Value of: A top 2D to Toronto.

[McJedi]

not exactly fair to say a guy has never hit over 43pts when his first season he had 43 in 73 games as a rookie and was lost for most of the season to injury year 2.

Rookie year: 21g/47pts in 80 games (reg. season and playoff)

to say he isnt a top 6 forward is pretty ignorant actually. 31 teams x 6 forwards = 186 "top 6 players"
Johnsson was 120th in goals and 124th in pts as a rookie despite playing only 73 games, and 13:40 per. pts/60 beat guys like barzal,connor and couturier.

take the L and move on

And he got worse his second season and then suffered a major injury from which he has yet to prove he has recovered. The time to sell on Johnsson came and went over a year ago. Now he is worth a mid roind pick at best. Selling low this offseason if sold.

 

[Dr Quincy]

Toronto needs a stay at home, righty that can log lots of minutes. I say top 2D but he could also be a top 3D on our team after Rielly and Muzzin. Someone in the same ilk as Muzzin would be good.

I have this package:

Dermott-A good flashy d man who makes a few mistakes in his own end. He is only 23 years old but we are stocked on LD.

Gauthier-A big serviceable 4th line forward. He is a decent part time NHL'er with some opportunity to take a permanent 4th line spot.

Johnsson-A very serviceable top 6 forward with tons of skill and speed. We have 4 guys in the system like him so he is expendable.

Depends on who the D is coming back, but I am open to throw in a pick, 2nd in 2022. My package isn't garbage. They are good players. Gauthier will be the weakest player there. Dermott will get better in his own end as D men don't mature until they are 26 or 27.

That won't get you a 2 or a 3. Maybe try a package that doesn't have expendable guys in it.

 

[Dr Quincy]

you’re selling Johnsson as a top six forward with skill and speed? He’s coming off knee surgery and has never hit or been on pace for over 43pts. He’s not a top six forward.

A combination of those players does not net you a top pairing dman and Toronto probably doesn’t have the cap space to add one with a flat cap over the next two seasons.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but getting 43 pts in 73 games is being on pace for over 43 pts (and what a bizarre number to pick).

 

[Dr Quincy]

Dermott+Johnsson+2nd seems fair enough for
Risto
Seversson
Manson
but I am thinking with the flat cap UFA's should be cheap and we may be able to get 1 of Tanev, Brodie, Hamonic.

The assets we have to make a trade are Dermott+Johnsson+Kerfoot. Dermott would be his RFA rights. It would be 6.9 going out and I would like to keep the incoming MAX 6

The problem is not what these guys are collectively worth, it's also about finding a team that needs those particular pieces and doesn't mind giving up a D to get them. For instance, this makes no sense at all for NJ as they are weak already at D. This makes them worse without addressing any particular need.

 

[Richard88]

I just made a proposal in the thread linked below, involving a 3 way trade between Toronto, Colorado, and Anaheim...

Proposal: - 3 way trade between TOR COL ANA



TOR out: Nylander
TOR in: Manson + Rakell @$1.9m

ANA out: Manson + Rakell ($1.85m retained)
ANA in: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage

COL out: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage
COL in: Nylander

 

[Jerkbait]

This "rhd" fixation for Toronto has to stop. We just need a solid shutdown d. Does not matter what hand he plays. This lhd rhd/ Babcock Olympics in 2014 stuff has gotten so out of control. If he can play the right side, kills penalties and can play 20 of rielys 25 min a night we need him.. left handers welcome

No they actually need a RHD shot..you are incorrect.

 

[Funk21]

Toronto needs a stay at home, righty that can log lots of minutes. I say top 2D but he could also be a top 3D on our team after Rielly and Muzzin. Someone in the same ilk as Muzzin would be good.

I have this package:

Dermott-A good flashy d man who makes a few mistakes in his own end. He is only 23 years old but we are stocked on LD.

Gauthier-A big serviceable 4th line forward. He is a decent part time NHL'er with some opportunity to take a permanent 4th line spot.

Johnsson-A very serviceable top 6 forward with tons of skill and speed. We have 4 guys in the system like him so he is expendable.

Depends on who the D is coming back, but I am open to throw in a pick, 2nd in 2022. My package isn't garbage. They are good players. Gauthier will be the weakest player there. Dermott will get better in his own end as D men don't mature until they are 26 or 27.

AJ and Kerfoot are likely cap dumps at this point. The brass will have to make a decision on Dermott this offseason. Gauthier is a fourth line C and not very special at this point but serviceable. We also don’t have anybody in the pipeline ready to replace him. There is a ton of UFA RHD available and a few other D that might be of interest (Manson, Savard, Larsson) who again may be be available. The sum of the trade chips we get for said players is likely not too much. I figure 2x2nds and a 3rd for Kerfoot. Will that be enough for any D listed above? Not sure.

 

[howkie]

Toronto needs a stay at home, righty that can log lots of minutes. I say top 2D but he could also be a top 3D on our team after Rielly and Muzzin. Someone in the same ilk as Muzzin would be good.

I have this package:

Dermott-A good flashy d man who makes a few mistakes in his own end. He is only 23 years old but we are stocked on LD.

Gauthier-A big serviceable 4th line forward. He is a decent part time NHL'er with some opportunity to take a permanent 4th line spot.

Johnsson-A very serviceable top 6 forward with tons of skill and speed. We have 4 guys in the system like him so he is expendable.

Depends on who the D is coming back, but I am open to throw in a pick, 2nd in 2022. My package isn't garbage. They are good players. Gauthier will be the weakest player there. Dermott will get better in his own end as D men don't mature until they are 26 or 27.

I would be intressted to see what D-men you have in mind, and if this package would make that team better after the trade.

Gauthier is 25 and he is player you got from Free-agent, you never really pay any assets for him.

Johnsson , soon to be 26, had a really bad knee-injury, noone knows his status really and only 1,5 NHL seasons. Shall we call it a "gamble"?

Dermott soon to be 24, has had his up and downs, but you cant really see him as a replecement, so your D will take a massive hit loosing your top-pairing guy.

It is down to Dermott and Johnsson, nope would not trade a guy like Pionk for that.

 

[UnSandvich]

This is like saying Lindgren, Howden, and Fast should fetch a top pairing Dman.

 

[member 300185]

I would be intressted to see what D-men you have in mind, and if this package would make that team better after the trade.

Gauthier is 25 and he is player you got from Free-agent, you never really pay any assets for him.

Johnsson , soon to be 26, had a really bad knee-injury, noone knows his status really and only 1,5 NHL seasons. Shall we call it a "gamble"?

Dermott soon to be 24, has had his up and downs, but you cant really see him as a replecement, so your D will take a massive hit loosing your top-pairing guy.

It is down to Dermott and Johnsson, nope would not trade a guy like Pionk for that.

I stopped reading after that. He was drafted in 2013 at 21st overall in the first round...by Toronto. Not a free agent.

 

[howkie]

I stopped reading after that. He was drafted in 2013 at 21st overall in the first round...by Toronto. Not a free agent.

Sorry, writing on My Swedish cellphone, and it hates me. What I meant, a player like Gauthier you get from free-agency. You dont seek him as a return when trading a top-2 dman, and im pretty sure he will soon hit FA within 2 years

 

[I am Canadian]

I just made a proposal in the thread linked below, involving a 3 way trade between Toronto, Colorado, and Anaheim...

Proposal: - 3 way trade between TOR COL ANA



TOR out: Nylander
TOR in: Manson + Rakell @$1.9m

ANA out: Manson + Rakell ($1.85m retained)
ANA in: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage

COL out: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage
COL in: Nylander

That doesn't seem like enough for Anaheim.

 

[Skin Tape Session]

No they actually need a RHD shot..you are incorrect.

Actually no we dont. We need any handed d. It does not matter the handedness. Just because you're paradigm is lhd must be left handed and rhd must be right handed does not mean that's what we need.

if a left handed d who is sturdy, can play 20 plus min a night is available we want him. It's not a " well he checks all of our boxes but he's a left hand shot so poo poo the deal" no.. We don't have to have only a rhd to play the right side. That's a false narrative...a lame one actually...fail...

 

[WSS11]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but getting 43 pts in 73 games is being on pace for over 43 pts (and what a bizarre number to pick).

I mistyped in that facet of my point. He’s never eclipsed that mark in a season. His career PPG is 43.95. That’s not somebody who I’d categorize as a top six forward or somebody I’d want to give top six minutes to if I’m trying to contend.

I remember there was a thread where people were gauging Labanc’s value in a trade. A few people labeled him as a top six forward. He’s not for the same reason Johnsson is not.

It doesn’t change the main point that Toronto isn’t getting a top pairing dman (that they can’t afford under a flat cap) for the scraps in the OP.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

I mistyped in that facet of my point. He’s never eclipsed that mark in a season. His career PPG is 43.95. That’s not somebody who I’d categorize as a top six forward or somebody I’d want to give top six minutes to if I’m trying to contend.

I remember there was a thread where people were gauging Labanc’s value in a trade. A few people labeled him as a top six forward. He’s not for the same reason Johnsson is not.

It doesn’t change the main point that Toronto isn’t getting a top pairing dman (that they can’t afford under a flat cap) for the scraps in the OP.

Over the last 2 seasons, Johnsson is 124th among forwards in goals/60 at 5v5 and 67th in points/60. He'd be a top 6 forward on most teams. For what it's worth, Labanc is 139th and 149th respectively. That's a pretty big gap in production I'd say

 

[shortfuze]

I mistyped in that facet of my point. He’s never eclipsed that mark in a season. His career PPG is 43.95. That’s not somebody who I’d categorize as a top six forward or somebody I’d want to give top six minutes to if I’m trying to contend.

I remember there was a thread where people were gauging Labanc’s value in a trade. A few people labeled him as a top six forward. He’s not for the same reason Johnsson is not.

It doesn’t change the main point that Toronto isn’t getting a top pairing dman (that they can’t afford under a flat cap) for the scraps in the OP.

Andreas Johnsson was 47th in points the last 2 years and 43rd in goals the last 2 years for a LW. He’s got speed and he’s decent defensively and can play up and down the line up. Sounds like a top 6 winger to me. I don’t see him as a 1LW but is no problem playing middle 6.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

That might get you a D that wears #2, but for a legitimate top pairing one, heck no.

 

[cwede]

Nylander <> Trouba

 

[Jerkbait]

Andreas Johnsson was 47th in points the last 2 years and 43rd in goals the last 2 years for a LW. He’s got speed and he’s decent defensively and can play up and down the line up. Sounds like a top 6 winger to me. I don’t see him as a 1LW but is no problem playing middle 6.

Only a top 6 on some teams ...teams like tampa wash pitt Edmonton he doesnt crack top 6

 

[shortfuze]

Only a top 6 on some teams ...teams like tampa wash pitt Edmonton he doesnt crack top 6

Which still makes him a top 6 winger. Luckily there’s 31 teams in the league.

 

[Boondock]

Andreas Johnsson was 47th in points the last 2 years and 43rd in goals the last 2 years for a LW. He’s got speed and he’s decent defensively and can play up and down the line up. Sounds like a top 6 winger to me. I don’t see him as a 1LW but is no problem playing middle 6.

Sounds valuable, keep him. The issue is that you need to find a team with enough extra D, that they can replace a top 2/3 defender with a middle 6 LW + pieces.

 

[shortfuze]

Sounds valuable, keep him. The issue is that you need to find a team with enough extra D, that they can replace a top 2/3 defender with a middle 6 LW + pieces.

I know what the issue is. And I think the original poster knows the issue as well which is why he is proposing a trade.

 

[joe dirte]

Over the last 2 seasons, Johnsson is 124th among forwards in goals/60 at 5v5 and 67th in points/60. He'd be a top 6 forward on most teams. For what it's worth, Labanc is 139th and 149th respectively. That's a pretty big gap in production I'd say

Everyone has a different definition of top 6. I look at it this way - the goal is to win the stanley cup, and so when you look at who is top 6 or not, you ask yourself if he belongs in that position on a cup winning team. That's the bar I set, although that's higher than many look at it. To reach your goal, would you have to upgrade there.

With Andreas Johnsson, I'd say that's pretty borderline. If he's a second line winger on your team, and you're looking to contend, he's not really an issue, but it's not an area of strength either. I think he's a decent player, and upgrading on him wouldn't be a priority, but if an upgrade came along, I'd be happy with it. If he's on your third line, filling in on the second in the event of injury, you've got some really damn good wingers, so that's really the position I'd like him in.

But if you look at top 6 winger as a winger that is among the top 120 wingers, because technically there are 120 top 6 wing spots, he's without a doubt in there, and borderline first line winger.

someone called him a cap dump earlier..... that poster should probably keep quiet. He's an asset for sure, but not one that would garner some massive return, like some Leaf fans like to think.

 

[joe dirte]

I just made a proposal in the thread linked below, involving a 3 way trade between Toronto, Colorado, and Anaheim...

Proposal: - 3 way trade between TOR COL ANA



TOR out: Nylander
TOR in: Manson + Rakell @$1.9m

ANA out: Manson + Rakell ($1.85m retained)
ANA in: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage

COL out: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage
COL in: Nylander

this isn't bad. The only one I'm not sure would take it is Anaheim? I can see maybe a small sweetener for Toronto as well.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Love how fans want a top 2D, But want to give up scraps to obtain them.