Speculation: According to Mirtle/Siegel Leafs were trying the sign Derek Ryan on July 1st.

Menzinger

Kessel4LadyByng
Apr 24, 2014
41,074
32,569
St. Paul, MN
Gardiner is coming off a 50+ point season.

Why on Earth would Dubas want to trade him?

GMs are tasked with making decisions based on the big picture. Not a single game 7 performance.

Gardiner isn’t a choke artist either. He’s had big clutch performances in make-or-break games.

Just accept that he is staying...

I don’t think he’d trade him because he’s a bad player, but rather because he’s a upcoming UFA and may be too expensive to sign.

So if you can get a replacement player + assets from a Gardiner trade, there would be a logic to it, though I’d be just as fine keeping Gardiner and try to resign him on a fair deal.
 

indigobuffalo

Portage and Main
Feb 10, 2011
6,790
559
Winnipeg MB
I don’t think he’d trade him because he’s a bad player, but rather because he’s a upcoming UFA and may be too expensive to sign.

So if you can get a replacement player + assets from a Gardiner trade, there would be a logic to it, though I’d be just as fine keeping Gardiner and try to resign him on a fair deal.

I agree. Unless a clear replacement is knocking on the door, I can’t see how the Leafs part ways with Gardiner in a trade.
 
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Warden of the North

Ned Stark's head
Apr 28, 2006
46,314
21,591
Muskoka
Mirtles explanation of his cryptic tweets the night before he signed was cool. Interesting to hear that he knew if Ryan signed in Calgary that it indicated Tavares waa coming here
 

jrgtml67

Registered User
Sep 12, 2011
5,457
945
I love Jake! I just don't see how we can afford him after next year if he wants a fair market contract. He'll be UFA.

JT taking a big discount is huge. It shows leadership just by doing that. You want to win, you want to be here that bad and possibly get your name on the mug..you take a discount. JT taking 11million now shows the ceiling for anyone we have to reup or any ufa we sign for the next 7yrs. Only 1 guy will make close and its Matthew's.

Rielly makes 5 for next 4yrs. Jake wont get more that him..no way. Their numbers are very very close. So I'd say Jake gets 4.5 over 5?
 

jrgtml67

Registered User
Sep 12, 2011
5,457
945
What? Gardiner is a UFA working towards his *1st UFA contract. He'll be 29 years old next July. He'll want to be paid. He'd be a fool to take less from TOR.

So JT was a fool to take less from Toronto too? 27yr old ufa top 5 center in the NHL lol. Rielly makes 5mill for next 4yrs Jake and his #s are very similar he wont get more than 5 and no less than 4.5m.

Jt taking a big discount to win and play where he wants now is the standard. As to say..only 1 player we have will come close to 11million and its Matthew's. JT already shown leadership by taking that discount..if Jake wants to win he stays..if he is greedy like De Haan he goes. I bet he stays.
 

jrgtml67

Registered User
Sep 12, 2011
5,457
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there is no league anywhere on this planet or any other that Nylander plays ahead of Kadri

Right now..100% agree Nylander will one day get there. With our plethora of wingers in the system and lack of centers it could be in a yr or 2.

Matthew's
Jt
Kadri
Nylander

Omfg lol

But also we could see Kadri traded if Nylander suddenly figures out how to play center in the NHL. Just because of Kadris awesome contract.

In any case..itll be amazing hockey to watch this yr
 

Mikeyg

Registered User
Dec 26, 2011
8,884
2,579
Matthews
Tavares
Kadri
Lindholm

Vs
Matthews
Kadri
Ryan
Lindholm

Woof second lineup couldn’t carry the first lineups skates. Just like cry baby eichel.
 

kb

Registered User
Aug 28, 2009
15,274
21,695
I agree. Unless a clear replacement is knocking on the door, I can’t see how the Leafs part ways with Gardiner in a trade.

They will be cap crunched next year. They can't afford him on his current deal, let alone a raise.

No idea how this will work out. But they can't let him walk. They will have to either sign him or trade him prior to the season. Because they won't be trading him away at the deadline.
 

kb

Registered User
Aug 28, 2009
15,274
21,695
So JT was a fool to take less from Toronto too? 27yr old ufa top 5 center in the NHL lol. Rielly makes 5mill for next 4yrs Jake and his #s are very similar he wont get more than 5 and no less than 4.5m.

Jt taking a big discount to win and play where he wants now is the standard. As to say..only 1 player we have will come close to 11million and its Matthew's. JT already shown leadership by taking that discount..if Jake wants to win he stays..if he is greedy like De Haan he goes. I bet he stays.

Jake is going to get the Shattenkirk contract as a UFA. Rielly was an RFA. They do not compare.
 

ottomaddox

Registered User
Oct 31, 2017
10,592
4,600
Toronto
So JT was a fool to take less from Toronto too? 27yr old ufa top 5 center in the NHL lol. Rielly makes 5mill for next 4yrs Jake and his #s are very similar he wont get more than 5 and no less than 4.5m.

Jt taking a big discount to win and play where he wants now is the standard. As to say..only 1 player we have will come close to 11million and its Matthew's. JT already shown leadership by taking that discount..if Jake wants to win he stays..if he is greedy like De Haan he goes. I bet he stays.

Yes. Jake Gardiner is a fool.
 

Havoc

Registered User
Jul 25, 2009
7,288
7,517
I don't think this organization has ever been sold on Nylander as a center. Seems pretty clear.

Nylander is already a better center than Kadri was at the same age. One can argue his faceoffs at 21 years of age is better than Kadri's current faceoff skills at 27. Foolish to think the organization is sold on him not ever being a center. Look how many years it took Kadri to be considered defensively responsible.

Not to mention Nylander literally played center at times.

It is more suitable to have Nylander at wing in the current lineup. That doesn't mean management doesn't think he can't become a center.

"Seems pretty clear". Nah
 

ottomaddox

Registered User
Oct 31, 2017
10,592
4,600
Toronto
Gardiner is coming off a 50+ point season.

Why on Earth would Dubas want to trade him?

GMs are tasked with making decisions based on the big picture. Not a single game 7 performance.

Gardiner isn’t a choke artist either. He’s had big clutch performances in make-or-break games.

Just accept that he is staying...

Chicago traded Brian Campbell (a similar playing style to Gardiner) after winning the cup/coming off a 50 point season. It happens.
 

super6646

Registered User
Apr 16, 2018
17,858
15,679
Calgary
JT taking a big discount is huge. It shows leadership just by doing that. You want to win, you want to be here that bad and possibly get your name on the mug..you take a discount. JT taking 11million now shows the ceiling for anyone we have to reup or any ufa we sign for the next 7yrs. Only 1 guy will make close and its Matthew's.

Rielly makes 5 for next 4yrs. Jake wont get more that him..no way. Their numbers are very very close. So I'd say Jake gets 4.5 over 5?

Come on man. 11 million/7 years is hardly a discount. Mcdavid is getting 12.5 million by comparison and is a lot better than Tavares.
 

BertCorbeau

F*ck cancer - RIP Fugu and Buffaloed
Jan 6, 2012
55,175
35,817
Simcoe County
Chicago traded Brian Campbell (a similar playing style to Gardiner) after winning the cup/coming off a 50 point season. It happens.

No they didn't... Campbell scored only 38 points in 68 games that cup-winning season. It was the season before then that Campbell hit 50 points. Campbell then played another season with 27 points in 65 games .. After that year he was traded while having 5 years left on his deal with a $7.41 mill AAV cap hit.... Pretty substantial for the time.

But if anything, Gardiner's value is pretty high after consecutive career high seasons.. Right now is a pretty decent sell-high opportunity.
 

ottomaddox

Registered User
Oct 31, 2017
10,592
4,600
Toronto
No they didn't... Campbell scored only 38 points in 68 games that cup-winning season. It was the season before then that Campbell hit 50 points. Campbell then played another season with 27 points in 65 games .. After that year he was traded while having 5 years left on his deal with a $7.41 mill AAV cap hit.... Pretty substantial for the time.

But if anything, Gardiner's value is pretty high after consecutive career high seasons.. Right now is a pretty decent sell-high opportunity.

My point is lost. I am not trying to have a conversation about the history of d-men who scored 50 points and exact numbers. My point is that D players who produce points get traded.
 

indigobuffalo

Portage and Main
Feb 10, 2011
6,790
559
Winnipeg MB
My point is lost. I am not trying to have a conversation about the history of d-men who scored 50 points and exact numbers. My point is that D players who produce points get traded.

But the circumstances are vastly different. I mean, yeah Gretzky was traded. So obviously Gardiner can be traded. But trading Gretzky was moronic, and irreversibly damaged the franchise.

Trading Gardiner has no short term or long term strategic value. Hence it too would be moronic.
 

ottomaddox

Registered User
Oct 31, 2017
10,592
4,600
Toronto
But the circumstances are vastly different. I mean, yeah Gretzky was traded. So obviously Gardiner can be traded. But trading Gretzky was moronic, and irreversibly damaged the franchise.

Trading Gardiner has no short term or long term strategic value. Hence it too would be moronic.

Improving the defense would be the end game.

I hope to God there's no long term strategic value in regards to TOR and Jake Gardiner.
 

DarkKnight

Professional Amateur
Jan 17, 2017
31,878
48,886
Nylander is already a better center than Kadri was at the same age. One can argue his faceoffs at 21 years of age is better than Kadri's current faceoff skills at 27. Foolish to think the organization is sold on him not ever being a center. Look how many years it took Kadri to be considered defensively responsible.

Not to mention Nylander literally played center at times.

It is more suitable to have Nylander at wing in the current lineup. That doesn't mean management doesn't think he can't become a center.

"Seems pretty clear". Nah
Come on dude with the Kadri comparison, he played center the whole time, absolutely nothing analogous about their "paths". Was it more "suitable" to mess up three lines so Marleau (who doesn't want to play center) could take Matthews place, instead of simply moving Willie over and adding a winger? Simple move vs changing all your lines because one guy was injured. If it was "suitable", no brainer, and yet....

I actually thought Nylander did okay at center this year, big deal about faceoffs, Marner was great on the dot too last year. I'm more interested in his positioning and compete there, he passed my eye test. But, I still think he's a question mark, and unless we failed to sign another center, he wasn't any "first" option for next year. Again, I feel quite comfortable believing the organization isn't sold on him at center, and nothing I've seen to date has caused me to revise that view. Will he be a center, maybe he would have, sure.
 
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Beaumaris

Registered User
May 21, 2015
1,016
320
But the circumstances are vastly different. I mean, yeah Gretzky was traded. So obviously Gardiner can be traded. But trading Gretzky was moronic, and irreversibly damaged the franchise.

Trading Gardiner has no short term or long term strategic value. Hence it too would be moronic.
Gretzky was sold,not traded.
 

Sypher04

Registered User
Jan 20, 2011
11,525
9,748
Right now..100% agree Nylander will one day get there. With our plethora of wingers in the system and lack of centers it could be in a yr or 2.

Matthew's
Jt
Kadri
Nylander

Omfg lol

But also we could see Kadri traded if Nylander suddenly figures out how to play center in the NHL. Just because of Kadris awesome contract.

In any case..itll be amazing hockey to watch this yr

Any chance of Nylander playing center for this club anytime in the next 7 years died the day Tavares signed.
 
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Joey Hoser

Registered User
Jan 8, 2008
14,232
4,143
Guelph
You might, say as part of a package, for another type of D-man

Yeah except when most people talk about trading Gardiner, they cite him being dumb or unreliable as the reason, and the phrase "addition by subtraction" is often used.

And all keep saying it... That is just emotional over-reaction. Solely focused on how angry they were at him for game 7, with no regard for body of work and what he brings to the team.
 
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