Post-Game Talk: #30: Senators 3 at FLYERS 4, Saturday, Dec. 7, 2019, 1 pm ET [Konecny UBI]

[Curufinwe]

Rinaldo once threw a dirty hit on a Penguin and Flyers fans on the main board thread were as angry as Pens fans. We were sick of his crap.

This was against Buffalo, but I recall being disgusted by it.

 

[ybnvs]

1. In the post of mine you quote, I explicitly say, "I’m not saying the Flyers should be the Broad Street Bullies anymore." So the majority of your post, as it relates to the post you are replying to, is a straw man argument.

2. I acknowledge that I think there is still value in having a couple of guys who don't always abide by the rules. That is my point, as well as that almost all of us cheer for them when they're on our side.

3. The Flyers didn't beat Russia in '76 through sheer brutality. The physical intimidation certainly helped. And it still can, to a degree. But they also had great players and played a 1-4 neutral zone trap that neutralized Russia's possession style.

 

[renberg]

I'm aware the time of the "Broad Street Bullies" was the most successful time of the team's history. Nearly 50 years later, and we have people who still want to associate the current Flyers with a bunch of *******s who went out to deliberately hurt other people. Took on the Red Army when no one else wanted to and won through brutality on the ice. Xenophobia was rampant during the 70's, as it still is today but under guise and deceit.

It's not the 1970's anymore. Bringing up the past is a way to deflect and distract against the new changes to the game and player's own individual philosophies and styles. Sure, you may have liked that style of play (How old are you?) but it is absolutely criminal how that brand of hockey was played. For instance, up until 1993, in many states it was legal for men to rape their wives. Native American families could have the government rip their children ripped away from them due to the image of being too "savage". Times are changing, so too must your mindset on the brand of hockey.

Team identities evolve and adapt as the game continues to evolve. We see this through systems, practice, coaching methodologies, and in general simply players' own philosophy and approach to the game. Skill trumps thuggery. Capitalism is prevailing - A winning culture brings in more revenue.

To me, "Be a ****ing Flyer" doesn't mean they players & coaches have to even resemble a nuance of what the Broad Street Bullies brought to the NHL - thuggery and battery on ice. In my opinion it is simple - it means to represent the brand with passion and respect. This is Philadelphia, we thrive on passion in all avenues of life.

The Flyers of the seventies were not really much different than several other teams in the league that played a physical game. The Blues and Bruins were right there as well. Most teams carried physical players or a line of them. It’s just that Kelly, Saleski and Schultz gained notoriety by being on Cup winners.
As for that Red Army team, they were notorious for the stick work and cheap shots. They also flopped around on the ice like the soccer players of today begging for calls. Sure Clarke got singled out for his chop but it was a warning to the Russians that they weren’t going to get away with that crap in this game. Play big boy hockey or go home; which they almost did when the pulled their AS club off of the ice.

 

[Starat327]

There is a drastic difference between nasty stickwork and physical play, and jumping a player.

Venn diagram of "theres nothing wrong with what tkachuk did" and "hagg is a NHL level d man" is needed. I've got a few guesses on who is in the middle...

 

[Beef Invictus]

The point is people are hypocrites.

If the Flyers had a Tkachuk they'd love him just as much as we all loved Pronger who is one of the dirtiest players in league history.

It's why Starat can't even answer the simple question of if he rooted for Pronger as a Flyer. Because of course he did. You love it when it's on your side, and it's effective.

The difference, which sparked all of this, is that Flyers fans here have zero issue calling out when their players do irresponsible and stupid stuff like Tkachuk did.

And again, the Pronger we got was nowhere close to the dirty monster he was when he was younger. Young Pronger always struck me as the answer to the question, "What would it be like if Scott Stevens was angry all the time?"

Of course, I was also told I would adore Rinaldo and I certainly did not.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

The difference, which sparked all of this, is that Flyers fans here have zero issue calling out when their players do irresponsible and stupid stuff like Tkachuk did.

And again, the Pronger we got was nowhere close to the dirty monster he was when he was younger. Young Pronger always struck me as the answer to the question, "What would it be like if Scott Stevens was angry all the time?"

Of course, I was also told I would adore Rinaldo and I certainly did not.

Pronger was dirty as f***. Vicious. Got away with more penalties than anyone I've seen in recent times.

Not perhaps as dirty as he was when he was younger (though that's debatable; I'd personally say he threw fewer hits but was just as dirty), but that doesn't mean he still wasn't one of the league's dirtiest players as a Flyer. And we loved him.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Pronger was dirty as ****. Vicious. Got away with more penalties than anyone I've seen in recent times.

Not perhaps as dirty as he was when he was younger (though that's debatable; I'd personally say he threw fewer hits but was just as dirty), but that doesn't mean he still wasn't one of the league's dirtiest players as a Flyer. And we loved him.

What are you defining as dirty? Because I'm referring to the kind of stuff that gives people brain damage, and that's the stuff he wasn't doing as a Flyer at anything like the rate he was famous for.

 

[deadhead]

The Flyers of the seventies were not really much different than several other teams in the league that played a physical game. The Blues and Bruins were right there as well. Most teams carried physical players or a line of them. It’s just that Kelly, Saleski and Schultz gained notoriety by being on Cup winners.
As for that Red Army team, they were notorious for the stick work and cheap shots. They also flopped around on the ice like the soccer players of today begging for calls. Sure Clarke got singled out for his chop but it was a warning to the Russians that they weren’t going to get away with that crap in this game. Play big boy hockey or go home; which they almost did when the pulled their AS club off of the ice.

The Flyers of the 70s were a response to the punishment meted out to the "French line" by teams like the Bruins.
Fight fire with fire.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

The Flyers of the 70s were a response to the punishment meted out to the "French line" by teams like the Bruins.
Fight fire with fire.

They were a direct response to the Flyers getting physically bullied and humiliated by St. Louis and Snider vowing that it would never happen again.

 

[Tripod]

The point is people are hypocrites.

If the Flyers had a Tkachuk they'd love him just as much as we all loved Pronger who is one of the dirtiest players in league history.

It's why Starat can't even answer the simple question of if he rooted for Pronger as a Flyer. Because of course he did. You love it when it's on your side, and it's effective.

I would love for us to have a Tkachuk or Pronger on out team.

But down by one with 30 seconds left, I would also be pissed that he chose that moment to jump Laughton and call him an idiot for it. He should have just done it earlier in the game...or wait until like 5 seconds left if the puck cleared the zone.

But whatever. We benefited from him being dumb. On to the next game and on Dec 21st, it could be a wild game.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

What are you defining as dirty? Because I'm referring to the kind of stuff that gives people brain damage, and that's the stuff he wasn't doing as a Flyer at anything like the rate he was famous for.

This all derived out of what Tkachuk did, right? Did he do anything to Laughton that would cause brain damage? Wouldn't you still classify it as dirty?

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I would love for us to have a Tkachuk or Pronger on out team.

But down by one with 30 seconds left, I would also be pissed that he chose that moment to jump Laughton and call him an idiot for it. He should have just done it earlier in the game...or wait until like 5 seconds left if the puck cleared the zone.

But whatever. We benefited from him being dumb. On to the next game and on Dec 21st, it could be a wild game.

I mostly agree with this. But he wanted to get Laughton and the opportunity was right in front of him. And it's not like Ottawa is going to the playoffs.

 

[Beef Invictus]

This all derived out of what Tkachuk did, right? Did he do anything to Laughton that would cause brain damage? Wouldn't you still classify it as dirty?

Yes, jumping an unprepared individual and raining punches on their head can cause brain damage.

There are different levels of dirty. The unacceptable and the acceptable. Crosby hacking at people's wrists is shitty, but it's not as bad as Malkin's nonstop siege on the collective brains of the NHL, for instance. Briere jabbing guys with his stick is dirty, but it's not like Richards blasting Booth's head off, which was so nasty it even shook up Richards.

 

[Curufinwe]

Flyers announce Konecny has a concussion.

 

[Adtar02]

The point is people are hypocrites.

If the Flyers had a Tkachuk they'd love him just as much as we all loved Pronger who is one of the dirtiest players in league history.

It's why Starat can't even answer the simple question of if he rooted for Pronger as a Flyer. Because of course he did. You love it when it's on your side, and it's effective.

Well I am not sure who you’re talking about. Most everything I have read is about that play. Many have said they would like him on the team. Please stop making false statements in an attempt to elevate yourself.

 

[flyersnorth]

I can only hope the concussion to Konecny is mild. He didn't appear to lose consciousness, didn't look wobbly, and seemed coherent.

I honestly don't know how hockey players do it. I've known half a dozen people who have gotten concussions, and the recovery was MONTHS, including a month or more in a completely dark room with no stimulus whatsoever.

 

[Starat327]

Well I am not sure who you’re talking about. Most everything I have read is about that play. Many have said they would like him on the team. Please stop making false statements in an attempt to elevate yourself.

Good luck - strawmen abound.

It appears as though some cant separate rooting for a player, and not condoning individual actions. GB didnt get an answer from me because I knew hed be incapable of separating the two. Of course I loved having Pronger here. That doesnt mean I blindly worshipped everything he did before he got here though. Brady Tkachuk would still be a pile of shit in my book if he was wearing a flyers Jersey and did what he did this weekend to Crosby.

 

[deadhead]

Yes, jumping an unprepared individual and raining punches on their head can cause brain damage.

There are different levels of dirty. The unacceptable and the acceptable. Crosby hacking at people's wrists is ****ty, but it's not as bad as Malkin's nonstop siege on the collective brains of the NHL, for instance. Briere jabbing guys with his stick is dirty, but it's not like Richards blasting Booth's head off, which was so nasty it even shook up Richards.

Gee, we actually agree on something!

Playing with an edge is one thing, but trying to actually hurt players is another.

I have no problem with the hit on TK because there wasn't an attempt to head hunt, just happened helmets bounced off each other and the shorter guy got the brunt - but no elbow to the head, slamming a guy head first into the boards, etc.

 

[Rebels57]

I can only hope the concussion to Konecny is mild. He didn't appear to lose consciousness, didn't look wobbly, and seemed coherent.

I honestly don't know how hockey players do it. I've known half a dozen people who have gotten concussions, and the recovery was MONTHS, including a month or more in a completely dark room with no stimulus whatsoever.

Yeah I would guess it's a minor one, fortunately. I've had a minor one or two from incidental collisions in hockey and the symptoms aren't too bad, but you just need to take some time off as a precaution.

 

[Curufinwe]

I can only hope the concussion to Konecny is mild. He didn't appear to lose consciousness, didn't look wobbly, and seemed coherent.

I honestly don't know how hockey players do it. I've known half a dozen people who have gotten concussions, and the recovery was MONTHS, including a month or more in a completely dark room with no stimulus whatsoever.

Giroux missed 4 games in 11-2 after this terrible knee to the head from Simmonds.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I can only hope the concussion to Konecny is mild. He didn't appear to lose consciousness, didn't look wobbly, and seemed coherent.

I honestly don't know how hockey players do it. I've known half a dozen people who have gotten concussions, and the recovery was MONTHS, including a month or more in a completely dark room with no stimulus whatsoever.

sometimes you feel worse after or the next day. But I agree, hopefully he misses 7-10 days after today and is good to go. If he isnt, he isnt. Long term health is way more important

 

[Flyotes]

have you been on social media lately? that's literally all it is. everyone getting offended over the dumbest **** imaginable. i don't know wtf happened to our society in the last couple years where literally now people aren't allowed to have their own opinions anymore.

I don't understand why people get worked up about this.

Opinions should be challenged. It is how coming to know things works.
The left, via schooling and teachers, has done a great job teaching the younger generations to stamp out anything they see as public sadism (and rightfully so). This isn't a political position. It's just a noted thing that happened in history (started in the 70s). Don't flame me.
But you do end up with people defending their turf and identity politics as a consequence of being taught to defend rabidly your position.

 

[Flyotes]

I can only hope the concussion to Konecny is mild. He didn't appear to lose consciousness, didn't look wobbly, and seemed coherent.

I honestly don't know how hockey players do it. I've known half a dozen people who have gotten concussions, and the recovery was MONTHS, including a month or more in a completely dark room with no stimulus whatsoever.

After Prims-- any concussion to a player makes me worry I'll never see him lace up the skates again.

 

[Starat327]

After Prims-- any concussion to a player makes me worry I'll never see him lace up the skates again.

Yup. I hate to soapbox this again, but there are a whole hell of a lot of people who are ignorant to the idea of concussions. They aren't like typical medical issues. These aren't "well if you can move it, it's not broken" types of things. Not having immediate common signs doesnt mean it isnt severe, it just hasnt manifested itself in that way. Also, common signs arent really common at all. I know people who never experience nausea during a concussion event. Most feel dizzy or light headed, but not all. It's such a wild medical phenomenon that it's best to just not assume anything in these types of situations.

 

[Rich Nixon]

Yup. I hate to soapbox this again, but there are a whole hell of a lot of people who are ignorant to the idea of concussions. They aren't like typical medical issues. These aren't "well if you can move it, it's not broken" types of things. Not having immediate common signs doesnt mean it isnt severe, it just hasnt manifested itself in that way. Also, common signs arent really common at all. I know people who never experience nausea during a concussion event. Most feel dizzy or light headed, but not all. It's such a wild medical phenomenon that it's best to just not assume anything in these types of situations.

They're confusing and a total bitch. My last big one didn't hit me for like 24 hours. Slipped on some ice and bounced my head off concrete one night, still ran my little errand and came home and went to bed. Next day I was waiting for my girlfriend to get off work and stopped at a nearby bar. Halfway through one drink, the entire room started melting and I had to cover my one eye to call an Uber. Probably had on and off symptoms for a month after, from light sensitivity to nausea to irritability.