AAV for new EK contract

[burf]

If the team can afford to spend $2.5-$3.25/year on bottom-6 players like Smith and Burrows, it can afford to pay EK 11+. Anything else is an insult to him.

With respect to the McDavid comparison, McDavid took an RFA discount. He couldn't threaten to walk in free agency. If Sens aren't willing to pay Karlsson what he'd get on the open market, he's free to go to a contender that can actually pay him.

 

[topshelf15]

EM needs to resign Duchene ,Stone and Ceci first...Then it may be possible for him to get him at 10.5 to 11 mil...

 

[pzeeman]

EM needs to resign Duchene ,Stone and Ceci first...Then it may be possible for him to get him at 10.5 to 11 mil...

I would argue EK first - to get try to get in before Doughty - with a view to what Stone, Duchene and Ceci need.

 

[topshelf15]

I would argue EK first - to get try to get in before Doughty - with a view to what Stone, Duchene and Ceci need.

Yep EK needs to think about what is best for him...Not Doughty who seems to be trying to use EK to gain more on his current deal.....If he likes where the team is headed and believes we are the best for him ,then he will resign at money he seems to be fair

 

[Sensung]

I would argue EK first - to get try to get in before Doughty - with a view to what Stone, Duchene and Ceci need.

Do you think Newport is going to allow EK to negotiate before Doughty signs?

I mean, EK could force them to do so, but it seems like a terrible blunder on their part if they dont let the team with more $ set the market.

 

[topshelf15]

Do you think Newport is going to allow EK to negotiate before Doughty signs?

I mean, EK could force them to do so, but it seems like a terrible blunder on their part if they dont let the team with more $ set the market.

11 mil for both would be fair ,12 to 13 million is what they would likely get offered,,,But for only 7 years ,we can offer the 8th ...Which would mean more overall money,again it really is up to EK in what he wants to do...The owner offers 10, EK likely counters with 12 ....We meet in the middle,if both sides are willing to do the deal its really not that complicated

 

[Sensung]

11 mil for both would be fair ,12 to 13 million is what they would likely get offered,,,But for only 7 years ,we can offer the 8th ...Which would mean more overall money,again it really is up to EK in what he wants to do...The owner offers 10, EK likely counters with 12 ....We meet in the middle,if both sides are willing to do the deal its really not that complicated

Do you think LA won't go over 11M for Doughty?

 

[topshelf15]

Do you think LA won't go over 11M for Doughty?

They may,but again what Doughty does or gets should be of little concern ....11M for 8 seasons is alot of money and represents a 4.5 million dollar pay raise for EK ....

Now again if EM doesnt have the trust of EK than he may very will ask for 13,so us losing him would still be on EM..As it was him that burnt the bridge of trust...For reasons we all very well know....

But 88 million over 8 seasons ,should be a fair deal for both parties ....

 

[pzeeman]

Do you think Newport is going to allow EK to negotiate before Doughty signs?

I mean, EK could force them to do so, but it seems like a terrible blunder on their part if they dont let the team with more $ set the market.

Seems like a smart strategy for Newport, and Karlsson if he's trying to maximize dollars and year-round summer.

But don't forget that Newport works for him, not the other way around. They can't prevent Karlsson from negotiating, but they can advise against it. If he wants to start (officially) on July 1 and if he gets a number he's comfortable with from OTT, along with "the plan" that he agrees with, and taking family, stability and working conditions into account, Newport can advise him against taking it, but it's really up to him. My concern on getting in before Doughty is that Karlsson's personal comfortable number could go up when Doughty is his comparable, no longer Subban. He's probably being advised on a big number right now anyways, so it likely doesn't make a difference, except for maybe the peer pressure after Doughty is signed.

Admittedly lots of "if"s up there, but that's the world we're right now as Senators fans. To paraphrase Rouge One "Fandom is built on hope!"

 

[Sensung]

Doughty is by far the best comparable.

What he gets will set the market, not what we think is "fair".

 

[topshelf15]

Doughty is by far the best comparable.

What he gets will set the market, not what we think is "fair".

Iam sure doughty would like EK to resign first,for him the more prolific defender will set the market...Which is EK

 

[Sensung]

Seems like a smart strategy for Newport, and Karlsson if he's trying to maximize dollars and year-round summer.

But don't forget that Newport works for him, not the other way around. They can't prevent Karlsson from negotiating, but they can advise against it. If he wants to start (officially) on July 1 and if he gets a number he's comfortable with from OTT, along with "the plan" that he agrees with, and taking family, stability and working conditions into account, Newport can advise him against taking it, but it's really up to him. My concern on getting in before Doughty is that Karlsson's personal comfortable number could go up when Doughty is his comparable, no longer Subban. He's probably being advised on a big number right now anyways, so it likely doesn't make a difference, except for maybe the peer pressure after Doughty is signed.

Admittedly lots of "if"s up there, but that's the world we're right now as Senators fans. To paraphrase Rouge One "Fandom is built on hope!"

Agreed.

EK is ultimately in charge, but his comments on the "business" side if the NHL suggest to me he will listen to what the people he pays to represent his interests tell him.

 

[Sensung]

Iam sure doughty would like EK to resign first,for him the more prolific defender will set the market...Which is EK

Newport will look at the two ownership groups and conclude that Doughty will set the market.

 

[pzeeman]

Agreed.

EK is ultimately in charge, but his comments on the "business" side if the NHL suggest to me he will listen to what the people he pays to represent his interests tell him.

I think the hope is that it ends up not just being about the bucks.

In my own life, I know that a larger number would be dropped into my bank account every two weeks if I became a contractor rather than a full time employee, but the benefits (literally and figuratively) and (perceived) reduced risk are worth a lower salary to me. We have to hope that those unquantifiable values go into Karlsson's personal equation as well.

ps - I work in the private sector, so the benefits and job security aren't gold plated. That's why I tagged reduced risk as perceived. I lived through Nortel, I know what can happen.

 

[topshelf15]

Newport will look at the two ownership groups and conclude that Doughty will set the market.

Look man ,you have done a wonderful thing in bringing out the dark hole that had hid in shadows of this team for so long ....

But it must be draining to always have to think you have to keep trying to defend your stance,lots of us here have felt the exact same way for a very long time ..Me being one of the most vocal,change will come dont worry ...EK will either resign or he wont ,but because of your effort EM will have to answer his critics whom have grown in number and strength..

I have said it before,he is going to sell ...He doesnt have the capital,nor the trust of the most important part of this whole arena venture which would be the fans.....And we all now the NHL wants a slice of that pie,so he is gonzo...

 

[Sensung]

I think the hope is that it ends up not just being about the bucks.

In my own life, I know that a larger number would be dropped into my bank account every two weeks if I became a contractor rather than a full time employee, but the benefits (literally and figuratively) and (perceived) reduced risk are worth a lower salary to me. We have to hope that those unquantifiable values go into Karlsson's personal equation as well.

ps - I work in the private sector, so the benefits and job security aren't gold plated. That's why I tagged reduced risk as perceived. I lived through Nortel, I know what can happen.

Agreed.

There is still hope, but we need to acknowledge that they hinge on EK taking a hometown discount, not a "fair" deal.

 

[Sensung]

Look man ,you have done a wonderful thing in bringing out the dark hole that had hid in shadows of this team for so long ....

But it must be draining to always have to think you have to keep trying to defend your stance,lots of us here have felt the exact same way for a very long time ..Me being one of the most vocal,change will come dont worry ...EK will either resign or he wont ,but because of your effort EM will have to answer his critics whom have grown in number and strength..

I have said it before,he is going to sell ...He doesnt have the capital,nor the trust of the most important part of this whole arena venture which would be the fans.....And we all now the NHL wants a slice of that pie,so he is gonzo...

Thanks.

Wasn't trying to attack you and sincerely hope that EK ignores his advisors. I'm just trying to put myself in his agents shoes and apply the best strategy.

They are in a pretty unique situation and have tons of leverage that i expect them to exploit if allowed to do so by EK and Doughty.

 

[Ray Kinsella]

If EK65 decides to stand his ground, and asks for 12M, and does not budge, and the decision is made to trade him........ who do you blame?

If EM... I mean, PD decides to stand his ground and offers 8.5M and doesn’t budge, and the decision is made to trade EK... who do you blame?

See how easy it is to spin things?

 

[topshelf15]

Thanks.

Wasn't trying to attack you and sincerely hope that EK ignores his advisors. I'm just trying to put myself in his agents shoes and apply the best strategy.

They are in a pretty unique situation and have tons of leverage that i expect them to exploit if allowed to do so by EK and Doughty.

Yep that leverage was given to EK by EM ,him being such a tightwad has wrecked everything,not only for us but also for him.....The team friendly contract ,and the constant crying poor have made the Sens a poisoned chalice for him now,as he will not have access to the latter anymore

 

[pzeeman]

Agreed.

There is still hope, but we need to acknowledge that they hinge on EK taking a hometown discount, not a "fair" deal.

True dat.

My personal perspective - I'm going to hold on to hope and not start thinking down the worst case scenario, blaming people for things they haven't done yet.

By the way while I'm thinking about it, while I still don't believe there's anything that we as a fan base can do to remove the team owner, it does look like the campaign did bring some change in attitude and perspective in the front office. Kudos for that.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

OK, so let's give the coach a name.

Do you think Alain Vigneault (or another coach with a proven track record i.e. a respected coach) would be more or less likely to consider Ottawa as a destination following Dorion's public shaming of our coach?

You act as if no other GM in the history of the NHL has talked about their coaching staffs' shortcomings, and that Pierre Dorion is the first one to do this, and it's going to sink the franchise into non existence, and the earth is going to open up and swallow the City into the deepest regions of hell..

Of course Alain Vigneault would consider Ottawa as a destination, he's coached here before, and would again as a head coach.

 

[Sensung]

.

 

[topshelf15]

.

I remember Claude Julien saying something to the effect that he wouldnt coach Ottawa with EM being the owner

 

[Sensung]

You act as if no other GM in the history of the NHL has talked about their coaching staffs' shortcomings, and that Pierre Dorion is the first one to do this, and it's going to sink the franchise into non existence, and the earth is going to open up and swallow the City into the deepest regions of hell..

Of course Alain Vigneault would consider Ottawa as a destination, he's coached here before, and would again as a head coach.

Poor attempt at deflection. I made no outrageous claims, so stop misrepresenting what I stated. Dorion's comments were unprofessional.

Would AV be more or less positively inclined towards Ottawa after Dorion's unprofessional shaming of Boucher, who is now twisting in the wind?

I actually like most things about Dorion and have defended a good deal of what he has done.

Can you, for once, just be intellectually honest enough to admit he overstepped with his comments?

 

[topshelf15]

Choosing not too spend is no longer a luxury,EM is a billionaire iam sure he must understand that you cant always save your way to profits....He is sitting on a potential goldmine here ,why he chooses to argue with the major contributers for success in the future,is way above my understanding....

Come on EM ,invest into our/your team and this city,and you will make tons of cash...You will be happy and we will be happy