AHL Affiliate?

[gstommylee]

Idaho?

yea Boise was one of the possiblities for the AHL team.

 

[PCSPounder]

There is a proposed 12,000 seat indoor stadium on the north side of the I-10 just off of Cook ST on Varner RD that may be able to converted for the AHL team.

I want to thank you for giving enough details that it was actually searchable.

Plan for 12,000-seat indoor stadium and sports complex in Thousand Palms in place

Now, it's one thing to say "it's meant for a football team, it won't be for hockey." Really, they're trying to attract a soccer team that probably helps fund this guy's football team. Hockey could theoretically do that, but people in Seattle are fully aware of the hockey history of the Tacoma Dome.

Thing is, read this. A new indoor sports arena in the desert? Here are 10 ways it could be put to use Usually, a writer has been talking to the protagonist about possibilities and folds SOME of them into the opinion piece. That's another way to read the intent here. BTW... Agua Caliente Clippers would be worse off in this stadium than they are in Ontario. That's another reason why I brought up Tacoma.

It's natural to want some local reaction to this, even if it drips with sarcasm. Sure. A $300 million stadium is totally coming to the Coachella Valley.

The key indicator, though? At least every month, the organization dedicated to Major League Baseball in Portland finds a way to get into the local news. The scale might be different in the Coachella Valley, but because sports media usually fawns over proposals like this, they're easily baited into writing stuff about proposals. It's the yummiest candy. To NOT have anything written since last July on this is either (1) very indicative of lack of effort because the project isn't gaining any financing, or (2) demonstrating that the proponent of this project doesn't know what he's doing. Or maybe (1) and (2) are the same in this instance.

I actually give this proposal a 10% chance of happening (chances of MLB in Portland, meanwhile, 5%). Still, that's meh.

In the end, I don't think it's an accident that the tweets today only mention Boise.

 

[gstommylee]

I want to thank you for giving enough details that it was actually searchable.

Plan for 12,000-seat indoor stadium and sports complex in Thousand Palms in place

Now, it's one thing to say "it's meant for a football team, it won't be for hockey." Really, they're trying to attract a soccer team that probably helps fund this guy's football team. Hockey could theoretically do that, but people in Seattle are fully aware of the hockey history of the Tacoma Dome.

Thing is, read this. A new indoor sports arena in the desert? Here are 10 ways it could be put to use Usually, a writer has been talking to the protagonist about possibilities and folds SOME of them into the opinion piece. That's another way to read the intent here. BTW... Agua Caliente Clippers would be worse off in this stadium than they are in Ontario. That's another reason why I brought up Tacoma.

It's natural to want some local reaction to this, even if it drips with sarcasm. Sure. A $300 million stadium is totally coming to the Coachella Valley.

The key indicator, though? At least every month, the organization dedicated to Major League Baseball in Portland finds a way to get into the local news. The scale might be different in the Coachella Valley, but because sports media usually fawns over proposals like this, they're easily baited into writing stuff about proposals. It's the yummiest candy. To NOT have anything written since last July on this is either (1) very indicative of lack of effort because the project isn't gaining any financing, or (2) demonstrating that the proponent of this project doesn't know what he's doing. Or maybe (1) and (2) are the same in this instance.

I actually give this proposal a 10% chance of happening (chances of MLB in Portland, meanwhile, 5%). Still, that's meh.

In the end, I don't think it's an accident that the tweets today only mention Boise.

Btw MLB comissioner is actually interested in expanding but they got 2 teams to deal with first. Oakland A's and Tampa bay both need new stadiums.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Btw MLB comissioner is actually interested in expanding but they got 2 teams to deal with first. Oakland A's and Tampa bay both need new stadiums.

Oakland likely stays, tommy.....since they border ORACLE....

 

[BattleBorn]

Btw MLB comissioner is actually interested in expanding but they got 2 teams to deal with first. Oakland A's and Tampa bay both need new stadiums.

Oakland looks like they're on the way to their new stadium. Hoping to start construction by 2021. Privately funded, but there's a few tax issues and Colosseum debt concerns. Should be pretty much guaranteed to get done, though.

Tampa is Tampa and is an actual issue. I don't really see locations for MLB expansion developing enough over the next decade to make actual expansion an option, though.

 

[gstommylee]

Oakland likely stays, tommy.....since they border ORACLE....

Right. I don't expect them to relocate.

 

[StreetHawk]

yea Boise was one of the possiblities for the AHL team.

There are flights from Seattle to Boise so that’s good. Only drawback for Boise is the distance from the other teams in the west which are all in California and Tucson.

I’m still hopeful Vancouver moves theirs from Utica to the west, be it California or somewhere else.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

There are flights from Seattle to Boise so that’s good. Only drawback for Boise is the distance from the other teams in the west which are all in California and Tucson.

I’m still hopeful Vancouver moves theirs from Utica to the west, be it California or somewhere else.

there's no guarantee that Idaho will join Seattle, Vancouver in the west likely never happens though, Street, Esche wanted in and the Canucks got the break when the Blues decided ownership was getting too expensive on the affiliate level

 

[PCSPounder]

Btw MLB comissioner is actually interested in expanding but they got 2 teams to deal with first. Oakland A's and Tampa bay both need new stadiums.

Let's keep this straight. Rob Manfred expresses an interest in expansion because it draws out a Portland stadium proposal that MLB uses to ensure Oakland gives the Athletics a semblance of what they want. Oakland has been calling the bluff and asking for a pound of flesh... and they may well get it, whatever that entails (it seems the city is balking at the Athletics' preferred location). Of course, Lew Wolff found a way with the Earthquakes in San Jose and knows he'd be throwing away big TV money if he relocated anywhere but maybe Los Angeles or New York... which also isn't happening.

BTW... the media guy in Portland staking his existence on bringing this to fruition has been hyping Tampa as a bigger possibility, basically characterizing the Ybor City proposal as their "last chance." No, it's not.

Once Oakland and Tampa are sorted, then MLB decides if there are enough markets truly interested to start up a competition for two new teams. I know about Portland, there's some whispers from San Antonio, and things are supposedly more silent in Montreal. If there's four cities, it might be a thing. I wouldn't bet on that in this environment. Mind you, the timetable probably stretches far into the 2020s before this is even a consideration, mostly because the lease in St. Petersburg ends in 2027.

 

[StreetHawk]

there's no guarantee that Idaho will join Seattle, Vancouver in the west likely never happens though, Street, Esche wanted in and the Canucks got the break when the Blues decided ownership was getting too expensive on the affiliate level

Canucks extended with Utica for another 6 years but with out clauses. Maybe they wait to see where Seattle places their AHL team to decide. Now that there are 5 teams in California it now makes sense to move it west. Not sure why they didn’t take the plunge rather than extend in Utica.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Canucks extended with Utica for another 6 years but with out clauses. Maybe they wait to see where Seattle places their AHL team to decide. Now that there are 5 teams in California it now makes sense to move it west. Not sure why they didn’t take the plunge rather than extend in Utica.

but it is the deal they're not going anywhere, Street, the only way it changes in the options is Esche leaves being the majority owner, Canucks like the way the Comets are run/operated if their fanbase doesn't get why the Canucks run the operation, that's why the extension, but what fanbase likes every decision the parent club makes whether you understand why they make those decisions

 

[gstommylee]

there's no guarantee that Idaho will join Seattle, Vancouver in the west likely never happens though, Street, Esche wanted in and the Canucks got the break when the Blues decided ownership was getting too expensive on the affiliate level

AHL already said team #32 (Seattle's AHL) will play in the pacific. And so far the tweet suggests Idaho Steelheads is gonna be the AHL team (via promotion/expansion) for Seattle. Seattle's AHL will not play in any other division than pacific.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

AHL already said team #32 (Seattle's AHL) will play in the pacific. And so far the tweet suggests Idaho Steelheads is gonna be the AHL team (via promotion/expansion) for Seattle. Seattle's AHL will not play in any other division than pacific.

the point being, tommy, will Idaho be owned by Seattle, the way Colorado is

 

[BattleBorn]

AHL already said team #32 (Seattle's AHL) will play in the pacific. And so far the tweet suggests Idaho Steelheads is gonna be the AHL team (via promotion/expansion) for Seattle. Seattle's AHL will not play in any other division than pacific.

I'm not doubting, but do you have the tweet handy?

 

[gstommylee]

I'm not doubting, but do you have the tweet handy?

 

[BattleBorn]

I saw that one, the one that said Seattle's AHL team was playing in the Pacific was the one I was looking for.

 

[gstommylee]

I saw that one, the one that said Seattle's AHL team was playing in the Pacific was the one I was looking for.

i'll have to dig for it.

 

[BattleBorn]

i'll have to dig for it.

Here's why I'm asking. While I believe the Seattle NHL team wants to own their AHL team and that they'll play in the Pacific Division of the AHL once they have an AHL team, I also believe they wanted to start play in 2020. While I didn't think that was likely, I was told it was almost guaranteed. We're now here.

My goal is to try to figure out what's going to happen, not what happens if things go perfectly. They almost never do. There's a lot of practical hurdles in the way of a Seattle owned 2021-2022 AHL team playing in the Pacific Division, and any definitive statement saying that's going to happen will alleviate my concerns and prove incorrect my doubts.

 

[gstommylee]

Here's why I'm asking. While I believe the Seattle NHL team wants to own their AHL team and that they'll play in the Pacific Division of the AHL once they have an AHL team, I also believe they wanted to start play in 2020. While I didn't think that was likely, I was told it was almost guaranteed. We're now here.

My goal is to try to figure out what's going to happen, not what happens if things go perfectly. They almost never do. There's a lot of practical hurdles in the way of a Seattle owned 2021-2022 AHL team playing in the Pacific Division, and any definitive statement saying that's going to happen will alleviate my concerns and prove incorrect my doubts.

Regarding start time being 21-22 for the AHL.

Seattle AHL Affiliate Expected for 2021-22 Season - Arena Digest

 

[BattleBorn]

Okay, so it's nothing definite. That's what I figured.

Don't get me wrong, I think that's the eventual result. I just think that if we're hoping that the Idaho Steelheads are announced as the fully owned AHL subsidiary of the Seattle NHL team next Monday, the chances of that are small.

There's a lot of considerations to AHL team locations. It's not an accident that they're all pretty close to each other in the Pacific, it has to do with travel budgets for all the teams, not just the new team. I'd think they'd want another Pacific team to join somewhere north of the California teams to help scheduling and travel costs if things go perfectly. I also wonder how Seattle's planning to get the personnel for their owned team after a single draft without spending money to sign AHL pros for no reason other than to make their AHL team competitive, which doesn't matter much at all.

 

[gstommylee]

Okay, so it's nothing definite. That's what I figured.

Don't get me wrong, I think that's the eventual result. I just think that if we're hoping that the Idaho Steelheads are announced as the fully owned AHL subsidiary of the Seattle NHL team next Monday, the chances of that are small.

There's a lot of considerations to AHL team locations. It's not an accident that they're all pretty close to each other in the Pacific, it has to do with travel budgets for all the teams, not just the new team. I'd think they'd want another Pacific team to join somewhere north of the California teams to help scheduling and travel costs if things go perfectly. I also wonder how Seattle's planning to get the personnel for their owned team after a single draft without spending money to sign AHL pros for no reason other than to make their AHL team competitive, which doesn't matter much at all.

Just to note the original announcement for the AHL team for Seattle was suppose to be last march that didn't happen. Seattle's ownership group has kept quiet about the AHL team in terms what's going to actually happen. Regarding owning the Idaho Steel heads it probably wouldn't take so long in terms of purchasing that franchise than having to build a separate building for said AHL team in another location. But with the ECHL team being the AHL team there should already players on the roster with the exemption of Dallas' players.

And it would be insane for seattle's AHL to play in any other division other than pacific. Even Vancouver's AHL team being in the eastern part of north America is ridicilous.

 

[BattleBorn]

And it would be stupid for seattle's AHL to play in any other division other than pacific. Even Vancouver's AHL team being in the eastern part of north America is stupid.

It's really not.

There's a plethora of concerns other than proximity to the parent team when it comes to AHL location. The two or three times a year you need an AHL call up quickly and are also at home might not be worth buying an AHL team and moving them or buying an ECHL team and promoting them. Especially when it's compared to the costs of having every single AHL away game involve a charter flight and the outside pressure from your fellow AHL teams not wanting to fly to every game against your AHL team if there's a viable alternative that doesn't involve that.

I mean, adding Idaho to the slate adds a couple hundred grand at least to every other Pacific AHL team's travel costs. Let alone what it would cost Seattle to fly to every away game instead of driving like they would if their team was in California.

 

[gstommylee]

It's really not.

There's a plethora of concerns other than proximity to the parent team when it comes to AHL location. The two or three times a year you need an AHL call up quickly and are also at home might not be worth buying an AHL team and moving them or buying an ECHL team and promoting them. Especially when it's compared to the costs of having every single AHL away game involve a charter flight and the outside pressure from your fellow AHL teams not wanting to fly to every game against your AHL team if there's a viable alternative that doesn't involve that.

And if AHL wants Seattle's AHL to be in pacific it'll be in the pacific. With out a major restructure alignment wise and relocations of several AHL teams it would be hard for there to be some "other" AHL team to be in the pacific instead of Seattle. AHL really needs more teams out west and i don't see any other way it'll work. Colorado plays in the pacific and they are further east than the Idaho team is thats how silly the alignment is.

 

[BattleBorn]

And if AHL wants Seattle's AHL to be in pacific it'll be in the pacific. With out a major restructure alignment wise and relocations of several AHL teams it would be hard for there to be some "other" AHL team to be in the pacific instead of Seattle. AHL really needs more teams out west and i don't see any other way it'll work. Colorado plays in the pacific and they are further east than the Idaho team is thats how silly the alignment is.

The AHL needs no teams out west, they resisted teams out west forever because the west isn't the AHL's traditional territory. The entire west coast was left without high level minor league hockey since the collapse of the IHL. That's why they require Pacific Division AHL teams to be owned by NHL teams. The AHL is an East Coast league.

The only AHL teams that are in the AHL Pacific Division will be owned by NHL teams forever because the AHL isn't interested in "growing the game" they're interested in a sustainable minor league, that involves NHL teams subsidizing teams outside of their traditional territory.

My evaluation of the situation is that Seattle said they wanted an AHL team close to the parent club, and that requires team ownership due to AHL rules. I think Seattle wants to own their team, but I just question whether it will be Idaho since Idaho doesn't serve much of the purposes required of a AHL team other than being "close" and providing a claim for Idaho to be part of Seattle NHL's territory.

I also think the AHL Pacific teams (again, all owned/paid for by NHL teams) will want to find a way to get two games out of a charter flight contract to Idaho by trying to figure out how to get a second team near Idaho (SLC?) if that's the way it goes. That, of course opens a whole new can of worms since Vegas is happy in Chicago and Vancouver is east coast and locked in. I think it's more likely, based on logic alone, that the Seattle AHL team winds up in California in the short term with eventual plans to locate in in Idaho once Vancouver opens up. I could definitely be wrong, but it's what makes the most sense for Seattle and the other Pacific division teams logistically.

 

[gstommylee]

The AHL needs no teams out west, they resisted teams out west forever because the west isn't the AHL's traditional territory. The entire west coast was left without high level minor league hockey since the collapse of the IHL. That's why they require Pacific Division AHL teams to be owned by NHL teams. The AHL is an East Coast league.

The only AHL teams that are in the AHL Pacific Division will be owned by NHL teams forever because the AHL isn't interested in "growing the game" they're interested in a sustainable minor league, that involves NHL teams subsidizing teams outside of their traditional territory.

My evaluation of the situation is that Seattle said they wanted an AHL team close to the parent club, and that requires team ownership due to AHL rules. I think Seattle wants to own their team, but I just question whether it will be Idaho since Idaho doesn't serve much of the purposes required of a AHL team other than being "close" and providing a claim for Idaho to be part of Seattle NHL's territory.

I also think the AHL Pacific teams (again, all owned/paid for by NHL teams) will want to find a way to get two games out of a charter flight contract to Idaho by trying to figure out how to get a second team near Idaho (SLC?) if that's the way it goes. That, of course opens a whole new can of worms since Vegas is happy in Chicago and Vancouver is east coast and locked in. I think it's more likely, based on logic alone, that the Seattle AHL team winds up in California in the short term with eventual plans to locate in in Idaho once Vancouver opens up. I could definitely be wrong, but it's what makes the most sense for Seattle and the other Pacific division teams logistically.

The person that made today's tweet wouldn't be saying Idaho steel heads unless he is hearing something out of Seattle NHL and the AHL SLC is not going to happen for any hockey team.