out of nowhere in the middle of the season, it was a known issue at the end of the previous season NHL might not participate in 2018 Winter Olympics – The Mercury News and it was a known issue before the previous season too Alex Ovechkin will defy NHL to play in 2018 Winter Olympics

    I don't think the NHLPA ever really cared much about the Olympics, and thus apparently made no really effort to negotiate to go; the moment it required something of them they cared even less

    The NHLPA seems like an incredibly stupid bunch to me (i.e. how they don't understand what 50% means and how the escalator worked) - it wouldn't surprise me at all if the NHLPA just assumed they'd magically get to go, and didn't really understand any of the issues (just like they didn't understand escrow/etc)




    But it sure shows that the NHL players, who make 400-500 percent more than they could make anywhere else in the world, thought getting more money/benefits was more important than Olympic participation

    To me the owners and the players are the same, money is the priority (and the Olympics really don't matter much at all to either side)
     
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  20. Lazlo Hollyfeld

    Lazlo Hollyfeld Pitter Patter

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    It was a known issue but the league didn't make the offer to extend the CBA until the season was underway. That was my point.

    I totally agree that as a whole I'm guessing that making more money is more important to the NHLPA than Olympic participation. And I don't know that I would call them incredibly stupid, but the league is made up of a lot of young guys, many of whom haven't had higher education, let alone financial education. Financially ignorant is probably more accurate. With the NHL you have a collective group of businessmen, along with their lawyers and accountants. On the other side you have a group of guys who are really good at putting a piece of frozen rubber into a net.

    I don't know what they're doing already but it sure seems like the NHLPA could do a better job educating its players about escrow and escalators. Though getting 20-something millionaires to attend financial lectures is no easy task. :laugh:

    I do think the Olympics in China will be more of a priority or at least interest for the NHL because every business wants to crack that market, for a billion+ reasons.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019
  21. PuckInTheNards

    PuckInTheNards Registered User

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    I dunno... if you set the mood properly... maybe some candles, Nickelback on the stereo...
     
  22. Thedogo

    Thedogo Dogs are superior to humans in every way

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    Oh god:laugh:
     
  23. Butch 19

    Butch 19 Go cart Mozart

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    So what makes you think they actually exist?

    I know of one player that played baseball (quite successfully), and was drafted by the Kings to play hockey: Tom Glavin.

    Okay, that's ONE. You must know dozens more in their 40s, right?
     
  24. ZeroPucksGiven

    ZeroPucksGiven Registered User

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    Eh, Comrade?
     
  25. Machinehead

    Machinehead ★★★YNWA★★★

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    You're god damn right, comrade.
     

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