Player Discussion #8 - Ben Chiarot: Swing Low, Sweet Chiarot

[NORiculous]

Meanwhile, Gardiner has been brutal for Carolina.

Where are all of those off-season analytics worshippers now lol?

I remember posting some anaytics about him.

He had good analytics if... you don't know how too look at them because he had the easiest opposition for the TO Ds. So he was great... yes, but for a 3rd paring D.

I was against the Habs getting him.

 

[japhi]

As usual for this place, the same old suspects, desperate to grind an axe against Bergevin didn't let the fact that they knew nothing about Chariot's game stop them from offering their "expert" opinion on him and wrote him off as over paid and a lousy signing before he'd ever even suited up.

They do it again and again and never learn.

As usual, now that he's playing well, they have all gone silent as if we can't just go back and look at the silly things they said without so much as a clue what they were talking about.

I was amazed at how many guys claimed to have watch him play so much in Winnipeg, and had him so well scouted. As if.

And the idea that Buff was carrying him never made sense. How can a guy that is constantly out of position carry his partner? Its pretty clear that he played with Buff to cover for him, and allow him to take chances.

Most surprising thing to me is how well he skates and how good he is in transition, he pivots quick and can make plays on turnovers.

Pretty limited offensively but frees up his partners to create offense. His deal so far is a steal.

 

[Michoulicious]

I was amazed at how many guys claimed to have watch him play so much in Winnipeg, and had him so well scouted. As if.

And the idea that Buff was carrying him never made sense. How can a guy that is constantly out of position carry his partner? Its pretty clear that he played with Buff to cover for him, and allow him to take chances.

Most surprising thing to me is how well he skates and how good he is in transition, he pivots quick and can make plays on turnovers.

Pretty limited offensively but frees up his partners to create offense. His deal so far is a steal.

He uses the boards a lot in zone exits, which does not seem to fit the "system", but as the season progresses, the forwards seems to be able to adjust more to "his style". I like that he hits the net with his shots a lot. Looks confident out there.

Poor man Craig Rivet... And I liked Rivet.

 

[Archijerej]

After we've signed him, I've watched the Blues-Jets series to get a read on him. I concluded that if it's his normal level of play, he'd turn out to be a solid acquisition. So far it looks like it is his normal level. Some of the hot takes coming from people who have claimed they've seen him a lot sure look silly right now. Carried by Byfuglien? I don't know how Byfuglien can carry anyone, considering how much of an adventure he is in his positional play. Unfortunately, with Kulak looking more and more like a mirage, our entire 3rd pair basically evaporated. So we've taken one step forward and one step back.

 

[ECWHSWI]

He uses the boards a lot in zone exits, which does not seem to fit the "system", but as the season progresses, the forwards seems to be able to adjust more to "his style". I like that he hits the net with his shots a lot. Looks confident out there.

Poor man Craig Rivet... And I liked Rivet.

well if you think he's a lesser version of Rivet, who was a 2nd pairing D...

 

[Michoulicious]

well if you think he's a lesser version of Rivet, who was a 2nd pairing D...

Not sure which Craig Rivet you are refering to, but the one I'm talking about was playing the most on the team after Markov in his last season in Montreal (his "prime" if you want). He even signed a 3,5 M x 4y deal as 33 y old UFA, which was almost 8% of the cap at time (not saying it was a great deal). The equivalent nowadays would be 5,7 M x 4y.

I'd say if Rivet was not a top pair defender in his prime (I think he was), he was at the very least a very high end second pair.

 

[azcanuck]

I was amazed at how many guys claimed to have watch him play so much in Winnipeg, and had him so well scouted. As if.

And the idea that Buff was carrying him never made sense. How can a guy that is constantly out of position carry his partner? Its pretty clear that he played with Buff to cover for him, and allow him to take chances.

Most surprising thing to me is how well he skates and how good he is in transition, he pivots quick and can make plays on turnovers.

Pretty limited offensively but frees up his partners to create offense. His deal so far is a steal.

He's played well for sure. Last two games he's been lights out. I think he's discovering he's not just a guy who rides someone's jockstrap like in Winnipeg.
But the analytics in Winnipeg did show his play dropped off when not with Buff. Lets not kid anyone Buff was an all-star D. So naturally his partners analytics will drop if paired suddenly with a 5/6.
Now Chiarot is coming into his own. Great for us.

 

[DangerDave]

He's been really good overall after a slow start. He's certainly playing at a higher level than he was in Winnipeg. Hopefully he can keep it up.

 

[Hannibal]

I like him.

 

[ECWHSWI]

Not sure which Craig Rivet you are refering to, but the one I'm talking about was playing the most on the team after Markov in his last season in Montreal (his "prime" if you want). He even signed a 3,5 M x 4y deal as 33 y old UFA, which was almost 8% of the cap at time (not saying it was a great deal). The equivalent nowadays would be 5,7 M x 4y.

I'd say if Rivet was not a top pair defender in his prime (I think he was), he was at the very least a very high end second pair.

oh, that ONE year ?

 

[gillyguzzler]

I knew if he was physical but what suprises me is his offensive awareness. Winnipeg is my second favourite team and I have watched them a lot over the past few years and didn't see his offensive game as much as we're seeing now.

 

[Paddyjack]

He's played well for sure. Last two games he's been lights out. I think he's discovering he's not just a guy who rides someone's jockstrap like in Winnipeg.
But the analytics in Winnipeg did show his play dropped off when not with Buff. Lets not kid anyone Buff was an all-star D. So naturally his partners analytics will drop if paired suddenly with a 5/6.
Now Chiarot is coming into his own. Great for us.

Or maybe it means that giving too much importance to analytics is not a good idea?

 

[azcanuck]

Or maybe it means that giving too much importance to analytics is not a good idea?

That is true in general.

But in this case it's more of a misinterpretation of the analytics.

Of course his analytics would be better with Buf's. Who's wouldnt be? When he was taken away from Buf and put with some other scrub his analytics dropped off. Geez really? Of course they would.

Nevertheless he's been a pleasant surprise. I see him gaining confidence too.

 

[loadie]

I like him a lot. I hope he can continue playing like this for the entire season.

 

[japhi]

Or maybe it means that giving too much importance to analytics is not a good idea?

This. Weber trade he was an advanced stars plug. Thousands of posts on how he is an offensive drain. Comes here and his numbers improve dramtically playing with bottom pair partners.

Same case was made for Chiarot, look at his advanced stats this year.

I’m sure advanced stats have some value but from what I can see they are used to try and demonstrate a guy I don’t like is underperforming, and guys I do like are better then their traditional stat lines.

Case in point, no one talks about Weber or Chiarots advanced stats anymore. Or Subbans.

 

[A55P2]

He does look like an excellent addition so far. Gotta give credit to Bergevin on that one, he an obvious upgrade on Benn. We'd be so poor depth wise if not for him!

 

[ProspectsFanatic]

He does look like an excellent addition so far. Gotta give credit to Bergevin on that one, he an obvious upgrade on Benn. We'd be so poor depth wise if not for him!

MB plan A was Gardiner who has been atrocious.

 

[ole ole]

Here's a nice story on Chiarot.
Chiarot: Delivering the goods

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

alzner 2.0 i've heard

 

[Zorba]

alzner 2.0 i've heard

Apparently Benn was better. That’s a laugh and a half

 

[Phil Parent]

You know, this is where Alzner not working out hurts.

Because if we had Alzner and Chiarot, then our D at least has a decent top 4, which we don't. We have a decent top 2.

 

[Adam Michaels]

Ben Chiarot has been stellar the last little while. If Habs had someone to play with Weber, the Top-4 would be set. And with Fleury holding the fort in the third pair, they'd have a much better defensive unit.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Habs better find a solution Chiarot won't be able to hold 30min for so long. He's gonna get burned like Petry and Weber did.

 

[26Mats]

Habs better find a solution Chiarot won't be able to hold 30min for so long. He's gonna get burned like Petry and Weber did.

To cut down on Chiarot's ice time:

1) I'd live with Kulak's mistakes first and foremost - as Julien did last night. Last night CJ had Kulak-Weber, Chiarot-Petry. I never liked Kulak-Weber last year, and always though Kulak-Petry were solid, despite the occasional blunders. so one of those two options for the top 2 pairs.

2) to get the bottom pair more ice time, see if Mete-Fleury is better than Kulak-Fleury. Would be great if they could get 15-17 minutes a night. In the meantime, try to give Leskinen real ice time and see if he can adapt to the NHL.

I don't want to give up picks and prospects for a mediocre vet.

 

[26Mats]

Ben Chiarot has been stellar the last little while. If Habs had someone to play with Weber, the Top-4 would be set. And with Fleury holding the fort in the third pair, they'd have a much better defensive unit.

Who do see making a good 3rd pairing, even if we get a partner from outside?

Mete-Fleury?
Kulak-Fleury?

Because if it's Mete-Fleury, and Kulak can give us what he did last year, we've got a serviceable, if unspectacular dcore. But the problems with the forward corps still remain, when there are injuries.