GDT: #79: Rangers at FLYERS, Mar. 31, 2019, 12:30 p.m. ET

[Chinatown88]

 

[deadhead]

Hakstol 12-15-4
Gordon 25-19-4

Last year Hakstol was called a good coach simply because they were winning... so does this mean Gordon is a good coach?

If Gordon had Hakstol's goalies last year (.904 S%) or this year (.880 S%), what do you think his record would be?

Gordon sucks, he was bad with the Islanders, he's bad here.
At least Berube can take a team to the playoffs.

 

[Rebels57]

If those are the only untouchables then he needs to be fired

Thats what he said, granted this was soon after he came on board. Im not sure I disagree though. Obviously it would take an extremely unlikely scenario for many others to be traded, but no one on the team but those 2 should be 100% untouchable.

 

[renberg]

Dave Scott for beginners.

This annoys me. Scott stepped in and canned Hextall which, in turn, meant that Hakstol was out the door. Would people rather that Scott did nothing and the organization kept the Hextall/Hakstol train rolling?
I understand that Scott is a corporate guy and not a hockey veteran but he saw that things were going off of the rails and stepped in to remedy things. When the hockey guys balked at what he wanted done, he canned them.
Scott is what he is. He's not Ed Snider bit it's a different era today than what it was in the 70's. So far he hasn't agreed to sign an over priced goof ball goalie.
Fletcher may not be Keith Allen but let's wait and see what he does before burying him. To his credit, he's cleaned some of the crap out of the stable.

 

[Amorgus]

Couturier is easily untouchable.

I wonder how close we are to the point when Coots becomes more untouchable then Giroux.

 

[Rebels57]

This annoys me. Scott stepped in and canned Hextall which, in turn, meant that Hakstol was out the door. Would people rather that Scott did nothing and the organization kept the Hextall/Hakstol train rolling?
I understand that Scott is a corporate guy and not a hockey veteran but he saw that things were going off of the rails and stepped in to remedy things. When the hockey guys balked at what he wanted done, he canned them.
Scott is what he is. He's not Ed Snider bit it's a different era today than what it was in the 70's. So far he hasn't agreed to sign an over priced goof ball goalie.
Fletcher may not be Keith Allen but let's wait and see what he does before burying him. To his credit, he's cleaned some of the crap out of the stable.

Good post. I think the hatred for Scott is fear that he will force Fletch into making ill-advised short-sighted moved. This fear was born out of certain comments he has made since canning Hextall.

With Ron Hextall gone, the Flyers are Dave Scott’s team now | Sam Donnellon

 

[Striiker]

I wonder how close we are to the point when Coots becomes more untouchable then Giroux.

Both are equally as untouchable.

 

[Domino666]

I wonder how close we are to the point when Coots becomes more untouchable then Giroux.

I believe we will arrive here very soon

 

[deadhead]

I sure hope Fletcher is more persuasive than Hextall:

"Dave, if a business fails to invest, what happens to it down the road?"
"Yes, you want to acquire assets, but if a business overpays for assets, what happens to it down the road."
"So yes Dave, I'm looking for any deal that will help us win now, without endangering our long-term success (value)."

 

[Jettany]

Howe was an all-time great dman though he doesn't get the credit.
With proper management that team could have had a longer run. Clarke was handed a full roster when he took over. He did add Kjell Samuelson.
That 87 def unit was loaded - howe, mcrimmon, samuelsson, crossman, marsh.... i gues Daigneault was the 6th, i guess ok for 6th but he was more of a journeyman type.
And the Poulin/Propp/Kerr line was one of the best in the NHL.
I think there's some similarities in this team's structure but these young guys need to all take steps forward in the next couple seasons.

My opinion. This team isn’t close to the teams of the mid 80s. But time will tell.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

My opinion. This team isn’t close to the teams of the mid 80s. But time will tell.

If they didn’t run into one of the greatest dynasties in recent memory they would of won 2 Cups.
Its hard to compare eras tho. The 80s was wide open hockey. Todays game is a fast game but its not the same.

 

[Jettany]

Good post. I think the hatred for Scott is fear that he will force Fletch into making ill-advised short-sighted moved. This fear was born out of certain comments he has made since canning Hextall.

With Ron Hextall gone, the Flyers are Dave Scott’s team now | Sam Donnellon

Wasn’t everybody saying these bad trades were going to be made at the deadline hoping to make playoffs? Let’s wait for a significant move before judging.

 

[deadhead]

Hopefully Fletcher learned from his Minnesota experience that trading top picks/prospects for players near or over 30 is a good way to deep six your team down the road, and overpaying free agents is guaranteed to tie you hands down the road.

Given Hart, Myers, Morin and Frost, Farabee et al next year, maybe the powers that be can see a marketing campaign built around the kids, instead of insisting on making a "splash," no matter how irrational.
Problem is the Phillies, by trading prospects for players and signing Harper and McCutcheon, raised the stakes.

Though if you look more closely, 25 year old Crawford for 29 year old Segura, 26 year old Alfaro for 28 year old Realmuto, and Sanchez with durability issues. So Klentak didn't sacrifice the future, he had loads of cap room to sign Harper, and he paid market value, not a gross overpay. But Middleton is a baseball owner, not some corporate hack.

Packaging Hagg, Laughton, 2nd and 3rd rd picks, prospects like Strome (his brothers' success may raise his value), Wylie, Ginning, etc. could bring solid veterans with a couple years on their deals without mortgaging the future.
I can even see 26 year old Ghost in the right deal for a top player 26-28 years old.
But if Fletcher trades our 1st rd pick for Spurgeon, or Frost/Farabee for some "name" veteran, we're Fk'ed.

 

[Magua]

"I want to improve the team NOW. Too many picks and prospects."

"Couturier is not untouchable."

 

[CanadianFlyer88]

"I want to improve the team NOW. Too many picks and prospects."

"Couturier is not untouchable."

Are those actual quotes from someone?

 

[Ghosts Beer]

If Gordon had Hakstol's goalies last year (.904 S%) or this year (.880 S%), what do you think his record would be?

Gordon sucks, he was bad with the Islanders, he's bad here.
At least Berube can take a team to the playoffs.

Was Gordon supposed to be able to take a team to the playoffs that was dead last (16th) in the conference and 12-15-4 before his first game on Dec. 17?

 

[Magua]

Are those actual quotes from someone?

In a reductive sense.....basically.

 

[Striiker]

The problem with the term "untouchable" is it seems like people have different definitions of what that means.

Some people mean literally untouchable, as in, no matter what this person can't be moved.
Some people mean realistically untouchable, as in, assuming we're only considering realistic trades that could actually happen.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Your same old BS.

Gordon's player management consisted of promoting Sanheim to the 1st pair, dropping TK to the 3rd line, and remembering to put Lindblom back on the 2nd line after coaching for a month. That's the extent of it.

Oh yeah, replacing Lehtera, Weal and Weise with Varone and Knight, and MacDonald with Myers, but that's more on Fletcher.

Anyone who has watch the games the last couple months has seen a team that is more talented, yet plays worse than any team under Hakstol, sloppy exits, bad passes, hemmed in the D-zone on a consistent basis. The winning streak was completely due to better goalie play and advanced metrics prove this.

Gordon may be a friendlier, more approachable HC, but his scheme is ???, and I think the last couple weeks the player coach is being played by his players.

Today was one of the worst Flyer performances I can remember, and at home, and rested (i.e. none of the usual excuses).

Lol.

The moves you listed were obvious good moves, that Hakstol refused to do.

How come 280 games wasn't enough time to judge Hakstol but you're able to judge Gordon on less than a season?

 

[Larry44]

I wonder how close we are to the point when Coots becomes more untouchable then Giroux.

About two years ago for me.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I doubt Couts could be traded. You do not trade Selke caliber centers. Who could they get to replace what he does. Answer, no one.

 

[Larry44]

My opinion. This team isn’t close to the teams of the mid 80s. But time will tell.

The similarity is there for me. The 85-87 teams had a veteran corps of great but not ultra elite players (Howe excepted): McCrimmon, Marsh, Poulin, Propp, Kerr, Sinisalo, Eklund, Craven, then a bunch of really good kids came in and pushed them over the top: Lindbergh, Hextall, Crossman, Daigneault and the Fs: Ron and Rich Sutter, Tocchet, Zezel, Derrick Smith.

The current team has some great vets and some great young players now, and there are reinforcements coming next year and the years after. As the 3rd and 4th lines fill up with dynamic talented kids, it'll make the team very hard to defend against, see: Tampa Bay.

Giroux, Couturier, Konecny
Lindblom, Patrick, Voracek
JVR, Frost, Allison
Farabee, Vorobyev, Laczynski
Ratcliffe, Rubtsov, Laberge/Kase
Raffl, Laughton, Hartman

If the bulk of our prospects at F continue to reach their potential, like the D and G prospects have, it's going to be a very good, deep team.

 

[TheKingPin]

This season can’t end soon enough. Hopefully the offseason starts with a lottery win.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

My opinion. This team isn’t close to the teams of the mid 80s. But time will tell.

Obviously they are nowhere near there yet. What I said is that the team we are building could approach winning the same way - rolling 3+ lines and 3 D pairs which are relatively interchangeable, rather than depend heavily on top-heavy lines and "stars" - it's about the approach, not the quality, at this point, but the fact remains that our pipeline has the potential to produce talent equal to that of the 87 team. As to unearthing another Keenan, good ****ing luck - hopefully we don't need something that drastic and a qualified, quality, thoughtful coach can suffice.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

This annoys me. Scott stepped in and canned Hextall which, in turn, meant that Hakstol was out the door. Would people rather that Scott did nothing and the organization kept the Hextall/Hakstol train rolling?
I understand that Scott is a corporate guy and not a hockey veteran but he saw that things were going off of the rails and stepped in to remedy things. When the hockey guys balked at what he wanted done, he canned them.
Scott is what he is. He's not Ed Snider bit it's a different era today than what it was in the 70's. So far he hasn't agreed to sign an over priced goof ball goalie.
Fletcher may not be Keith Allen but let's wait and see what he does before burying him. To his credit, he's cleaned some of the crap out of the stable.

I never thought I'd see someone white-knighting for Dave ****ing Scott.

Gather ye canned goods and spruce up your shelters - the world is ****ed.