All Ovechkin Talk (Part II): 50 Goals for #8

[hockeykicker]

I can just see the arguments this summer if crosby takes the art ross and ovy the richard

what arguments? ovechkin wins the award he is SUPPOSED to win by a good margin, Crosby wins the award he is SUPPOSED to win and still ovechkin is somehow a better hart canidate again

 

[Syckle78]

It's a good thing the nhl doesn't always feel that way. Crosby is the only player in the league who is easily above a ppg. He's playing at a 90+ point pace

Sidney the pace Crosby. Wonder how many posts on hf about Crosby have contained that word. It's always woulda, coulda, shoulda. Meanwhile ovie absolutely accomplished a tremendous feat and the Crosby brigade is here to talk about pace.

 

[geoo9]

He's got a serious shot at catching Lemieux (218 goals away) and cracking the top-10, but I just can't see him getting the 422 goals he'll need to catch Gretzky.

*Maybe* if we didn't have either lockout he'd get there, but I can't see him scoring 50 goals/year for the next 8 years.

This is different new NHL. Nobody can repeat 88th records -BUT IF HE will DO THAT - HE WILL turn to BEST PLAYER EVER - Need to be a superhuman to that these days

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Sidney the pace Crosby. Wonder how many posts on hf about Crosby have contained that word. It's always woulda, coulda, shoulda. Meanwhile ovie absolutely accomplished a tremendous feat and the Crosby brigade is here to talk about pace.

Oh good thing he's still actually leading the points race.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Even now crosby is outscoring him with 5 less games played

No, he's out-assisting him. Ovechkin has scored double the amount Crosby has.

 

[Fantomas]

Offensive Point Shares
1. Alex Ovechkin-WSH 9.7
2. Rick Nash-NYR 8.5
3. John Tavares-NYI 8.2
4. Vladimir Tarasenko-STL 8.2
5. Tyler Seguin-DAL 8.1
6. Steven Stamkos-TBL 8.0
7. Sidney Crosby-PIT 7.7
8. Evgeni Malkin-PIT 7.5
9. Max Pacioretty-MTL 7.4
10. Jiri Hudler-CGY 7.4
11. Jamie Benn-DAL 7.2
12. Joe Pavelski-SJS 7.1

 

[hockeykicker]

Sidney the pace Crosby. Wonder how many posts on hf about Crosby have contained that word. It's always woulda, coulda, shoulda. Meanwhile ovie absolutely accomplished a tremendous feat and the Crosby brigade is here to talk about pace.

exactly its all crosby could have done this or that but injuries stopped him. would he have done that? who knows, maybe yes, maybe no. will never know so they really need to stop using that argument

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

No, he's out-assisting him. Ovechkin has scored double the amount Crosby has.

Points=scoring which is why the art ross is referred to as the scoring title and never the Richard

 

[Syckle78]

Oh good thing he's still actually leading the points race.

And ovie has obliterated the scoring race. Grats to thr pace on his assists. Go make a thread about him.

 

[hockeykicker]

Points=scoring which is why the art ross is referred to as the scoring title and never the Richard

then what are goals? are they not scoring too?'

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

then what are goals? are they not scoring too?'

Scoring title= art ross
Goal scoring title=richard

 

[geoo9]

Points=scoring which is why the art ross is referred to as the scoring title and never the Richard

what will be if league starts to give points for 3d assissts or 4th ? Goals never will changed but secondary assists is a artificial term in my opinion
Look at it from this point
change nickname to SecondaryKing though)

 

[WarriorofTime]

Points=scoring which is why the art ross is referred to as the scoring title and never the Richard

Look at "Goals Created"
1. Ovechkin: 33.2
2. Tavares: 30.2
3. Stamkos: 29.0
4. Nash: 28.8
5. Tarasenko: 28.3
6. Seguin: 28.1
7. Paccioretty: 27.7
8. Crosby: 27.7

Personally, I find "points" to be a very flawed stat and I think we are just now coming to the realization that straight "points" isn't particularly useful to look at. It's like Batting Average in baseball.

"Points" places a secondary assist as being equally valuable as a goal when all common sense should dictate that they are not equally valuable.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Look at "Goals Created"
1. Ovechkin: 33.2
2. Tavares: 30.2
3. Stamkos: 29.0
4. Nash: 28.8
5. Tarasenko: 28.3
6. Seguin: 28.1
7. Paccioretty: 27.7
8. Crosby: 27.7

Personally, I find "points" to be a very flawed stat and I think we are just now coming to the realization that straight "points" isn't particularly to look at. It's like Batting Average in baseball.

"Points" places a secondary assist as being equally valuable as a goal when all common sense should dictate that they are not equally valuable.

The art ross has been handed out since 1948. The nhl has been operating with the point system for over 90 years. It is what it is and the art ross will always have more prestige than the Richard

 

[hockeykicker]

Scoring title= art ross
Goal scoring title=richard

lets try this again, you said scoring. and goals are scoring. doesnt matter what they are called. its still scoring. if you wanna believe that the art ross is more important then fine believe it. there are two ways to get an assist and only one way to get a goal (i hate using this argument)

means ovechkin has to do it all himself, crosby can make great passes yes but if others dont put it in the net they lose and the trophies are meaningless

you have to put the puck in the net. ovechkin does that. crosby can make a pass, go to the bench and still get an assist, he can make a pass and malkin can do all the work and score.

sure ovechkin has to get passes too but he in fact scores goals

 

[Syckle78]

One guy has ten more goals than anyone else in the league. The other guy has is tied with eight other players for twenty fifth in goals but he's statistically better because he has four more points due to assists? Are you freaking serious?

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

lets try this again, you said scoring. and goals are scoring. doesnt matter what they are called. its still scoring. if you wanna believe that the art ross is more important then fine believe it. there are two ways to get an assist and only one way to get a goal (i hate using this argument)

means ovechkin has to do it all himself, crosby can make great passes yes but if others dont put it in the net they lose and the trophies are meaningless

you have to put the puck in the net. ovechkin does that. crosby can make a pass, go to the bench and still get an assist, he can make a pass and malkin can do all the work and score.

sure ovechkin has to get passes too but he in fact scores goals

Scoring points is what it is called. Point scoring in hockey. Every hockey league in the works refers to its scoring title on points. It goes to whoever created either by scoring a goal or assisting.

 

[CapsJunkie]

OVI=beast...they should have an exclusive 50 club (only player in the league with 50 goals) and name it the Ovechkin trophy...But he would be the only player to keep wining it...Best goal scorer of our time

 

[Classicnamesup]

OV's year >>>> Sidney's year

Nothing more to be discussed about it, OV is neck and neck with Price for the Hart, Crosby isn't in the conversation.

 

[Syckle78]

The art ross has been handed out since 1948. The nhl has been operating with the point system for over 90 years. It is what it is and the art ross will always have more prestige than the Richard

Yea and people used to value goalie wins, pitcher wins, batting average, plus minus, etc etc. Things change. Basing your argument on because it's always been isn't a good foundation. Use a little common sense and remove the bias and try to tell us with a straight face Crosby has been statistically better.

 

[WarriorofTime]

The art ross has been handed out since 1948. The nhl has been operating with the point system for over 90 years. It is what it is and the art ross will always have more prestige than the Richard

This is a new and exciting time for sports (at least for stat geeks). People are beginning to understand better that traditional categories are not really great ways to assess values. They still call the guy who hits for the highest average the "Batting Champ" in Baseball but nobody cares about that anymore. You're basically just saying goals = 1st assists = 2nd assists because that's just the way it's been looked at traditionally and the Art Ross is a much older trophy than the Rocket Richard. I'm not too compelled by that.

 

[geoo9]

Scoring points is what it is called. Point scoring in hockey. Every hockey league in the works refers to its scoring title on points. It goes to whoever created either by scoring a goal or assisting.

What if league starts to counted only 1st assists
Sid will be no were near at top
So guys when did NHL begins to count 2 d assists as a points? anybody knows it?

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Yea and people used to value goalie wins, pitcher wins, batting average, plus minus, etc etc. Things change. Basing your argument on because it's always been isn't a good foundation. Use a little common sense and remove the bias and try to tell us with a straight face Crosby has been statistically better.

We will see who wins the art ross.... Goodnight

 

[ryan519*]

He has literally surpassed the guy the goal scoring trophy was named after..

 

[hockeykicker]

Scoring points is what it is called. Point scoring in hockey. Every hockey league in the works refers to its scoring title on points. It goes to whoever created either by scoring a goal or assisting.

yes but your saying that crosby is somehow better because he has more assists? uh yay? it is harder to score a goal then it is to get an assist

look at the caps first line lately and see marcus johannson. watch the caps games, and look at marcus johannson. then you will see why ovechkin isnt way ahead. look at barry trotz, ovechkin isnt out there for empty nets, there could easily be another 6-8 points there