Player Discussion #92 Jonathan Drouin

[Sorinth]

Look at who those guys played with and look at who Drouin played with last year.

Well look who Eller played with the past 5 seasons. Why is Drouin's ppg barely better then Eller's?

Why is Drouin expected to produce 70+ points anyways?
I mean... who actually expects that? And by "expect", I don't mean setting the bar soooooo high so it's easier to blame him afterwards.

Also... if Drouin and Pacioretty plays together... it's highly likely that they'll slump together. I mean, when DD turned into bad DD with 1 pts in 19 games, Pacioretty was neither playing great or producing a lot.

I don't expect it from him but there are plenty of posts about people expecting 60-70 points if not more. Posts about how he's the most exciting player behind only McDavid, etc...

As for slumps, Pacioretty was injured for most of that slump. He started the season with 3 points in 5 games though, came back and certainly wasn't as good as normal before turning it around.

It's quite likely that one will slump while the other still plays well. I would expect Drouin to mostly still be productive, even if Pacioretty slumps just like Radulov was during the playoffs when Pacioretty did nothing. If Drouin slumps whenever Pacioretty does then it's not a good sign it means he's too reliant on Pacioretty.

 

[Tuggy]

Superstar in the making

Agreed. I think he can become a top 10 scorer in the league.

 

[CauZuki]

Agreed. I think he can become a top 10 scorer in the league.

Stop limiting his potential he is top 5 , if not arguably top 3.

Wouldn't trade him for McDavid straight up.

 

[Tuggy]

Stop limiting his potential he is top 5 , if not arguably top 3.

Wouldn't trade him for McDavid straight up.

You can make dumb sarcastic comments all you want but Drouin has tons of talent and potential. I know the theme around here is always be down on the team and management but I'm excited about what I think Drouin can become.

 

[Maitz]

Remember his draft year, he said is favorite player was Kovalev. Probably wear the 27 because of him.

 

[hersky77]

Well look who Eller played with the past 5 seasons. Why is Drouin's ppg barely better then Eller's?



I don't expect it from him but there are plenty of posts about people expecting 60-70 points if not more. Posts about how he's the most exciting player behind only McDavid, etc...

As for slumps, Pacioretty was injured for most of that slump. He started the season with 3 points in 5 games though, came back and certainly wasn't as good as normal before turning it around.

It's quite likely that one will slump while the other still plays well. I would expect Drouin to mostly still be productive, even if Pacioretty slumps just like Radulov was during the playoffs when Pacioretty did nothing. If Drouin slumps whenever Pacioretty does then it's not a good sign it means he's too reliant on Pacioretty.

Im trying to figure out what you mean by this. Are you attempting to compare the two players.

 

[Sorinth]

Im trying to figure out what you mean by this. Are you attempting to compare the two players.

Someone brought up Drouin's lack of ES production. The excuse was that it's because he got 3rd line ice time and 3rd line quality linemates. But that doesn't make much sense since Drouin produced like other 3rd liners playing on the 3rd line. You would expect a 1st line player playing a 3rd line role to still outproduce other 3rd liners. Drouin didn't, so his lack of ES production is still a valid concern.

 

[hersky77]

Someone brought up Drouin's lack of ES production. The excuse was that it's because he got 3rd line ice time and 3rd line quality linemates. But that doesn't make much sense since Drouin produced like other 3rd liners playing on the 3rd line. You would expect a 1st line player playing a 3rd line role to still outproduce other 3rd liners. Drouin didn't, so his lack of ES production is still a valid concern.

Look at who he was playing with at the end of last year.

https://leftwinglock.com/line-combi...m=tampa-bay-lightning&strength=EV&gametype=GD

Guys like Killorn, Gourde and point were playing above him. Even with guys hurt he was stuck on the third line.

https://leftwinglock.com/line-combi...m=tampa-bay-lightning&strength=EV&gametype=10

It was a well known fact that cooper disliked him.

How is he supposed to produce more when he played with guys who were black hole offensively most of the time.

And i would look at his PP stats more then his EV strength stats. When he plays with talented players he produces, when he doesnt its a bit hairy. Playing with a guy like pacioretty or galchenyuk will allow him to produce more at 5 on 5

 

[Price is Wright]

Many fans from all teams would get excited by acquiring a young talent like Drouin. Will he be a 50-60 pts guy for us or a 60+ pts center for us? I agree we need to see him on the ice but there are reasons to be somewhat excited about having him on our team right? He has accomplished a lot up to this point and has proved himself worthy of a 3rd overall pick IMO.

If he plays as a top six centre the whole season, never taken off the position during a slump, never benched for risky plays, gets a chance to win defensive zone face-offs, I don't really care what his point totals are (unless they are really low).

All I wanted with Chuck's development was a chance to play centre without worrying about making a mistake. If Drouin gets that shot, I'll be very happy. He doesn't have to put up 60-70 points. If he can stick at centre and not look embarrassing in the role in the playoffs, it'll be a success to me.

 

[CauZuki]

You can make dumb sarcastic comments all you want but Drouin has tons of talent and potential. I know the theme around here is always be down on the team and management but I'm excited about what I think Drouin can become.

This is not at all the theme here...How many times have we been over excited over "potential". It's way too common , whether it be drafted or acquired youngsters , they somehow always have unlimited potential.

- Kristo the next big superstar! Oh no frozen foot syndrome...Bust!
- Avtsin this guy is underrated could be the next Ovechkin!
- Sergei Kostitsyn , a monster that was just as good as Kane and Gagner in the OHL...Where is he now?
- Collberg...Watchout he is a Swedish monster! Can't believe we traded him for Vanek...
- Thrower...Oh man this guy is going to be a top 4 D for the Habs!
- Tinordi...Solid D presence on the team for many years to come.
- Eller a former 13th overall pick! He's only 23!!
- Pouliot a former 4th overall pick! He's only 23 too!!

 

[MXD]

It's quite likely that one will slump while the other still plays well. I would expect Drouin to mostly still be productive, even if Pacioretty slumps just like Radulov was during the playoffs when Pacioretty did nothing. If Drouin slumps whenever Pacioretty does then it's not a good sign it means he's too reliant on Pacioretty.

Eh... for nearly every player, playing with a slumping linemate will have an effect on production. Hell, for just every player in the NHL right now, playing with a slumping linemate will have such an effect.

Of course, if Pacioretty gets 2 points in 10 games and Drouin gets 1, there's an issue. But if Drouin gets 5, well... that would be business as usual, mostly, even if Drouin's production would be below what's expected for him. Same thing if the other way around.

 

[Tuggy]

This is not at all the theme here...How many times have we been over excited over "potential". It's way too common , whether it be drafted or acquired youngsters , they somehow always have unlimited potential.

- Kristo the next big superstar! Oh no frozen foot syndrome...Bust!
- Avtsin this guy is underrated could be the next Ovechkin!
- Sergei Kostitsyn , a monster that was just as good as Kane and Gagner in the OHL...Where is he now?
- Collberg...Watchout he is a Swedish monster! Can't believe we traded him for Vanek...
- Thrower...Oh man this guy is going to be a top 4 D for the Habs!
- Tinordi...Solid D presence on the team for many years to come.
- Eller a former 13th overall pick! He's only 23 too!!

None of those guys are even comparable to Drouin. Give me a break.

 

[417]

You can make dumb sarcastic comments all you want but Drouin has tons of talent and potential. I know the theme around here is always be down on the team and management but I'm excited about what I think Drouin can become.

How dare you!

 

[417]

None of those guys are even comparable to Drouin. Give me a break.

Tune into HF boards in November/December...there are a bunch of posts made about Drouin since he was acquired which will be hilarious to look at.

 

[Tuggy]

Tune into HF boards in November/December...there are a bunch of posts made about Drouin since he was acquired which will be hilarious to look at.

I'm sure a lot of it goes back to people's general dislike of Bergevin but Drouin is a legit talent.

 

[MXD]

This is not at all the theme here...How many times have we been over excited over "potential". It's way too common , whether it be drafted or acquired youngsters , they somehow always have unlimited potential.

- Kristo the next big superstar! Oh no frozen foot syndrome...Bust!
- Avtsin this guy is underrated could be the next Ovechkin!
- Sergei Kostitsyn , a monster that was just as good as Kane and Gagner in the OHL...Where is he now?
- Collberg...Watchout he is a Swedish monster! Can't believe we traded him for Vanek...
- Thrower...Oh man this guy is going to be a top 4 D for the Habs!
- Tinordi...Solid D presence on the team for many years to come.
- Eller a former 13th overall pick! He's only 23 too!!

... Heh, I really expected Thrower to become a good bottom-pair option who can contribute toughness and some offense from the blueline on the PP

 

[CauZuki]

None of those guys are even comparable to Drouin. Give me a break.

I never said they were , I'm just showing a clear pattern of overestimation of potential.

I'm not saying Drouin will end up busting or anything close to that. Simply that your assessment is incorrect of the common theme on this board. The fact that you won't acknowledge some of the ridiculousness in this thread , tells me all I need to know. Can't you see how unwise it is to start predicting superstardom for a 22 year old who has yet to play in a prominent role , in one the most difficult markets in the NHL and as a local kid?

I hope he achieves his full potential and I recognize that he is a very talented player, why would I want him to fail? Afterall I'm a Habs fan , who wants to see the team do well , but I just can't stand the exaggerations and the blind confidence some have.

 

[Leon Lucius Black]

This is not at all the theme here...How many times have we been over excited over "potential". It's way too common , whether it be drafted or acquired youngsters , they somehow always have unlimited potential.

- Kristo the next big superstar! Oh no frozen foot syndrome...Bust!
- Avtsin this guy is underrated could be the next Ovechkin!
- Sergei Kostitsyn , a monster that was just as good as Kane and Gagner in the OHL...Where is he now?
- Collberg...Watchout he is a Swedish monster! Can't believe we traded him for Vanek...
- Thrower...Oh man this guy is going to be a top 4 D for the Habs!
- Tinordi...Solid D presence on the team for many years to come.
- Eller a former 13th overall pick! He's only 23!!
- Pouliot a former 4th overall pick! He's only 23 too!!

How the **** is Drouin comparable to any of these?

As a 21 year old he put up a 60 point pace over 82 games playing with guys like Filpulla and Killorn at even strength. Prior to that he put up 14 points in 17 games as a 20 year old in the playoffs on a team that made the Eastern Conference finals.

He has actually shown his potential in the NHL unlike most of those guys, if another team in our division traded for Drouin it would be people like you who would cry and complain Bergevin didn't get him.

 

[417]

I'm sure a lot of it goes back to people's general dislike of Bergevin but Drouin is a legit talent.

Oh 100% guaranteed...

 

[Belial]

This is not at all the theme here...How many times have we been over excited over "potential". It's way too common , whether it be drafted or acquired youngsters , they somehow always have unlimited potential.

- Kristo the next big superstar! Oh no frozen foot syndrome...Bust!
- Avtsin this guy is underrated could be the next Ovechkin!
- Sergei Kostitsyn , a monster that was just as good as Kane and Gagner in the OHL...Where is he now?
- Collberg...Watchout he is a Swedish monster! Can't believe we traded him for Vanek...
- Thrower...Oh man this guy is going to be a top 4 D for the Habs!
- Tinordi...Solid D presence on the team for many years to come.
- Eller a former 13th overall pick! He's only 23!!
- Pouliot a former 4th overall pick! He's only 23 too!!

You can't be serious with this list...

 

[417]

I never said they were , I'm just showing a clear pattern of overestimation of potential.

I'm not saying Drouin will end up busting or anything close to that. Simply that your assessment is incorrect of the common theme on this board. The fact that you won't acknowledge some of the ridiculousness in this thread , tells me all I need to know. Can't you see how unwise it is to start predicting superstardom for a 22 year old who has yet to play in a prominent role , in one the most difficult markets in the NHL and as a local kid?

I hope he achieves his full potential and I recognize that he is a very talented player, why would I want him to fail? Afterall I'm a Habs fan , who wants to see the team do well , but I just can't stand the exaggerations and the blind confidence some have.

First time I saw 21yr old PK Subban skate for the Habs in the playoffs, I thought he was going to be a superstar.

While I agree with you about not jumping the gun on young players, not every player is built the same way.

 

[CauZuki]

You can't be serious with this list...

Once again replying to one of my posts out of context , the onus was to prove that we tend to exaggerate the potential of our prospects. It's a common theme , that was what I was replying to , I never said anything about the prospects listed being comparable to Drouin. Whether it's a bust who we thought had top 6 potential or a guy we thought could be a star but ended up being a journeyman NHLer , the logic applies to all prospects.

Do you disagree with my premise that the Habs board (among I'm sure many boards on HF) , tend to exaggerate with the potential of our prospects? Did you not read the Poehling thread? Next Kesler , number 1 C material , could make the NHL as soon as next year...

 

[417]

Once again replying to one of my posts out of context , the onus was to prove that we tend to exaggerate the potential of our prospects. It's a common theme , that was what I was replying to , I never said anything about the prospects listed being comparable to Drouin. Whether it's a bust who we thought had top 6 potential or a guy we thought could be a star but ended up being a journeyman NHLer , the logic applies to all prospects.

Do you disagree with my premise that the Habs board (among I'm sure many boards on HF) , tend to exaggerate with the potential of our prospects? Did you not read the Poehling thread? Next Kesler , number 1 C material , could make the NHL as soon as next year...

But Jonathan Drouin is not a prospect.

But if we're to take what you just wrote, aren't you one of the posters who despite liking the trade, laments the fact we lost a "blue chip prospect"?

If so, how do you reconcile that, with what you just wrote above?

 

[CauZuki]

But Jonathan Drouin is not a prospect

You can replace "prospect" with "youngster" if that makes it easier to answer. The sentiment remains the same , we overate potential.

 

[417]

You can replace "prospect" with "youngster" if that makes it easier to answer. The sentiment remains the same , we overate potential.

I'll retort with the follow up question again.

aren't you one of the posters who despite liking the trade, laments the fact we lost a "blue chip prospect" in Sergachev?

If so, how do you reconcile that, with what you just wrote above?

If we overrate potential, how can you lament the fact we traded a player with potential, for an established "youngster"?

Once again, if you aren't one of the posters who argued against the trade because of the inclusion of Sergachev, I apologize in advance.