Proposal: 3 way trade between TOR COL ANA

Richard88

John 3:16
Jun 29, 2019
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How about this 3 way?

:leafs :avs :ducks

TOR out: Nylander
TOR in: Manson + Rakell @$1.9m

ANA out: Manson + Rakell ($1.85m retained)
ANA in: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage

COL out: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage
COL in: Nylander

Anaheim generally love the idea of Timmins + 1st for Rakell. Avs probably don't do that though as it probably favours Anaheim a bit. Kaut + Beaucage probably comes close to Manson, but favours Colorado slightly. Together the two parts balance for a fair trade.

Toronto would get a defensive RHD that they need and who TML fans have been making proposals about for 2 years, AND a direct replacement for Nylander with a really cheap cap hit.

Colorado gets a young and cost-controlled 1st line winger who is signed through his prime, for futures.

Maybe another pick or two need to be added for balance but as a basis I think this could work well for all 3 teams.
 
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Richard88

John 3:16
Jun 29, 2019
19,163
20,768
In terms of cap hits:

TOR out: $6.969m
TOR in: $4.1m + $1.9m = $6m ----> Net saving of $1m capspace which allows them flexibility to keep all their depth forwards (i.e. Mikheyev/Johnsson/Kapanen/etc).

ANA out: $6m
ANA in: 2 ELC's ($1.8m) -----> Net saving $4.2m (Rakell's $1.85m retention also disappears in 2022).

COL out: 2 ELC's (not currently on the roster)
COL in: $6.969m -----> Basically fills the capspace that is unused now so would fit well.
 
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Richard88

John 3:16
Jun 29, 2019
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:avs

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Junohockeyfan

Registered User
Dec 16, 2018
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So you are basically offering the Ducks a 1st + Timmons for Manson and Rackell. (Kaut and Beacage have little value and are fillers). I don’t think that comes close to their value. Newhook at a minimum would need to be in the package.
 

Richard88

John 3:16
Jun 29, 2019
19,163
20,768
So you are basically offering the Ducks a 1st + Timmons for Manson and Rackell. (Kaut and Beacage have little value and are fillers). I don’t think that comes close to their value. Newhook at a minimum would need to be in the package.
You're underrating Kaut (and to a lesser extent Beaucage) if you think they're just "filler".

I think Anaheim would get a better return selling those 2 separate.
Not getting Newhook and almost keeping 50% salary on Rakell is a bad return.
Manson would get a 1+ decent prospect on his own.
Rakell would get even more at 2 mil..
Kaut + Beaucage is the equivalent of a 1st + decent prospect. Kaut is a recent 16th overall pick, and Beaucage's stock has gone up since being drafted at #78.
 

Richard88

John 3:16
Jun 29, 2019
19,163
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Ducks say no. They will want sexier names. This 3 way was the uncool kind.
Yesterday Wheeler in The Athletic ranked Timmins as the 7th best drafted RHD prospect not currently in the NHL. He's EXACTLY the type of prospect Anaheim would LOVE. Ask any Anaheim fan if they'd accept Timmins + 1st for Rakell and the answer will unanimously be yes.

Kaut is admittedly not "sexy" or "flashy", but he's a really solid two-way forward with no weaknesses and who can play on the PP and PK.

Beaucage is quite a 'sexy' prospect though, given that he has an elite shot. If he can fix his skating he could do some serious damage next to a playmaker like Zegras.

And don't forget that a 2020 1st in a deep draft (even a late 1st) will get Anaheim a very good prospect, since according to HockeyProspects.com this draft has 27 "grade A" prospects.
 

Junohockeyfan

Registered User
Dec 16, 2018
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You're underrating Kaut (and to a lesser extent Beaucage) if you think they're just "filler".


Kaut + Beaucage is the equivalent of a 1st + decent prospect. Kaut is a recent 16th overall pick, and Beaucage's stock has gone up since being drafted at #78.

Ducks will hard pass in that one. Kaut and Beaucage are classic quantity for quality fillers. Without Newhook and the 1st I don’t see this happening. And there would be no need for retention on Manson. This heavily favors the Avs.
 

howkie

Registered User
Dec 13, 2014
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You're underrating Kaut (and to a lesser extent Beaucage) if you think they're just "filler".


Kaut + Beaucage is the equivalent of a 1st + decent prospect. Kaut is a recent 16th overall pick, and Beaucage's stock has gone up since being drafted at #78.

But then comes the question, would you trade Rakell at 50% for Timmins and a mid to late first.........
 

McJedi

Registered User
Apr 21, 2020
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Ducks say no. They will want sexier names. This 3 way was the uncool kind.
Hilarious. As an Avs fan, I have to agree with you. Avs didn’t perform to the fantasy expected and hoped for by the party in LA.

Nylander will cost them more than three good (but no elite) prospects and a low 1st.

Kaut did have his best nhl game in Anaheim. Picked Lindholm in the most embarrassing way and won that game with the steal and first assist on an easy goal off turnover.
 

McJedi

Registered User
Apr 21, 2020
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Richard. You sure do put more effort into your trade proposals than most. Nice effort here with follow up roster posts.

I’d do that deal for the Avs. It’s painful but not quite painful enough for me to squirm out of it. Toronto probably does it. But I think the mighty ducks pass.
 
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Zegs2sendhelp

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Hmm its not terrible... I just don't know if it moves the bar enough from Anaheim perspective.

Rakell with no retention prob gets us Timmins + 1st + Beaucage(prob slight add from anaehim but nothing excessive)
So wed essentially move Manson+ retention for Kaut.

Overall I think its close enough that id be willing to work it out a bit, I guess a lot depends on where the 1st lands...id prob say somewhere in the range of a 2nd off.... Obviously id love to say timmins + newhook + 1st for that package... but trading newhooks seems like an unwise move for Colorado.

The ducks should go all in on a rebuild, manson/rakell should be sold to contenders(retention if needed to up value) and add young players/assets to the team.... so I like the general premise of the deal.

Timmins becomes our best RHD
Kaut and Beaucage join comtois/jones/terry/tracey/Milano as competition for our wings

We would also end up with picks #
6, 27, 31, 36(27/31 could change pending a playoff)

My opinion is also pretty biased because I really want the ducks to make a play on timmins.
 
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WhatTheDuck

9 - 20 - 8
May 17, 2007
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How about this 3 way?

:leafs :avs :ducks

TOR out: Nylander
TOR in: Manson + Rakell @$1.9m

ANA out: Manson + Rakell ($1.85m retained)
ANA in: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage

COL out: Timmins, Kaut, 1st, Beaucage
COL in: Nylander

Anaheim generally love the idea of Timmins + 1st for Rakell. Avs probably don't do that though as it probably favours Anaheim a bit. Kaut + Beaucage probably comes close to Manson, but favours Colorado slightly. Together the two parts balance for a fair trade.

Toronto would get a defensive RHD that they need and who TML fans have been making proposals about for 2 years, AND a direct replacement for Nylander with a really cheap cap hit.

Colorado gets a young and cost-controlled 1st line winger who is signed through his prime, for futures.

Maybe another pick or two need to be added for balance but as a basis I think this could work well for all 3 teams.

I don't know where you get the notion that anyone was in love with the idea of Timmins + 1st for Rakell. From what I remember most deemed it to be acceptable by most. Probably right in the ballpark when you consider recent comparable trades. Suggesting that to be an overpayment (with 50% retention) the likes of which would excite Anaheim enough to toss in Manson for less than they'd move him otherwise is just laughable.

Did you happen to see the multiple quotes suggesting how unlikely the Ducks would be to part with Manson unless the offer is too good to pass up? I really doubt that translates to Kaut + Beaucage....


Your offer is classic quantity for quality in the context of trying to pry away two core players from a team with an already very deep farm system. It makes no sense for Anaheim to package those two players together unless for the purpose of drawing out a higher end piece than they could get for them separately. Otherwise they can obviously do much better than this selling them separately.

Rakell + Manson at a combined cost of 6M for two seasons...there's no way you're getting that with Timmins as a centerpiece + add ons. You have one prospect who makes Anaheim even consider this.
 
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Richard88

John 3:16
Jun 29, 2019
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Ducks will hard pass in that one. Kaut and Beaucage are classic quantity for quality fillers. Without Newhook and the 1st I don’t see this happening. And there would be no need for retention on Manson. This heavily favors the Avs.
Timmins + 1st for Rakell is fair.

That leaves Manson. Do you really think you're going to get Newhook in a trade for Manson?
 

Zegs2sendhelp

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Timmins + 1st for Rakell is fair.

That leaves Manson. Do you really think you're going to get Newhook in a trade for Manson?
1st + timmins is prob on the low end of fair, and you added retention to the deal. And im prob the best person for your argument as im very high on timmins… as im prob the main example of someone liking 1st + timmins for Rakell… but im pretty sure most of the time I said there would have been an add to the deal.
 
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Groo

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May 11, 2013
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Yesterday Wheeler in The Athletic ranked Timmins as the 7th best drafted RHD prospect not currently in the NHL. He's EXACTLY the type of prospect Anaheim would LOVE. Ask any Anaheim fan if they'd accept Timmins + 1st for Rakell and the answer will unanimously be yes.

Kaut is admittedly not "sexy" or "flashy", but he's a really solid two-way forward with no weaknesses and who can play on the PP and PK.

Beaucage is quite a 'sexy' prospect though, given that he has an elite shot. If he can fix his skating he could do some serious damage next to a playmaker like Zegras.

And don't forget that a 2020 1st in a deep draft (even a late 1st) will get Anaheim a very good prospect, since according to HockeyProspects.com this draft has 27 "grade A" prospects.
Duck fans already told you no and you go ahead and post they'd unanimously say yes. What's the matter with you?
 

Spilot23

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Dec 30, 2014
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I don't know the Ducks needs if it's either Nylander type of player or good prospects but I think both teams could do this deal without Avs being included here. Timmins + 1st might be interesting for a team like Ducks but Kaut and Beaucage does nothing for them while moving two valuable pieces. Almost every team has a Kaut and Beaucage in their system.
 
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