6th Overall - Jake Virtanen UPDATE: Signed to 3-Year ELC

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Love

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Feb 29, 2012
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Bingo. Dumb as a brick, poor vision and can't pass :laugh:

But he can shoot, skate and hit!

Virtanen really isnt a dumb player at all. Just because a player doesnt have insane vision and playmaking ability does not mean they arent a smart player.

Dumb would be if Virtanen didnt use his strenths (shot and speed) and tried to play like someone he isnt. To me, Virtanen playing the way he does shows intelligence because he is able to see his strengths and use them.


But ya I can see that he and Henrik are essentially opposites as players, but I dont agree with him being a dumb player at all.
 

Lundface*

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Virtanen really isnt a dumb player at all. Just because a player doesnt have insane vision and playmaking ability does not mean they arent a smart player.

Dumb would be if Virtanen didnt use his strenths (shot and speed) and tried to play like someone he isnt. To me, Virtanen playing the way he does shows intelligence because he is able to see his strengths and use them.


But ya I can see that he and Henrik are essentially opposites as players, but I dont agree with him being a dumb player at all.

Then they aren't opposites because Henrik is about as smart as they come.
 

CanaFan

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Then they aren't opposites because Henrik is about as smart as they come.

Well Virtanen is an elite skater, doesn't mean the opposite is Henrik being unable to skate at all. Means he is mediocre at the NHL level.

Henrik has elite hockey sense, passing, and vision. Doesn't mean Virtanen doesn't have these abilities at all, just that they are mediocre.
 

vadim sharifijanov

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Oct 10, 2007
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Virtanen reminds me of a young slightly more skilled Mario Marios

haha, nice. i misread that guy's hockey card for years.


Is nobody taking the Nolan comparison? Everything I've seen of Jake thus far has given me the impression of him being similar.

OOOHHH I forgot about Nolan.

He's a very good comparison.

Voted one of the fastest skaters, hardest hitters, and best shot..
arn't those the same 3 categories that Virtanen won awards for in Junior. They both boast similar frames too.... Could be a clone!

if Virtanen scores as many as Nolan did i'll be happy!

i only know virtanen's game from the highlight reels, but i feel like compared to young nolan he relies significantly more on speed and significantly less on brute strength.

is virtanen really 208 lbs as he's sometimes listed? that seems awfully big to me. anyway, according to that draft video, and the backs of hockey cards i pulled off google, nolan was 194 as a teenager. but watching the virtanen highlights, and remembering young nolan, it seems like nolan had the ability to just power through guys that i'm not sure virtanen can do. you see virtanen put his shoulder down and you see him use frame to protect the puck while pulling away with his speed. but nolan didn't just protect the puck, he skated through guys. in short, he looked "bigger" on the ice, even if he and virtanen are probably the same size at the same age, or even if jake is actually bigger as an 18 year old.

which is also to say, what virtanen did in the WHL, i don't think he could do in the NHL-- at least not right now. he just doesn't look big or strong enough to me to be able to pull away like that; i think NHL defensemen would knock him right off the puck. obviously, he should grow and get stronger. and i certainly hope he comes to camp next season able to just plow through guys nolan-style.

i think the other point of comparison with nolan is that nolan's wrist shot was phenomenal. quick flick of the wrist and it was hard and accurate. virtanen has a great wrist shot... for the CHL. but at least from what i've seen on the highlight reels, he's going to get creamed if he takes that long to get it off in the NHL or he's not even going to find the space to try to load that cannon. but dat backhand--- can't complain about the backhand.


i guess in a way these are things virtanen can, and almost certainly will, work on. but i still think, fundamentally, that virtanen isn't going to be a guy who if he's carrying the puck and shea weber is between him and the net just put his head down bulldoze his way in. i think there's a significant difference between the kind of fast power forward uses the advantage of his frame to buy himself an edge to break away from defenses (okay let's not say booth, let's say nashville series kesler), and the big power forward who uses the advantage of his speed to buy himself an extra split second to break through defenses (so nolan, neely, wendel clark, and spring of 2002 bertuzzi). there's a reason why that latter category is still the unicorn/holy grail/rarest of the rare that makes scouts mess up their pants. and i still don't think we have one.
 

thepuckmonster

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Oct 25, 2011
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haha, nice. i misread that guy's hockey card for years.






i only know virtanen's game from the highlight reels, but i feel like compared to young nolan he relies significantly more on speed and significantly less on brute strength.

is virtanen really 208 lbs as he's sometimes listed? that seems awfully big to me. anyway, according to that draft video, and the backs of hockey cards i pulled off google, nolan was 194 as a teenager. but watching the virtanen highlights, and remembering young nolan, it seems like nolan had the ability to just power through guys that i'm not sure virtanen can do. you see virtanen put his shoulder down and you see him use frame to protect the puck while pulling away with his speed. but nolan didn't just protect the puck, he skated through guys. in short, he looked "bigger" on the ice, even if he and virtanen are probably the same size at the same age, or even if jake is actually bigger as an 18 year old.

which is also to say, what virtanen did in the WHL, i don't think he could do in the NHL-- at least not right now. he just doesn't look big or strong enough to me to be able to pull away like that; i think NHL defensemen would knock him right off the puck. obviously, he should grow and get stronger. and i certainly hope he comes to camp next season able to just plow through guys nolan-style.

i think the other point of comparison with nolan is that nolan's wrist shot was phenomenal. quick flick of the wrist and it was hard and accurate. virtanen has a great wrist shot... for the CHL. but at least from what i've seen on the highlight reels, he's going to get creamed if he takes that long to get it off in the NHL or he's not even going to find the space to try to load that cannon. but dat backhand--- can't complain about the backhand.


i guess in a way these are things virtanen can, and almost certainly will, work on. but i still think, fundamentally, that virtanen isn't going to be a guy who if he's carrying the puck and shea weber is between him and the net just put his head down bulldoze his way in. i think there's a significant difference between the kind of fast power forward uses the advantage of his frame to buy himself an edge to break away from defenses (okay let's not say booth, let's say nashville series kesler), and the big power forward who uses the advantage of his speed to buy himself an extra split second to break through defenses (so nolan, neely, wendel clark, and spring of 2002 bertuzzi). there's a reason why that latter category is still the unicorn/holy grail/rarest of the rare that makes scouts mess up their pants. and i still don't think we have one.

Having watched him in the WHL the last year or so during various points (job requirement stuff) I think it's fair to state he's around 208-213. His legs are massive.
 

CanaFan

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i think the other point of comparison with nolan is that nolan's wrist shot was phenomenal. quick flick of the wrist and it was hard and accurate. virtanen has a great wrist shot... for the CHL. but at least from what i've seen on the highlight reels, he's going to get creamed if he takes that long to get it off in the NHL or he's not even going to find the space to try to load that cannon. but dat backhand--- can't complain about the backhand.

Lost me here. His release is one of the best I've ever seen in a junior player. Off his stick in an instant, almost no loading or "cocking" of the puck at all. IMO one of his most projectable NHL-skills is his release and how quickly he gets it off his stick. No worries about that part of his game for me.
 

vadim sharifijanov

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Oct 10, 2007
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Lost me here. His release is one of the best I've ever seen in a junior player. Off his stick in an instant, almost no loading or "cocking" of the puck at all. IMO one of his most projectable NHL-skills is his release and how quickly he gets it off his stick. No worries about that part of his game for me.

actually i think you're right. i watched the highlight package again. i had the big wrist shot goal against medicine hat stuck in my head (0:30 in this video), but even there it's a quick release, and lack of a follow through seemed to have fooled the goalie, but still a long wind up.

there were only two other markus naslund-style real wrist shot/snipe type goals in that package, but both were quick releases though he obviously didn't get quite as much mustard behind those as the medicine hat goal.

here's a different wrist shot goal against medicine hat from the one i was remembering. that's a nice shot:



happy to have been wrong about this one.
 

The Iron Goalie

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Feb 8, 2012
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Lost me here. His release is one of the best I've ever seen in a junior player. Off his stick in an instant, almost no loading or "cocking" of the puck at all. IMO one of his most projectable NHL-skills is his release and how quickly he gets it off his stick. No worries about that part of his game for me.

Yup. He's right up there with Mantha, and Ehlers for the best release in the CHL...probably has the best backhander as well.
 

lush

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Sep 9, 2008
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He looked great in that makeshift video they took of him in the non contact jersey up at whistler

I think it may work out nicely that in general, he's almost flying under the radar right now because of Horvat & Shinkaruk, next year he could make a huge impact and maybe expectations will be more reasonable then they usually are for our first round picks
 

Lundface*

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He looked great in that makeshift video they took of him in the non contact jersey up at whistler

I think it may work out nicely that in general, he's almost flying under the radar right now because of Horvat & Shinkaruk, next year he could make a huge impact and maybe expectations will be more reasonable then they usually are for our first round picks

Expectations will be sky high as they should be. 6th overall pick and with guys like Ehlers, Nylander and Fiala already lighting it up, he'll have a ton of pressure on him.

Ehlers in particular has looked fantastic and with so many on this board wanting Ehlers/Nylander, people won't soon forget passing them up if they continue their success.
 

GPNuck

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Expectations will be sky high as they should be. 6th overall pick and with guys like Ehlers, Nylander and Fiala already lighting it up, he'll have a ton of pressure on him.

Ehlers in particular has looked fantastic and with so many on this board wanting Ehlers/Nylander, people won't soon forget passing them up if they continue their success.

excellent point.. I admit I wanted Ehlers the most but I am pretty darn happy with Virtanen.. I hope he gets to play on a line with McDavid at the World Juniors :yo: would be exciting to see that duo together. I think Ehlers will actually get at least 9 games with the Jets since they are not a strong team and he's playing so good. Happy for Winnipeg to get such a talented guy with the 9th pick
 

Peen

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Honestly Ehlers scares me. I think of that 6-10 group I would have taken him 10th. He's got the highest ceiling, but lowest floor of all those players.
 

WetcoastOrca

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I'm really not too worried about Nylander and Ehlers lighting it up in training camp. Virtanen will be back in October and we will be able to see how he progresses. I'm not sure any of those three really belong in the NHL at this point.
 

biturbo19

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Expectations will be sky high as they should be. 6th overall pick and with guys like Ehlers, Nylander and Fiala already lighting it up, he'll have a ton of pressure on him.

Ehlers in particular has looked fantastic and with so many on this board wanting Ehlers/Nylander, people won't soon forget passing them up if they continue their success.

I'm hopeful that people will wait a while to see who "lights it up" in the real NHL before making rash judgments and flipping out about all the "skill" we passed up. But that's probably expecting too much.

Especially when it comes to the inevitable media hoopla that accompanies any and all Toronto Maple Leafs prospects. Which knows no bounds. It's never too early to start crowning the latest Leafs prospect a HoFer. :sarcasm:
 

arsmaster*

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I'm hopeful that people will wait a while to see who "lights it up" in the real NHL before making rash judgments and flipping out about all the "skill" we passed up. But that's probably expecting too much.

Especially when it comes to the inevitable media hoopla that accompanies any and all Toronto Maple Leafs prospects. Which knows no bounds. It's never too early to start crowning the latest Leafs prospect a HoFer. :sarcasm:

Excellent point. I was just about to say something similar.
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Where is Ehlers looking fantastic? Is this still prospects tourney stuff or have the Jets played preseason games.

All the mites looked good in Penticton....
 

DCantheDDad

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I'm hopeful that people will wait a while to see who "lights it up" in the real NHL before making rash judgments and flipping out about all the "skill" we passed up. But that's probably expecting too much.

Especially when it comes to the inevitable media hoopla that accompanies any and all Toronto Maple Leafs prospects. Which knows no bounds. It's never too early to start crowning the latest Leafs prospect a HoFer. :sarcasm:

Hey, of course he will be a HoFer, he helped them plan the parade route down Younge Street :sarcasm:
 

Hodgy

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Feb 23, 2012
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Excellent point. I was just about to say something similar.
-----
Where is Ehlers looking fantastic? Is this still prospects tourney stuff or have the Jets played preseason games.

All the mites looked good in Penticton....

Save perhaps Valk, none of our prospects really stood out in Penticton....
 

Nona Di Giuseppe

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Excellent point. I was just about to say something similar.
-----
Where is Ehlers looking fantastic? Is this still prospects tourney stuff or have the Jets played preseason games.

All the mites looked good in Penticton....

I watched the Wild vs Jets game last night and I have to say that Ehlers looked good. For a rookie, he looked really good. Highly skilled and trying to show it.
 

CanaFan

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Glad Ehlers looked good. Watched highlights only and saw he took a beating from the wild D on one shift, but didn't see much else of him. Thing with him with be to gain enough strength so that he can battle with bigger forwards and D for the puck, otherwise he's going to be a fairly limited player. High reward but also somewhat risky.
 

arsmaster*

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I watched the Wild vs Jets game last night and I have to say that Ehlers looked good. For a rookie, he looked really good. Highly skilled and trying to show it.

Well we know he's skilled, but was the skill accomplishing anything? I don't want to drag this conversation into the pre-draft convo's that took play in regards to these guys, but if you're not getting the puck on net, IMO you're not being effective.

There are plenty of supremely skilled hockey players who never make a meaningful NHL contribution.

This isn't to suggest Ehlers won't become a very good pro, but there are always going to be guys like this that flash skill, but when they can't withstand the physicality of the pro game they struggle to meet the expectations that their skill level would bestow on them.

^^^^

Canafan, yeah, ol' Keith Ballard was manhandling him pretty good there.

It's NHL preseason for a recent draftee, not the be all end all, but I don't see that type of physical dominance ever not happening to Ehlers, similar to Mason Raymond.
 

CanaFan

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Well we know he's skilled, but was the skill accomplishing anything? I don't want to drag this conversation into the pre-draft convo's that took play in regards to these guys, but if you're not getting the puck on net, IMO you're not being effective.

There are plenty of supremely skilled hockey players who never make a meaningful NHL contribution.

This isn't to suggest Ehlers won't become a very good pro, but there are always going to be guys like this that flash skill, but when they can't withstand the physicality of the pro game they struggle to meet the expectations that their skill level would bestow on them.

^^^^

Canafan, yeah, ol' Keith Ballard was manhandling him pretty good there.

It's NHL preseason for a recent draftee, not the be all end all, but I don't see that type of physical dominance ever not happening to Ehlers, similar to Mason Raymond.


Agreed. I hate being negative about Ehlers, because I actually like him and think he could end up being a very good player. I just get a bit put off by the habit of this board to look at every little thing a player that we passed on does as somehow "amazing" when it really is just par for the course. I mean, there's really nothing wrong with saying he looked good and I don't even think the poster above was saying it to put a negative on Virtanen. But it something this board does a lot, esp last year every time a certain Russian picked up a second assist or something equally pedestrian.

Anyway, nothing wrong with seeing Ehlers have a good game, as I still feel good about taking Virtanen and it's not like there won't be other good players taken after us in the draft. I just wish we'd focus more on our players (difficult I know with Virtanen not playing) rather than obsessing so much over every other player we passed on.

/end rant :)
 
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