American Prospect Update Thread - Part 4

[ASPIFC]

The jury is still out on every player from that draft, but it looks like the USA had the best crop of players from the 2019 draft from any country.

What are the numbers of American players registered as opposed to Canadian players or Russian players? Those countries must also have big numbers of players registered. It is true that we don't produce as many good players per capita as Finland or Sweden, but hockey is more popular in those countries, and there's a much bigger effort and percentage of their athletic budget that goes into hockey. Hockey is a niche sport in the USA.

Canada

621,026

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

United States

567,908

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Czech Republic

121,613

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Russia

112,236

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Finland

64,641

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Sweden

55,431

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Switzerland

27,867

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

France

21,503

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Germany

21,340

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Japan

18,837

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Slovakia

11,394

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Norway

10,353

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Great Britain

8,162

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Austria

7,670

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Hungary

7,106

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Latvia

7,000

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Kazakhstan

6,915

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Ukraine

5,384

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Italy

5,210

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Belarus

4,580

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Source: IIHF

 

[ASPIFC]

It is true that we don't produce as many good players per capita as Finland or Sweden, but hockey is more popular in those countries, and there's a much bigger effort and percentage of their athletic budget that goes into hockey. Hockey is a niche sport in the USA.

Obviously we don't have real numbers but i think USA Hockey has much bigger budget compared to Finland and Sweden.

 

[canuck2010]

I have never understood what these numbers are all about especially in the Canadian case. What is the criteria for being a registered hockey player in Canada. What is the age range, does this include women?

 

[canuck2010]

Obviously we don't have real numbers but i think USA Hockey has much bigger budget compared to Finland and Sweden.

I would think so. Do your associations get any NHL money, what about the Americans and Canadians?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Canada

621,026

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

United States

567,908

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Czech Republic

121,613

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Russia

112,236

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Finland

64,641

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Sweden

55,431

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Switzerland

27,867

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

France

21,503

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Germany

21,340

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Japan

18,837

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Slovakia

11,394

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Norway

10,353

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Great Britain

8,162

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Austria

7,670

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Hungary

7,106

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Latvia

7,000

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Kazakhstan

6,915

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Ukraine

5,384

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Italy

5,210

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Belarus

4,580

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Source: IIHF

Does Russia not register their players? I can't imagine they'd have less players than the Czech's.

Obviously we don't have real numbers but i think USA Hockey has much bigger budget compared to Finland and Sweden.

That wasn't what I was talking about. I'm talking about the quality of the athletic impetus. Those countries are hockey countries. A much higher percentage of the athletic kids want to be hockey players, a larger percentage of the people with a quality hockey mind want to be coaches and hockey is nowhere near the regional sport as the USA. There's more rinks per capita, there's more quality competition in each region and there's more quality coaching in each region. Quality is not the same as quantity.

 

[JiggsNY]

I mean for sure Sweden and Finland do amazing in terms of NHLers given the amount of total hockey players. but the can be said about Canada, Canada is something like 45% of the NHL and they have 600k+ players. So it can be argued Canada should have way more when compared to Sweden and Finland. Granted they are producing higher quality players more consistently.

Given the volume i agree we should have higher quality and more volume of top players. But where USAH hockey is right now compared to 10- 15 -20 years ago is massive. Seems like since 2015 we've hit another gear with only a few dud years since. Theres never been this much young top American talent in the NHL and 2021, 2022 seem to show that it's not slowing down.

 

[ASPIFC]

Given the volume i agree we should have higher quality and more volume of top players. But where USAH hockey is right now compared to 10- 15 -20 years ago is massive. Seems like since 2015 we've hit another gear with only a few dud years since. Theres never been this much young top American talent in the NHL and 2021, 2022 seem to show that it's not slowing down.

Obviously USA Hockey has done massive step up like you said and NTDP has been big part of it but i guess we just always want more when we talk about American sports. I feel that potential is there that we can put Canada in their place.

 

[tealhockey]

Obviously USA Hockey has done massive step up like you said and NTDP has been big part of it but i guess we just always want more when we talk about American sports. I feel that potential is there that we can put Canada in their place.

Their place seems to be at the top of the game for the foreseeable future. If we can continue to challenge them, in a couple decades I think we will emerge on top, but there's a lot of work to be done and I can't imagine the Canadians will fall off the map. They will do whatever they can to support the game's growth

 

[ASPIFC]

Cruz even more talented than his older brother? They was teammates last season.

 

[Bonin21]

Cruz even more talented than his older brother? They was teammates last season.

He's tiny

 

[Tube Skates]

He's tiny

5’8” 154lbs at 15 isn’t that tiny. Now if he was 18 that would be different

 

[tealhockey]

Link below is to the Minn HS all star prospects game, starts in 40 mins.. just an all star game but bunch of good players in that like Carsen Richels (2020 draft), Jake Braccini, Luke Levandowski, the Mittelstadt bros, etc

www.youtube.com/watch?v=kiu2RDttQRQ

 

[ASPIFC]

World Junior A Challenge next. Any interesting names to follow? Obviously roster is not out but lets talk about who should be there. I would like to see Avery Hayes and Antonio Stranges.

 

[tealhockey]

World Junior A Challenge next. Any interesting names to follow? Obviously roster is not out but lets talk about who should be there. I would like to see Avery Hayes and Antonio Stranges.

Do we usually get CHL-types on the American team? IIRC it's usually the best non-NTDPers from basically the USHL. So maybe we'll get Brisson, Farrell, Laferriere, Bantle, Rolston, Colangelo, Ellis as far as draft guys go, De St Phalle, Kuntar, Ben Meehan, Gunnarwolfe Fontaine, Oliver MacDonald for older types. I'm seriously just talking out of my ass though those are just a handful of guys from the league who have done well that I've seen

 

[ASPIFC]

Do we usually get CHL-types on the American team? IIRC it's usually the best non-NTDPers from basically the USHL. So maybe we'll get Brisson, Farrell, Laferriere, Bantle, Rolston, Colangelo, Ellis as far as draft guys go, De St Phalle, Kuntar, Ben Meehan, Gunnarwolfe Fontaine, Oliver MacDonald for older types. I'm seriously just talking out of my ass though those are just a handful of guys from the league who have done well that I've seen

Yeah you are right. It is Hlinka where we see CHL guys. My bad.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

An early projection of what our WJC18 team could look like.

Tuch-Bordeleau-Peterson
Beniers-Smilanic-Lucius
Janicke-Slaggert-Duke
Berard-Hughes-Pastujov
Yoder

Sanderson-Powell
Kleven-Faber
Hughes-Gallagher
Truscott

Commessso
Grannon

I think the most U17's we've ever had was 5. 8 is probably stretching it, but the U18's are a pretty weak crop, and the U17's are a high number this year.

 

[ASPIFC]

.
I think the most U17's we've ever had was 5. 8 is probably stretching it, but the U18's are a pretty weak crop, and the U17's are a high number this year.

U18's are improving tho. They just won 5nations tournament in Sweden. My guess is that there is going to be two or three guys from U17's. U18 tournament is like graduation day for NTDP guys so i dont see there is going to be too many guys from u18's who have to miss it. Maybe they should mix those team more this year but i dont see it happening.

 

[BKarchitect]

So any more rumblings about Adam Fantilli possibly being eligible for the U.S.? I have no idea if there is any truth to this nugget from the article below, but it would obviously be a huge coup if true. Fantilli was awesome as what amount to being a double under-ager in the GTHL last season (Dec 2004 birthdate) and at least prior to this season, with Shane Wright getting exceptional status, was the odds-on favorite to be the #1 prospect in the 2020 OHL Draft.

He'd take an already loaded looking 2004 USNTDP class to the next level and give the U.S. a potential franchise forward prospect for the 2023 NHL Draft as a late '04. I've heard the 2005 crop in the States is not nearly as good as 2004 so he'd be a big get.

Again I don't know if the author has some insight on potential dual-eligibility or if he is conflating a desire to play prep with his brother and potentially choosing the NCAA over the OHL as a sign that he could be U.S. team candidate. I had always thought Roman Schmidt was just Canadian too until he was American so maybe?

Most recently and following in his alleged interest to pursue an NCAA career, Fantilli walked away from the GTHL’s Toronto Jr. Canadiens in order to play alongside his brother Luca with Kimball Union Academy within the USHS-Prep circuit. Although his option to play in the OHL still remains, it appears increasingly likely that Fantilli will opt to compete for the NTDP or in the USHL come the 2020-21 season.

2020 OHL Draft Top Prospect: Adam Fantilli

 

[canuck2010]

So any more rumblings about Adam Fantilli possibly being eligible for the U.S.? I have no idea if there is any truth to this nugget from the article below, but it would obviously be a huge coup if true. Fantilli was awesome as what amount to being a double under-ager in the GTHL last season (Dec 2004 birthdate) and at least prior to this season, with Shane Wright getting exceptional status, was the odds-on favorite to be the #1 prospect in the 2020 OHL Draft.

He'd take an already loaded looking 2004 USNTDP class to the next level and give the U.S. a potential franchise forward prospect for the 2023 NHL Draft as a late '04. I've heard the 2005 crop in the States is not nearly as good as 2004 so he'd be a big get.

Again I don't know if the author has some insight on potential dual-eligibility or if he is conflating a desire to play prep with his brother and potentially choosing the NCAA over the OHL as a sign that he could be U.S. team candidate. I had always thought Roman Schmidt was just Canadian too until he was American so maybe?

Most recently and following in his alleged interest to pursue an NCAA career, Fantilli walked away from the GTHL’s Toronto Jr. Canadiens in order to play alongside his brother Luca with Kimball Union Academy within the USHS-Prep circuit. Although his option to play in the OHL still remains, it appears increasingly likely that Fantilli will opt to compete for the NTDP or in the USHL come the 2020-21 season.

2020 OHL Draft Top Prospect: Adam Fantilli

As far as I know he is still a Canadian, he was born in Canada, and has played hockey for 10 years in Canada. Where does this NTDP bit enter into things?

 

[BKarchitect]

As far as I know he is still a Canadian, he was born in Canada, and has played hockey for 10 years in Canada. Where does this NTDP bit enter into things?

I don't know that's what I am asking...I didn't make this up, it's in that article, which is a Canadian-based, OHL scouting service/outlet. I'm not saying it's accurate just wondering if there is anything to it or if it is misguided conjecture. Going to a New England prep school to play with your brother and preferring the NCAA obviously doesn't mean you've suddenly become an American, it just makes you a Canadian going that route - I think that's obvious so wondering if the author has some other info to throw such a statement out there about the USNTDP.

 

[tealhockey]

So any more rumblings about Adam Fantilli possibly being eligible for the U.S.? I have no idea if there is any truth to this nugget from the article below, but it would obviously be a huge coup if true. Fantilli was awesome as what amount to being a double under-ager in the GTHL last season (Dec 2004 birthdate) and at least prior to this season, with Shane Wright getting exceptional status, was the odds-on favorite to be the #1 prospect in the 2020 OHL Draft.

He'd take an already loaded looking 2004 USNTDP class to the next level and give the U.S. a potential franchise forward prospect for the 2023 NHL Draft as a late '04. I've heard the 2005 crop in the States is not nearly as good as 2004 so he'd be a big get.

Again I don't know if the author has some insight on potential dual-eligibility or if he is conflating a desire to play prep with his brother and potentially choosing the NCAA over the OHL as a sign that he could be U.S. team candidate. I had always thought Roman Schmidt was just Canadian too until he was American so maybe?

Most recently and following in his alleged interest to pursue an NCAA career, Fantilli walked away from the GTHL’s Toronto Jr. Canadiens in order to play alongside his brother Luca with Kimball Union Academy within the USHS-Prep circuit. Although his option to play in the OHL still remains, it appears increasingly likely that Fantilli will opt to compete for the NTDP or in the USHL come the 2020-21 season.

2020 OHL Draft Top Prospect: Adam Fantilli

I've been talking to a lot of people about Fantilli this month (including talking to his high school coach) and no one has said anything about that. As far as I know he is trying to play at KUA for two years, as I reported he is going to try and fast-track to get his high school diploma in spring of 2021 at 16. But it is as good a guess as anyone's I suppose. If he were to follow that track I would anticipate him going to either USHL or the OHL or a very small chance he would play the NCAA in his D-1 year which would make him one of if not the youngest to play in the NCAA ever. I wrote a bunch about this on my site this week. I also put out a report talking about many of the uncommitted prospects available today and mentioned him (+ his brother) in that: Uncommitted Watchlist Release: Fall 2019

 

[William H Bonney]

I've never heard anything of Fantilli being American. The source of this rumor - Prospect Pipeline - has since updated their article to remove the NTDP claim, did so without noting the correction in the article, all while ignoring the original questions about it on that OHL draft prospects thread despite posting another prospect profile in the thread after the questions. Incredibly poor form that doesn't build much credibility for anything they write.

 

[BKarchitect]

@tealhockey that report you did is amazing, thanks for the link!

 

[canuck2010]

I don't know that's what I am asking...I didn't make this up, it's in that article, which is a Canadian-based, OHL scouting service/outlet. I'm not saying it's accurate just wondering if there is anything to it or if it is misguided conjecture. Going to a New England prep school to play with your brother and preferring the NCAA obviously doesn't mean you've suddenly become an American, it just makes you a Canadian going that route - I think that's obvious so wondering if the author has some other info to throw such a statement out there about the USNTDP.

I went back to my post and realized it sounded somewhat aggressive in tone. Apologies for that I didn't mean or write it in that way. It was just short form and points out the dangers of email and written messaging.

Thanks for your efforts and further explanation.

 

[JiggsNY]

So any more rumblings about Adam Fantilli possibly being eligible for the U.S.? I have no idea if there is any truth to this nugget from the article below, but it would obviously be a huge coup if true. Fantilli was awesome as what amount to being a double under-ager in the GTHL last season (Dec 2004 birthdate) and at least prior to this season, with Shane Wright getting exceptional status, was the odds-on favorite to be the #1 prospect in the 2020 OHL Draft.

He'd take an already loaded looking 2004 USNTDP class to the next level and give the U.S. a potential franchise forward prospect for the 2023 NHL Draft as a late '04. I've heard the 2005 crop in the States is not nearly as good as 2004 so he'd be a big get.

Again I don't know if the author has some insight on potential dual-eligibility or if he is conflating a desire to play prep with his brother and potentially choosing the NCAA over the OHL as a sign that he could be U.S. team candidate. I had always thought Roman Schmidt was just Canadian too until he was American so maybe?

Most recently and following in his alleged interest to pursue an NCAA career, Fantilli walked away from the GTHL’s Toronto Jr. Canadiens in order to play alongside his brother Luca with Kimball Union Academy within the USHS-Prep circuit. Although his option to play in the OHL still remains, it appears increasingly likely that Fantilli will opt to compete for the NTDP or in the USHL come the 2020-21 season.

2020 OHL Draft Top Prospect: Adam Fantilli

Looks like the NTDP bit might have been removed from the article.