Rumor: Alex Pietrangelo discussion #2- Will it happen?

[stickty111]

Last one over the limit.
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[Wafflewhipper]

I smell a Stamkos #2 under normal circumstances but St Louis is staunchly against signing bonuses. As soon as this happens if it does, we are trending in to a entirely different period.
The changes that will be necessary to structure him in would be significant..

$8,000,000 A.P with $6,106,000 space right now. So .......

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

If I'm Dubas I'm waiting until a week before the October 9th deadline (so this Friday) and then I'm calling St. Louis to see how receptive they are to a sign and trade. Would help lower the cap hit if we were to sign him over 8 years instead of 7, and St. Louis gets something over just letting him walk. Hell maybe you call them up today, my one week deadline is just so it doesn't come off as insulting.

 

[MapleLeafs9]

I just can’t see it. I felt like the Tavares signing was a sure fire thing because of the circumstances. But with our cap the way it is now, can’t see us giving him $8.5+ million unless Marner is traded

 

[egd27]

Signing Pietrangelo isn't an emotional, reactionary move.

If they don't move WN or MM it's a completely emotional, reactionary move.

 

[Dekes For Days]

If they don't move WN or MM it's a completely emotional, reactionary move.

Nylander and Marner have nothing to do with that move. Signing Pietrangelo isn't an emotional, reactionary move. As already explained, he's a free, elite player in our biggest hole, that we've been looking to fill for a while. We would have had interest in him regardless of the outcome of our series (where we actually played good defense).

 

[seanlinden]

If I'm Dubas I'm waiting until a week before the October 9th deadline (so this Friday) and then I'm calling St. Louis to see how receptive they are to a sign and trade. Would help lower the cap hit if we were to sign him over 8 years instead of 7, and St. Louis gets something over just letting him walk. Hell maybe you call them up today, my one week deadline is just so it doesn't come off as insulting.

Personally, I believe that St. Louis wants to retain AP.

I also believe that they think / feel that they have a better chance of doing so if an 8-year deal is off the table....which means that Armstrong really doesn't have any reason to participate in a sign & trade situation.

The "interview period" isn't a thing anymore. It's not like AP can really make his decision before October 9th.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

If they don't move WN or MM it's a completely emotional, reactionary move.

this makes no sense. How would keeping Nylander/Marner on the team make signing him emotional and reactionary?

 

[kb]

this makes no sense. How would keeping Nylander/Marner on the team make signing him emotional and reactionary?

Because you are 100% correct and that take makes no sense - at all.

 

[Sonofamitch]

Nope this has Steven Stamkos sweepstakes written all over this.

 

[Stephen]

Personally, I believe that St. Louis wants to retain AP.

I also believe that they think / feel that they have a better chance of doing so if an 8-year deal is off the table....which means that Armstrong really doesn't have any reason to participate in a sign & trade situation.

The "interview period" isn't a thing anymore. It's not like AP can really make his decision before October 9th.

Nothing that St. Louis has done to date would suggest that their number one priority is to re-sign Pietrangelo.

Seems like they won the cup and their primary objective as a mid market franchise is to avoid the entanglements of rewarding a core piece of a championship team retirement money - which maybe they feel is what undid Chicago and Los Angeles as contenders.

If that means letting Petro walk because he can't fit into a team friendly deal, so be it. Turn the page with Faulk and Scandella and live to fight another day. Frankly it reminds me of the way Shapiro and Atkins unceremoniously dismantled the Toronto Blue Jays after 2016, 2017. Just let the air out of the tires and retool.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

Personally, I believe that St. Louis wants to retain AP.

I also believe that they think / feel that they have a better chance of doing so if an 8-year deal is off the table....which means that Armstrong really doesn't have any reason to participate in a sign & trade situation.

The "interview period" isn't a thing anymore. It's not like AP can really make his decision before October 9th.

They want to keep him so bad maybe they should stop dicking around and offer him some signing bonuses then if that’s his line in the sand.

In any case, whatever St. Louis wants doesn’t change the fact that if the Leafs are indeed serious about acquiring him they should at least inquire about a sign and trade. If St. Louis has no interest fine, but you won’t know unless you ask.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

If they don't move WN or MM it's a completely emotional, reactionary move.

I feel it’s the complete opposite. If the Leafs did move one of MM or WN that’d be more emotional and knee-jerk than trying to sign the epitome of that this team needs.

 

[seanlinden]

Nothing that St. Louis has done to date would suggest that their number one priority is to re-sign Pietrangelo.

Seems like they won the cup and their primary objective as a mid market franchise is to avoid the entanglements of rewarding a core piece of a championship team retirement money - which maybe they feel is what undid Chicago and Los Angeles as contenders.

If that means letting Petro walk because he can't fit into a team friendly deal, so be it. Turn the page with Faulk and Scandella and live to fight another day. Frankly it reminds me of the way Shapiro and Atkins unceremoniously dismantled the Toronto Blue Jays after 2016, 2017. Just let the air out of the tires and retool.

I didn't say it was their #1 priority -- their #1 priority is probably to get him back UNDER THEIR TERMS.

Armstrong's focus is to get the team back to the cup, but he's not prepared to hand out long NMCs or big bonuses to do it.

Signing a 30 year old player to a 7 year deal with a full NMC and big bonuses is problematic. Signing an 8 year deal is even worse. By taking 8 years off the table for everyone, the differences between St. Louis offer and the others is going to be smaller.

To put it more simply -- let's assume that DA is willing to do a 5 year NTC as he did with Faulk and Schenn. 2 years of exposure are better than 3.

 

[kb]

I feel it’s the complete opposite. If the Leafs did move one of MM or WN that’d be more emotional and knee-jerk than trying to sign the epitome of that this team needs.

I think most posters understand this.

It's fine to trade either of them, but the only way they get traded is a pure hockey trade for equivalent value.

 

[Menzinger]

Nothing that St. Louis has done to date would suggest that their number one priority is to re-sign Pietrangelo.

Seems like they won the cup and their primary objective as a mid market franchise is to avoid the entanglements of rewarding a core piece of a championship team retirement money - which maybe they feel is what undid Chicago and Los Angeles as contenders.

If that means letting Petro walk because he can't fit into a team friendly deal, so be it. Turn the page with Faulk and Scandella and live to fight another day. Frankly it reminds me of the way Shapiro and Atkins unceremoniously dismantled the Toronto Blue Jays after 2016, 2017. Just let the air out of the tires and retool.

Imo thr Blues were likely done with Pietro the moment they signed Faulk.

There's still a decent chance he resigns if he caves on the structure demands, but theres definitely a fair amount of evidence of tensions between the sides.

 

[seanlinden]

They want to keep him so bad maybe they should stop dicking around and offer him some signing bonuses then if that’s his line in the sand.

In any case, whatever St. Louis wants doesn’t change the fact that if the Leafs are indeed serious about acquiring him they should at least inquire about a sign and trade. If St. Louis has no interest fine, but you won’t know unless you ask.

As I mentioned, they want to keep him on their terms.

The difference between a bonus-laden NMC 8 year vs straight up 8 year is bigger than the difference between a couple of 7 year options.

 

[A1LeafNation]

60% STL
40% TOR

St Louis will match on the bonuses unless Covid hit their bank account bug enough.

Toronto will pounce if St Louis doesn't come up with the scratch.

 

[qqaz]

He will get better offers than what Toronto can afford, cap wise. So it will come down to bonuses (an underrated advantage), and his preference of team.

If he signs here, the will be some serious cap issues. It probably means moving Andersen, which I don't like. And then will put Rielly and Hyman in jeopardy, which I don't like. We just can't keep everyone while adding 8 million.

I'd prefer to sign someone Tanev or Hamonic, or trade for someone like Manson.

 

[egd27]

As already explained, he's a free, elite player

He is not free.........if there were no cap, he would be free or if the team had enough cap space he'd be free(er)

There is no way to add this player without somehow getting rid of players in order to pay his contract, that is not free.

Anyway, hopefully Kid Kyle has a decent plan this time if they sign him.

 

[Dekes For Days]

He is not free

He is free in terms of assets necessary to acquire him. The assets necessary to acquire a player like this outside of free agency would be significant.

There is no way to add this player without somehow getting rid of players in order to pay his contract

That is not a loss of asset. That is a transformation of that asset value into a different form.

 

[kb]

He will get better offers than what Toronto can afford, cap wise. So it will come down to bonuses (an underrated advantage), and his preference of team.

If he signs here, the will be some serious cap issues. It probably means moving Andersen, which I don't like. And then will put Rielly and Hyman in jeopardy, which I don't like. We just can't keep everyone while adding 8 million.

I'd prefer to sign someone Tanev or Hamonic, or trade for someone like Manson.

If the Leafs hope for improvement over this past season, these moves won't be enough.

 

[Eternal Leaf]

He is not free.........if there were no cap, he would be free or if the team had enough cap space he'd be free(er)

There is no way to add this player without somehow getting rid of players in order to pay his contract, that is not free.

Anyway, hopefully Kid Kyle has a decent plan this time if they sign him.

Even in the cap world, he's a free asset.

Any player that's lost will be moved for other assets (i.e. draft picks, prospects, a cheaper player).

 

[kb]

Even in the cap world, he's a free asset.

Any player that's lost will be moved for other assets (i.e. draft picks, prospects, a cheaper player).

Exactly. Players will be moved out, and assets acquired. If you trade for someone, it's costing assets.

 

[qqaz]

If the Leafs hope for improvement over this past season, these moves won't be enough.

I disagree. They went the max games in their series losses the last 3 years. It's not like they've been an easy out. The difference between our losses and a deep playoff run might be as small as a single win.

I think the team can win as they are, let alone with some small improvements. Just a full year without Babcock might be the difference.