All Purpose Trade / Roster Building Thread Pt 10 (45 Days to the Trade Deadline)

[Nikishin Go Boom]

I do think they call up a 7th defenseman for the road swing, however.

I’d like to see Kaski or McKeown knowing Rod ain’t going to play whoever it is. I would hate to waste all that bench / press box time on Bean.

 

[spockBokk]

LeBrun's latest hypotheticals and complete speculation:

New Jersey Devils trade Sami Vatanen to the Carolina Hurricanes for a 2020 second-round pick. (Devils retain 30 percent of Vatanen’s $4.875 million cap hit.)
My take: Let me preface this by saying Hurricanes owner Tom Dundon isn’t a big fan of paying for rentals. He doesn’t think it’s good business. He’d rather GM Don Waddell make a hockey deal for a blueliner under contract past this season. But as we know, that’s easier said than done. Although I do think Carolina inquired on Matt Dumba in Minnesota recently. I just think that’s too big a deal for Canes right now.
The pending UFA Vatanen, a right-hand shot D who can play both sides, would help fill the void left by Dougie Hamilton’s injury. The Hurricanes, in doing their diligence, I’m told, have talked to New Jersey among other teams while they search the D market. Carolina has two second-round picks, its own plus the Rangers’ (from the Adam Fox trade). The Devils might have enough interest in Vatanen to get a second asset in the deal, perhaps a conditional pick attached in case Vatanen signs with his new team.

While I think this is totally realistic and would not be at all surprised if it happened, I find the most interesting comment to be about CAR inquiring about Dumba. He does preface by saing "I do think...", but I just don't see it working next year with Hamilton and Pesce already on the right side with both making $4M+.

Although...if you look at it from what they've done in the past, it does make sense to be proactive and get a potential Hamilton replacement that's signed long-term, just in case the Hamilton contract negotiations go sour.

 

[GoldiFox]

LeBrun's latest hypotheticals and complete speculation:

New Jersey Devils trade Sami Vatanen to the Carolina Hurricanes for a 2020 second-round pick. (Devils retain 30 percent of Vatanen’s $4.875 million cap hit.)
My take: Let me preface this by saying Hurricanes owner Tom Dundon isn’t a big fan of paying for rentals. He doesn’t think it’s good business. He’d rather GM Don Waddell make a hockey deal for a blueliner under contract past this season. But as we know, that’s easier said than done. Although I do think Carolina inquired on Matt Dumba in Minnesota recently. I just think that’s too big a deal for Canes right now.
The pending UFA Vatanen, a right-hand shot D who can play both sides, would help fill the void left by Dougie Hamilton’s injury. The Hurricanes, in doing their diligence, I’m told, have talked to New Jersey among other teams while they search the D market. Carolina has two second-round picks, its own plus the Rangers’ (from the Adam Fox trade). The Devils might have enough interest in Vatanen to get a second asset in the deal, perhaps a conditional pick attached in case Vatanen signs with his new team.

While I think this is totally realistic and would not be at all surprised if it happened, I find the most interesting comment to be about CAR inquiring about Dumba. He does preface by saing "I do think...", but I just don't see it working next year with Hamilton and Pesce already on the right side with both making $4M+.

Although...if you look at it from what they've done in the past, it does make sense to be proactive and get a potential Hamilton replacement that's signed long-term, just in case the Hamilton contract negotiations go sour.

Vatanen could be an interesting case because NJ hasn't even talked to him about an extension. I would imagine that most high-end rentals in any given year have decided to go to UFA and that is partially why their team deals them rather than re-signing. For all we know Vatanen would be open to signing a reasonable extension. Let's say $6 million x 3 years which would match Dumba's current deal. In that scenario the Canes pickup a similar quality RHD for a 2nd round pick rather than significant assets.

I haven’t talked to anybody right now. I’ve just been playing hockey,” he said. "We’ll see if they reach out to me like that, what’s going to happen. I’ve liked it here a lot and it’s been fun to be here

Where Devils’ Sami Vatanen stands on future with free agency looming

 

[Stickpucker]

Is there a world where they do a sign and trade for Vatanen and move Gards?

 

[MinJaBen]

While I think this is totally realistic and would not be at all surprised if it happened, I find the most interesting comment to be about CAR inquiring about Dumba. He does preface by saing "I do think...", but I just don't see it working next year with Hamilton and Pesce already on the right side with both making $4M+.

Dumba only makes sense to me if the organization is having buyer's remorse over the Gardiner signing. Otherwise, they are over spending on the backend.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Is there a world where they do a sign and trade for Vatanen and move Gards?

To the devils? They need lefties

 

[MinJaBen]

To the devils? They need lefties

Don't tease me.

 

[Svechhammer]

It just continues to blow my mind how we keep tinkering on defense. On paper, we have one of the most enviable situations in the entire league on the blueline, for not just now but the future as well, and yet we keep getting ourselves involved in talks for more defense. Don't get me wrong, I believe that we definitely could improve there, but I hope we're not hyper focused on tweaking our strength and missing out on possibly improving the areas that would have a more immediate ROI, like at forward or in net. Or maybe that's what the offseason will be for.

 

[Joe McGrath]

It just continues to blow my mind how we keep tinkering on defense. On paper, we have one of the most enviable situations in the entire league on the blueline, for not just now but the future as well, and yet we keep getting ourselves involved in talks for more defense. Don't get me wrong, I believe that we definitely could improve there, but I hope we're not hyper focused on tweaking our strength and missing out on possibly improving the areas that would have a more immediate ROI, like at forward or in net. Or maybe that's what the offseason will be for.

Slavin and Pesce are the only strengths right now. Everyone else is overslotted.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Slavin and Pesce are the only strengths right now. Everyone else is overslotted.

Fleury is only over-slotted because we refused to play him. We shot ourselves with that one.

while we could use another righty, the defense isn’t terrible. The offense has shown to be just as much of an issue as the defense.

 

[Svechhammer]

Slavin and Pesce are the only strengths right now. Everyone else is overslotted.

Right now, yes.

But I don't see us making a move for only right now. We hate rentals, and if we pull a trigger, I see it for a guy with term, especially if we are giving up anything of value.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Right now, yes.

But I don't see us making a move for only right now. We hate rentals, and if we pull a trigger, I see it for a guy with term, especially if we are giving up anything of value.

We can hate rentals all we want, the only way this team is going to the playoffs is getting a RHD to play with Slavin on the top pair. Not addressing that in anyway is pissing away a chance to build on the momentum of last season.

 

[bleedgreen]

Slavin and Pesce are the only strengths right now. Everyone else is overslotted.

The difference in this teams d from one year to the next is mind bottling. We had five top 4 guys and no room for Fleury last season. Right now we have two top four guys with Fleury maybe knocking on the door to be one.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

The difference in this teams d from one year to the next is mind bottling. We had five top 4 guys and no room for Fleury last season. Right now we have two top four guys with Fleury maybe knocking on the door to be one.

Not many people thought Gardiner would have stone skates on.

although trading for Edmundson and signing Gardiner wasn’t the smartest. Our righty depth was already bad but then just make it worse by adding more lefties.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

I don't understand the anti-Gardiner faction on this board. Gardiner's game isn't reliant on athleticism, and he has been playing like a top 4 guy this entire month (0.5 PPG over the last 13 games), which is probably a big reason why our organization isn't looking for LHD at the moment. Dumba makes a ton of sense if the Borg has concerns about Hamilton's signability. If signability is less of a concern, Vatanen becomes a very solid choice for a rental.

 

[Svechhammer]

I have been very vocal against Gardiner this year.

But I think he's starting to come around and find his role on the team lately. I haven't been seeing the horrendous errors he was making earlier this year, and he's literally picked multiple pucks off the goalline this year preventing the opposing team from scoring. And he's starting to get involved a little more offensively than he was earlier in the year. At this point, I definitely think he's a Top 4 D for us now, and I think it would be a mistake to move him out, because he seems to be getting better and more reliable by the game.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

I don't understand the anti-Gardiner faction on this board. Gardiner's game isn't reliant on athleticism, and he has been playing like a top 4 guy this entire month (0.5 PPG over the last 13 games), which is probably a big reason why our organization isn't looking for LHD at the moment. Dumba makes a ton of sense if the Borg has concerns about Hamilton's signability. If signability is less of a concern, Vatanen becomes a very solid choice for a rental.

Gardiner is the reason for the anti Gardiner faction.

Dumba wont work unless we move out a contract. Assuming Dougie is actually coming back. That is without consideration of his cost to acquire.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

Gardiner is the reason for the anti Gardiner faction.

Dumba wont work unless we move out a contract. Assuming Dougie is actually coming back.

I expect any Dumba deal to involve one of our forwards, along with draft picks. It would certainly help to end the healthy scratch brigade if the Borg decides to move a McGinn or someone like that, either in a separate trade or in the deal itself. It may be a deal worth taking a shot, especially since we're one of the few teams in the league with the asset pool to acquire a Dumba outright, without trading any NHL forwards.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

The thing with Gardiner is that he should be your #4 defence man. With Slavin, Hamilton, and Pesce slotted ahead of him that was fine. The unfortunate thing is that much like Dougie last year, it has taken Gards about half a season to feel more comfortable on the ice with a new team and now with Dougies injury our d pairings are all out of wack.

We definitely need more RHD depth or have to give the young guys a chance to prove their worth.

I’m happy letting Edmundson and TVR walk at the end of the year and having Fleury plus a cheap vet on the bottom pair next year. Call up one of the other young guns to be the 7th D. That should help with payroll flexibility as well.

 

[MinJaBen]

I don't understand the anti-Gardiner faction on this board. Gardiner's game isn't reliant on athleticism, and he has been playing like a top 4 guy this entire month (0.5 PPG over the last 13 games), which is probably a big reason why our organization isn't looking for LHD at the moment. Dumba makes a ton of sense if the Borg has concerns about Hamilton's signability. If signability is less of a concern, Vatanen becomes a very solid choice for a rental.

I'm not worried about his point production. His ability to keep up with the play looks terrible and I can't imagine what it will look like as he gets three more years on those tired wheels.

 

[Svechhammer]

The thing with Gardiner is that he should be your #4 defence man. With Slavin, Hamilton, and Pesce slotted ahead of him that was fine. The unfortunate thing is that much like Dougie last year, it has taken Gards about half a season to feel more comfortable on the ice with a new team and now with Dougies injury our d pairings are all out of wack.

We definitely need more RHD depth or have to give the young guys a chance to prove their worth.

I’m happy letting Edmundson and TVR walk at the end of the year and having Fleury plus a cheap vet on the bottom pair next ye at. Call up one of the other young guns to be the 7th D. That should help with payroll flexibility as well.

If I had to pinpoint where I am most disappointed with our defense this year, I think its with both Edmundson and TVR. They were never expected to be rocks for us, but they just seem like marginal, easily replaceable players for us, lately where I do find myself wondering often on why they're each getting minutes over Fleury, as well as thinking maybe it wouldn't be such a bad idea to see what some of the guys in Charlotte could contribute. Not that they're necessarily bad, just that I don't know if I've seen either playing well enough to justify not having seen the callups for the sake of experience this year, especially Bean.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

I'm not worried about his point production. His ability to keep up with the play looks terrible and I can't imagine what it will look like as he gets three more years on those tired wheels.

It was a lot worse at the beginning of the year than it is right now. He's never been a super-fast player, but I agree that he was slow even by his standards during the 1st half of the year. I think a lot of it was re-adjusting to a new system right after a back injury, which is why Brindy had him on the third pairing during the first half of the year. Gardiner was already back to playing top-4 minutes, and doing well with the increased TOI, before Hamilton broke his fibula. I have seen his skating improve along with it in January. As proven by Joe Pavelski, you don't have to be fast to be a positive impact player from a puck possession standpoint. It helps, maybe, but it's not the only factor.

 

[GoldiFox]

I'm not worried about his point production. His ability to keep up with the play looks terrible and I can't imagine what it will look like as he gets three more years on those tired wheels.

Terrible is a gross hyperbole. He's made some questionable decisions which have led to chances against but he's also shown some high-end skating as well. Take a look at the Nino goal last night and tell me that Gardiner can't keep up with the play.

Over the past 10 games Gardiner is:

• #3 in Canes 5v5 scoring (5 points - tied with Svech and Foegele) behind Aho and TT
• Contributing to 71.4% of total 5v5 production while he is on the ice
• #3 among D in 5v5 minutes played
• #2 among D in 5v5 CF% (52.5%) behind TVR and ahead of Pesce/Slavin
• #3 among D in 5v5 GF% (63.6%) with 7 GF and 4 GA
• #2 among D in 5v5 GA/60 (1.45) behind just Pesce
• #3 among D in 5v5 CA/60 (52.6) behind TVR and Fleury

He's playing well lately. There was a time when he deserved a lot of criticism (similar to 2018 Hamilton) but right now is not it.

Bonus Lucas Wallmark fun fact: Wallmark hasn't allowed a 5v5 goal against in the past 10 games. 4 GF and 0 GA.

 

[spockBokk]

So, Vatanen and Hischier to CAR confirmed, right????

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Terrible is a gross hyperbole. He's made some questionable decisions which have led to chances against but he's also shown some high-end skating as well. Take a look at the Nino goal last night and tell me that Gardiner can't keep up with the play.

Over the past 10 games Gardiner is:

• #3 in Canes 5v5 scoring (5 points - tied with Svech and Foegele) behind Aho and TT
• Contributing to 71.4% of total 5v5 production while he is on the ice
• #3 among D in 5v5 minutes played
• #2 among D in 5v5 CF% (52.5%) behind TVR and ahead of Pesce/Slavin
• #3 among D in 5v5 GF% (63.6%) with 7 GF and 4 GA
• #2 among D in 5v5 GA/60 (1.45) behind just Pesce
• #3 among D in 5v5 CA/60 (52.6) behind TVR and Fleury

He's playing well lately. There was a time when he deserved a lot of criticism (similar to 2018 Hamilton) but right now is not it.

Bonus Lucas Wallmark fun fact: Wallmark hasn't allowed a 5v5 goal against in the past 10 games. 4 GF and 0 GA.

assuming this is just Canes comparison, comparing him with TVR, Fleury and Edmundson is just padding his place. It means very little.

Also, he has 5 points in the last 10 ( 1 goals and 4 secondary assists). Which sounds good but he would be much lower on the list if we did the last 5 (1 point), his 4 points in 5 games outburst is what is making him look so good (10 points in his other 47 games). Im glad that he is racking up the secondary assists to pad his numbers.