Discussion in 'The History of Hockey' started by Bhrangerfan0809, Feb 17, 2016.
Gerd Truntschka can also be added to the German team. 1x AST FW at the WC, 5x Bundesliga MVP.
Thanks for the German team suggestions, guys!
I seem to remember someone saying his not super great Selke finishes could be becouse he did not play on the first pairing on the PK, or many times even the second. That would mean though that he was extremely good defensively five on five.
Thomas Sandstrom is a swede. No question about that. He might have born in finland, but many people are born in other countries and represented the other.
Best ever internationanl Finnish line has been Lehtinen - Koivu - SelÃ¤nne, so no reason to but Tikkanen there. Also Tikkanen belongs with Kurri.
Lehtinen - Koivu - SelÃ¤nne
Tikkanen - Kurri - Petri Skriko
S.Kapanen - O.Jokinen - J.Jokinen
C.Ruuttu - M.Koivu - N.Hagman
Numminen - Lumme
Timonen - Ruotsalainen
Siltanen - Salo
Of course, because neither you nor him are Czech. You think the game American/Canadian way. And so did he, in the end.
The thing with Czechs, especially at their best, was that they had a "weird" style. Not very physical. Soft and non-violent. Team play and chemistry were the key words there, especially on offense.
We weren't out to intimidate and outpower our opponents like Canadians, to outskate them like Finns do, to outskill them like Soviets/Russians did/do, to frustrate them with an overally good game like Swedes, to lose no matter how loaded we look as Slovaks always do (JK, sort of). At our best, we're there to outsmart/outpass you. We could beat you our way and we could beat you badly. So badly that the last five minutes of the game even your best guys will do nothing but slash, hit, punch and crosscheck. It's a confirmed fact. And for that, we need not guys like Bobby, thank you very much.
We need guys who can pass and think the game in advance, like Krejci and Hudler these days. Sly guys, foxy guys. Two steps ahead are not enough. Three, yes.
Prospal was mediocre at everything but passing and thinking the game. He saw well and he always clicked. He also had heart. Take him over Holik, always and forever.
Straka was one of my favorites. I loved the way he looked almost cartoonish accelerating through a couple of strides. Passed well, thought well. Never let up.
Reichel may have been the smartest folk on skates we ever had. He could go from an offensive prodigy to a 4th line defensive forward in a minute.
You say Bobby have been through many big games, true, but we're not talking SC finals here. As an NT player, he was more pristine than he could be dirty in the NHL. His junior years were splendid. But he played with that couple of dudes (Jagr+Reichel). And with them precisely, maybe, I would have him on the all-time plate. Maybe.
what happen before the 90s I do not take seriously. The hockey world has change to much.
M NÃ¤slund - Forsberg - Alfredsson
Zetterberg - Sundin - Nylander
D Sedin - H Sedin - Eriksson
Dahlen - BÃ¤ckstrÃ¶m - T Steen
Karlsson - Hedman
OEL - LidstrÃ¶m
Klingberg - Ã–hlund
It's difficult to make a roster for Russia.
It seems like there are 3 (maybe even 4) separate cases:
Players that had their prime in NHL (Ovechkin, Fedorov, etc)
Players that didn't have their prime in NHL but played against them on international level (Green Unit, Kharlamov, Tretiak, etc.)
Players whose prime came before the Summit Series.
I think its safe to say that the last category isnt veiwed in the same light as the others. People forget that the reason Summit Series happened in the first place was because the 60s guys dominated for nearly a decade.
Who knows, maybe if that series happens earlier, this list would be far different.
Damn 3/4 of this all time team would play at same time. What a great generation it was Actually 10 of them played in Torino and Ziggy, Handzus and Nagy could as well if they would not be injured or retired mid season ( Palffy). I am so gratefull I could witness all slovakian medals and great performances. Except Lilehammer one. I heard we played some nice hockey
Anyway I would maybe add some guys like Pasek, Rusnak, Lukac, Marian and Anton Stastny. I am thinking about some defenceman from CSSR times but I canÂ´t find anyone. Maybe I am too young
My thoughts exactly. Holik is not an all-star skills, flashy type of player. But I find his intangibles cannot be ignored if you're to play a team as talented as Canada. He plays very well without the puck, which you need on stacked teams. He checks extremely well; again a need against other stacked teams. He wins faceoffs. He's big and physical, while not slow. And he's good under pressure, or when it counts.
There's plenty of flashy skill to go around, but no other player quite like him for the Czech team. I say Holik brings a different skill set, and will not even concede that he is less skilled. He helped New Jersey to win at the highest level.
What about 1989?
Hockey has changed a great deal since the 90s, you might as well just post the current top Sweden team.
There is nothing wrong with comparing players from different eras based on how good they were relevant to their peers.
Always hard to compare player from different eras. I based my team on WC.
Dieter Hegen-Erich KÃ¼hnhackl-Marcus Kuhl
Helmut Steiger-Gerd Trunschka-Joachim Ziesche
Marco Sturm-Markus Egen-Alois Schloder
Ernst HÃ¶fner-Leon Draisaitl-Tobias Rieder
Udo KieÃŸling-Christian Ehrhoff
Rainer Philipp-Dennis Seidenberg
Uwe Krupp-Uli Hiemer
Prospal rarely played on the PK.
To remain fair I think we need to consider the realities of the different eras of hockey. Hockey evolved so much through the years to a point that it's really difficult to make accurate comparisons. For example, is Glenn Hall really a better goaltender than Carey Price, Martin Brodeur or Roberto Luongo?
To put that in perspective, I did "multi-generational" International All-Time teams. You can found the players/teams by clicking on the following link : http://nhldecades.weebly.com/international.html
The teams are the following (the full rosters are available by clicking the above link) :
1910-1970 Team Canada
1970-1980 Team Canada
1980-1995 Team Canada
1995-2010 Team Canada
2010-2015 Team Canada
1980-2015 Team Czech Republic
1980-2015 Team Finland
1950-1990 Team Russia
1990-2015 Team Russia
1980-2015 Team Solvakia
1980-2015 Team Sweden
1980-2000 Team USA
2000-2015 Team USA
I would like your comments on those!!
Sapinvert, that's pretty solid for Russia. It would be a bit different for me:
- Maltsev played as a center even more often then on wing, so he can be there instead of Bykov. Bykov was good, but a guy like Veniamin Alexandrov has a better resume.
- Afinogenov stands out like a sore thumb. I would go with Larionov or Zhamnov at center and Yashin at wing.
- I don't see what was so special about Tverdovskiy that he would be there instead of Fetisov.
Thanks for your comments MaxV. Never heard of that Veniamin Alexandrov before. IMO, Maltsev is a no brainer to be considered, whether it's in his natural position (Center) or in his alternate position (RW). Then between Alexandrov and Bykov, it might require a coin toss, because they seem to have comparable International stats (76 GP, 112 pts for Alexandrov and 108 GP, 97 pts for Bykov).
I really wanted to put Zhamnov in for the 1990-2015 Russia team, but in respect to their natural positions I was not able to fit him. Did Yashin ever played RW?
As for Larionov and Fetisov, they are both in the 1950-1990 USSR team. If you have a better choice than Tverdovsky, let me know. Dmitry Kulikov?
Switched Afinogenov for Yashin, and I put Zhamnov at center. Looks better that way : http://nhldecades.weebly.com/team-russia-1990-2015.html
Alexandrov was one of Soviet's best players before the Summit Series.
Firsov played LW before he switched to center late in his career. He's out of position at RW.
Ok, I trust you he was. I put him in the lineup instead of Bykov. He's a LW but I still put it on right. The 1950-1990 Russia forwards team now looks like that :
Kharlamov - Petrov - Mikhailov
Krutov - Larionov - Makarov
Bobrov - Starshinov - Firsov
Yakuchev - Maltsev - Alexandrov
MaxV, do you know what was the jersey numbers of Alexandrov and Nikolai Sologubov?
I know he was a LW, but he still shoots right. There seems to be a surplus of excellent left wingers in that era. That's why I put Firsov and Alexandrov as right wingers, when they've both mostly played as LW.
WOW, you thread was moved and lost a very, very long post regarding all-time teams...
The thrust of it : 90ies and 00ies Habs teams need a second look (Sheldon Souray and Roman Hamrlik completely left off feels wrong, and Craig Rivet on the '90ies is VERY wrong, considering he was a regular (bottom-pairing...) for about two seasons. Brisebois instead of Rivet would be accurate.
I agree with you about Brisebois (instead of Rivet) and Souray (instead of Bouillon), but I think that Gorges had more of an impact than Hamrlik in MTL. I will make the changes, thanks!
Sorry, but I don't know
The other, somewhat more controversials, suggestions were switching Provost and Cournoyer (longevity, and Provost arguably had the best season, too) and Galchnyuk with Cammalleri.
I really dont see Hamrlik and Gorges as close. Hamrlik was, by default, the #1 D-Men for a while.
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