Proposal: 3 way trade between TOR COL ANA

[McJedi]

Colorado and Anaheim should deal directly. Rakell might be as good as Nylander

No thanks from the Avs. Rackell doesn’t move the needle enough. Nylander is both better and younger and signed for much longer.

 

[Gliff]

Ducks say no easily.

 

[Gliff]

I'm yet to see Anaheim fans declining Timmins + 1st for Rakell, whether it's on this forum or capfriendly's AGM. In fact, have a look at any Anaheim AGM on capfriendly involving Colorado and you'll see that the vast majority of them feature that exact trade.

I think Rakell is worth more, but not much. I do think that the 3 year flat cap makes Rakell's contract even more valuable. I get that isnt as important to COL, but other teams value it.

 

[Hasbro]

Rather than trade Timmins, I'd offer up Zadarov to Toronto. They need to plug some holes back there and Sakic suckered Dubas into Kerfoot.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

No thanks from the Avs. Rackell doesn’t move the needle enough. Nylander is both better and younger and signed for much longer.

You're underrating Rakell a metric tonne...

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I think Rakell is worth more, but not much. I do think that the 3 year flat cap makes Rakell's contract even more valuable. I get that isnt as important to COL, but other teams value it.

If he was signed for all 3 years... Sure.


But as a UFA in 1 year? If anything the flat cap hurts his value. Now any team that's potentially acquiring him will have even less cap space then originally thought to have to try and re-sign him next summer... In a time where Rakell will certainly be looking to cash in as much as he can after being underpaid in his last deal and likely being at his last high end shot to get a good pay day in the league.


Now... Teams will certainly still be very interested in getting him and if a team decides to really go all in on 1 year, Rakell is an attractive piece. But he's attractive in the sense of a rental far more then in the sense of acquiring and re-signing at this point.

There's gonna be very little money to go around for the next few years and teams will be trying to avoid paying UFAs as much as they can right now, instead looking for the guys who have term locked up through the next couple years of uncertainty.

 

[TheImpatientPanther]

Rather than trade Timmins, I'd offer up Zadarov to Toronto. They need to plug some holes back there and Sakic suckered Dubas into Kerfoot.

Can Zadorov play RD, otherwise, why would the Leafs need another LD? They have 7 of them already

 

[lwvs84]

A problem from Anaheim perspective is the "only" thing they are missing is the top end talent. They have plenty of guys that can fill 2nd/3rd lines and d-pairs (aside from RD). There is no one on the team that can drive the line they are asked to play on (like Getzlaf can probably be the guy on a second line, but can't consistently on the 1st anymore). If the Ducks are making moves, it should be for quality and not quantity. If they are trading Rakell plus Manson, Ducks should be aiming for fewer pieces with the potential to play on the top line or more quality picks to let the scouting team do their thing (or ammo to trade up).

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

If he was signed for all 3 years... Sure.


But as a UFA in 1 year? If anything the flat cap hurts his value. Now any team that's potentially acquiring him will have even less cap space then originally thought to have to try and re-sign him next summer... In a time where Rakell will certainly be looking to cash in as much as he can after being underpaid in his last deal and likely being at his last high end shot to get a good pay day in the league.


Now... Teams will certainly still be very interested in getting him and if a team decides to really go all in on 1 year, Rakell is an attractive piece. But he's attractive in the sense of a rental far more then in the sense of acquiring and re-signing at this point.

There's gonna be very little money to go around for the next few years and teams will be trying to avoid paying UFAs as much as they can right now, instead looking for the guys who have term locked up through the next couple years of uncertainty.

He has 2 years left, after this season.

And honestly any more years than that and his contract would be insanely valuable, that there would be no reason for us to move him.

 

[Samus44]

Hilarious. As an Avs fan, I have to agree with you. Avs didn’t perform to the fantasy expected and hoped for by the party in LA.

Nylander will cost them more than three good (but no elite) prospects and a low 1st.

Kaut did have his best nhl game in Anaheim. Picked Lindholm in the most embarrassing way and won that game with the steal and first assist on an easy goal off turnover.

I'd call Connor Timmins an elite or near elite prospect.

 

[Arizonan God]

As an Avs fan, I don't understand why we're involved in this trade. Trading away the bulk of our prospect depth for a guy we really don't need doesn't make any sense to me. We were already top 5 in goal scoring despite all of the injuries to significant players. Adding Nylander and his ~$7m cap hit to score ~60 points doesn't fill a dire need, as we already have guys capable of scoring. Having good young players who can potentially contribute, even in a bottom 6 role, while still on their ELCs is much more important to the long term success of this team. We're poised to make a few runs, then reload with more good young talent through our prospect pool and try again. Why screw that up for Nylander?

You instantly have one of the best top 6’s in the league?

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

He has 2 years left, after this season.

And honestly any more years than that and his contract would be insanely valuable, that there would be no reason for us to move him.

True my bad, thought he only had 1 year.

 

[Merrrlin]

Ducks get the worst of this easily. Toronto cleans up. Rakell is a Nylander level talent, IMO.

Interesting, I'd love to see a poll asking the rest of the forum if they agree.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Interesting, I'd love to see a poll asking the rest of the forum if they agree.

Agree to what?

 

[The Moose is Loose]

I think Toronto wins this big time. Adding a defensive top 4 RHD without even downgrading much on the wing and not adding cap.

Anaheim could probably use a bit more valuable.

Fair for Colorado, maybe favors them slightly.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

I think Toronto wins this big time. Adding a defensive top 4 RHD without even downgrading much on the wing and not adding cap.

Anaheim could probably use a bit more valuable.

Fair for Colorado, maybe favors them slightly.

I think overall it was a solid attempt from the OP... and I think it at the very least is a workable base... I think avs/leafs would be pretty much on board... ducks prob feel its a bit light.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

You instantly have one of the best top 6’s in the league?

We were 3rd in the NHL in goals per game this season. We led the Western Conference in goals by 12. Donskoi was the only member of our top 6 that finished outside of the top 40 in PPG for his position (he was 47th). I think there's a very strong case to be made that we already have one of the best top 6s in the league, even though 5 out of our top 6 forwards missed 10+ games due to injury this year.

Is there a dire need for more offense that justifies giving up a large portion of our prospect pool, which is currently one of the best in the league? I certainly don't see it.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

We were 3rd in the NHL in goals per game this season. We led the Western Conference in goals by 12. Donskoi was the only member of our top 6 that finished outside of the top 40 in PPG for his position (he was 47th). I think there's a very strong case to be made that we already have one of the best top 6s in the league, even though 5 out of our top 6 forwards missed 10+ games due to injury this year.

Is there a dire need for more offense that justifies giving up a large portion of our prospect pool, which is currently one of the best in the league? I certainly don't see it.

I mean who are you really losing

Timmins is the big piece... but I think you could afford to lose him, if you are bettering your chances come playoff time
1st is going to be a late 1, and likely not a piece that you guys would mind parting with
Beaucage/kaut is kind of a normal prospect most every team has... not exactly hurting the system much

I think you are over rating what you are giving up quite a bit.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Interesting, I'd love to see a poll asking the rest of the forum if they agree.

Depends. Swap Rakell and Nylander's teammates and linemates, who's putting up more points? My money's on Rakell lighting it up with a full season on Matthews' wing instead of a combination of Adam Henrique and a 35 year old Getzlaf.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Depends. Swap Rakell and Nylander's teammates and linemates, who's putting up more points? My money's on Rakell lighting it up with a full season on Matthews' wing instead of a combination of Adam Henrique and a 35 year old Getzlaf.

Rakell would absolutely kill it in Toronto, people saw how good he was when he had a capable center around him... unfortunately we don't have anything that resembles that in Anaheim(maybe zegras if were lucky)... then you put him on a powerplay with Marner/Tavares/Matthews/reilly etc. Ya his numbers would look a bit better specially with his cap hit for 2 seasons.

I don't feel like doing this argument with Toronto fan base tho... as a lot of them think every player on their team is a superstar that drives the team... and don't benefit from playing with each other at all.

That being said id take Nylander over Rakell, due to age and locked in contract(but this trade isn't really nylander for rakell, its essentialy nylander for Rakell + Manson), which is a borderline no brainer for Toronto.

 

[Richard88]

I think overall it was a solid attempt from the OP... and I think it at the very least is a workable base... I think avs/leafs would be pretty much on board... ducks prob feel its a bit light.

What more would Ducks want to balance it? And from which team? I guess Colorado pays another asset, either a pick or roster player.

How about if Donskoi is added and goes to Anaheim to replace Rakell? That might actually suit Colorado well as it moves some salary to give some more cap flexibility.

TOR out: Nylander
TOR in: Manson + Rakell @$1.9m

ANA out: Manson + Rakell ($1.85m retained)
ANA in: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage, Donskoi

COL out: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage, Donskoi
COL in: Nylander

Alternatively a 2nd or 3rd from Colorado would be acceptable, though 5 solid 'futures' pieces total might be one too many. Maybe Toronto could throw a mid-round pick Anaheim's way as well since they're getting a pretty good deal here too.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

Ya the problem is making a trade work that would interest the other team. The young assets that Toronto does have, they don't want to move(sandin, Liljegren, Robertson)… AJ/Kap have much more value in Toronto than they do in trade value... I really doubt Toronto even wants to move their 2nd at this point as they don't have many picks to begin with.

In this deal the 3rd team gives Ana the value... and while Nylander > Rakell….. rakell is still a very good player that would prob do very well in Toronto style play.... and you solve an issue on y our back end/gritt. I think rakell is a comfortable bet for 60+ point player on Toronto, he excelled in Anaheim when he had a capable center, unfortunetly Getzlafs game has gone to shit and rakell has no solid line mates there... but you put him with Matthews/marner/Tavares/hyman/kapanen/AJ and he likely becomes a lethal player agin.

I think there is pretty good interest for Kap league wide so I would disagree with you on that. I could also see a guy like Lily moved if it is for the right RD partner for Rielly long term. I think AJ value due to injury is at an all time low so I would try to keep him for another year at least. He is a good younger player signed for 3 more season after this one at a fair cap hit for a middle 6 guy.

Honestly the leafs have been hitting on 2nd rounders really well to compensate for their lack of 1st round picks lately. Pleasantly surprised as I too was worried about the lack of picks. I also think the leafs will be moving out the depth guys for picks before they price themselves out of town so they will hopefully get some picks back. As a result I do think the next 1st round pick they have available could be in play.

The problem is there is no way the leafs will be able to afford Rakell's next contract. They will have Rielly, Anderson, Lily, Sandin, Kap etc all up around that time too. All this and the cap will have been flat. As a result Rakell would be valued at 2 years of term by the Leafs. Nylander contract is longer and they might even be able to resign him after it.

I'm not disagreeing that Rakell would probably excel with the leafs forwards. However many aren't thinking about the fact Nylander was pacing for like 37 goals and 71 points before the season was cancelled. He is just entering his peak years and is still likely to improve while being locked down for a lot of those years.

 

[Perratrooper]

From an Avs fan perspective I don’t think it’s terrible, but I do think the Ducks need more if they’re forking up Rakell and Manson especially with any retention. If Timmins + 1st = Rakell it doesn’t equal Rakell with almost 50% retention, I think at least a second would be required to balance that out and I think that second comes from the Leafs.

Now I still don’t think Beaucage and Kaut is enough for Manson, but the Avs could add Jost and remove Beaucage. Even it the Ducks don’t want Jost they can flip him for at least two third if not a second and a 4th type package. I think Jost would fit perfectly with Ducks imo.

So re-worked trade:

TO:
Nylander (To Col)
2020 2nd (To Ana)

COL: (all to Ana)
Timmins
2020 first
Jost
Kaut

ANA:
Rakell (50% retained, to TO)
Manson (To TO)

The Ducks would be sending out approximately $6mil and taking in Jost and two Elcs so approximately $3-4mil. Total savings $2-3mil

Toronto takes on approx. $6mil and sends out approx. $7mil. Total savings $1mil

Colorado sends out $2-3 mil however only about half is on the current roster. They take on approx. $7mil. Total hit approx. $5.5mil.

 

[lauraP]

This is terrible for the ducks

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I mean who are you really losing

Timmins is the big piece... but I think you could afford to lose him, if you are bettering your chances come playoff time
1st is going to be a late 1, and likely not a piece that you guys would mind parting with
Beaucage/kaut is kind of a normal prospect most every team has... not exactly hurting the system much

I think you are over rating what you are giving up quite a bit.

It's really not about who we are losing. We're going to need to reload in 2-3 years as contracts expire and guys leave, and having a deep prospect pool gives us better options on how to do that. I don't want to be forced to look to UFA or trades whenever we need to replace someone, because we were stupid and traded away most of our decent picks/prospects in order to try to improve an already stacked offense.