Pre-Game Talk: All Purpose Off Day Thread | This wasn't what I meant by a balanced defense ...

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EightyOne

My posts are jokes. And hockey is just a game.
Nov 23, 2016
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This year is a culmination of a trend that started in the second cup year.

But it's okay, a bunch of people will call it revisionist and continue to think they're just one trade from perfection.
 

Turin

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Feb 27, 2018
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Eh, I don't think one being bad should be an excuse for every other aspect of the game that's below par.

Watched the Leafs/Sens game tonight. Ottawa's defense is horrible. Chabot's basically the only guy who can move the puck or has a clue where he's supposed to be, yet Ottawa was working their asses off all game and their forwards did as much as they humanly could to try and win the game.

Having a bad defense corps shouldn't excuse the forwards from not giving it their all.

Yea but you’d say the same thing about the Penguins when they win generally.
 

Sidney the Kidney

One last time
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Yea but you’d say the same thing about the Penguins when they win generally.

When the Pens win, it's because they either do try for most of the 60 minutes, or they get dominant individual efforts from some of their stars. I'm not sure how that's similar to Ottawa's defense being horrible, but their forwards actually giving 100% even though the defense will likely cost them the game.
 

Turin

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When the Pens win, it's because they either do try for most of the 60 minutes, or they get dominant individual efforts from some of their stars. I'm not sure how that's similar to Ottawa's defense being horrible, but their forwards actually giving 100% even though the defense will likely cost them the game.

How is it any different? :laugh: You think Ottawa is always just on full try hard mode and Pittsburgh is inexplicably lazy? That’s just your limited perception as somebody who watches Pittsburgh and saw AN Ottawa game.
 

EightyOne

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Nov 23, 2016
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How is it any different? :laugh: You think Ottawa is always just on full try hard mode and Pittsburgh is inexplicably lazy? That’s just your limited perception as somebody who watches Pittsburgh and saw AN Ottawa game.

It's kinda semantics, eh?

As long as the Pens are outplayed, they are outplayed. Whether they did 0% or 100% effort, someone else had a higher talent/skill/effort floor during any given Pens loss.

Generally. Sometimes it is truly luck---but sometimes wins are luck too.
 

Turin

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It's kinda semantics, eh?

As long as the Pens are outplayed, they are outplayed. Whether they did 0% or 100% effort, someone else had a higher talent/skill/effort floor during any given Pens loss.

Generally. Sometimes it is truly luck---but sometimes wins are luck too.

I just think effort is usually a poor evaluation thing. Brassard? Ok I can see your point. Everybody else? Nah they’re trying but can’t get the puck.
 

LOGiK

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Nov 14, 2007
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When the Pens win, it's because they either do try for most of the 60 minutes, or they get dominant individual efforts from some of their stars. I'm not sure how that's similar to Ottawa's defense being horrible, but their forwards actually giving 100% even though the defense will likely cost them the game.

And then the breach of outer space happens and the vacuum of space rips them to shreds.
Can't fly to close to the sun on wings of pastrami.
 

EightyOne

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What did he say?

From the trade thread:




Sidney The Kidney said:
This part sounds a bit ... weird.
"Brassard also found it difficult to penetrate the Penguins’ leadership structure, spearheaded by Crosby, Malkin and others.
He said it was too hard to come in as an outsider and feel part of the group given what the Penguins’ core had accomplished together. It was similar to what Trevor Daley experienced in Chicago a couple years ago before coming to Pittsburgh and thriving.

“Yes, they have good guys, they make you feel unbelievable, their organization, staff, everyone is unreal,” Brassard said. “But the fact that they have star power, they won, it’s the same core and everything … you’re coming in as a new guy, and it’s not an easy thing to do.”
Maybe it's my interpretation, but it sounds like he didn't seem to fit in even off the ice or something.
 

Peat

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I don't think the Pens players looked lazy in the opening against Carolina. I do think they looked easily knocked off their game mentally when the team generated all the best chances then went behind to a slightly soft long range wrister.

Also, while I don't think the Pens players look lazy that often, I don't think I see full on whirlwind effort as often as I'd like. This team used to be frantic chasing games. Now, not so much.

edit: p.s. I think my new plan for the season is to drug/hypnotise them so they think every other game is against the Caps.
 

LittleSpoon

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Jan 17, 2016
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I think the team just needs to develop the mindset of shot quantity over quality at this point. Instead of trying to make the perfect play in the ozone and even on the breakout. Just make the simple play, and battle for the loose pucks. Nothing breaks down coverage better than a shot on goal and regaining possession after the rebound.
 

EightyOne

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Nov 23, 2016
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I think the team just needs to develop the mindset of shot quantity over quality at this point. Instead of trying to make the perfect play in the ozone and even on the breakout. Just make the simple play, and battle for the loose pucks. Nothing breaks down coverage better than a shot on goal and regaining possession after the rebound.

Except:

Dmen can't breakout pass with regularity

Forwards are confused in NZ

Forecheck is a two step behind joke and has won like five puck battles all year


Otherwise, yeah, sure, let's shoot the puck.
 

Peat

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Except:

Dmen can't breakout pass with regularity

Forwards are confused in NZ

Forecheck is a two step behind joke and has won like five puck battles all year


Otherwise, yeah, sure, let's shoot the puck.

Gotta start somewhere though. More pucks on net rather than overpassing in the hope of a perfect chance isn't a bad place to do so.
 

EightyOne

My posts are jokes. And hockey is just a game.
Nov 23, 2016
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Gotta start somewhere though. More pucks on net rather than overpassing in the hope of a perfect chance isn't a bad place to do so.

If they get into the offensive zone, then yes.
 

Pancakes

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We need to win this game. We have Tampa next, and I have little faith that we beat them again.
 

Peat

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If they get into the offensive zone, then yes.

They get in the offensive zone plenty. Its converting that's the issue.

Although, honestly, some of those chances vs Carolina should have gone in. When you pass up 2 1v1s (more probably) in the first period alone, "Shoot more" mightn't be the answer.
 

Honour Over Glory

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Jan 30, 2012
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Lol the picture.

qdL34WW.jpg
 
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Sidney the Kidney

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How is it any different? :laugh: You think Ottawa is always just on full try hard mode and Pittsburgh is inexplicably lazy? That’s just your limited perception as somebody who watches Pittsburgh and saw AN Ottawa game.

Why are you assuming my comment about Ottawa was exclusively based on last night's game?

I probably watch more Sens and Leafs games than I do Penguins games, just by virtue of where I live and what the television channels I get show most often. So my impression of the Sens as a "crappy defense, but hard work most of the time" team is based over the full season. I just brought up last night's game as an example because it was fresh in my mind.

In any case, if you don't think effort has been one of the issues for the Pens, then we might as well agree to disagree on the topic because IMO, aside from roster composition, that's been one of the bigger disappointments when I watch them the past couple of years.

Edit: I'd also deviated from my original point, which is that we've seen that the Pens can actually win games even with this crappy defense when they actually play a solid 60 minutes. So my point is simply ignoring the games with a lack of effort because of a bad defense ignores an issue that could still be present even if JR upgrades and fixes the defense.
 
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