Proposal: A new look in 2019/2020 - TML

Magic Man

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Signing Myers is a decent idea for the Leafs. No one is trading rights anymore, even if it's just rights for rights.

That Zaitsev for Spooner deal is terrible for whatever team Spooner plays on now.

To trade Marleau, you will probably have to give up a pick, or 2 for a nobody contract..

Ristolainen is overrated, but Nylander and holding out, plus this season plus this off season has lowered his value.
Marleau doesn't have a bad contract. He only makes 1.25M in salary after his bonus is paid. If available to the entire league he returns positive value comfortably. The only problem is he get's a say in where he goes.
 

Magic Man

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I’m sorry, but no one cares about what he did in the KHL, what he did on the powerplay 2 years ago, or what he did at Worlds. He’s also not a free agent this summer, so that hypothetical has no merit.

I appreciate the effort with your mental gymnastics but your arguments are irrelevant.

He’s a bottom-4 defenseman signed until 2024(!!) at $4.5M AAV. That is horrid.
It all matters. It's his resume. It's what other GM's look at when they're determining if he's the right candidate or if he has the ability to recover offensively. If he brings everything else and a team gives him PP minutes and he starts to score over 30 points a season, his value explodes as the term goes down.
 

JetsHomer

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Marleau doesn't have a bad contract. He only makes 1.25M in salary after his bonus is paid. If available to the entire league he returns positive value comfortably. The only problem is he get's a say in where he goes.
What team would give up positive value for Marleau? Can you name even one?
 

IceBoxHockey

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Feb 14, 2016
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Marleau doesn't have a bad contract. He only makes 1.25M in salary after his bonus is paid. If available to the entire league he returns positive value comfortably. The only problem is he get's a say in where he goes.

You also have to take into account his actual on ice performance. Which at this point is career suggests he’s all but done.
 

Magic Man

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What team would give up positive value for Marleau? Can you name even one?
I have no clue who would want him. There are 31 teams, he scored at a middle-6 rate. His contract only has one year of term and he only makes 1.25M in actual salary, so I put two and two together and realized there is a team out there who would take him for cheap. I would think the most interested would be teams that will be near the salary floor that don't have much fire power. Teams like Ottawa and Arizona. Those teams could use the name draw of Marleau to their advantage.
 

Magic Man

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You also have to take into account his actual on ice performance. Which at this point is career suggests he’s all but done.
Which is why he's worth no more than a mid round pick. He produced 37 points this season, that's middle-6 production. If he can do that again one more time, it's worth more than the salary he'll be paid.
 

Snowman

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I have no clue who would want him. There are 31 teams, he scored at a middle-6 rate. His contract only has one year of term and he only makes 1.25M in actual salary, so I put two and two together and realized there is a team out there who would take him for cheap. I would think the most interested would be teams that will be near the salary floor that don't have much fire power. Teams like Ottawa and Arizona. Those teams could use the name draw of Marleau to their advantage.
Except that Marleau has a NMC that he won't waive to go to Ottawa or Arizona. Marleau will 100% guaranteed be a Leaf next year. No cap relief to be gained there.
 
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Magic Man

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ops.meme_.nba_-1024x768.jpg


Kassian can skate dude. Brown has trended downwards in goals and if he's a good buy-low option, you guys ain't getting ZK for him. I'd rather keep Kass for our playoff run next year (YEAH I SAID IT)
The Leafs will get a 2nd for Brown at the draft. I do like Kassian as a modern day enforcer who can play.
 

SEALBound

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TML fans tend to forget that not all 31 GMs are TML fans, regardless of where they grew up or who they liked as a kid.
 
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Magic Man

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Except that Marleau has a NMC that he won't waive to go to Ottawa or Arizona. Marleau will 100% guaranteed be a Leaf next year. No cap relief to be gained there.
All the Leafs have to do is ask him to waive and all he has to do is say yes or provide a list of teams. Pretty simple stuff. If they threaten to lessen his role (Take away his 'A', demote to 4th line, put his ironman streak in jeopardy, etc) he may accept a trade.

I agree those teams are more unlikely because Marleau has to willingly accept to go there. They would just be the most interested. It's a cheap depth move for a team, doesn't cost big assets, term or salary and you get a middle-6 performer.
 

IceBoxHockey

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Which is why he's worth no more than a mid round pick. He produced 37 points this season, that's middle-6 production. If he can do that again one more time, it's worth more than the salary he'll be paid.

He was 189th in scoring last season and 259th in P/GP. That’s not middle six production.

He produced those numbers by being carried by one of the deepest forward teams in the league. He can’t drive play and brings players around him down which was evident in the playoffs. He doesn’t have value to the Leafs and he doesn’t have value to teams around the league.
 

JetsHomer

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All the Leafs have to do is ask him to waive and all he has to do is say yes or provide a list of teams. Pretty simple stuff. If they threaten to lessen his role (Take away his 'A', demote to 4th line, put his ironman streak in jeopardy, etc) he may accept a trade.

I agree those teams are more unlikely because Marleau has to willingly accept to go there. They would just be the most interested. It's a cheap depth move for a team, doesn't cost big assets, term or salary and you get a middle-6 performer.
Do you really think Marleau will want to uproot his young family just to do a the Leafs a solid, especially after they threaten him?

You certainly have a hopeful outlook, I'll give you that
 

Magic Man

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He was 189th in scoring last season and 259th in P/GP. That’s not middle six production.

He produced those numbers by being carried by one of the deepest forward teams in the league. He can’t drive play and brings players around him down which was evident in the playoffs. He doesn’t have value to the Leafs and he doesn’t have value to teams around the league.
There are 186 top-6 forwards in the NHL, if every team has 6. He was 189th in scoring, 3 spots back. I said he produced as a middle-6 player which includes 2nd and 3rd lines. In which he fit comfortably, if he got a couple more points I could have suggested top-6 production.

It should be remembered that he only scored 9 more points in the season before he signed with Toronto and got a 6.25M contract over 3 years. He's only got one of those years left and there is basically no money owing.
 

Magic Man

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Do you really think Marleau will want to uproot his young family just to do a the Leafs a solid, especially after they threaten him?

You certainly have a hopeful outlook, I'll give you that
All those things will likely happen here anyway. That knowledge may make him think of other destinations where he could potentially fit in and do well.

He's likely only going to play one more year if he doesn't bounce back into ~45 point territory. Will playing that year in a different city than his family hurt him much? If so, can the Leafs find him a home in destination that is close by? Time will tell. That's where his input comes into play and eliminates obvious choices for Toronto and a list of teams interested in Marleau get's smaller. Which is why they likely can't maximize his value. But, I think there will be enough interest that it comes down to Marleau being willing to waive and I think he'll take the best option and go because it's also better for his career.
 

Snowman

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Sure, they could be jackasses and do that. But Marleau could do the same thing in reverse. Dig his heels in and tell them to go to hell. He signed with the Leafs for a chance at the cup. There is zero chance under any circumstance that he will waive.

Granted, I will give you that Marleau's chances of winning the Cup with Toronto next year are only marginally better than his chances would be with Ottawa or Arizona.
 

Magic Man

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Sure, they could be jackasses and do that. But Marleau could do the same thing in reverse. Dig his heels in and tell them to go to hell. He signed with the Leafs for a chance at the cup. There is zero chance under any circumstance that he will waive.

Granted, I will give you that Marleau's chances of winning the Cup with Toronto next year are only marginally better than his chances would be with Ottawa or Arizona.
The Leafs didn't have Tavares before they signed him and they offered him the most money. It wasn't all about a cup for Marleau. The Leafs haven't made it out of the 1st rd. in their 3 recent seasons in the playoffs. Other teams can offer him a similar chance, they only have to find one team he's willing to go to.

Is it being jackasses or being respectful to a long time professional to tell him his role will diminish here if he is to stay but there may be mutually beneficial situations available where he can get a larger role. His ironman streak is pretty important, as is his year to year statistics. If he scores 20 points on the 4th line in Toronto when he could get more minutes and put up 40 somewhere else. I think those things are also important to players. He has a 1 in 31 shot at a cup no matter what.
 

Snowman

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The Leafs didn't have Tavares before they signed him and they offered him the most money. It wasn't all about a cup for Marleau. The Leafs haven't made it out of the 1st rd. in their 3 recent seasons in the playoffs. Other teams can offer him a similar chance, they only have to find one team he's willing to go to.

Is it being jackasses or being respectful to a long time professional to tell him his role will diminish here if he is to stay but there may be mutually beneficial situations available where he can get a larger role. His ironman streak is pretty important, as is his year to year statistics. If he scores 20 points on the 4th line in Toronto when he could get more minutes and put up 40 somewhere else. I think those things are also important to players. He has a 1 in 31 shot at a cup no matter what.
Well you can believe that if it makes you happy. I personally put the chance of that happening at 0%, to be generous. Marleau has nothing to gain and only risks his reputation as a good player by agreeing to go to a bottom feeder. There's just no incentive at all for him to do it.
 

Magic Man

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Well you can believe that if it makes you happy. I personally put the chance of that happening at 0%, to be generous. Marleau has nothing to gain and only risks his reputation as a good player by agreeing to go to a bottom feeder. There's just no incentive at all for him to do it.
It doesn't have to be a bottom feeder. There are 31 teams and 16 made the playoffs. Just have to find one that works for both Toronto and more importantly Marleau.

He risks his reputation as good player by accepting a lesser role, which means less production when there are opportunities out there where he could perform more and better and have similar chances at a cup before he retires. It could also prolong his career in the NHL to have another good season. He doesn't come back if he scores 20 points on the 4th line next year. It would be time to move on.
 

Randy Randerson

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Jul 28, 2016
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Why is Hyman still on the top line?!?
What is the fascination with this guy?
in the Leafs' cap position there's going to be some guys asked to play roles that are bigger than their talents. That said, I've been a huge critic of Hyman but he was much closer to worthy of that role this year, he doesn't create much but a lot less plays died on his stick than years before
 
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