Value of: Adam Fox (Canes)

GoldiFox

Registered User
Apr 21, 2014
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I'm not a Flames fan btw.
He was a highly touted prospect who had no intention to sign in Calgary so he was included in the trade before they lost time for nothing.
I don't think he was designed as one of the centerpiece but congrats getting a good young player as an add-on.

I didn’t say you were a Flames fan. I was testing your hypothesis of a player being considered a “throw in” simply because they won’t sign with their team.

We know for a fact that Fox wasn’t a centerpiece. Canes and Flames talked about Lindholm + Hanifin for Ferland + Hamilton at the Draft. Canes balked and said they wanted another good piece. They decided on Fox and the deal got done.

“Throw in” is defined by Merriam Webster as “something added as a bonus”. By definition Fox was not a bonus. A “bonus” is defined as “something in addition to what is expected or due”. Clearly Fox was not in excess of what was expected as he was required by Carolina to get the deal done.
 
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GeeoffBrown

Registered User
Jul 6, 2007
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Jimmy Vesey got a 4th, so maybe something similar to that? Things can change over time but Fox's agent indicated that Fox wants to become a UFA.
 

TFHockey

The CEO of 7-8-0
May 16, 2014
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Just like Pontus Aberg, it's weird how ALL fan bases do that.

Who pumped up Pontus Aberg? I can't recall a single Oiler fan doing that. He's a player with some talent who'll always be on the bubble. He isn't committed enough.
 

Flamesjustwin

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Oct 8, 2010
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London ON
Wouldn't be shocked if 21 is his career high and he never breaks 20 again. He isn't bringing Monahan or Gaudreau with him for Carolina.

All said and done, I think Fox will have the better career.
The problem with Fox is everything I have heard indicates he will go UFA and sign wherever he wants once he is done at Harvard. At least you know Ferland is playing for the Canes, I highly doubt he will sign there once he is UFA.
 

Boom Boom Apathy

I am the Professor. Deal with it!
Sep 6, 2006
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In a vacuum, no it doesn't. But when you take everything into account, I think he is:

1) Canes need forwards more than D. That has value.
2) Fox is a 3rd rounder who has done well, but still isn't a great skater and isn't very big. There's no guarantee he'll every become a full time NHLr. Ferland already is a full time NHLr.
3) In addition to offense, Ferland provides something the Canes desperately need with his physical play.

If Fox was a blue-chip guy that was all but assured of being a scoring top 4 D in this league, that might be a different story, but he's not.

To add on to this, here was Tom Dundon's quote about Ferland from today's news:

Q: Did Micheal Ferland get you out of your seat with his physical play?

TD: He was a guy we really wanted. What’s nice is he’s a really good person, locker-room guy, family guy. And he scored 21 goals and he’s got talent. And the fact is to have someone who can do all those things and provide that level of toughness, it definitely invigorated not only ownership and management and fans, but the other players, too.
He’s exactly what we need and obviously he’s going to be a fan favorite. What was great about it was he didn’t have to get into a fight to be tough. And that’s what Roddy has been preaching, sticking up for each other. But, yeah, it was pretty fun. It was clear that it was the first time since I’ve been around that we had the guy no one wanted to incite.”
 

Lunatik

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To add on to this, here was Tom Dundon's quote about Ferland from today's news:

Q: Did Micheal Ferland get you out of your seat with his physical play?

TD: He was a guy we really wanted. What’s nice is he’s a really good person, locker-room guy, family guy. And he scored 21 goals and he’s got talent. And the fact is to have someone who can do all those things and provide that level of toughness, it definitely invigorated not only ownership and management and fans, but the other players, too.
He’s exactly what we need and obviously he’s going to be a fan favorite. What was great about it was he didn’t have to get into a fight to be tough. And that’s what Roddy has been preaching, sticking up for each other. But, yeah, it was pretty fun. It was clear that it was the first time since I’ve been around that we had the guy no one wanted to incite.”
My understanding was that Ferland was the 2nd choice. I heard the Canes asked for Bennett instead but the Flames declined. That may have been what made the need for Fox to be included
 

super6646

Registered User
Apr 16, 2018
17,765
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Calgary
To add on to this, here was Tom Dundon's quote about Ferland from today's news:

Q: Did Micheal Ferland get you out of your seat with his physical play?

TD: He was a guy we really wanted. What’s nice is he’s a really good person, locker-room guy, family guy. And he scored 21 goals and he’s got talent. And the fact is to have someone who can do all those things and provide that level of toughness, it definitely invigorated not only ownership and management and fans, but the other players, too.
He’s exactly what we need and obviously he’s going to be a fan favorite. What was great about it was he didn’t have to get into a fight to be tough. And that’s what Roddy has been preaching, sticking up for each other. But, yeah, it was pretty fun. It was clear that it was the first time since I’ve been around that we had the guy no one wanted to incite.”

He's a character guy who hits hard and has that scoring touch, so you're gonna love him. While I think it was smart to sell high on him, I'm gonna miss him more than dougie tbh (and I liked him as well).
 

Lunatik

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I find it hard to believe they wanted Bennett.

Where did you hear that?
I don't recall where I heart it. But how would that be hard to believe? Bennett is simply a more valuable asset. He's younger, has more upside, more team control left, is a natural centerman., is more consistently physical than Ferland.... .but yeah, why would Carolina want that :help:
 

Fig

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Dec 15, 2014
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The problem with Fox is everything I have heard indicates he will go UFA and sign wherever he wants once he is done at Harvard. At least you know Ferland is playing for the Canes, I highly doubt he will sign there once he is UFA.

I dunno. I think Ferland will extend in Carolina.

But the biggest problem with Fox is not his talent. It's literally the contract situation with the NCAA FA rules. This means that he literally is a scratch card. You either get something or completely nothing. At least with drafted players, there's still more team control. Fox has less of it and it's ticking down (year and a half left I think?). The Flames knew they had little to no value in holding on to Fox. But by throwing him in as part of a bigger deal, he's now actually quite valuable to the Canes as he was to us prior to hinting he wanted to stay out East. It's weird. Anyone trading for Fox straight up is taking a major risk and probably getting ripped off. But as a sweetener? The value of it is suddenly huge since you can ride off the value of the original trade and hope you get a bonus. We couldn't benefit from it, so let someone see if they can benefit from it.

As far as I know so far, both Canes and Flames feel the Ferland/Hamilton and Hanifin/Lindholm swap is a win win. Canes fans are cool. I really hope Fox signs with them to give them that additional "win". I feel like quality wise, Fox is at least going to be somewhat on par with a prospect like Haydn Fleury.
 

Cardiac Jerks

Asinine & immoral
Jan 13, 2006
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I don't recall where I heart it. But how would that be hard to believe? Bennett is simply a more valuable asset. He's younger, has more upside, more team control left, is a natural centerman., is more consistently physical than Ferland.... .but yeah, why would Carolina want that :help:

Maybe not everyone is sold on Bennett?
 

Flamesjustwin

Registered User
Oct 8, 2010
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London ON
I dunno. I think Ferland will extend in Carolina.

But the biggest problem with Fox is not his talent. It's literally the contract situation with the NCAA FA rules. This means that he literally is a scratch card. You either get something or completely nothing. At least with drafted players, there's still more team control. Fox has less of it and it's ticking down (year and a half left I think?). The Flames knew they had little to no value in holding on to Fox. But by throwing him in as part of a bigger deal, he's now actually quite valuable to the Canes as he was to us prior to hinting he wanted to stay out East. It's weird. Anyone trading for Fox straight up is taking a major risk and probably getting ripped off. But as a sweetener? The value of it is suddenly huge since you can ride off the value of the original trade and hope you get a bonus. We couldn't benefit from it, so let someone see if they can benefit from it.

As far as I know so far, both Canes and Flames feel the Ferland/Hamilton and Hanifin/Lindholm swap is a win win. Canes fans are cool. I really hope Fox signs with them to give them that additional "win". I feel like quality wise, Fox is at least going to be somewhat on par with a prospect like Haydn Fleury.
I wasn't referring to Ferland not signing, I meant Fox who has given every indication he will stay on school until his final year where two months after school he can be a UFA. Given the Canes depth on D and the fact he can go where he wants I don't think there is much of a chance he signs there. Probably will end up a Ranger.
 

LakeLivin

Armchair Quarterback
Mar 11, 2016
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I wasn't referring to Ferland not signing, I meant Fox who has given every indication he will stay on school until his final year where two months after school he can be a UFA. Given the Canes depth on D and the fact he can go where he wants I don't think there is much of a chance he signs there. Probably will end up a Ranger.

From a newspaper article:

Canes general manager Don Waddell said Thursday he's confident Fox will sign an entry-level contract with Carolina next year, saying discussions have been held with Fox and his adviser.
"I'd say it's 99.9 percent we will get him signed," Waddell said. "I don't see it being as issue at all."

Read more here: Could defensive prospect Adam Fox give the Hurricanes the edge in the Calgary trade?

Waddell could be wrong but at least he's talked to Fox. I'm curious as to where everyone who thinks there's little chance he signs with the Canes are getting their info.
 
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StreetHawk

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Sep 30, 2017
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From a newspaper article:

Canes general manager Don Waddell said Thursday he's confident Fox will sign an entry-level contract with Carolina next year, saying discussions have been held with Fox and his adviser.
"I'd say it's 99.9 percent we will get him signed," Waddell said. "I don't see it being as issue at all."

Read more here: Could defensive prospect Adam Fox give the Hurricanes the edge in the Calgary trade?

Waddell could be wrong but at least he's talked to Fox. I'm curious as to where everyone who thinks there's little chance he signs with the Canes are getting their info.
Likely cause the flames got the feeling he wouldn’t sign with them. It’s still early. Kid just started his sophomore year. Plenty of time. It’s also Harvard that he’s going to. So, that likely adds to the thought that he won’t sign early.

There’s also no reason on the part of Fox to say anything other than what he told the canes. Not like anything he tells them binds him to anything.

NCAA guys sign when they sign. No going back to play if you opt to leave. So defer that decision until the end of each season.
 

Lunatik

Normal is an illusion.
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From a newspaper article:

Canes general manager Don Waddell said Thursday he's confident Fox will sign an entry-level contract with Carolina next year, saying discussions have been held with Fox and his adviser.
"I'd say it's 99.9 percent we will get him signed," Waddell said. "I don't see it being as issue at all."

Read more here: Could defensive prospect Adam Fox give the Hurricanes the edge in the Calgary trade?

Waddell could be wrong but at least he's talked to Fox. I'm curious as to where everyone who thinks there's little chance he signs with the Canes are getting their info.
Clearly based on what you quoted, he thinks Fox will finish school and wait a couple months to become a UFA. It's not a matter of where someone is getting info, it's purely based on opinion and many are of the belief he will finish getting his Harvard education.
 

Lunatik

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Has (DET) Svechnikov's value dropped that much?
No idea, I just think with the ties Waddell has to Harvard and Carolina being on the East Coast, their odds of signing Fox are better than most. So Fox's value would have risen after leaving Calgary because the odds of him signing are better. But listening to a friend that's a Wings fan, he isn't particularly high on Svech
 
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