Speculation: Acq./Rost. Bldg./Cap/Lines etc. Part LXXXV -- 2017-18 Training Camp/Preseason Edition

[Calicaps]

previous: http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2367651

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[usiel]

previous: http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2367651

First! Err I mean Second!

 

[Calicaps]

First! Err I mean Second!

This thread's off to a rip-roarin' start. Here's hoping it's not a harbinger of the season ahead.

 

[usiel]

This thread's off to a rip-roarin' start. Here's hoping it's not a harbinger of the season ahead.

I think this post encapsulates my soul going into this season. Not that I'm a D&G'er....just the annual ritual of season sports and the weariness of age starting to creep in....despite a little more interesting story lines going into TC. Lot more things need to go right this season as their depth is less. They lose Holtby and a couple veteran D and one of their legit top 6 forwards and this could be a brutal season.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

I think this post encapsulates my soul going into this season. Not that I'm a D&G'er....just the annual ritual of season sports and the weariness of age starting to creep in....despite a little more interesting story lines going into TC. Lot more things need to go right this season as their depth is less. They lose Holtby and a couple veteran D and one of their legit top 6 forwards and this could be a brutal season.

Couldn't this be said for nearly every team?

 

[g00n]

Couldn't this be said for nearly every team?

Well the Pens won despite key injuries and a goalie carousel. Crosby missed 7 games, Malkin 20, Sheary 21, Hornqvist 12, Letang out for the season after 41 games, Hagelin 21, Dumoulin 12, Maatta 27 games, etc etc

And they were also a MASH unit in the playoffs

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/...ck-Bonino-Brian-Dumoulin/stories/201706160090

Yet year after year, if more than one starter is out for the Capitals we begin to hear about how they miss those guys. Still they roll only 28 skaters and 2 goalies all season long (and they could've gotten away with fewer). Seven starters played a full 82 games while another seven only missed single digit games.


Meanwhile, the Pens lose nearly everyone at some point, with key players being out for long periods, and they still win the Cup. Using four goaltenders and 35 skaters. The only player to never miss a regular season game was Phil "Hot Dog" Kessel.


Is there a fancy stat for that? Or do they just have better depth and fewer excuses?

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2202727

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

I said nearly every team. The Pens are an anomaly. I think their resilience is the result of a multitude of factors, including having a terrific coach and an established team identity to go along with two of the best centers of all time.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Couldn't this be said for nearly every team?

Seriously....

 

[Hivemind]

This team does have paper thin defensive depth. Even when healthy the bottom 3 defenders are going to be questionable. If one of Niskanen/Carlson/Orlov get hurt, the defense is going to be straight up ugly.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

One of them WILL miss time....I suspect it won't be straight up ugly in terms of team success but we'll see.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

This team does have paper thin defensive depth. Even when healthy the bottom 3 defenders are going to be questionable. If one of Niskanen/Carlson/Orlov get hurt, the defense is going to be straight up ugly.

Luckily our benchmark for a terrible defense is Slurcina. I don't think we see anything approaching that this season.

 

[Carlzner]

I still can't believe we stacked the deck so heavy and lost to a Pitt team that was limping on one leg.

 

[MrGone]

Well the Pens won despite key injuries and a goalie carousel. Crosby missed 7 games, Malkin 20, Sheary 21, Hornqvist 12, Letang out for the season after 41 games, Hagelin 21, Dumoulin 12, Maatta 27 games, etc etc

And they were also a MASH unit in the playoffs

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/...ck-Bonino-Brian-Dumoulin/stories/201706160090

Yet year after year, if more than one starter is out for the Capitals we begin to hear about how they miss those guys. Still they roll only 28 skaters and 2 goalies all season long (and they could've gotten away with fewer). Seven starters played a full 82 games while another seven only missed single digit games.


Meanwhile, the Pens lose nearly everyone at some point, with key players being out for long periods, and they still win the Cup. Using four goaltenders and 35 skaters. The only player to never miss a regular season game was Phil "Hot Dog" Kessel.


Is there a fancy stat for that? Or do they just have better depth and fewer excuses?

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2202727

I have always looking at the Penguins like the Patriots. They have a system and plug guys into the spot they need. Bill Belichick is a master of at not over paying for skills he does not need for his system. Its a big part of why they keep it going. Tom Brady is the best "System" quarterback of all time. Don't believe that look at Matt Cassel's 2008 season. And then look at the rest of his career.

Looking at say GMGM. He was a master at collecting skilled players. He just had no clue how to build a winner. The Caps have had more talent then 90% of the teams in the league the past few seasons. And they just don't know how to build a winner.

I don't see Kuza as a player you win with. I see him as a high skilled player but not one you win with. I love Nick and most of the time he is the most skilled guy on the ice. Still he has no second level. He is not a guy that can cray a team. Even Holtby is guilty of not getting it done. On paper one of the best playoff goalies of all time. Still we get beat by teams playing musical goalies. Is it to much to task to steal a series?

It all comes down to a system and the right players in place. The winners have a system and the pretenders try to add skill not worrying about how it fits.

 

[Sam Spade]

I have always looking at the Penguins like the Patriots. They have a system and plug guys into the spot they need.

If you mean a system of Malkin/Crosby then I agree.

 

[um]

I still can't believe we stacked the deck so heavy and lost to a Pitt team that was limping on one leg.

Yeah that was sad, but I like to remind myself of that awful third line at least. That team was not without weakness.

 

[MrGone]

If you mean a system of Malkin/Crosby then I agree.

It does help that there stars make people better. While its been a none stop search to find a wing to play with OV and Nick.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Luckily our benchmark for a terrible defense is Slurcina. I don't think we see anything approaching that this season.

No, Kiwi Doig....

 

[Revelation]

I have always looking at the Penguins like the Patriots. They have a system and plug guys into the spot they need. Bill Belichick is a master of at not over paying for skills he does not need for his system. Its a big part of why they keep it going. Tom Brady is the best "System" quarterback of all time. Don't believe that look at Matt Cassel's 2008 season. And then look at the rest of his career.

Looking at say GMGM. He was a master at collecting skilled players. He just had no clue how to build a winner. The Caps have had more talent then 90% of the teams in the league the past few seasons. And they just don't know how to build a winner.

I don't see Kuza as a player you win with. I see him as a high skilled player but not one you win with. I love Nick and most of the time he is the most skilled guy on the ice. Still he has no second level. He is not a guy that can cray a team. Even Holtby is guilty of not getting it done. On paper one of the best playoff goalies of all time. Still we get beat by teams playing musical goalies. Is it to much to task to steal a series?

It all comes down to a system and the right players in place. The winners have a system and the pretenders try to add skill not worrying about how it fits.

Is Kessel a player you win with? What about Hossa? Mr Game 7 is the quintessential player you win with and he got outclutched by Juz handily in his time here.

And JR literally added Kessel without caring how he fits, simply because he had the skill to put up numbers in the playoffs. He proceeded to not mesh with either Crosby or Malkin and ended up filling the all important playoff role of 3rd line winger.

You have no idea what you're talking about beyond cherry picking in hindsight.

 

[MrGone]

Is Kessel a player you win with?

His name is on the cup.

What about Hossa?

His name is on the cup three times.

Mr Game 7 is the quintessential player you win with and he got outclutched by Juz handily in his time here.

The key part of that statement is "here".

And JR literally added Kessel without caring how he fits, simply because he had the skill to put up numbers in the playoffs. He proceeded to not mesh with either Crosby or Malkin and ended up filling the all important playoff role of 3rd line winger.

You just made my point. Was he a speed guy that did not workout in the top six so he had to play out of role as a grinder on the 3rd line? Or did he get plugged into one of the fastest lines in the playoffs? He fit the system no matter where he played.

 

[Revelation]

His name is on the cup.



His name is on the cup three times.

Do either of them get a name on the cup here?

The key part of that statement is "here".

So basically he had the luxury of not playing here, just like Kessel and Hossa. Which Kuz didn't. That somehow makes Kuz unclutch I'm guessing.

You just made my point. Was he a speed guy that did not workout in the top six so he had to play out of role as a grinder on the 3rd line? Or did he get plugged into one of the fastest lines in the playoffs? He fit the system no matter where he played.

He played a Semin type game with less defense and got chemistry with Hagelin and Bonino and managed to produce points in the playoffs. There was no system for him to fit beyond "be Phil Kessel". If we traded for him instead of the Pens you'd be chasing him out of town harder than 52 back in the day for how much of a softy mcchoker he is.

 

[MrGone]

Do either of them get a name on the cup here?




So basically he had the luxury of not playing here, just like Kessel and Hossa. Which Kuz didn't. That somehow makes Kuz unclutch I'm guessing.



He played a Semin type game with less defense and got chemistry with Hagelin and Bonino and managed to produce points in the playoffs. There was no system for him to fit beyond "be Phil Kessel". If we traded for him instead of the Pens you'd be chasing him out of town harder than 52 back in the day for how much of a softy mcchoker he is.

Being "Phil Kessel" is the point. They got a guy that fit the system. They did not just add talent and hope it worked out.

Do you think its luck that the Penguins keep finding guys that just step right in? It was like they were missing half of there team at one point last season. And they just don't miss a beat.

Mean while the Caps took the better part of 10 season trying to find a wing to play with Nick and OV.

That's the difference between have a system and a collection of talent.

 

[um]

Kozlov and Knuble were good on Ovechkins wing, Semin was fine, don't really remember after 2011 that well, which is the part i'd agree with. But we have had very good 1st lines, it's been the strength of our organization since Ovechkin came along.

 

[Caps8112]

No, Kiwi Doig....

how about zettler, or who was that turd. he wore 81 I wanna say before orlov. sloan maybe?

 

[Caps8112]

Kozlov and Knuble were good on Ovechkins wing, Semin was fine, don't really remember after 2011 that well, which is the part i'd agree with. But we have had very good 1st lines, it's been the strength of our organization since Ovechkin came along.

they kept trying turds like wilson, crab and other astonishingly awful offensive players.

 

[strungout]